The rise of the Super clubs...Are we on board?

[Huntercrow]

In light of the clubs "Super Saturday" tomorrow where the Crows play 3 games in one day
Unheard of in our relatively short history, I thought it was timely to look towards the future of our club and the rise of the "super clubs".

No this isn't a line from a cheap B grade movie but a description of the new direction in Australian sport.
Where a sporting or social club evolves into the next level of competition breaking away from a restrictive single code and branching out into other world class competitions.

Many overseas clubs have had this philosophy for a while now.
Barcelona, Man united. Huge sporting organisations with the GDP of a small nation.
There main focus is football and always will be but their expansion into other sports has exposed their brand where it may not have had relevance before.

Our own Women's AFL team would be achieving this for the Crows even now.
Fagan mentioned during the season launch that the club is enjoying record membership. How much of this is due to the success of the clubs AFLW team?

One example of a growing super club is the GWS Giants. They have struggled in the huge Sydney sporting market since day one.
They have to contend with the likes of......

The NRL (both the good and not so good)
Rugby Union
The A league (in particular Western Sydney Wanderers)
The Swans (they pinched Buddy)

Their thoughts now are to expand from the AFL into the AFLW and the new "Super Netball league"
Some weeks ago they themselves played 3 games on one Saturday. Not a bad effort considering their very short history.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-02-28/gws-giants-lead-rise-of-the-super-club/8311426

Another disadvantage to the Sydney AFL teams is that the NRL kicked off last week hogging the sporting interest in town. The media are all about them at the moment. At least for the Giants with their AFLW and Super Netball teams their brand is in the papers each week.
Not so for the Swans (unless Buddy has a night out!)!
The Sydney market will be interesting to watch from a perspective of the 2 AFL teams and their differing philosophies. The Swans chose not to expand into the AFLW (sound familiar?).

Collingwood are the complete opposite to the Giants in terms of their needs and requirements in their own market. They are the number 1 brand in AFL bar none. They have an adoring media that lives off of their daily grind.
Their history and culture pre dates the beginning of the VFL. Their on field success doesn't seem to drive their popularity. They dominate in their market. Yet they are not sitting on their laurels. They see the future is in spreading their (black and white) wings into other sports. They also have a team in the new Super Netball league as well as the AFLW.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-02-...-and-tipped-to-dominate-super-netball/8278882

There seems to be something in this expansion idea for the powerfull as well as the up and coming clubs.

The A League are mentioned in an article below about the possibility of cross sport involvement.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2011/05/11/super-clubs-the-way-to-go/

So where to for the Adelaide Football Club?
Our cross town rivals are expanding into China (well thats their plan) If it all pans out for them they will be on their way. The AFC do not want to be left behind.

We wisely expanded into the AFLW competition with all the benefits it will bring but for the near future this is on the back of a popular but limited 7 week season. Cross code promotion is the obvious benefit under a single banner. Eddie was at Norwood oval last week promoting the Womens side.

However our reserves team seems to be an after thought as far as promotion goes. To me they represent a group who consists of "also rans" and "top ups" with little feeling from a team perspective. Although I was starting to believe during the SANFL Finals this was beginning to change. We just don't seem to understand they are a fully fledged SANFL team building their own history. They are facing a battle not unlike the GWS in a hostile environment. Hostile from an SANFL point of view as well as from within.

The AFL have a theory that all teams should remain as equal as possible for the good of the game.
Their rules and regulations insist on this form of socialistic ideal.
So with little room to move how does a club expand their horizons in this environment? Any club cannot expand beyond its fellow lesser AFL clubs or risk upsetting the balance. Perhaps moving outside of the restrictive AFL competition into other more adventurous sporting codes can overcome this. Expansion through diversification.

So moving forward we have a choice.....

Do nothing more and hope our club has "organic growth" within its structure (love that phrase)

or Bust out of the confines of the AFL and expand and diversify?

We are only limited by our Board and CEO (the money will flow if we present it properly).

Hopefully our people are thinking along these lines.

 

[GreyCrow]

Well done on presenting your thoughts.

I think the biggest issue is trying to marry the SANFL ideas to the SANFL instead of a feeder club. Difficult I know but that should be the philosophy to shift perceptions.

Did Port link up with the Thunderbirds briefly? I think the AFC should look at this as well. And I think Greg Griffin pushed an idea of a superclub or was that Rob Gerard and linking a SANFL club to the Adelaide United side?

The ideas are there it just needs a focused effort to make it happen.

One of the biggest concerns would be a perception that a club is ''moving away fro their core business'' . The other is finding the right pricing structure for Memberships.

