Swing Bowling

[Devil Fish]

Guys, I'd like to know your thoughts on what conditions favour swing bowling. I am a swing bowler - Some weeks I swing the ball a long way, other weeks, I can't get 1 inch of swing. I've always found cloudy breezey conditions (not necessarily humid) are favourable but on Saturday just passed, I thought conditions were perfect & I could not get any swing at all. Very confusing. Thoughts?

 

[boof]

Guys, I'd like to know your thoughts on what conditions favour swing bowling. I am a swing bowler - Some weeks I swing the ball a long way, other weeks, I can't get 1 inch of swing. I've always found cloudy breezey conditions (not necessarily humid) are favourable but on Saturday just passed, I thought conditions were perfect & I could not get any swing at all. Very confusing. Thoughts?

Some times it is simply down to the ball. The simple fact of that matter is that some balls swing and you will get some that don't. The position of your wrist at the time of delivery and seam position are also the other important factors.

 

[~GURU~]

Guys, I'd like to know your thoughts on what conditions favour swing bowling. I am a swing bowler - Some weeks I swing the ball a long way, other weeks, I can't get 1 inch of swing. I've always found cloudy breezey conditions (not necessarily humid) are favourable but on Saturday just passed, I thought conditions were perfect & I could not get any swing at all. Very confusing. Thoughts?

Overcast cloudy day is the best for swing bowling.

But then it comes down to how you posistion the ball in your hands and how it comes out. That is propably the most important part about swing bowling. Technique

 

[R00StaR]

Theres so many factors, I too found cloudy overcast days best, but the breeze also made a difference. If you are predominately an outswing bowler pick the end to bowl that best suits.

Myself, I used to bowl predominately outswingers and would prefer a slight breeze from fine leg to mid on to bowl into. Often when bowling on song id also get a few to cut back in (swing out then cut back off the wicket), I knew I the seam was upright and coming out well when that happened.

Agree with both boof and guru, technique is the No1 factor however.

 

[GoSydneySwans]

I remember in an interview with Jason Gillespie he said that sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, all you can do is keep the seam straight and give it every opportunity to swing in case it's a swinging day.

 

[boof]

I remember in an interview with Jason Gillespie he said that sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, all you can do is keep the seam straight and give it every opportunity to swing in case it's a swinging day.

In fairness, Dizzy isn't the best swing bowler in the country.

 

[starz]

New ball
Overcast
Warm and overcast, even more-so.
Near the ocean for some reason
When one side heavier than the other.
Old ball + ^
Too much saliva on one side creates reverse swing due to heaviness (with old ball).
Hope that helps.

 

[GoSydneySwans]

In fairness, Dizzy isn't the best swing bowler in the country.

Yeah but you'd think that with all of his pace coaching he's had over the years he would've picked up enough to know how to swing it...actually putting it into practice may be another story.

 

[Devil Fish]

For the guys who play cricket in Melbourne, did any of you get the ball to swing on Saturday & how much? I only got a few balls to swing & it was only a little, which surprised me as it was overcast & quite windy.

 

[sting]

For the guys who play cricket in Melbourne, did any of you get the ball to swing on Saturday & how much? I only got a few balls to swing & it was only a little, which surprised me as it was overcast & quite windy.

A few of our guys were really swinging it , while the others really struggled .

It comes down to technique , the ability to have good seam and wrist position at the point of release . And ofcourse weather conditions can help.

 

[wang]

Type of ball has a big impact. 2 peice balls swing all day whereas a 4 peice ball will stop swinging very early unless you look after it well. Speed the ball is bowled also has a huge impact I beleive. Ive never faced a fast bowler who swung the ball.

 

[beatnik]

Too much saliva on one side creates reverse swing due to heaviness (with old ball).

yeah saliva works but not nearly as well as the gooey sugar lolly goo the poms were coating the ball with during Ashes past

Bracken was on the money in his comments about glucose lollies - he understandably backed off when WW3 broke out over it though

but Wasim was saying it all through the Ashes and, as he practically invented the art, I trust his judgement when he says reverse swing is about loading up one side with glucose etc

he says that reverse swinging teams have what is called a 'candy man' who usually sits in the slips and slaps on the gooey spit for others to rub in

ok, some pom is sure to come back and say "boo hiss, where's your proof?"

well, it is a little-remembered fact that Tresgothick was suspended, fined or disciplined by match referee (not sure which) in the 2001 Ashes series in England after he fell over on the field and a heap of glucose treats fell out of his pocket and all over the ground for all to see

(side note: when India used to do this, we used to call them cheats)

so I am hoping that the Aussies do away with the 'nice guys' code of conduct and get back to being a bunch of savage, ruthless muthas in next Ashes series

I hope we have our own 'candy man' but I hope they share the duties around as Tresgothick's big ass is testament to what comes of eating too many sweets...

peace

 

[fairdinkum]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...icket-ball-swing/story-e6frg7mf-1226374189922

THE widely held belief that moisture in the air during humid conditions helps make a cricket ball swing has been clean bowled in a scientific study.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...icket-ball-swing/story-e6frg7mf-1226374189922

Very interesting reading. Makes intuitive sense.

