Opinion Sydney Swans Academy and Rebuild

[RUNVS]

No, for all picks.

First rounders are the ones everyone is upset at

 

[Mr Meow]

Which is ironic as the best player for the Swans yesterday was a Western Australian who went pick 39 in the 2019 draft.

One of the very best players of the AFL era was a player who would've been a late second round pick at best who just happened to have a famous Dad.

 

[Walshawk]

First rounders are the ones everyone is upset at

Keep it simple and consistent.

 

[VinnieB]

We couldn't because he wanted to stay in Melbourne, regardless of having ties to the swans.

Did he? I thought the Swans passed on him.

Dunkley nominates for father-son selection

Draft prospect Josh Dunkley today elected to nominate the Sydney Swans under the father-son rule.

www.sydneyswans.com.au

 

[bloodsbigot]

Did he? I thought the Swans passed on him.

Dunkley nominates for father-son selection

Draft prospect Josh Dunkley today elected to nominate the Sydney Swans under the father-son rule.

www.sydneyswans.com.au

The swans passed on him because he told them privately that he wanted to stay in Victoria.

 

[SSSSSS]

I don't mind the academies. Interstate teams need priority access to talent that is likely to stay and we need to grow the game to accommodate all these teams.

It's the points system that needs to be overhauled.

It's silly to stockpile a bunch of dogshit picks and somehow make it a 1st/2nd rounder.

 

[lordbob]

I don't mind the academies. Interstate teams need priority access to talent that is likely to stay and we need to grow the game to accommodate all these teams.

It's the points system that needs to be overhauled.

It's silly to stockpile a bunch of dogshit picks and somehow make it a 1st/2nd rounder.

think its a pretty weak argument to say that swans need academies to get players who will stay and then on the flip side they were able to attract player like franklin purely because they werent in victoria.

The swans dont seem to have an issue attracting top end talent, grundy and taylor adams this year as further examples.

Their access to academy players in the first round is an unfair advantage just as their cola allowance was prior to the buddy franklin signing.

Either all clubs should have access to academies or no clubs should, with the exception to expansion clubs who havent yet had the time to have enough past players to have access to father sons/daughters.

What is the difference between the swans having an academy in sydney and another vic team having an academy in say NT. If both are helping to develop local talent that would otherwise not have the opportunity or access to necessary training and pathways to making to the elite level, then what does it matter?

Give all clubs the same access to academy picks eg from first round onwards and then clubs will be more incentivised to invest in their academies. Better for the comp, better for the kids, better for the clubs.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

I don't mind the academies. Interstate teams need priority access to talent that is likely to stay and we need to grow the game to accommodate all these teams.

It's the points system that needs to be overhauled.

It's silly to stockpile a bunch of dogshit picks and somehow make it a 1st/2nd rounder.

All teams are interstate teams.

Just depends on your location

 

[SSSSSS]

think its a pretty weak argument to say that swans need academies to get players who will stay and then on the flip side they were able to attract player like franklin purely because they werent in victoria.

The swans dont seem to have an issue attracting top end talent, grundy and taylor adams this year as further examples.

Their access to academy players in the first round is an unfair advantage just as their cola allowance was prior to the buddy franklin signing.

Either all clubs should have access to academies or no clubs should, with the exception to expansion clubs who havent yet had the time to have enough past players to have access to father sons/daughters.

What is the difference between the swans having an academy in sydney and another vic team having an academy in say NT. If both are helping to develop local talent that would otherwise not have the opportunity or access to necessary training and pathways to making to the elite level, then what does it matter?

Give all clubs the same access to academy picks eg from first round onwards and then clubs will be more incentivised to invest in their academies. Better for the comp, better for the kids, better for the clubs.

Grundy and Taylor Adams aren't top end talent. Both were pushed out of their respective clubs?

I know the thread is about Sydney but I was speaking of all interstate academies (GWS, GC, Lions and Sydney). I think all interstate academies are fine and I'm happy for them to have priority access to these players but they should be made to pay an appropriate amount to access the talent rather than a hodgepodge of 3rd and 4th round pick.

