" The Last Dance " on Netflix 5pm AEST

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Cleavy

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Nov 28, 2004
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DIG

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Nah I don’t get the criticisms over the timelines. I thought it was perfect. Slowly going through the 98 season while also building through all the years prior. The little graphic was helpful too and they used the two primary timelines to tie in key rivalries.
 

DIG

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Such an outstanding show. Absolutely loved it.

Playing one of my favourite PJ songs at the end was just awesome too.

I loved that little look MJ gives Longley after he dished it off to him and Luc almost misses the lay-up - they were f’ed if he bungled that!

I’ve seen one NBA game live, in early 2017 at Madison Square. Watching Carmelo Anthony and the Knicks vs the Bulls with both sides already out of the running....despite the situation I had the friggn best night but I couldn’t help but think Jesus - how good would this fixture have been back in ‘93...
 

fidstar

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I’ve seen one NBA game live, in early 2017 at Madison Square. Watching Carmelo Anthony and the Knicks vs the Bulls with both sides already out of the running....despite the situation I had the friggn best night but I couldn’t help but think Jesus - how good would this fixture have been back in ‘93...
First game I saw was Knicks vs Bulls as well. Back in the late 00s. They both sucked back then too, but at least Rose made it fun.
 

peternorth

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I didnt notice the timelines on reflection. The timeline diagram wizzed and whirled fairly quickly i couldnt focus on the date. But for mine it didnt matter. It was just fun
 

Venkman

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lol the pizza guy saying the whole hotel smelled like cigar smoke. imo Lebron can't be the goat unless he smokes cigars. It's like the ultimate troll - i'm going dominate you and kill my lungs at the same time.
 

UnitedWarrior93

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lol the pizza guy saying the whole hotel smelled like cigar smoke. imo Lebron can't be the goat unless he smokes cigars. It's like the ultimate troll - i'm going dominate you and kill my lungs at the same time.
MJ been smoking 6 cigars a day for god knows how long, his lungs must be cooked.
 

Cyber_punk

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Up to ep 6, He is just as intense and competitive as his playing days. Most of these "Alpha" types chill out with age, but when he talks about slights/rivalries or losses you can still see and hear the fire in him as if it were 90's MJ
 

UnitedWarrior93

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I totally forgot Steve Kerr went to the Spurs after 98’ where he won another championship, 4 in a row, then was there to win his 5th as a player in 2003.
 

hamG

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wouldn't players order food under an assumed name?
Sif Jordan deigned to order his own pizza. His pal did it. It was delivered to a hotel right? Straight to the room? And I aint no media hound but pretty sure the entire city saw the Bulls rock up to a specific hotel on the news. If the story was true I reckon Jordan's guy called the hotel desk / concierge and asked them to order a pizza for them. And the guy probably looked up the room records on his Pentium 1 and told his pal at his go-to pizza place for hotel customers who it was for.

One observation I will add I don't think there are many off the shelf things out there that result in massive spewing. Shitting absolutely, but spewing? Also not like they had rancid spew food on the shelf waiting. Or maybe they did? Hah.
 

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Scotland

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I totally forgot Steve Kerr went to the Spurs after 98’ where he won another championship, 4 in a row, then was there to win his 5th as a player in 2003.
Understandable. Everyone knows Kerr because he is the Warriors coach, but he played 10 years in Chicago/San Antonio (one year in Portland in there) and started one game. In 3 playoff runs with the Spurs he averaged about 8 minutes and 3 points a game. I reckon a few people watching The Last Dance learned for the first time that he is an ex player.
 

PP34

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ok controversial comment time - as good as that was, it was a massive mj vanity project. I really liked the non mj parts the most - Steve Kerr, Kukoc, Pippen. MJ is a massive figure in bball, the biggest, so I get why they went that way but for me more about the team, rather than the mj story, would have been better.
It was disappointing for me to hear that MJ’a company was heavily involved in the whole project. I had hoped when Jordan said weeks back that people would think he was an a-hole after watching that we were getting a documentary that had some say from Michael but ultimately it wasn’t up to him. Doesn’t sound like it was the case.

It was still a highly entertaining documentary and well done, but the bias definitely holds me back from putting it up there with some other great documentaries I watched.

It probably also explains why there wasn’t as much 1997-98 behind the scenes footage as I was hoping. I’m sure there was a fair bit that made MJ look a different way or some of his teammates especially Pippen look different.

A Bulls documentary was always going to be heavily focused on MJ and supposedly he wouldn’t make this without having a heavy say. But it’s classic Jordan not allowing some proper criticism. He doesn’t like being criticised and he’s petty. Just have to look at his beef with Barkley.

If people want a good insight into another side of the Bulls and MJ, I suggest reading The Jordan Rules.
 

Scotland

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Meh. Kemba has always been a fifth best PG if that. Couldn’t prove much at Charlotte and MJ earned every dollar at Chicago and now Walker was going to get a max worth more then what Jordan was getting 94-98 combined, whilst not winning a playoff series? Nah. 100% not worth it
He's alright, but at 6 foot tall isn't quite good enough to go to superstar level. If you are little you basically need to be Curry.