 

[DrVanNostrand]

I've always found bowing with a ball that is 10-15 overs old to be best for swing bowling. Hate opening the bowling, always demand to bowl first change.

I swing the ball a fair way into the right-hander, no idea how though. I keep my index and middle finger together on the seam, pull my wrist back as much as I can and let it go. Seems to work. Having an upright or rounded action has an effect as well (I have the former).

Swung the ball away as a kid, then a few years ago it just turned around on me. Bowled with a fair sling as a kid so I put it down to this.

I don't think I've ever noticed a cloudy/cool day to be better for swing. Candle wax on the trousers is far more effective.

 

[CAS79]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...icket-ball-swing/story-e6frg7mf-1226374189922



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...icket-ball-swing/story-e6frg7mf-1226374189922

Very interesting reading. Makes intuitive sense.

Interesting but Im hardly convinced as the bowlers over generations who tell you are hard to toss.

 

[Dipper]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...icket-ball-swing/story-e6frg7mf-1226374189922



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...icket-ball-swing/story-e6frg7mf-1226374189922

Very interesting reading. Makes intuitive sense.

I remember as a kid in England watching the BBC TV coverage and they said that they used to get loads of letters from scientists saying that it was impossible for a cricket ball to swing and that it was just an optical illusion!

Usually they say that cloudy/humid conditions are good for swinging almost like the 2 are synonimous, but I guess from this research they're saying that the moisture content in the air is unimportant and it's the cloud that is the major factor.So although cloudy conditions create humidity that's not the crucial factor.

I don't think anybody can completely nail down exactly why a cricket ball swings, obviously they shine one side to create an aerodynamic differential and I'm sure that helps but I've seen the first ball of a match swing like a mother so it's clearly not critical.Derek Pringle (who was a decent enough swing bowler) once wrote an article saying that whilst the shine helped it was all down to the seam, he said it was like a rudder and the aim was to get it revolving perfectly back on its line & it would direct the ball if conditions allowed and that is why brand new balls swing.

Reverse swing is even more interesting when they were trying to dissect it back here years ago they were putting forward all kinds of hypothesise and a lot of players that had played in teams who faced it and then worked out how to do it themselves, such as Atherton, completely disagreed with the idea that it was a weight differential that caused it.They kept going on about everyone trying to keep the ball completely dry and fielders not being allowed to touch it with sweaty hands.

There was even a 3 page article in the Sunday Times that tried to definitively show what caused reverse swing, they actually said that it was little stucking out bits of leather on the rough side that caused small pockets of turbulence that made that side go faster through the air than the smooth side, they said like a shark's skin which is rough and moves better aerodynamically through the water than if it was smooth.I always thought this was a crock of shit because what they are asking you to beleive is that the smooth side of a cricket ball moves faster through the air than the none shiny side and then all of a sudden a point of critical mass is reached whereby the rough side is suddenly more aeordynamically efficent.

I've always thought that it was one side getting heavier that caused reverse, if you watch reverse swing it starts to go much sooner after leaving the hand than orthodox, and if you've played tennis ball cricket with one side of the ball taped it starts to go really early as well.

I turned the telly on once, didn't hear any commentary but England are bowling, I think it was Trent Bridge, it looked a shiity day and the ball swung and I thought to myself that looked like reverse the way the ball started to swing so early but I thought it couldn't be because of the waether and time of year, then the commentary comes on and they say 'England are gettinhg it to reverse' and that kind of proved to me that I was right in my view of how reverse just looks different to orthodox and just starts to go a lot closer to release and I think that only be do to a weight difference and not aerodynamics.

I've never really understand why some bowlers can reverse a cricket ball but not bowl orthodox, Flintoff was a perfect example, don't think I ever saw him swing a ball with orthodox but was a fine reverse swing bowler.

Simon Jones was the same, got a reputation as an old ball reverse swing specialist couldn't bowl orthodox swing and then in 2005 he came out for the 1st Test against Bangladesh, typical English May conditions and he's bowling with Hoggard who was a good swing bowler and he's swinging it miles further than him, admittedly bowling a fuller length, and obviously bowling quicker and I assumed that he'd worked with Troy Cooley that winter who'd probably said if you can bowl reverse you can bowl orthodox.

 

[fairdinkum]

^Good post, Dipper.

 

[Old Skool]

It's all about seam positioning and body mechanics.

I have played cricket with blokes that could swing a brick.

 

[Miqar_Baqfhied]

When it comes to swiing bowling there is way too much emphasis on external conditions.

If you want a ball to swing you need to learn how to bowl with the seam dead straight. This 'art' has died in recent decades. Top bowlers still struggle to do it. Have a look at Morne Morkel and Mithchell Johnson as examples. And everyone wonders why the ball dont swing no more.

Look at the best swing bowlers over history like Akram, Alderman, Massie, and more modern day players like the bowlologist (Fleming) and Jimmy Anderson - the thing they do best is consistently have the seam dead straight. Its quite simple really!

 

[Tex_21]

^^ watch clips of Malcolm Marshall bowling. Fast, accurate and swung. But Malcolm was a once in a lifetime bowler.

