Analysis The Rebuilds of Carlton and Fremantle and their future prospects

[chunkylover53]

Yep tis embarrassing innit.

Blues fans fell overthemselves defending Bolts and SOS in comparison with Brisbane back in 2017.

Then moved onto Freo, despite Freo being minor premiers when SOS started his build ar Carlton. But now Freo have gone past them too.

Perhaps Carlton v North might be the one for next year??

Such a crap view.

Yes, Freo were minor premiers with a bit to work with and build around before starting their rebuild.

Do you ever take into account that when SOS took over, not only were we the bottom team, but the oldest list in the league as well?

Clubs like Sydney, Geelong and Collingwood have shown how clubs can rebuild on the fly after a couple of years down.

We actually tried this under Mick - each year he was there we traded in the best available talent we could land and put out the best possible 22. It resulted in a 9th*, 14th & 18th finishes. We didn't have the cattle to do what these clubs do.

Clubs only rebuild when they've made poor decisions and are forced into it.

 

[Fadge]

We actually tried this under Mick - each year he was there we traded in the best available talent we could land and put out the best possible 22. It resulted in a 9th*, 14th & 18th finishes. We didn't have the cattle to do what these clubs do.

Clubs only rebuild when they've made poor decisions and are forced into it.

Trading is one element of rebuilding on the fly.

Drafting the right talent and developing that talent is even more important, as it provides depth to your playing list.

Obviously Geelong have recently traded in the likes of Cameron and Smith, but do you really think they'd still be where they are now if they didn't identify and develop the likes of Stewart (pick 40, 2016), Stengle (Delisted Free Agent), Blicavs (Rookie Draft), Atkins (Rookie Draft), etc.?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

I know you're second KPD short and TDK isn't there yet, but I refuse to believe that with your spine + Walsh and Cripps that you guys aren't finals quality at the very least. If the mental stuff is real it might stop you winning flags but you guys will be in it.

Young is as good a 2nd fiddle KPD you could ask for. Had a fantastic season and still only 40 games into his career.

TDK and our Wings/HFF's are our weaknesses. Not enough class by foot and not enough scoreboard impact.

 

[chunkylover53]

Trading is one element of rebuilding on the fly.

Drafting the right talent and developing that talent is even more important, as it provides depth to your playing list.

Obviously Geelong have recently traded in the likes of Cameron and Smith, but do you really think they'd still be where they are now if they didn't identify and develop the likes of Stewart (pick 40, 2016), Stengle (Delisted Free Agent), Blicavs (Rookie Draft), Atkins (Rookie Draft), etc.?

As I said, clubs only rebuild when forced into it from poor decision making. Geelong haven't made many poor decisions, we made every poor one possible in the past which resulted in a deep and long rebuild.

I'd like to know what you and the other experts think we should've done at the end of 2015, when we won 4 games and fielded this team in round 23:

 

[Rich01]

We actually tried this under Mick - each year he was there we traded in the best available talent we could land and put out the best possible 22. It resulted in a 9th*, 14th & 18th finishes. We didn't have the cattle to do what these clubs do.

Clubs only rebuild when they've made poor decisions and are forced into it.

You also had a crap recruiting team at the time. Only a small group of talent picked thru the draft in the previous half dozen years at Micks disposal.
It doesn’t work when the core is below par.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

As I said, clubs only rebuild when forced into it from poor decision making. Geelong haven't made many poor decisions, we made every poor one possible in the past which resulted in a deep and long rebuild.

I'd like to know what you and the other experts think we should've done at the end of 2015, when we won 4 games and fielded this team in round 23:

View attachment 1501817

 

[Freomaniac]

You seem very worried about what other supporters think of your club, considering you've bumped this thread multiple times.

I have tolerated certain crap from certain posters on here. Most Carlton fans are decent. It's just that La Dispute is a troll and predicted Freo to finish 14th this season in 2022. LoL

I don't really think about what posters think of my club, quite the opposite. But if you look at my recent posts in the last week, I did congratulate Brisbane and Sydney for their wins.

Yes.... I want the non Vic sides to do well.

 

[im_a_lazy_sod]

I have tolerated certain crap from certain posters on here. Most Carlton fans are decent. It's just that La Dispute is a troll and predicted Freo to finish 14th this season in 2022. LoL

I don't really think about what posters think of my club, quite the opposite. But if you look at my recent posts in the last week, I did congratulate Brisbane and Sydney for their wins.

Yes.... I want the non Vic sides to do well.

Maybe they meant 14th bottom as opposed to 14th

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Blues will enter another mini rebuild soon, Voss will get blamed and sacked. Rinse repeat. How can anyone have faith in a football club that has no faith in its coach. Sacked Ratten for Malthouse, Sacked Malthouse for Bolton. Sacked Bolton hired Teague, Sacked Teague to hire Clarkson. Clarkson tells Carlton to gagf and they hire Michael Voss? I think this one ends in tears for blues fans.

Bump. A decent coach and Carlton are still playing right now imo.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Bump. A decent coach and Carlton are still playing right now imo.

