Schofield almost definitely a Docker next year.

[raffrox]

Skill-wise who would you take. Cook or Schofield? Toughness-wise Woods or Schofield?

The softest and average skilled midfielder at Port would be a skillful hard nut at Freo.

 

[voodoo_86]

If he plays at Cooks expense I wont be very happy..

At Maccas i could take it or leave it..

The only places I can see him taking is the browne/smith/dodd/webster types etc that sit around the fringes, and would we rather develop youth or go for the quick fix?

I think he'll be an alright pickup, but i sure hope we dont miss out on a backup ruckman by picking him up instead.

 

[Kenny_01]

I'd take Webster, Dodd and Browne over Cook, McManus and Schofield anyday.

 

[raffrox]

I'd take Webster, Dodd and Browne over Cook, McManus and Schofield anyday.

I just hope Websters knee holds up.

 

[YAKUZA]

Can someone tell me how Fremantle propose to get Schofield?

 

[Portia]

Wait for us to delist him by the 12th of November, then pick him up either in the national draft or preseason draft. Port need to make at least one delisting, and if Schoey keeps being a tool in negotations, it'll probably be him.

 

[bee dee]

As l reported weeks ago, is going going gawn

 

[crazy_big_al]

take the bum he is no longer in our best 22 and is nothing more than a reciever

 

[BB gun]

If he does come, i think he will struggle for a game. I would rather see someone like R Dunn given and oppportunity before schofield.

 

[purplesoul]

Am very surprised that the club considered this. Surely we have acquired the necessary midfielders for 2005, and have enough developing players without Schofield.

 

[newlander77]

Bring it on! I have been envious of the depth West Coast and port has had in their midfield for too long. It's about time we had some real depth in the midfield also. Let the old guys like Macca, Cook and Schofield get in there and compete for their place in the side. This will only make our list healthier. You saw how Macca reacted last year when dropped to the WAFL. This will send a clear message that if you're game isn't up to scratch, then you're out!

Having this depth in the midfield will not hold back players like Ryley Dunn, it will only make them better. You need experienced players as mentors for these guys.

 

[The Hobo]

just bare in mind. a team of champions will not be a champion team.

look at real madrid if you dont believe me. Fremantle are turning into the real madrid of afl footy.

paying so much for high profile recruits, and can't get them to gel.

 

[BB gun]

the problem with schofield is that he is old and may hinder the development of a younger player. freo still need a key forward

 

[ImperialPurple]

just bare in mind. a team of champions will not be a champion team.

look at real madrid if you dont believe me. Fremantle are turning into the real madrid of afl footy.

paying so much for high profile recruits, and can't get them to gel.

I shall treat this as a serious post, even though it has "troll" written all over it.

You are absolutley correct that a team of champions does not make a champion team. However, in recent years (say the last 4-5, since 2000) we have had the following "high profile recruits" come to FFC:

1. Peter Bell (2000): started his career at South Fremantle Football Club, winning their B&F in 1994, before being one of the first 2 signings to the fledgling Fremantle Football Club. Neesham in his infinite wisdom, cut him loose and as we all know he went to North and flourished. He decided he wanted to return home - club of preference FFC. By the time his career ends he will have spent the majority of it playing for Fremantle. A product of Freo returning to Freo.

2. Matthew Carr (2000): not high profile at the time, profile has risen following some very good performances over the last few years since being at Freo, and the higher profile of younger brother Josh. Originally from East Fremantle Football Club. A product of Freo returning to Freo.

3. Trent Croad (2001): no connection at all to FFC. Recruited purely because of his high profile, star potential - we were crap and needed a big name to raise our profile and put some bums on seats. He was also supposed to be better than what he turned out to be...

4. Luke McPharlin (2001): not high profile at the time, his profile has risen following some outstanding performances over the last few years. Originally from East Fremantle Football Club. A product of Freo returning to Freo.

5. Jeff Farmer (2001): Very high profile recruit wanting to return to WA to continue his career. From South Fremantle Football Club country zone.

