Review The Controlled how do we fix it thread

[Cap]

Well that sucked again.

I hope the mods will help me out here, I want to keep the debate to a decent level, I really don't want to hear OMG sack Craig or individual players being singled out because this really achieves nothing.

Now I also realise this is a fourm so this thread really won't help the Crows but it will make me feel better

So the major issues that have come to light after the start of the season

• We have minimal depth based on actual ability..plenty on potential
• Our ball movement has stagnated to the point the leading has become difficult for a forward.
• Not only are our forwards getting it less they aren't kicking straight.
• Our game plan, which relies heavily on high skill level isn't working due to a combination of poor form, injuries and perhaps its wrong for the players we have.
• Our senior players whilst being serviceable haven't done what we probably needed
• We really miss Bock probably more so than anyone expected
• We don't seem to have a viable plan b
• We have a really nice training facility....

My problem is how do we fix to at least remain competitive and not embarrass the club?

 

[ManInTheArena]

• When we get "stuck" in a handball frenzy and look like we are going to turn it over, hack it forward 50 meters
• Play players on form regardless of "status", reward youger players for good form e.g. Out: Edwards or Doughty In:Jaensch
• Have a flexible game plan that can be "tweaked" during the game
• Drop Douglas, he will never make it as an AFL player
• We are not Geelong, kick the ball and don't hand ball backwards all the time
• Clone Dangerfield

 

[Cap]

It also seems that our forward line becomes really congested, despite claims of "clearing out the forward line" we never seem to have a free forward?

what happened to creating space and room to lead?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

The slow upward curve continues. Bit better again tonight and in the early part of the first quarter and the latter part of the second quarter we actually played some Good Football, something we haven't done in any games so far this season.

Gives me some hope at least that we can beat Port, Richmond and the Kangas in the next three games.

There are some things that are unfixable in the short term like our midfield depth. The Bulldogs eventually just overran us with quality at the stoppages and across the middle of the ground.

That is the No. 1 priority as far as I see and the problem will only get worse when Goodwin, McLeod and Edwards go. Would we be prepared to burn a player or a first round draft pick to add some instant depth to our midfield?

 

[cmndstab]

Can people please try to actually post in the spirit of this thread? There are plenty of other threads around to have a whinge in. I'm getting sick of deleting posts here.

I'm not so sure specifically how we can fix it, but I can identify a couple of specific areas that are getting on my nerves beyond the usual blanket statements like "kick it more" and "the gameplan is crap".


- In way too many clearances for it to be coincidence, we look like we're about to get our hands on the ball, only for a desperate opposition fist to knock it clear of the pack. Inevitably, an opposition player ends up with the ball. Are we setting up with too many numbers too close to the stoppage? Or should we be the ones throwing the desperate fist in? Not quite sure what the ticket is here.
- On a similar vein, why are we unable to force goals from ground level anymore? Today we see several goals from Bulldogs players running towards the goal square and getting a foot to it. It was only his first game, but Henderson (who I thought had a good debut) frustrated me when Dangerfield contested and brought the ball to ground level in the goal square, and Hendo half-heartedly jogged towards the ball, which sat up perfectly for him. All we needed was him to show some desperation and it would have been a certain goal. That story can be repeated for several players this year.
- Low spearing kicks that are being cut off. Good on the Crows for trying to kick dart-like balls, but you have to do it intelligently. No point trying to kick a head-high ball through the middle of a zone!

I could go on. Just lots of little things at the moment. To be honest I thought our overall standard was a lot better today, but there were lots of little things that we were punished for.

 

[ManInTheArena]

It also seems that our forward line becomes really congested, despite claims of "clearing out the forward line" we never seem to have a free forward?

what happened to creating space and room to lead?

That's probably because we get it in there too slowly, we are never catching the opposition "off guard". By the time we hand ball it 10 times in the defensive 50 the flood is on.

 

[SydCrow]

the good news was the intensity and tackle count was much better

also the skill level

so we now have a base-line to work off - we can't blame lack of pressure or players being out of form any longer

so the problem is the game style. as we heard ad nauseum from the experts tonight - too much handball and with the bulldogs pressure, too many turnovers

the crows are trying to play a quick handball game but it's high risk and not working. the zone seemed to work OK but the turnovers got us again

what is the answer - more play on and run and obviously more kicking?

we are also still getting smashed out of the middle - the lack of class in our midfield was exposed again, thank god boyd wasn't playing

we have plenty of talent and endeavour - we just need to get some reward for it

 

[amer]

We have the list to seriously attack this thing, but we're forced to watch a side playing to but a small fraction of what it's capable of, that's the most frustrating aspect.

