The on topic thread

[SM]

Not sure on their loan rules, but it'd only be 3 or 4 players a season.

And you're already on your way to a similar deal with Boro.

 

[Jatz]

I think its a cracking setup that greatly benefits us, the other club and especially the player.

Mostly yes.

However you aren't doing it for the player benefit, you're doing it for the profit benefit.

I agree it greatly benefits you and Vitesse/Marseille. What about the other clubs in their respective leagues? They should suffer because Chelsea's decided they'll partner with a certain club?

No doubt it's great for Chelsea and it's not breaking any rules, I just don't personally agree with it.

 

[SM]

Mostly yes.

However you aren't doing it for the player benefit, you're doing it for the profit benefit.

I agree it greatly benefits you and Vitesse/Marseille. What about the other clubs in their respective leagues? They should suffer because Chelsea's decided they'll partner with a certain club?

No doubt it's great for Chelsea and it's not breaking any rules, I just don't personally agree with it.

Who says it isn't for the players' benefit? If they produce shit players they won't sell for much. It's in the club and the players' best interests for the players to get as good as possible.

The other clubs could set up respective deals, but aren't willing to risk the financial outlay. That's their call.

So Leicester doesn't have a local club that it sends a chunk of youth players on loan to?

 

[SM]

Jatz, out of interest do you agree that if a club had, say, 18 players out on loan, that that is far too much and the club in question is taking the piss out of the loan rules?

 

[Jatz]

Who says it isn't for the players' benefit? If they produce shit players they won't sell for much. It's in the club and the players' best interests for the players to get as good as possible.

The other clubs could set up respective deals, but aren't willing to risk the financial outlay. That's their call.

So Leicester doesn't have a local club that it sends a chunk of youth players on loan to?

Because they sign for Chelsea and end up playing their games in the Eredivisie before being sold, without ever pulling on a Chelsea shirt.

If you're Kramaric, do you prefer playing in the PL or the Eredivisie? These are players that Hull could sign now, develop them and then sell them for a profit. Now, Chelsea just buy a stack load, wait to see if they're any good and if they aren't, piss them off to the highest bidder. You tell me, which one is likely to be more beneficial for the player? Playing/developing at Hull or being shipped off to Vitesse?

Not a single club that we send everyone to. We send players out on loan to some of the lower league clubs but we don't have an arrangement.

 

[SM]

Because they sign for Chelsea and end up playing their games in the Eredivisie before being sold, without ever pulling on a Chelsea shirt.

If you're Kramaric, do you prefer playing in the PL or the Eredivisie? These are players that Hull could sign now, develop them and then sell them for a profit. Now, Chelsea just buy a stack load, wait to see if they're any good and if they aren't, piss them off to the highest bidder. You tell me, which one is likely to be more beneficial for the player? Playing/developing at Hull or being shipped off to Vitesse?

Not a single club that we send everyone to. We send players out on loan to some of the lower league clubs but we don't have an arrangement.

If Chelsea want to buy a player and loan them to Hull, where they are paying a percentage of his wage, and fronted the transfer fee, I would be perfectly happy developing a player for them. Less cost for us.

 

[Jatz]

Jatz, out of interest do you agree that if a club had, say, 18 players out on loan, that that is far too much and the club in question is taking the piss out of the loan rules?

I do.

If you have 18 players on loan, an U18 side, an U21 side and a PL squad, you're no longer a football club, you're a football player factory.

 

[SM]

I do.

If you have 18 players on loan, an U18 side, an U21 side and a PL squad, you're no longer a football club, you're a football player factory.

So you're calling Leicester a football player factory?

 

[Jatz]

If Chelsea want to buy a player and loan them to Hull, where they are paying a percentage of his wage, and fronted the transfer fee, I would be perfectly happy developing a player for them. Less cost for us.

I'm sure you would. That's not what I asked though. They don't loan players to other PL clubs.

 

[SM]

I'm sure you would. That's not what I asked though. They don't loan players to other PL clubs.

OK, as a player I would prefer to go to Chelsea, at a higher quality Academy and training facilities, be sent to clubs that only Chelsea have determined will further my development, and be constantly watched by Chelsea scouts and performance managers to determine if I can play games for Chelsea. If I wasn't good enough for Chelsea I'd be pretty secure in knowing that when the time is right I'd be sold to one of these lesser clubs you're keen for players to go to, who would be paying a lot for me, and thus expressing how keen they are to get me in their side.