6. Troy Simmonds (2001): not high profile at the time, profile has risen following some good performances over the last few years. His high profile is just as much about him being one of very few talls available in this year's trade period, and getting a 5 year deal to move to RFC.

7. Des Headland (2002): high profile at the time - wanted to return home, club of preference: FFC. Des also attended all his pre-draft interviews in a FFC club t-shirt, indicating where he would prefer to play his footy.

8. Josh Carr (2004): wanted to leave PAFC, to play only for one other club - FFC. Obviously the "brother factor" was the main reason, but let's also remember he is originally from East Fremantle Football Club. A product of Freo returning to Freo.

9. Heath Black (2004): played 5 years at FFC before retruning home to Vic. After 2 years at StK asked to be traded back to FFC. Trade was stuffed up, Black played another season for StK, then asked again to be traded back to FFC.


So, after all this, the 2 Vics who headed our way with no connection to Fremantle have headed back where they came from (Croad and Simmonds). Otherwise, all 7 of these players have a specific connection with FFC, SFFC or EFFC and wanted to play for the club.

Deeps, you make it sound as though Freo went out waving the cheque book around to land these guys. Just like guys who played for PAMFC like the opportunity to play for PAFC in the AFL, don't underestimate the pull of having played for the WAFL Freo teams for some guys wanting to play for FFC in the AFL.

 

[Portia]

How many of those players came to Freo for the same or less money than they were offered elsewhere? Also, are they gelling?

 

[ImperialPurple]

Fair question:

More or less money:

Bell: prob more, but North were trying desperately to keep him, so who know what they were offering. But I'd say more.
MCarr: prob similar
Croad: more
McPharlin: considering he was just coming off his first 2 year draftee's contract, who knows. Hawthorn may very well have offered more to keep him, but he was dead-set on returning home. Either way he was going to get more than what he had been getting to that point.
Farmer: more
Simmonds: was desperate for an opportunity which Freo gave him, don't know.
Headland: prob more, but Bris were desperate to keep him, and he was desperate to go home, but I think it would be fairly obvious that it would have been more. It became more about satisfying Brisbane in the end (just like with JC this year).
JCarr: about the same by all accounts
Black: prob less - his last contact by all accounts involved very large amounts of cash

Have they gelled - hmmm... not really. Moments of greatness, marred by moments where, as a fan, you just have to hide your face and shake your head. Perhap with the arrival of JC and Blacky, and with Pav becoming a KPP, there'll be a more settled line-up and things will improve.


I realise you were taking the p1ss Porthos, but I have tried to give a fair response. The Real Madrid thing is plain inaccurate. It's not as if we went out and bought Beckham or Rooney equivalents, who had no connection to the club or the town at all, but came purely for the cash.... well except Croad - but that's a 1 from 9 hit-rate.

Each of these other guys has / had a reason for being a current part of FFC.

 

[nurries]

How many of those players came to Freo for the same or less money than they were offered elsewhere? Also, are they gelling?

Haselby, Pavlich and Longmuir, J signed for Freo less than they were offered at other E/S clubs so it evens out.

 

[The Hobo]

I shall treat this as a serious post, even though it has "troll" written all over it.

You are absolutley correct that a team of champions does not make a champion team. However, in recent years (say the last 4-5, since 2000) we have had the following "high profile recruits" come to FFC:


So, after all this, the 2 Vics who headed our way with no connection to Fremantle have headed back where they came from (Croad and Simmonds). Otherwise, all 7 of these players have a specific connection with FFC, SFFC or EFFC and wanted to play for the club.

it was a serious post, i do not troll. Ok, so you have got players that were connected to the club previously. fair enough. However, it's come to my notice that MOST of them (not all) have actually gone downhill since coming to freo, as opposed to improving. Des headland is a prime example, although he was made to look good by the brissie midfield, i know that he is a better player than he is showing at freo atm. (apart from a few good games)

Peter bell, sustained his magnificent form from the roos at freo for a season or two, and then apart from the occasional good game, he has gone down. dont get me wrong, hes still a wonderful player, but he is not as good as before.