 

[Huntercrow]

Well done on presenting your thoughts.

I think the biggest issue is trying to marry the SANFL ideas to the SANFL instead of a feeder club. Difficult I know but that should be the philosophy to shift perceptions.

Did Port link up with the Thunderbirds briefly? I think the AFC should look at this as well. And I think Greg Griffin pushed an idea of a superclub or was that Rob Gerard and linking a SANFL club to the Adelaide United side?

The ideas are there it just needs a focused effort to make it happen.

One of the biggest concerns would be a perception that a club is ''moving away fro their core business'' . The other is finding the right pricing structure for Memberships.

I think the core business issue needs to be separated somehow. I believe the FC Barcelona model involves many sporting sub branches under one controlling body. This could involve a major restructure for the Crows to achieve this long term. i don't think this could be addressed overnight.
In the short term they would need to take it step by step with a solid plan for the future. This would be a long term plan I think.

As far as Port and the Thunderbirds are concerned I found the following link....
http://www.portadelaidefc.com.au/news/2010-04-07/thunderbirds-power-on

 

[Vhaluus]

An interesting concept but I would be very, very worried about the secondary teams becoming a resource drain and costing more money than they bring in.

I'm still reluctant on the AFLW team we have for this exact reason.

 

[GreyCrow]

More opportunity for Jobs for the Boys(and Girls)

 

[GreyCrow]

An interesting concept but I would be very, very worried about the secondary teams becoming a resource drain and costing more money than they bring in.

I'm still reluctant on the AFLW team we have for this exact reason.

I think you make a valid point on secondary teams but I would hope that in 'taking over' an established club would serve better than a start up.

On the womens team I believe the AFL are bankrolling a lot of it , but even if not the upsurge so far would outstrip outgoings. If the lines at the Merchandise Vans is any guide

 

[Vhaluus]

I think you make a valid point on secondary teams but I would hope that in 'taking over' an established club would serve better than a start up.

On the womens team I believe the AFL are bankrolling a lot of it , but even if not the upsurge so far would outstrip outgoings. If the lines at the Merchandise Vans is any guide

I hope you are right. I love that we have a womens team, I just don't want it detracting from our mens team.

As for these other clubs we could theoretically take over. How many clubs from other codes actually run at an operating profit and how many rely on government money?

Take over a soccer team? great idea, good money in that game. Netball? Can't see that ever being worth it financially.

 

[Morganashlee]

Sorry for the intrusion but just following this thread from the post Huntercrow made on the Collingwood board.

I am a Collingwood Football Club supporter first and foremost but I welcome the addition of both the AFLW and Netball teams to our club. From an emotional perspective and as a young woman, it would have been simply a pipe-dream for me to represent the club I love but with these two new ventures it is a reality for little girls to strive for. I think that is brilliant.

I am so proud to be a supporter of a club that has shown such initiative to branch out and grow our brand across multiple sports. The bigger, more successful we become the better it will be for all aspects of the club.

Well done on presenting your thoughts.

I think the biggest issue is trying to marry the SANFL ideas to the SANFL instead of a feeder club. Difficult I know but that should be the philosophy to shift perceptions.

Did Port link up with the Thunderbirds briefly? I think the AFC should look at this as well. And I think Greg Griffin pushed an idea of a superclub or was that Rob Gerard and linking a SANFL club to the Adelaide United side?

The ideas are there it just needs a focused effort to make it happen.

One of the biggest concerns would be a perception that a club is ''moving away fro their core business'' . The other is finding the right pricing structure for Memberships.

The core business argument is used so often on our board by those who don't support what the club is doing. I think if you stand still (which we would be if we focused on only the AFL side) then we would be overtaken. Everyone is looking for an advantage and other ways to grow. We are never going to go down the Hawthorn path and expand our base into another state. We aren't taking our games to China or New Zealand or Ballarat. We needed something more and this is it - developing ourselves into a superclub.


I became an inaugural member of the Collingwood Netball Team and went to my first game last week. It was a fantastic match day experience and I was shocked by how many supporters we had already. We all know how great the AFLW has been and I am sure that will continue to grow from a base that nobody expected to be as good as it is. I say go for it. Just don't go to China with a team that wears their national colours

 

[Huntercrow]

I was just checking out Greg Griffin and any connection to a super club when I found this article regarding The AFL X concept. And his absolute contempt for it.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport...e/news-story/42e67f458e2a4e8cf3f05957e75df87b

if this concept was still on the AFL agenda this should be the type of thing the AFC should be looking at.