There are two players I'm not at all happy with at the moment, Doughty and Burton. As others have suggested, Dogga looks like a bloke who went one year beyond what he should have. He's working class, decreasingly mobile, not creative, wrong side of 30. Exactly the sort who after an 0-5 start should be relegated, particularly when we've got a creative footballer with pace and talent to burn (Jaensch) who would benefit from an opportunity.

With all due respect to Burton, he is a lot of the reason our forward structure appears frustrated in my opinion. The consistency with which he runs across into a team mate's space (Tippett especially), dragging an extra opponent to what should ideally for us be a one-out contest, is unbelievable. It's nonsensical. We're 0-5 now and we have an elite forward talent who didn't front up for us tonight. We should be investing time in the Walker/Tippett combination so the dynamic can settle itself. Absolute waste the way we're handling it at present.

"Waste" more or less sums up how I'm feeling about this season. We were put under the pump from the start with a raft of injuries, and the lack of ruthlessness in how we handle struggling senior players is now stalling the development of some exceptionally talented players. If the rough pre season is going to de-rail our flag push, I at least want progress in other areas. Make some gutsy changes please!

 

[Cap]

The forward line is an issue which I think Riggy pointed out, it is terribly dysfunctional at the moment

 

[Smoooothy]

i think it's simple. what they offered in the last quarter was what we've been missing all year. run with the ball, use the handball only when you absolutely have to, and kick to a leading forward.

how much better did we look when this happened.

also, get rid of this zone, it's not working, do not persist with it!

 

[ManInTheArena]

The forward line is an issue which I think Riggy pointed out, it is terribly dysfunctional at the moment

I'm not a Burton hater and I know he has leadership ability but I think he needs to play on the wing and give the forward line to Tippett, Walker, Porps, Knights and co. I think Burton messes up the dynamics, Tippett played well when Burton wasn't there much in the last quarter.

 

[Cap]

listening to Craigs presser he really hasn't offered much..yet

the good part is he does at least sound concerned and passionate.

Can you tweak a gameplan in a week?

 

[Allbetsroff]

I'm not a Burton hater and I know he has leadership ability but I think he needs to play on the wing and give the forward line to Tippett, Walker, Porps, Knights and co. I think Burton messes up the dynamics, Tippett played well when Burton wasn't there much in the last quarter.

I think he needs to not play at all, he gets in the way of other forwards too often.

 

[afc1991]

The slow upward curve continues. Bit better again tonight and in the early part of the first quarter and the latter part of the second quarter we actually played some Good Football, something we haven't done in any games so far this season.

Gives me some hope at least that we can beat Port, Richmond and the Kangas in the next three games.

There are some things that are unfixable in the short term like our midfield depth. The Bulldogs eventually just overran us with quality at the stoppages and across the middle of the ground.

That is the No. 1 priority as far as I see and the problem will only get worse when Goodwin, McLeod and Edwards go. Would we be prepared to burn a player or a first round draft pick to add some instant depth to our midfield?

Good post.

The first half was a bit better. It was good to see us lift after dangers goal when it looked like the game was gone in the 2nd. The next couple of goals probably provided us with more highlights than the other 4 games combined, which is promising but terribly sad at the same time.

On that form we may beat average sides. Though it seems the year will be half over before we get going, game over.

 

[aneale]

I'n not sure it can under the current regime unless something desperate happens with gameplan.

fact is we have been playing the same way now for 5 years, we basically invented it, and then remained the same. Other Clubs, like Hawthorn, tweaked how we played. Others have just seen it so often its easy to unravel

When fully fit and firing it will come off more times than not. Underdone, kids playing in their first dozen games, skills below par and the thing is shithouse. It is too labour intensive and complicated if everything is not working.

We have gone back to plan B. How we are playing is the plan B,its the zone set up to keep opposition teams down and allow us the ability to kick 13-14 goals to win a game. For a period last year, when Craig finally had the cattle he needed to fulfil his gameplan we saw Plan A. Attacking, running in waves, less defensive football. Under pressure its still comes unstuck because it requires pinpoint precision.