Jeff farmer was a superstar, now he's a player that CAN rip up a game, but seldom does nowadays

These players were lured not only because of the "come home factor" but ALSO the lucrative salaries. Headland aside, i beleive that the rest would have stayed in melbourne or whatever, without freo offering such high paid salaries. Maybe it's getting to the head's of the players, and making them think they are wonderful. (i'm talking about the high profile recruits).

Matthew Carr has alot of potential, he has yet to fulfill it.

in all honesty, the only players freo have devolped THEMSELVES (without a 2nd club being involved in the development), is paul haselby and paul medhurst. Medhurst can become even better, but seems to b getting held back at freo. Haselby has done well

Bell was an average player when he left freo, as was black and farmer. There are plenty of players that were average at freo, and have become successful at another club. This happens to many clubs occasionaly, but seems to happen more so to freo.

 

[masai]

it was a serious post, i do not troll. Ok, so you have got players that were connected to the club previously. fair enough. However, it's come to my notice that MOST of them (not all) have actually gone downhill since coming to freo, as opposed to improving.

Deeps you have written some inaccuracies and confused yourself.

Bell is still very good and his leadership skills are worth the money he is paid.

Matt Carr was a nobody when he came to Freo.

Players Freo have developed that have been chased vigourously by other teams included Pav, JLo, Hasleby, Schammer etc with Medhurst further back.

Medhurst being held back!!!!, jeez for a player to be held back you would expect him to be sitting on the pine or in the twos. Medhurst was given every opportunity this season,as the media keep informing us. He will bounce back after to gets his "head" around some G & D skills.

Farmer went straight from Tambellup to Melbourne, so Freo didn't "buy" him back like Black and Bell.

Please note the main reason that Black and Headland returned may be that their partners had them by the S & C's.

 

[The Hobo]

Players Freo have developed that have been chased vigourously by other teams included Pav, JLo, Hasleby, Schammer etc with Medhurst further back.

pavlich schammer hasleby are all class players to begin with. You can put these players in any team with any coaching staff, and they will be better than the average. That is just their natural talent coming through. Pavlich is a much much better player than he has so far shown. He is NOT playign to anywhere near his potential.

That is what i meant about medhurst. I know he was picked up late, and all ,but he has the potential to become excellent, as oppsed to just good. i meant held back, as in , he is not developing like he should be.

Mcarr is another, i'm not saying he is /was high profile. He has potential (not as much as pav or medhurts) but he has more potential then he's shown.

i agree, bell is still very good, but he was better when he was at the roos,and his first year or two back at freo. But he's declining. Still a wonderful player though


In essence, what i mean is that you guys are not getting enough out of your players and what thye are capable off. I know NO team will ever get 100% of what every player is capable off, but you guys aren't doing as well as you should due to that reason

 

[newlander77]

That is what i meant about medhurst. I know he was picked up late, and all ,but he has the potential to become excellent, as oppsed to just good. i meant held back, as in , he is not developing like he should be.

I think Medhurst has done incredibly well in his time at Freo. Remember, he is a small forward, not a key forward! So considering he has never really had a quality FF and CHF absorbing a majority of the pressure, he's done an absolutely amazing job (as has Phil Matera for West Coast).

It's fair to say that hyperthetically the team could have held him back a bit because of this, but it's also fair to argue that this has brought out the best in him. Consistancy is his major fault, when he's off his game, he might as well be sitting on the sidelines!

 

[ImperialPurple]

In essence, what i mean is that you guys are not getting enough out of your players and what thye are capable off. I know NO team will ever get 100% of what every player is capable off, but you guys aren't doing as well as you should due to that reason

I agree... sadly.

 

[ThePope]

That is what i meant about medhurst. I know he was picked up late, and all ,but he has the potential to become excellent, as oppsed to just good. i meant held back, as in , he is not developing like he should be.