Decent fitness boss think u mean

 

[Arr0w]

First it was the Brisbane v Carlton prospects and we quickly leapfrogged Carlton’s rebuild.
Now Freo has leapfrogged Carlton’s rebuild.
I feel a North rebuild and future prospects thread in the near future.

I find this funny.

Lions started their rebuild 2 years before us and while they have played finals last 4 seasons, they have had a poor finals record achieving absolutely nothing

Dockers, great season, but let's wait and see what happens this week

But, nice troll

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Decent fitness boss think u mean

Lol. A fitness boss isn't why you didn't make finals, terrible on-field leadership is.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Lol. A fitness boss isn't why you didn't make finals, terrible on-field leadership is.

Yeah I'm sure players such as Hewett, Kennedy, Curnow, Newman and Walsh wouldn't have helped with that. I'd be keen to see how Freo would go without Brayshaw, Serong and Fyfe all at once?

 

[TheBigHorne]

Yea na Carlton couldn't run out games that's why they didn't make finals but overall the list has so many stars that I'm not too concerned for them. They just need a better 'bottom 6' they field in their best 22 and they'll be much better. Plowman is VFL quality and shouldn't be getting afl games, let alone 15 at a club trying to make finals.

 

[Elixuh]

I find this funny.

Lions started their rebuild 2 years before us and while they have played finals last 4 seasons, the have had a poor finals record achieving absolutely nothing

Dockers, great season, but let's wait and see what happens this week

But, nice troll

Carlton can’t even make finals, what’re you talking about. The bulldogs who don’t have a forward or backline managed to make finals.

 

[WillHayward]

Bloke who kicked straight to Howe is very lucky

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Bloke who kicked straight to Howe is very lucky

He's played 23 games in his entire career and is 20 years old...

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Yeah I'm sure players such as Hewett, Kennedy, Curnow, Newman and Walsh wouldn't have helped with that. I'd be keen to see how Freo would go without Brayshaw, Serong and Fyfe all at once?

Blaming injuries is loser talk 101. Trust me, as a Freo supporter I know what it sounds like. Blues had Finals locked in 2 weeks in a row and crumbled under pressure both times in the dying stages of the match. That's not fitness based, that's all mentality and coaching in my opinion.

 

[Arr0w]

Carlton can’t even make finals, what’re you talking about. The bulldogs who don’t have a forward or backline managed to make finals.

Nothing to do with your original post though, and surely you understand not all fixtures are the same

But of course you also think it has some bearing on the future

 

[Elixuh]

Nothing to do with your original post though, and surely you understand not all fixtures are the same

But of course you also think it has some bearing on the future

Didn't Carlton have one of the easiest fixtures this year? I again ask you, what're you talking about?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Blaming injuries is loser talk 101. Trust me, as a Freo supporter I know what it sounds like. Blues had Finals locked in 2 weeks in a row and crumbled under pressure both times in the dying stages of the match. That's not fitness based, that's all mentality and coaching in my opinion.

Not an excuse, it was inexcusable to choke those game...But when you're having to play Sam Docherty through the midfield because you can't trust Paddy Dow to come in and play his role due to horrific coaching in prior regimes that's where it becomes an issue. When we were up and running, with most of our good players out there our game plan worked and was able to take it to the best teams in the comp, including your own.

It's common knowledge that our bottom end is horrific, unfortunately there's no quick fix to that... But that simply wasn't an issue until injuries mounted and we were forced to play the spuds. That's not a sign of poor coaching, that's a sign of having to fix ingrained issues, much like it took Longmuire for ur mob with players who had been lost a bit under previous coaches and clubs systems.

It will likely take Voss multiple seasons to get players fully across his game style and understand what's expected of them every game.

 

[Arr0w]

Didn't Carlton have one of the easiest fixtures this year? I again ask you, what're you talking about?

So we keep shifting the goalposts.

Easiest draws?, not even close

Blues played 11 games against the top 8 teams this year despite finishing 13th. Only Essendon, StKilda and GWS played more (12x)

What next?

 

[Elixuh]

So we keep shifting the goalposts.

Easiest draws?, not even close

Blues played 11 games against the top 8 teams this year despite finishing 13th. Only Essendon, StKilda and GWS played more (12x)

What next?

To be honest friend, the rebuilds of Carlton and Freo really aren't that interesting to keep engaging. Good luck next year

 

[Arr0w]

To be honest friend, the rebuilds of Carlton and Freo really aren't that interesting to keep engaging. Good luck next year

Nice backtrack, hopefully the Lions can achieve something of substance after starting their rebuild 2 years before either side

 

[Purple Suit]

Yea na Carlton couldn't run out games that's why they didn't make finals but overall the list has so many stars that I'm not too concerned for them. They just need a better 'bottom 6' they field in their best 22 and they'll be much better. Plowman is VFL quality and shouldn't be getting afl games, let alone 15 at a club trying to make finals.

They need to be able to draft and develop the bottom 6. Trades cost too much so they can’t do it all based on a few guns recruits, trades and not much else. This will be the big test for Voss and hopefully the club gives him time rather than sacking him if they miss or don’t win a final next year.