So, How do we fix it. It can be fixed quickly. We either need everyone with 120+ games in them or 22 blokes who went top 10.

The problem with this way of playing it will suit some and it won't suit others altho' they are all expected to play their part. Cook is ****ed under this structure, the kid can't kick and never will be able to, he can't play under Craig with disposal that ordinary because he must not miss targets, he isn't out of form, he just can't kick. A fully fit list and he is at South Adelaide unquestionably. Thommo is out of form and dodgy at best and he looks terrible, Edwards' legs are going and he can't be precise and he looks terrible, So many of them are out of form but still insist on trying to thread the eye of the needle, it just will not work.

Skills coach, a proper one

Kicking coach, a proper one

Goal kicking coach, preferably a forward

Beers after training, if these guys are having fun i'll kiss my own arse. The over the top defending of Craig not being a gormless scientist reeks of script writing

Recruiting, stop ****ing well recruiting vanilla choirboys. Yes they look good, yes they are highly skilled, yes they speak well, yes they will never get reported. Other types win premiership medals too. You need a balance. I'd trade Cross or Boyd for Vince and McKay some days.

Trade, it's that simple. Unpleasant as it is, it brought to this Club our best period of success. I'd happily throw Thommo to GC for a decent pick. Rendell has shown he can pick them.

 

[Cap]

on Rendell I don't understand the callers on 5AA bagging him, he has done an exceptional job IMO.

I also agree our current regime doesn't seem to have a great amount of room for non-standard players, I wonder if someone has pointed that out to Craig or if he cares I guess.

 

[SydCrow]

re the forward line

• Tippett at FF obviously is a winner
• Porps - great signs tonight
• Burton showed enough I thought tonight - taking him out would leave a big hole
• Danger - **** me how good is he - if he doesn't kill himself he could win a Brownlow
• I want to see Hendo there again - he looks a bit like Tex but with more toe
• Knights still isn't right - I hope he wasn't off the ground getting a shot for his foot
• I'm worried about Petrenko - fantastic attack on the ball but needs to get it and use it better
• Dougie - his good is very good but ...

if we could only get the ball in there quickly - preferably out of the middle

 

[ManInTheArena]

I think he needs to not play at all, he gets in the way of other forwards too often.

Well he won't do that on the wing, he used to play there. It's worth a go like Richo.

 

[Cap]

I wonder if Hendo will get another shot in the Showdown?

What about the big J? Surely if we have pace as an issue he gets a gig.

I would also suggest that getting BOcky back will help significantly weather that is a good thing i'm not sure.

 

[Smoooothy]

seriously, what the hell are you on about???

please enlighten us

 

[SydCrow]

on Rendell I don't understand the callers on 5AA bagging him, he has done an exceptional job IMO.

I also agree our current regime doesn't seem to have a great amount of room for non-standard players, I wonder if someone has pointed that out to Craig or if he cares I guess.

how do you define non-standard? that's a pretty big generalisation

Tippett, Henderson, Petrenko, Walker what is standard about them?

 

[Allbetsroff]

Well he won't do that on the wing, he used to play there. It's worth a go like Richo.

Yeah, but does he have the fitness and legs to do that anymore, I mean looking at his kicking tonight and really last year as well, there is no penetration in those kicks.

At his age does he have the engine, speed and kick to play on the wing?

 

[SydCrow]

Yeah, but does he have the fitness and legs to do that anymore, I mean looking at his kicking tonight and really last year as well, there is no penetration in those kicks.

At his age does he have the engine, speed and kick to play on the wing?

yeah that one from 50 was pathetic wasn't it?

 

[Cap]

how do you define non-standard? that's a pretty big generalisation

Tippett, Henderson, Petrenko, Walker what is standard about them?

Sorry probably the wrong word.

but blokes who aren't stock standard take a mark, give a kick or handball.

Blokes with a bit of x factor who break the rules a bit i'm thinking Dacios or a Davis type player.

 

[ManInTheArena]

Yeah, but does he have the fitness and legs to do that anymore, I mean looking at his kicking tonight and really last year as well, there is no penetration in those kicks.

At his age does he have the engine, speed and kick to play on the wing?

Yes he has one of the biggest tanks in the AFL.