If they rate them, make them pay for them. They of all clubs will have almost half a decade or more intel to make the call of whether the draftee is worth the selection or not.

FWIW I also believe the same should apply to NGA and F&S selections. If you rate them, pay up.

 

[SSSSSS]

All teams are interstate teams.

Just depends on your location

Sure but you already know which clubs I was referring to.

 

[RUNVS]

Did he? I thought the Swans passed on him.

Dunkley nominates for father-son selection

Draft prospect Josh Dunkley today elected to nominate the Sydney Swans under the father-son rule.

www.sydneyswans.com.au

Yes, and Dunkley basically said "Do not match a bid on me if a Victorian team calls my name"

 

[Maddo11]

Did he? I thought the Swans passed on him.

Dunkley nominates for father-son selection

Draft prospect Josh Dunkley today elected to nominate the Sydney Swans under the father-son rule.

www.sydneyswans.com.au

He did that so he didn't end up in Perth or Adelaide. He requested we don't match if bid on by a Melbourne based team

 

[lordbob]

Grundy and Taylor Adams aren't top end talent. Both were pushed out of their respective clubs?

I know the thread is about Sydney but I was speaking of all interstate academies (GWS, GC, Lions and Sydney). I think all interstate academies are fine and I'm happy for them to have priority access to these players but they should be made to pay an appropriate amount to access the talent rather than a hodgepodge of 3rd and 4th round pick.

If they rate them, make them pay for them. They of all clubs will have almost half a decade or more intel to make the call of whether the draftee is worth the selection or not.

FWIW I also believe the same should apply to NGA and F&S selections. If you rate them, pay up.

Im not against the academies at all. just think all teams should have the option to have similar access and by extension encourage greater investment into under developed youth pathways eg NGA. ie not this can only match after pick 40 bs where swans can match any pick.

And franklin was top end, top of the top even. Tippet before him was also a top end talent.

 

[legend166]

In the last 10 years we've lost a future Brownlow winner (Mitchell), multiple players who are now captains of their club (Nankervis and Dawson) and All Australians (Aliir). Two of Carlton's best 22 (Newman and Hewett) are players we couldn't keep.

 

[Muddiemoose]

In the last 10 years we've lost a future Brownlow winner (Mitchell), multiple players who are now captains of their club (Nankervis and Dawson) and All Australians (Aliir). Two of Carlton's best 22 (Newman and Hewett) are players we couldn't keep.

Dont disagree with the point of ou are trying to make but Nank is a shocking example was 4th fiddle at the time behind Tippett, Sinclair and Naithsmith but Nank was ready to play at afl level

That wasn’t anything to do with Sydney being a northern club it’s just that he wanted opportunity

He’s not even from Victoria

Would be like a tigers fan complaining that we couldn’t keep Soldo and blaming something apart from the fact it was he was a number 1 ruck stuck playing as a number 2

 

[GC2015]

The AFL can still do it without the 4 northern clubs being given exclusive access.

The AFL tried this and it was nowhere near as successful. Remember the NSW scholarship program that was available to all 16 clubs prior to 2010? It really only produced one standout player in Taylor Walker and even that wasn't a guarantee. Like it or not, the current northern academy programs are by far the best developmental tools that the AFL has ever put together for the northern states and increasing the draft talent pool is a good thing for those who don't know.

If you remove the incentive of priority access for the northern teams then they'll go the same way of the NGAs when the AFL removed first and second round access and that's not what the AFL wants when it's trying to expand the game in QLD & NSW.

In the last 10 years we've lost a future Brownlow winner (Mitchell), multiple players who are now captains of their club (Nankervis and Dawson) and All Australians (Aliir). Two of Carlton's best 22 (Newman and Hewett) are players we couldn't keep.

