Should all the rules introduced by current Geelong CEO Stephen Hocking be reversed?

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

You never actually respond to my points, which means you acknowledge their merit. Also, scoring was trending heavily down between 2017 and 2020 (even adjusting for quarter size), which stopped in 2021. It's right here in this thread.

Trending down doesn't mean that trend would have continued without this rule.
The fact is that scoring is the same and we have a silly rule in place.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

IYFO. If Hocking hadn’t taken the Geelong CEO job he’d probably be CEO of the AFL now. He was highly respected within the AFL, I know that for an absolute fact

Thank god that didn't happen . Brendan Gale was the obvious choice but was shafted by the boys club.

 

[Mr Meow]

Trending down doesn't mean that trend would have continued without this rule.
The fact is that scoring is the same and we have a silly rule in place.

It's not the same though. We trended down to a 148ish per game point average before the rule, now it's steady at 164ish points. We didn't stay at 148 points or continue declining to 138 points, so you are wrong.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

It's not the same though. We trended down to a 148ish per game point average before the rule, now it's steady at 164ish points. We didn't stay at 148 points or continue declining to 138 points, so you are wrong.

Show me the stats for each year average scoring.

 

[Mr Meow]

Show me the stats for each year average scoring.

I already quoted it for you earlier.

Let's count this as a brainteaser to see if you can find it.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

Aristotle Pickett here you go. The raw data is quoted and my summary is something simple enough that you should be able to understand it.

2016-2017 average of 86.5 per team. Scoring heavily declines to 74 per team by 2019-2020. Rule changes, we then get back to 82 per team since (instead of continuing to decline further below 74).

Not enough info per year and covid per year was adjusted.
I cant find and per year for the last 7 years.
Even if it went up a goal a game , that's nothing.

 

[Mr Meow]

Not enough info per year and covid per year was adjusted.
I cant find and per year for the last 7 years.
Even if it went up a goal a game , that's nothing.

First sentence is wrong.

Second sentence, the information has been posted in this thread.

Third sentence, its gone up by 16 points per game, not a goal. After it had declined by 24 points per game the years leading up to it. That is extremely significant unless you don't know how numbers work.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

Right here - https://afltables.com/afl/stats/yearly.html

	G	B
2010​	13.1​	9.6​	88.2​
2011​	13.5​	9.7​	90.7​
2012​	13.3​	9.6​	89.4​
2013​	13.4​	9.4​	89.8​
2014​	12.6​	8.9​	84.5​
2015​	12.6​	8.6​	84.2​
2016​	12.9​	9.1​	86.5​
2017​	12.9​	9.5​	86.9​
2018​	12​	9​	81​
2019​	11.6​	8.6​	78.2​
2020​	8.8​	6.4​	59.2​
2021​	11.5​	8.6​	77.6​
2022​	12.1​	8.4​	81​
2023​	12.1​	8.5​	81.1​
2024​	12.3​	8.5​	82.3​
2025​	12.2​	8.8​	82​

Total I added ([goals * 6]+points) for complete clarity.

You didn't post it Mr Meow , Nick did.
Forget about the covid year and it hasn't hardly moved at all and it's miles off 2017 and before.

 

[Mr Meow]

You didn't post it Mr Meow , Nick did.

I said "the information has been posted". Where did I say I collated it? You even tried to pretend you couldn't find it. Shocking dishonesty.

Now answer all of my points, which irrefutably correct every wrong thing you said.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

I said "the information has been posted". Where did I say I collated it?

Now answer all of my points, which irrefutably correct every wrong thing you said.

The stats show that all of Hocking's rule changes have done bugger all to increase scoring.
Have a look at the table.

 

[Mr Meow]

The stats show that all of Hocking's rule changes have done bugger all to increase scoring.
Have a look at the table.

Again, your comprehension is staggeringly poor. We trended down by 24 points per game in the seasons leading up to the rule change, then instead of trending a further 24 points down we have actually gone up by 16 points. The trend reversed.

I can't walk you through this in simpler terms. If you deny it, you are either thick or simply can't objectively look at things.

You've been proven wrong and that's fine. It's up to you if you admit it or stay in a state of cowardly denial/misdirection.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

Again, your comprehension is staggeringly poor. We trended down by 24 points per game in the seasons leading up to the rule change, then instead of trending a further 24 points down we have actually gone up by 16 points. The trend reversed.

I can't walk you through this in simpler terms. If you deny it, you are either thick or simply can't objectively look at things.

You've been proven wrong and that's fine. It's up to you if you admit it or stay in a state of cowardly denial/misdirection.

You're being a dick.
Average from 2010 to 2017 was an average of 87 points.
Average from 2018 to 2021 (excluding covid year) was about 79 points.
Average from 2022 to 2025, the rule change years, is about 81.5.
So it's miles behind 2010 to 2017 and marginally ahead of 2018 to 2021.