The guy's been in the AFL for 3 years. He's missed 2 games in that time (Rd 7 & 8 in 2002). He's been our leading goal scorer for the past 2 years. He sits 2nd and 8th on the most goals in a game list, 4th in the all-time goal scoring list... not a bad resume for a 3rd year player. Yes, I hope that next year he plays every game like the 9 goal game vs Bris or the 7 vs the Blooze, or even how he helped win the game vs the Roos at the G by great pressure on Archer and a pin point pass to Headland, but he aint the problem with the team. Blame team structure, blame arrogance, blame wrong phase of the moon, we all know that we went sideways/backwards this year. So did most teams in the AFL other than Port, Geelong, Saints and Melb (up until Rd 18 or so!).

Mcarr is another, i'm not saying he is /was high profile. He has potential (not as much as pav or medhurts) but he has more potential then he's shown.

i agree, bell is still very good, but he was better when he was at the roos,and his first year or two back at freo. But he's declining. Still a wonderful player though

Carr was very good in 2003 and he was injured early this year.
Bell got 8 Brownlow votes in 2000 when he won the Roos B&F. He got 11 in 2001, 14 in 2002, 19 in 2003 and 9 this year. You can argue about Carey/Harvey/King/McKernan stealing votes off him, or that the Brownlow isn't a good measure, but winning B&Fs at Freo in 2001, 2002 and 2004 indicates that the match comittee still reckon he's doing pretty well!

In essence, what i mean is that you guys are not getting enough out of your players and what thye are capable off. I know NO team will ever get 100% of what every player is capable off, but you guys aren't doing as well as you should due to that reason

This year, yes, you are right. 2003 probably exceeded what we thought we could do (remember 2001 we only won 2 games all year!) But look at where the Saints finished in 2003. Look at Melbourne's even and odd season records. See which experts tipped the Hawks or Tigers to be top 4 this year. If we fail again next year, then yes, strong questions should be asked of both the coach and key players. But, I still feel that we are going into 2005 knowing that the "house of cr!p" doesn't deliver us the 4 points just for turning up. Hopefully the early end of the year was a kick in the pants that they all needed to make the step up next year.

 

[ImperialPurple]

This year, yes, you are right. 2003 probably exceeded what we thought we could do (remember 2001 we only won 2 games all year!) But look at where the Saints finished in 2003. Look at Melbourne's even and odd season records. See which experts tipped the Hawks or Tigers to be top 4 this year. If we fail again next year, then yes, strong questions should be asked of both the coach and key players. But, I still feel that we are going into 2005 knowing that the "house of cr!p" doesn't deliver us the 4 points just for turning up. Hopefully the early end of the year was a kick in the pants that they all needed to make the step up next year.

I agree with that even more!

Thank you oh holy one, for putting it back into perspective....

 

[The Hobo]

ok, a quick look at your midfield

Bell, Cook, Haselby, Pavlich, Black, J.Carr, M.Carr, Schammer, Headland and McManus

out of which, bell, cook, black, j.carr, headland were all developed by an opposition club. The players that Fremantle have developed are
Haselby, pav, m.carr,schammer and mcmanus

Players like pavlich and schammer as i said before are just so talented naturally,it doesn't take much nurturing.

so you have made haselby,m.carr and mcmanus by yourself

haselby is the only top notch player on that list, matthew car is decent and macca is nothing special (big heart, courageous etc. but that wasnt taught by freo)


medhurst might have been topping your listings etc etc. but as i said, he has alot more potential than that. i know he's a small forward, but is he as good as phil matera? no, but he can be easily better.

Fremantle have many youngters but fail to develop them properly. And again ,pavlich schammer etc. have so much talent that you THINK you developed them, when in actual fact, had pav been playing at a side such as port adelaide, he would be in the top echelon of players in the AFL. he's still pretty damn good, but that's because he is him. so naturally gifted

Freo need to start developing their own stars, right from the start. Dont say you've only been in the afl a few year, and you need to do some quick fixing...take a look at port

we developed on our own

Tredrea, Chad Cornes, Kane Cornes, Roger James, Peter Burgoyne, Shaun Burgoyne, etc etc etc. There is a huuge list of proven top rate players that port developed themselves

fremantle have a small list, pavlich, schammer, etc. Plus the ppl that came back to them, after another club devloped them into class players

if medhurst, pavlich etc. were at another club, they would be alot more brilliant than they are now