 

[GreyCrow]

Sorry for the intrusion but just following this thread from the post Huntercrow made on the Collingwood board.

I am a Collingwood Football Club supporter first and foremost but I welcome the addition of both the AFLW and Netball teams to our club. From an emotional perspective and as a young woman, it would have been simply a pipe-dream for me to represent the club I love but with these two new ventures it is a reality for little girls to strive for. I think that is brilliant.

I am so proud to be a supporter of a club that has shown such initiative to branch out and grow our brand across multiple sports. The bigger, more successful we become the better it will be for all aspects of the club.


The core business argument is used so often on our board by those who don't support what the club is doing. I think if you stand still (which we would be if we focused on only the AFL side) then we would be overtaken. Everyone is looking for an advantage and other ways to grow. We are never going to go down the Hawthorn path and expand our base into another state. We aren't taking our games to China or New Zealand or Ballarat. We needed something more and this is it - developing ourselves into a superclub.


I became an inaugural member of the Collingwood Netball Team and went to my first game last week. It was a fantastic match day experience and I was shocked by how many supporters we had already. We all know how great the AFLW has been and I am sure that will continue to grow from a base that nobody expected to be as good as it is. I say go for it. Just don't go to China with a team that wears their national colours

Congrats on your membership and support of the club you love.

Yes I agree core business is code for ' I want football only' . My concern was more about how it would be managed, which Hunter outlined clearly.

I have been to all the AFLW AFC games and will go to the GF if we are lucky to host it. I am not so sure about netball or soccer but I might at least make plans where I wouldn't do so now.

 

[GreyCrow]

I was just checking out Greg Griffin and any connection to a super club when I found this article regarding The AFL X concept. And his absolute contempt for it.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport...e/news-story/42e67f458e2a4e8cf3f05957e75df87b

if this concept was still on the AFL agenda this should be the type of thing the AFC should be looking at.

Try this one

NEW Adelaide United owner Robert Gerard outlined his vision for the Reds that will see them join forces with a rival code in a bid to turn United into a super club in the coming years.

Both Griffin and Noble are heavily involved with SANFL club North Adelaide and Gerard said his dream of 'code sharing' will see both clubs and codes benefit from the exercise.

Gerard acknowledged with the Hyundai A-League running in summer and North Adelaide playing in winter, he hopes incentives such as dual memberships will be the way of the future.

"The other thing I would say is we're going to have a fair bit of North Adelaides in here with us," he said.

"I've got this little dream of mine that there's going to be a bit of code sharing in the years to come. I don't believe in any town you can just have one code of it. We've got a summer game and a winter game and I think we can put a lot of backroom and admin and all that together.

 

[lincsPJ]

The netball deal cost port a shitload.

 

[Huntercrow]

Sorry for the intrusion but just following this thread from the post Huntercrow made on the Collingwood board.

I am a Collingwood Football Club supporter first and foremost but I welcome the addition of both the AFLW and Netball teams to our club. From an emotional perspective and as a young woman, it would have been simply a pipe-dream for me to represent the club I love but with these two new ventures it is a reality for little girls to strive for. I think that is brilliant.

I am so proud to be a supporter of a club that has shown such initiative to branch out and grow our brand across multiple sports. The bigger, more successful we become the better it will be for all aspects of the club.


The core business argument is used so often on our board by those who don't support what the club is doing. I think if you stand still (which we would be if we focused on only the AFL side) then we would be overtaken. Everyone is looking for an advantage and other ways to grow. We are never going to go down the Hawthorn path and expand our base into another state. We aren't taking our games to China or New Zealand or Ballarat. We needed something more and this is it - developing ourselves into a superclub.


I became an inaugural member of the Collingwood Netball Team and went to my first game last week. It was a fantastic match day experience and I was shocked by how many supporters we had already. We all know how great the AFLW has been and I am sure that will continue to grow from a base that nobody expected to be as good as it is. I say go for it. Just don't go to China with a team that wears their national colours

Hahaha... I remember when we were a one team one town club. Those were the heady days of our beginnings. But I always felt something missing compared to other AFL clubs in general. We were all about the league side that played week in week out. Our juniors were spread amongst the disgruntled SANFL clubs which was not an ideal situation. Looking back this now seems so odd considering the numerous teams now under the Crows banner. we now seem much more of a club than before.
I hope your club has much success in the Netball league. i can imagine from my own experiences with my sons primary school teams how the situation has changed for the girls who loved playing their sports as much as the boys.

 

[Huntercrow]

Try this one

NEW Adelaide United owner Robert Gerard outlined his vision for the Reds that will see them join forces with a rival code in a bid to turn United into a super club in the coming years.