Salary cap was $2.6m when Jordan started in 84/85 and $26.9m when he retired in 98. Now it's $110m and every team except NY is over it this year. Obviously Jordan got paid wayyyy above the cap in his last two years as the rules of the day allowed, but the rules are very structured. Steph is on $40m, LeBron $37m, Durant $37m. Yet Conley is on $32m, Harris on $33m, Kemba on $33m, Lowry on $33m. First is $40m, 10th is $33m, 20th $30m, 50th $21m. Go back to 97/98 and the top 10 went 1st $33m, 10th $10m, 20th $7m, 50th $4.5m.

Jordan isn't exactly going to go hungry given he made millions (in 1980s dollars) from basketball and squillions more from endorsements, but salaries from the agreed share of revenue pool do disproportionately go to non superstar players. If the cap is $109m and you can spend $140m (with luxury tax) then LeBron, Steph, KD, Giannis etc. shouldn't be capped at 5/35% or lower. Supermax in the 97/98 cap would've been $9.4m. 10 players got more than that, and two got more than double.

I can see why they have the rules they do given teams still get into trouble with terrible contracts, but Curry making 35% of the Knicks' payroll while his own team is allowed to spend another $20m is a bit silly. Don't get me wrong they are all very well paid but you just need to look at the AD trade to see what matters in a 5 a side sport. Two recent top 2 picks (both starters), a bench player pick 4 and three more first round picks. IMO having a ceiling on earnings and restrictions on team signings and a soft cap is a recipe for a whole bunch of overpaid players. LeBron, Kawhi etc. can't get $50m, $60m contracts so instead move where they want and build big threes etc. Theoretically Rudy Gobert and Giannis will both be supermax players. I like Rudy, but the Jazz would give him up with whoever else you want for Giannis in a heartbeat.

Cliffs: hyper-competitive Michael Jordan doesn't strike me as the sort of guy who would think that $33m for Kemba vs a capped $40m for the best player in the game is a good deal.
 

swingdog

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Great series. A few things stood out.

1. It was a good reminder for us oldies / introduction to younger audience about how good he was. The comparison is with once in a lifetime players (Bradman, Federer, Maradona), how much better they were than their peers and how they seemingly couldn't be stopped when they were 'on'.

2. Jordan's post-playing career just reinforces the notion that champion players generally make terrible coaches / managers in any sport (there are exceptions e.g. Johan Cruyff) because they can't put themselves in the shoes of a good or average player. Actually, Maradona is also somewhat of an exception here - watch Maradona in Mexico on Netflix, another great doc.

3. I wonder how people like Jordan, who had such a high during their career, cope with the rest of their lives afterwards. You need to channel those competitive urges somehow.

4. We seem to be living in a bit of a golden age for good sporting documentaries and it's the streaming companies driving it. Amazon and The Test and the upcoming AFL version, Netflix with the aforementioned shows plus F1 Drive to Survive. I live in a house with 3 women who are generally indifferent to most sports and they're loving all of these. Also shows how little imagination our terrestrial channels have.
 

hamG

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I was a cigarette smoker for 35 years, I was never a fan of cigars, do you actually inhale the smoke into your lungs with them? I didn't think you did.
I'm not expert but each cigar is about the same as a pack of cigarettes and you are supposed to just absorb the whatever in your mouth, not inhale. Else you probably die a little earlier. I imagine the good ones must taste nice which is impossible to imagine.

Jordan's generation was only real fat cats smoked cigars. Lebon's generation real fat cats go on the road with thousand dollar bottles of wine.
 

DidakDelight

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Interesting all round this pizza story. Look, I believe Fite is telling the truth, but MJ is MJ so who is everyone going to believe? Certainly not some pizza manager. Does sound like something that could’ve happened, MJ playing cards/gambling, sinking piss, smoking cigars etc. Orders pizza, goes a bit to hard on the drink, starts throwing up, media gets wind he isn’t well so they go with “it was food poisoning”.

?
That would be all well and good if the media actually got wind with it and labelled it the “food poisoning game” rather than the “flu game”.

Air sucked it up and gone on with it.
 

Ross

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As a child of the 90s who, like many other Australians, became a big casual basketball fan during the Bulls dynasty this was an incredible watch. Obviously it was pretty difficult to follow the NBA in Australia then compared to how it is now and much of my knowledge of the players came from video games and trading cards and so a lot of the stuff on here was completely new to me. I didn't know Bulls management had basically hit the self-destruct button on the team before the season even started, I didn't know about Pippen's low pay gripes or his delayed surgery, trade demands and even the match where he sat it out on the bench. I also realised that outside of Horace Grant I knew none of the other Bulls players from the first three-peat, 1994 was probably when the NBA really took off here, at least for me.

It's interesting to me that nobody other than Jordan and Pippen played for the Bulls in 1993 and 1996 while by the start of the 2000 season nobody from the 1998 championship roster was there. I know they're very different sports but just imagine Hawthorn or Geelong going into the 2017 or 2013 seasons with all of their premiership players no longer on the list.

One question: I had just always assumed Jordan's baseball career flopped and fizzled out but they framed it here that after a rough patch in the middle he finished the 1994 season pretty strongly and was a good chance to play in the majors, only to walk away from it because of the MLB strike and him not wanting to be used as a filthy scab player. Which is closer to the truth?
 

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