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Stats observations
- Thread starter red+black
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Hawthorn were ahead at 3/4 time in 15 consecutive matches - rounds 3 to 17 1963 (drew 1 and lost 1)
Hawthorn were ahead at 3/4 time in 14 consecutive matches- rounds 7 to the Grand Final 1961 ( lost 1)
In 1971 Hawthorn were ahead at 3/4 time in 11 consecutive matches rounds 7-17 and won all of them.
Hawthorn have currently won their last 29 matches where they were leading at 3/4 time.
(The last team to comeback against Hawthorn in the last quarter was West Coast in round 4, 2012.)
From round 8, 1988 to round 11 1992 Hawthorn won 68 consecutive matches where they were ahead at 3/4 time.
Round 7, 1988 Melbourne trailed by 10 points at 3/4 time and won 15.21-111 v Hawthorn 13.12-90.
Round 12, 1992 Adelaide trailed by 9 points at 3/4 time and won 15.13-103 v Hawthorn 15.12-102.
Hawthorn weren't actually ahead in all those games, in a couple of them they were level. So the record, I'm pretty sure, is the current run of 12.
You are correct.
Scripting error saw the even at 3/4 time missed.
12 consecutive is the record for Hawthorn being ahead at 3/4 time.
11 in 1971 is next, then 10 in 1961 and 10 1983-4
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One statistic I have noticed for a few weeks now is that Greater Western Sydney have lost every game by at least 30 points!
If the Giants do not get within fifteen points of any of their remaining nine opponents, they will set an unwanted and unenviable record of having the highest minimum losing margin for a winless VFL/AFL team, beating a record held by University in their last season of 1914 when the closest the Students came to a win was losing to South Melbourne by fifteen points.
In fact, if Greater Western Sydney do not manage to get within twenty-four points of any of their remaining nine opponents, they will beat Sturt’s 1995 record for the highest minimum losing margin by a winless team in any of the three major Australian Rules leagues, which would be a pretty sad farewell for a famous coach like Sheedy! (It’s ironic that Sturt’s 1995 coach, Phil Carman, built the club up to a Grand Final appearance in 1998).
If the Giants do not get within fifteen points of any of their remaining nine opponents, they will set an unwanted and unenviable record of having the highest minimum losing margin for a winless VFL/AFL team, beating a record held by University in their last season of 1914 when the closest the Students came to a win was losing to South Melbourne by fifteen points.
In fact, if Greater Western Sydney do not manage to get within twenty-four points of any of their remaining nine opponents, they will beat Sturt’s 1995 record for the highest minimum losing margin by a winless team in any of the three major Australian Rules leagues, which would be a pretty sad farewell for a famous coach like Sheedy! (It’s ironic that Sturt’s 1995 coach, Phil Carman, built the club up to a Grand Final appearance in 1998).
What’s the record for any team in the VFL/AFL?
Best for each club (quite a bit of manual work in this due to lack of grunt on work PC, so not infallible):
\Ad|10|2003 R10
\||2005 R13
\Br|12|1999 R13
\||2001 R18
\Ca|16|1987 R7
\Co|21|1928 SF
\Es|24|1949 R12
\Fr|6|2006 R13
\Ge|15|1989 R1
\||2007 R6
\||2008 R10
\GC|2|2013 R7
\GWS|1|2012 R19
\||2013 R4
\Ha|12|2013 R2
\Me|11|1959 R4
\NM|10|1993 R4
\PA|8|2002 R8
\||2003 R15
\Ri|14|1974 R13
\St|11|2005 R14
\Sy|11|2012 R10
\WC|13|2005 R4
\WB|10|1997 R19
\||2005 R17
\Fi|13|1947 R14
\Un|7|1910 R7
People don’t realise just how good Carlton were in 1987 and (whilst the weather kept fine) 1988, but that figure of sixteen successive games leading at three-quarter time, even though they lost two and won three by less than a goal, does make one think that 1987 team would be behind only the 1908, 1979 and 1995 teams as the greatest the Blues ever produced.