Both Griffin and Noble are heavily involved with SANFL club North Adelaide and Gerard said his dream of 'code sharing' will see both clubs and codes benefit from the exercise.

Gerard acknowledged with the Hyundai A-League running in summer and North Adelaide playing in winter, he hopes incentives such as dual memberships will be the way of the future.

"The other thing I would say is we're going to have a fair bit of North Adelaides in here with us," he said.

"I've got this little dream of mine that there's going to be a bit of code sharing in the years to come. I don't believe in any town you can just have one code of it. We've got a summer game and a winter game and I think we can put a lot of backroom and admin and all that together.

Exactly what I was thinking

 

[GreyCrow]

Exactly what I was thinking

I think the idea was that e.g some of Norths Admin people would move to Coopers and do both summer then winter alongside some of AUs team. 1 CEO, 1 CFO, 2 Managers , 2 coaches etc shareloading fitness staff, combining medical experience. Sounded like a good idea. Surprised it was 7 years ago and I remembered.

Alcohol I'm winning

 

[Huntercrow]

The netball deal cost port a shitload.

I wonder if there was any net gain for the PAFC through membership or such?

 

[Huntercrow]

I think the idea was that e.g some of Norths Admin people would move to Coopers and do both summer then winter alongside some of AUs team. 1 CEO, 1 CFO, 2 Managers , 2 coaches etc shareloading fitness staff, combining medical experience. Sounded like a good idea. Surprised it was 7 years ago and I remembered.

Alcohol I'm winning

It is Friday night

Sharing resources must be a plus for both clubs. They can only learn from each other.

 

[lincsPJ]

I wonder if there was any net gain for the PAFC through membership or such?

My understanding is that it burnt them financially all factors considered.

 

[Huntercrow]

An interesting concept but I would be very, very worried about the secondary teams becoming a resource drain and costing more money than they bring in.

I'm still reluctant on the AFLW team we have for this exact reason.

I see these concepts as an investment. they may not return much in the short term so we must to be able to finance this ahead of any long term gain.
This is a gamble as it is a new concept. But Collingwood and GWS are leading the way as far as the Super Netball experiment goes. We just need to keep an eye on their efforts and make adjustments.

 

[Huntercrow]

My understanding is that it burnt them financially all factors considered.

I guess there are no guarantees when branching out into other sports. There wouldn't be much patience shown from the Membership regarding non football funding.

 

[Huntercrow]

It seems there is a triple header tonight in Canberra.
AFL, Union and league.


http://www.canberratimes.com.au/rug...-brumbies-and-gws-giants-20170306-gurptg.html


So the Union and league matches are head to head......How dumb is this?

The Giants have already played so their fans could feasibly attend one of the other games.

Not so for the League and Union fans. This sort of exclusivity is crazy. Their idea being (I guess) is....You as a fan must choose whom your allegiances are with....take it or leave it.

You wonder why these 2 codes are struggling.

 

[barrackers]

It's an interesting direction I just hope it's more successful than the last foray into different sports. The '90s seen us and Carlton enter teams into the national soccer league and we also brought a lawn bowls club, but that was more about pokies. AFLW seems a lower risk than the netball team, but being female sports will help both, which is something the soccer teams lacked.

From a finance perspective while there's potentially the ability to spread spending and appointments to counter the football department cap there isn't going to be much overlap in resources outside of management roles like we seen with Gubby Allan who briefly headed our AFLW and netball programs, but I'm sure the AFL will pay close attention.

 

[Pdub]

Judging by Nigel Smart's twitter, I think the club is looking into esports. Smart certainly seems to have a fascination with it.

 

[Huntercrow]

It's an interesting direction I just hope it's more successful than the last foray into different sports. The '90s seen us and Carlton enter teams into the national soccer league and we also brought a lawn bowls club, but that was more about pokies. AFLW seems a lower risk than the netball team, but being female sports will help both, which is something the soccer teams lacked.

From a finance perspective while there's potentially the ability to spread spending and appointments to counter the football department cap there isn't going to be much overlap in resources outside of management roles like we seen with Gubby Allan who briefly headed our AFLW and netball programs, but I'm sure the AFL will pay close attention.

I wasn't aware of the previous soccer "foray" Was it a full on attempt to intergrate the 2 codes under one banner or was there more a sponsorship scenario?

 

[Huntercrow]

Judging by Nigel Smart's twitter, I think the club is looking into esports. Smart certainly seems to have a fascination with it.

This involves space invaders and Pacman?