That's according to the table you are referring to.
Can you see that?

 

[Mr Meow]

You're being a dick.
Average from 2010 to 2017 was an average of 87 points.
Average from 2018 to 2021 (excluding covid year) was about 79 points.
Average from 2022 to 2025, the rule change years, is about 81.5.
So it's miles behind 2010 to 2017 and marginally ahead of 2018 to 2021.
Can you see that?

87 points per team up to 2017. 174 per game.

2018, 2019 and 2020 (adjusted) it started steadily declining each season.

By 2019-2020 it was down to 76 points per team (AFTER extrapolating scores for Covid shortened games). 152 points per game.

So we trended down 22 points per game. The league didn't want that trend to continue.

Then we have gone back up to 81.5 points per team the last few seasons. 163 points per game. Up 11 points instead of down another 22.

The league obviously didn't want us to start having 130 point game averages. Job done.

Deny it all you want but a 22 point trend down was flipped to an 11 point trend up, despite defensive systems getting better all the time.

 

[Sttew]

You didn't post it Mr Meow , Nick did.
Forget about the covid year and it hasn't hardly moved at all and it's miles off 2017 and before.

You obviously cannot interpret data.

 

[Sttew]

Thank god that didn't happen . Brendan Gale was the obvious choice but was shafted by the boys club.

Thanks to people like you. The AFL said we can’t have a man who is CEO of a club whose supporters call the competition the ‘CFL’ become CEO of the AFL. So blame yourselves.

Tasmania is looking good and Brendon will be back at the helm

 

[Mr Meow]

You obviously cannot interpret data.

Ironically AP's thread made someone do the data analysis that proved his main thesis around scoring wrong. The rule change coincided with a cessation of the steep decline in scoring leading up to it. We actually offset that decline by about 50% in fact.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

87 points per team up to 2017. 174 per game.

2018, 2019 and 2020 (adjusted) it started steadily declining each season.

By 2019-2020 it was down to 76 points per team (AFTER extrapolating scores for Covid shortened games). 152 points per game.

So we trended down 22 points per game. The league didn't want that trend to continue.

Then we have gone back up to 81.5 points per team the last few seasons. 163 points per game. Up 11 points instead of down another 22.

The league obviously didn't want us to start having 130 point game averages. Job done.

Deny it all you want but a 22 point trend down was flipped to an 11 point trend up, despite defensive systems getting better all the time.

You keep saying 'trending' and 'steadiliy declining' like it was going to continue every year and you count the covid year with adjustments , that should not be included.
Like I said It's improved slightly but it's no where near 2017 and before, and that's with a heap of silly rules introduced.
If you think Hocking's fiddling with the game is an overwhelming success then you're wrong.

 

[Mr Meow]

You keep saying 'trending' and 'steadiliy declining' like it was going to continue every year and you count the covid year with adjustments , that should not be included.
Like I said It's improved slightly but it's no where near 2017 and before, and that's with a heap of silly rules introduced.
If you think Hocking's fiddling with the game is an overwhelming success then you're wrong.

Covid not included? I guess we can remove a Richmond premiership cup and Martin's achievements that year then?

The facts are the facts. It declined 22 points per game heading into the rule change, while the last 4 seasons it's been 11 points per game higher than that low.

Trend reversed so that we didn't see a continuation of the drop off occurring each season 2018 > 2019 > 2020.

You've been proven wrong I'm afraid. Take the medicine and move on.

 

[PhatBoy]

You keep saying 'trending' and 'steadiliy declining' like it was going to continue every year and you count the covid year with adjustments , that should not be included.
Like I said It's improved slightly but it's no where near 2017 and before, and that's with a heap of silly rules introduced.
If you think Hocking's fiddling with the game is an overwhelming success then you're wrong.

Tell us more about how you don’t know what per game and per team mean

 

[STPer18]

Don't worry, Tom Harley will fix the game.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

Tell us more about how you don’t know what per game and per team mean

How about all these low scoring games this week.

 

[Mr Meow]

How about all these low scoring games this week.

Have you figured out that two teams play in each game yet?

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

Have you figured out that two teams play in each game yet?

Don't be patronising. The game is still a low scoring game with Hocking's crazy rules .
It was done in a panic because the TV rights holders weren't getting enough ads in.

 

[Mr Meow]

Don't be patronising. The game is still a low scoring game with Hocking's crazy rules .
It was done in a panic because the TV rights holders weren't getting enough ads in.

You've backtracked heavily from your original (wrong) statements. I think that means my work here is done. Have the most beautiful evening of your life.

 

[PhatBoy]

How about all these low scoring games this week.

What about them?
Are you in the habit of citing one round of football to prove your argument?

Hang on I forgot who I was talking to.