The debate over the 'sling' action also has merit - if not completely for 'swing'. With that action, often the ball is let go from a wider position (see Malinga, who lets it go from right in front of the umpire), and the different angle gives the appearance of swing to the batsman, added with genuine swing (something Malinga also gets, as does Tait) is a huge handful.

 

[Miqar_Baqfhied]

Just on Dippers post talking about reverse swing happening 'earlier' - I think the thing that makes reverse swing so potent is that it happens to so late. The ball shapes to swing in one direction but at the last split second goes the other way. Thats why it get quality batsmen (look at the Aussis in 2005 England for example).

Top batsman can play a swinging ball without too much problems. Its late swing that does them cos they play for the shape of the ball out the bowlers hand and initially once the ball leaves their hand.

Check out a couple of Simon Jones' dismissals in that Ashes series - think he got Michael Clarke bowled a couple of times.

Wasim Akram and Waqar Younis were also masters of toe crushing reverse swinging yorkers.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I reckon there are three stages the cricket ball goes through.

Seam Swing
A brand new ball swings. Rough and shiny sides have not yet come into effect. This is because the seam is slightly raised. The rougher and more abrasive the surface and the harder the pitch, the quicker the raised seam gets worn down.

That article about humidity not having an impact hits the nail on the head. The conditions in the air don't impact on the ball. But usually areas that have high humidity also have green, lush outfields, well grassed pitch squares and moisture in the deck. As a result the ball doesn't age as quickly and the "seam swing" lasts longer.

So bowlers make the link that humidity = swing. In reality it is the impact climate has on the pitch and surrounds, and in turn what this does to the ball.

Shine Swing
Once the seam gets worn down and the ball becomes 'rounder' that is when rough side/shiny side is the decisive factor. Again, the "humid" conditions that deliver the green, lush, less abrasive surfaces means that you can keep the ball shiny for longer.

Reverse Swing
The final stage - as others have discussed above.

On the very rough surfaces where the ball ages quickly the reverse swing is achieved more quickly. The seam needs to be worn down as much as possible and the ball almost completely round for reverse swing to take effect.

There are two schools of thought with reverse swing and I have seen both work:
1) load up one side with as much sweat, spit and glucose as possible and it picks up dirt, dust along the way
2) polish one side but keep it as dry as possible, no moisture at all

I was 'schooled' on the first method but some players that have come back to our club from state cricket preach the second method.

Again, (apart from the techinique of the bowler, seam position) I think the most decisive factor with regards to swing bowling is the condition of the pitch, the pitch square and the outfield and in turn what impact this has on the age of the ball.

 

[Black Diamond]

Swinging the ball is largely because of a bowlers natural action.

Also, the very tall fast men like McGrath tend not to be swing bowlers. Normally it's those around 6ft mark who do it best.

 

[Marklar_33]

What I have found, over many years, is that I swing the ball prodigiously on windy days. Cloud cover seems to help, but that could just be that the wind is up more in these conditions

By windy, I don't mean sitting the ball up and letting the breeze do all the work! I bowl predominantly inswing to the right-handers, and if the breeze comes from fine-leg, then the resistance caused when the ball heads that way gives me great movement in the air

I'm also a believer that body position is not nearly as important as wrist position. I have been filmed swinging the ball both ways with no change of action, although an alert batsman could spot the wrist positioning

I'm not an expert on this matter, but I was once told by an umpire who has done nearly 50 years service in the league that he's only ever seen one guy swing it more than me

 

[gbatman]

Conditions are just part of it. You need angle on the seem and most of the time a ball bowled with just a little angle is the best because it swings later and not too much. Some times you need to have more angle on the seem to force it to swing. Just look at Hilfenhaus compared to McGrath. McGrath never got a great deal of seam angle but he moved the ball late and never a huge ammount which can be more dangerous and harder to detect. A lot of people say McGrath didn't swing it, truth is he did but when it's only swinging the width of a bat or a bit more over 22 yards and swinging late it's hard to pick up. Hawkeye and watching some McGrath DVD's proved that he did swing it in the best way possible, just a little and late. Also sometimes he got it to move and sometimes he didn't which made him unpredictable. Hilfenhaus puts a heap of angle on the ball, gets a heap of swing and very rarely doesn't get any swing, he also swings it early and it's easy to pick up but still when he gets it right, he is so hard to play regardless of how early and how much he moves it.

If you find it's not swinging you can try a few things like changing ends, make sure if it's a cross wind that the wind is assisting your swing or chose to bowl into the wind. Work on the angle of the seam, perhaps work on bowling a ball where the seam points to first slip for normal swing and also a ball that you may hold with the seam slightly accross and run your fingers down the crossed seam so that it comes out spinning with the seam up and pointing more to 2nd/3rd slip like Hilfenhaus. Also if you are pretty shap you can take a bit of pace off the odd ball to see if that helps it to move. Most of all, bowl as full as you can, more time in the air means it has more of a chance to move. There is also a chance that perhaps your action changes a bit from game to game and sometimes the seam just comes out too straight or too scrambled. Basic rule, if your fingers are pointing pack over the top of your head, and your arm comes down accross your body then it should be swinging out.