 

[BlueBen]

How many of the players that Chelsea have sent to or are at Vitesse now have gone on to "make it" at Chelsea? Genuinely curious...

 

[Jatz]

So you're calling Leicester a football player factory?

Nope. I know where you're going with this because you think you've caught me out.

Have you seen the list of players we have out on loan? Have you seen the clubs they're on loan to?

We aren't snapping up the best youth and then selling them for a profit because we have no room for them.

We have fatboy Gary Taylor Fletcher on loan ffs. In no way is that comparable to what's happening at Chelsea.

 

[SM]

Nope. I know where you're going with this because you think you've caught me out.

Have you seen the list of players we have out on loan? Have you seen the clubs they're on loan to?

We aren't snapping up the best youth and then selling them for a profit because we have no room for them.

We have fatboy Gary Taylor Fletcher on loan ffs. In no way is that comparable to what's happening at Chelsea.

You have 18 players out on loan. You said a club that has 18 players out on loan is not a football club.

Remove fatso from the equation, even remove Wood from the equation, you still have over 15 players out on loan which is a shit-ton.

 

[Jatz]

OK, as a player I would prefer to go to Chelsea, at a higher quality Academy and training facilities, be sent to clubs that only Chelsea have determined will further my development, and be constantly watched by Chelsea scouts and performance managers to determine if I can play games for Chelsea. If I wasn't good enough for Chelsea I'd be pretty secure in knowing that when the time is right I'd be sold to one of these lesser clubs you're keen for players to go to, who would be paying a lot for me, and thus expressing how keen they are to get me in their side.

You mean the facilities you don't get to use because you go straight out on loan? Sure.

In the meantime, you could already be plying your trade in the PL for a number of seasons before making the same move.

Worked well for West Ham, with Lampard, Cole etc etc.

 

[SM]

You mean the facilities you don't get to use because you go straight out on loan? Sure.

In the meantime, you could already be plying your trade in the PL for a number of seasons before making the same move.

Worked well for West Ham, with Lampard, Cole etc etc.

I'm really not sure I understand your point. You're complaining that these players aren't getting the same chance of development at smaller clubs.. despite never setting foot inside Chelsea's ground and spending their entire development at said smaller clubs?

 

[chef]

I'm sure you would. That's not what I asked though. They don't loan players to other PL clubs.

Yeah we do, Moses, Atsu, Lukaku to name a few.

 

[SM]

Yeah we do, Moses, Atsu, Lukaku to name a few.

Mata.

 

[Jatz]

You have 18 players out on loan. You said a club that has 18 players out on loan is not a football club.

Remove fatso from the equation, even remove Wood from the equation, you still have over 15 players out on loan which is a shit-ton.

It's more than necessary, yes. It does involve players like Gallagher and co that are just playing out their contracts.

What we're doing is not the same as Chelsea.

How many do Chelsea have out on loan?

 

[Jatz]

Yeah we do, Moses, Atsu, Lukaku to name a few.

Ok, so there's some exceptions to the rule. Is it fair to say that the vast majority don't?

 

[SM]

It's more than necessary, yes. It does involve players like Gallagher and co that are just playing out their contracts.

What we're doing is not the same as Chelsea.

How many do Chelsea have out on loan?

So when you said a club that has 18 players out on loan can't be considered a football club, what you really meant was, they aren't a football club unless they're your club?

Chelsea only have 5-10 more than you, and amongst those are guys like Salah and Torres.

 

[chef]

How many of the players that Chelsea have sent to or are at Vitesse now have gone on to "make it" at Chelsea? Genuinely curious...

Its not just Vitesse though, Zouma and Courtois have come through loans. KDB too, but he was deemed surplus but was good enough to play for us.

 

[chef]

Ok, so there's some exceptions to the rule. Is it fair to say that the vast majority don't?

And not fair at all. Some do and some don't. Chalobah, Bamford, Omeruo, Kalas etc should all pkay Prem next seadon too and who knows there coild be others.

 

[SM]

Its just Vitesse though, Zouma and Courtois have come through loans. KDB too, but he was deemed surplus but was good enough to play for us.

Lukaku would have been getting games this year after being out on a couple of PL loans, Bamford close to Chelsea standard, but might need a PL loan to find his feet, Kalas looking promising too...

 

[chef]

How many do Chelsea have out on loan?

26.

 

[SM]

26.

So 8 more than non-Football factory Leicester. And two of those loans are Salah and Torres who won't play for Chelsea again.