What’s interesting is that Sydney conceded over 100 points in all but one match in 1993, and it was the Bulldogs who failed to score a century against the 1993 Swans, scoring 94 points in Round 12. Carlton in 2007 conceded 100 points in every game bar their opener in 2007, including the last game where the Blues and Demons were playing to lose for draft choices - perhaps evidence that draft systems are ethically wrong.
Observed in Round 15, 2013:
The equal 2nd highest 1st quarter aggregate score in a Carlton v Collingwood match.
Only the 3rd time Collingwood have won against Carlton by winning only the 2nd and 3rd quarters.
Margins up to 3/4 time never seen before.
A feat for Nth. Melbourne not seen since 2004.
A 250th milestone in Brisbane.
A degree of scoring inefficiency only seen twice before in 117 seasons.
A first for West Coast against Adelaide.
The fewest goals with most behinds scored in a 2nd quarter for one team since 1942.
Two firsts since 2007 for the Dockers.
A new scoring record for Essendon against Port Adelaide.
Hawthorn ranks 4th in results from the last 6 matches.
Geelong has the highest lowest score.
The highest attended round ever.
Currently for 2013, Geelong have a higher average attendance than Hawthorn.
Carlton have had 91 better results from 14 matches.
Nth. Melbourne’s average points conceded is their lowest since 1977.
2013 has seen the highest percentage of matches won by teams that trailed at 1/2 time since 1987.
Nth. Melbourne are the first quarter champs – Port Adelaide best in the last.
Details and more: Click here.
The Bear's list of each club's longest steak of matches leading at 3/4 time is 100% correct.
Noting that Hawthorn's ended in round 15 and the Giants as of round 15 are on a new streak of one.
Anyone want a list of most consecutive matches trailing at 3/4 time?
From the slush pile:
Average points score from matches 1-14 of the season.
71.64: Hawthorn 1957
71.64: GWS Giants 2013
71.57: Geelong 1963
71.57: Hawthorn 1941
71.57: Carlton 1926
70.07: Nth Melbourne 1954
70.07: Melbourne 2013
70.00: Sth Melbourne 1964
70.00: Geelong 1921
Average points score from matches 1-14 of the season.
71.64: Hawthorn 1957
71.64: GWS Giants 2013
71.57: Geelong 1963
71.57: Hawthorn 1941
71.57: Carlton 1926
70.07: Nth Melbourne 1954
70.07: Melbourne 2013
70.00: Sth Melbourne 1964
70.00: Geelong 1921
Not by request:
Each club's number of most consecutive matches trailing at 3/4 time.
(Essendon did not compete 1916-1917 - Geelong not in 1942-1943)
SJ
Premium Platinum
Premiership team.
Joel Selwood and Nathan Jones are each slated to play their 150th game this week.
Joel has currently played in 123 wins and 26 defeats....while Nathan has played in 37 wins, three draws and 109 defeats.
Pretty amazing contrast in fortunes between two players celebrating the same milestone.
Joel has currently played in 123 wins and 26 defeats....while Nathan has played in 37 wins, three draws and 109 defeats.
Pretty amazing contrast in fortunes between two players celebrating the same milestone.
That surprises me a lot. It’s notable how significant the previous two cases in 1969 and 1979 were: the first was a sensation third quarter effort in a violent match: the Magpies scored 12-5 in the third quarter yet McKenna kicked only three (John Greening, normally an on-baller, got seven). That 1969 match remains the equal second largest win by a team that lost the first and final quarters, behind only Richmond against Footscray in Round 2 of 1989 (look here for some notes and a parallel with the two clubs’ games in 1958 and 1979) and equal to Carlton against St. Kilda in Round 5 of 1981. The 1946 Grand Final, I might note, was only one point behind.
I counted 790 games up to the end of 2012 where the winner lost both the first and last quarters, but know very well that in about a quarter of these the winner won only one of the other two quarters.