Southerners want to ignore facts like this because it doesn't suit their narrative. Look at the way Izak Rankine is playing for the Crows at the moment and tell me SA clubs aren't in a more naturally advantageous position when it comes to retaining/recruiting top end players compared to Queensland clubs. The same can be said about Jordan Dawson with the Swans.

 

[Spirit Level]

I haven't read this thread but I'm guessing the posts are something like:

WA/SA/Vic fans: The academy allowances are grossly out of whack and the Northern teams get an incredibly unfair advantage over the rest of the competition.

Northern fans: YoU CanT TAke Our AcAdEmiEs wE DeSErVe tHem We nEEd a SilVeR SPooN tO StAy ReleVant.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

I haven't read this thread but I'm guessing the posts are something like:

WA/SA/Vic fans: The academy allowances are grossly out of whack and the Northern teams get an incredibly unfair advantage over the rest of the competition.

Northern fans: YoU CanT TAke Our AcAdEmiEs wE DeSErVe tHem We nEEd a SilVeR SPooN tO StAy ReleVant.

Im waiting for homesick NSW players

 

[boncer34]

The AFL tried this and it was nowhere near as successful. Remember the NSW scholarship program that was available to all 16 clubs prior to 2010? It really only produced one standout player in Taylor Walker and even that wasn't a guarantee. Like it or not, the current northern academy programs are by far the best developmental tools that the AFL has ever put together for the northern states and increasing the draft talent pool is a good thing for those who don't know.

If you remove the incentive of priority access for the northern teams then they'll go the same way of the NGAs when the AFL removed first and second round access and that's not what the AFL wants when it's trying to expand the game in QLD & NSW.

Yes after it failed the AFL developed a better program and the 4 northern clubs are benefiting.

There is nothing to suggest the academy programs would fall away if the AFL took them over, your NGA example is not like for like because the clubs still pay for them, so yes they pay less due to the less rewards.

I'm simply stating the AFL could very easily take over the existing academies and we'd still see the same level of players coming out that we're seeing now, except it doesn't give the 4 Northern clubs exclusive rights to outbid the 14 remaining clubs.

 

[Muddiemoose]

Forgive my ignorance on the subject but it’s simply because I don’t follow the sport but how does the NRL work in terms of Melbourne and player recruitment and retention from northern states?
Do they have any advantages over northern clubs?

 

[The 747]

Forgive my ignorance on the subject but it’s simply because I don’t follow the sport but how does the NRL work in terms of Melbourne and player recruitment and retention from northern states?
Do they have any advantages over northern clubs?

I think in the NRL you can just sign whoever you like.

 

[GC2015]

I'm simply stating the AFL could very easily take over the existing academies and we'd still see the same level of players coming out that we're seeing now, except it doesn't give the 4 Northern clubs exclusive rights to outbid the 14 remaining clubs.

If you genuinely believe that then you don't understand what's going on in the northern states. You've got a far too simplitic outlook on how challenging this situation really is. Fortunately, you're not the one making the decision on this and the AFL appears to be fairly committed to continuing with the northern academy model for the foreseeable future.

For the record, northern teams have won just two premierships in the last 20 years and NONE in the academy era (2013-).

 

[Spirit Level]

Im waiting for homesick NSW players

You won't have homesick NSW kids cause Sydney just gets to draft them all

 

[boncer34]

If you genuinely believe that then you don't understand what's going on in the northern states. You've got a far too simplitic outlook on how challenging this situation really is. Fortunately, you're not the one making the decision on this and the AFL appears to be fairly committed to continuing with the northern academy model for the foreseeable future.

For the record, northern teams have won just two premierships in the last 20 years and NONE in the academy era (2013-).

Considering you cut my post because I pointed out the flaw in your logic leaves me fairly comfortable with my position.

 

[SM]

I don’t have a problem with academies, but you can’t compare them with F/S. F/S is available to all clubs. It may be luck or possibly early club talent identification and support, as to why some clubs have had more success than others.

The Pies for instance have had more F/S busts than successes.

Can you imagine if the Swans listed Dunkley as a F/S?

We couldn't because he chose to stay in Victoria..