After 14 matches in 1963 - Melbourne had the highest average score 86.4 points, while the eventual premiers, Geelong ranked 7th in attack.
However at the time Geelong were number 1 in defence having conceded and average of 59.8 points.
By the end of the season they were still first in defence but had moved up to 6th in attack.
Sort of goes against the impression that has come down of Geelong at the time as being a more free-running and attacking team especially in comparison to the runners-up, Hawthorn.
Hawthorn were actually 3rd in attack but only 5th in defence which tends to re-infornce the idea that its defence that wins premierships.
Occurs that a list of premiers and runners-up rankings in defence and attack might be in order.
In the 790 games mentioned above - the the winner won both the 2nd and 3rd quarters 564 times - 71.4% of the matches.
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Update to the 'most watched player' stat, with Dustin Fletcher having carved out a huge lead and the careers of his two nearest active rivals, Ben Johnson and Alan Didak, nearing an end.
Player|Gms|Crowd|Average
\Fletcher, Dustin|374|18,125,365|48,464
\Bartlett, Kevin|403|13,948,510|34,612
\Bradley, Craig|375|13,497,476|35,993
\Lloyd, Matthew|270|13,387,209|49,582
\Lucas, Scott|270|13,040,805|48,299
\Burns, Scott|264|12,833,708|48,613
\Buckley, Nathan|280|12,825,876|45,807
\Johnson, Ben L.|235|12,745,545|54,236
\Harvey, Robert|383|12,405,895|32,391
\Williams, Paul|306|12,291,008|40,167
\Hird, James|253|12,252,698|48,430
\Tarrant, Chris|268|12,245,277|45,691
\Davis, Leon|225|12,210,325|54,268
\O'Bree, Shane|246|12,158,636|49,425
\McLeod, Andrew|340|12,059,092|35,468Highest averages:
Player|Gms|Crowd|Average
\Cooke, Michael C.|2|162,627|81,313.50
\O'Brien, Denis|1|80,231|80,231.00
\Twomey, Wayde|2|160,059|80,029.50
\Roach, Danny|1|78,638|78,638.00
\Walker, John H.|1|72,659|72,659.00
\Thompson, Ben J.|1|71,501|71,501.00
\Pugsley, Andrew|5|345,083|69,016.60
\Banks, Matthew|3|204,088|68,029.33
\Witts, Jarrod|4|250,369|62,592.25
\Anderson, Jed|3|186,943|62,314.33
\Macaffer, Brent|43|2,679,151|62,305.84
\Whitcroft, Greg|4|249,038|62,259.50
\Rounds, Luke|6|370,356|61,726.00
\Toovey, Alan|114|6,924,231|60,738.87
\Sidebottom, Steele|99|5,999,010|60,596.06
\Reid, Ben|86|5,204,085|60,512.62
\Boumann, Jarrad|2|120,756|60,378.00
\Dwyer, Sam|12|723,821|60,318.42
\Fasolo, Alex|40|2,405,551|60,138.78
\Hider, Nick|2|120,248|60,124.00
\Wellingham, Sharrod|95|5,705,252|60,055.28
\Fletcher, Dustin|374|18,125,365|48,464
\Bartlett, Kevin|403|13,948,510|34,612
\Bradley, Craig|375|13,497,476|35,993
\Lloyd, Matthew|270|13,387,209|49,582
\Lucas, Scott|270|13,040,805|48,299
\Burns, Scott|264|12,833,708|48,613
\Buckley, Nathan|280|12,825,876|45,807
\Johnson, Ben L.|235|12,745,545|54,236
\Harvey, Robert|383|12,405,895|32,391
\Williams, Paul|306|12,291,008|40,167
\Hird, James|253|12,252,698|48,430
\Tarrant, Chris|268|12,245,277|45,691
\Davis, Leon|225|12,210,325|54,268
\O'Bree, Shane|246|12,158,636|49,425
\McLeod, Andrew|340|12,059,092|35,468
\Cooke, Michael C.|2|162,627|81,313.50
\O'Brien, Denis|1|80,231|80,231.00
\Twomey, Wayde|2|160,059|80,029.50
\Roach, Danny|1|78,638|78,638.00
\Walker, John H.|1|72,659|72,659.00
\Thompson, Ben J.|1|71,501|71,501.00
\Pugsley, Andrew|5|345,083|69,016.60
\Banks, Matthew|3|204,088|68,029.33
\Witts, Jarrod|4|250,369|62,592.25
\Anderson, Jed|3|186,943|62,314.33
\Macaffer, Brent|43|2,679,151|62,305.84
\Whitcroft, Greg|4|249,038|62,259.50
\Rounds, Luke|6|370,356|61,726.00
\Toovey, Alan|114|6,924,231|60,738.87
\Sidebottom, Steele|99|5,999,010|60,596.06
\Reid, Ben|86|5,204,085|60,512.62
\Boumann, Jarrad|2|120,756|60,378.00
\Dwyer, Sam|12|723,821|60,318.42
\Fasolo, Alex|40|2,405,551|60,138.78
\Hider, Nick|2|120,248|60,124.00
\Wellingham, Sharrod|95|5,705,252|60,055.28
Theorem: People obviously go to the footy to watch Alan Toovey. Highest average for players with >50 or >100 career matches.
Corollary: The AFL should encourage more players like Alan Toovey into their ranks.
Back of the Envelope: if 20% of the crowd yells "TOOV!" whenever Toovey touches the ball, and he has had 1,410 disposals in his career, then he has heard this yelled by roughly 17 million voices so far.
Attackers v Defenders
56.0% (65/116) of premiers have had a higher average points scored for the season than the runners-up.63.8% (74/116) of premiers have had a lower average points conceded for the season than the runners-up.
41.4% (48/116) of premiers had the highest average points scored for the season.
27.6% (32/116) of runners-up had the highest average points scored for the season.
44.0% (51/116) of premiers had the lowest average points conceded for the season.
24.1% (28/116) of runners-up had the lowest average points conceded for the season.
Matches against the current top 8 teams at round 15, 2013
It's notable that of the really famous attacking teams in league history, only Melbourne in 1940 and Richmond in 1980 actually managed to win the flag. The 1940 Melbourne team, against a Richmond defence closely descended from the brilliant 1934 unit that twice demolished South Melbourne's free-scoring attack, was helped by a wet Grand Final day that made attack much more crucial to winning than on firm turf. South Melbourne in 1934, Hawthorn in 1982 and Geelong in 1989 and 1992 were beaten by exceptionally strong defences, in three cases very easily.
The reputation of Geelong as a free-scoring and attacking team is very recent. In 1980, they were the solitary team with the defence to challenge the incomparable attack of Roach, Bartlett and Cloke. No critic from 1980 thought that Geelong would have done as badly in the 1980 Grand Final as the weaker Collingwood defence did against probably the best attack in league history. What changed Geelong's playing style to the form that attracted attention in the late 1980s was two disastrous seasons in 1982 and 1983 where they won only three of their last sixteen games each year and had by a margin of 163 points the worst attack.
The recruitment of Gary Ablett and Mark "Jacko" Jackson revolutionised Geelong's playing style very quickly.
Geelong's rankings in attack and defence in each of their premierships years. (Average points per match - for and against - complete season including finals.)
1925: 1st and 4th
1931: 4th and 2nd
1937: 3rd and 1st
1951: 2nd and 1st
1952: 1st and 2nd
1963: 5th and 2nd
2007: 1st and 1st
2009: 2nd and 2nd
2011: 1st and 2nd.
1925: 1st and 4th
1931: 4th and 2nd
1937: 3rd and 1st
1951: 2nd and 1st
1952: 1st and 2nd
1963: 5th and 2nd
2007: 1st and 1st
2009: 2nd and 2nd
2011: 1st and 2nd.
