I'm no footy head expert, but I have to bump the talent v system argument.
And of course I'm going to use the Pies as an example, this is not a bias thing and in before the 'should be on the Collingwood board' comments, I want the views of oppo supporters on the evolution of the game and the way teams use thier 'talent' to optimize their system.
The opinion of the talking footy heads clearly states that this team is not personnel reliant. Clarko in his presser was more than transparent that they were defeated by a system moreso than the talent on the opposition's list. And yes I know the Pies were heavily depleted.
Another recent example is the Richmond dynasty, both teams, when they flagged, one could confidently argue or speculate that those teams weren't the best lists in the comp when they won it.
Here's an in short summary of those systems. Simplistic I know, but it's an easy to 'see' the systems.
Current Collingwood, team d, without ball they zone up to deny opposition transition footy (or attempt to) and force a kick / handball to contest, then Collingwood close space, suffocate the opposition to win turnover and then spread with ball speed in transition. If they don't win the first immediate contest, like ghosts 'where'd he come from?!', they just appear out of nowhere to outnumber at the next immediate contest.
You need to run harder both ways than your opposition to achieve this, which has its own compromises. For example if the close space game doesn't result in a possession win then they're exposed and allows the opposition outnumber and by extension transition forward, easy scoring opportunities if you will.
The Richmond dynasty, maybe the Tiger posters can help here. But the way I saw it, was that they basically forced contest forward and forced the opposition into submission and win ball. They basically sucked in the opposition into contest and won the ball and had numbers on the spread which allowed transition. In short a grunt contest team that won them ball and then easy transition.
The mantra that Kingy uses 'Don't get beaten by what you know', well that's easier said than done against a system like this. Same with the current Pies, easy to identify what you know, much harder to 'don't get beaten by'
More than certain, in fact Fly has stated that they train this system ad nausem during the week, probably the same with Dimma and Tiges in their dynasty.
To the North game last night, I haven't see this before, but unlike other teams this year, North or more accurately Clarko attempted to spread or widen the Pies team d zone set up to take away the Pies contest game and attempt to chip / mark through the widened team d zone. That requires a high efficiency possession game to achieve it. This worked well for the first 2 and a half qtrs.
Is this the blueprint to dismantle the Pies system? Maybe yes but you need to apply this for 4 qtrs, could a highly talented list team like Bris or Giants apply this for 4 qtrs?
Clearly these systems are / were better than the sum of their parts. Some will argue that Richmonds list was the best in their flag years, I'd argue the system they played gave that impression. For example, I'd argue the Giants they destroyed in 2019 were better list wise.
So how does a coaching panel optimize their lists to generate a very hard to defeat system? What is Fly's and previously Dimma's secret? Was it a secret?
Why can't teams defeat these 'systems'?
And of course I'm going to use the Pies as an example, this is not a bias thing and in before the 'should be on the Collingwood board' comments, I want the views of oppo supporters on the evolution of the game and the way teams use thier 'talent' to optimize their system.
The opinion of the talking footy heads clearly states that this team is not personnel reliant. Clarko in his presser was more than transparent that they were defeated by a system moreso than the talent on the opposition's list. And yes I know the Pies were heavily depleted.
Another recent example is the Richmond dynasty, both teams, when they flagged, one could confidently argue or speculate that those teams weren't the best lists in the comp when they won it.
Here's an in short summary of those systems. Simplistic I know, but it's an easy to 'see' the systems.
Current Collingwood, team d, without ball they zone up to deny opposition transition footy (or attempt to) and force a kick / handball to contest, then Collingwood close space, suffocate the opposition to win turnover and then spread with ball speed in transition. If they don't win the first immediate contest, like ghosts 'where'd he come from?!', they just appear out of nowhere to outnumber at the next immediate contest.
You need to run harder both ways than your opposition to achieve this, which has its own compromises. For example if the close space game doesn't result in a possession win then they're exposed and allows the opposition outnumber and by extension transition forward, easy scoring opportunities if you will.
The Richmond dynasty, maybe the Tiger posters can help here. But the way I saw it, was that they basically forced contest forward and forced the opposition into submission and win ball. They basically sucked in the opposition into contest and won the ball and had numbers on the spread which allowed transition. In short a grunt contest team that won them ball and then easy transition.
The mantra that Kingy uses 'Don't get beaten by what you know', well that's easier said than done against a system like this. Same with the current Pies, easy to identify what you know, much harder to 'don't get beaten by'
More than certain, in fact Fly has stated that they train this system ad nausem during the week, probably the same with Dimma and Tiges in their dynasty.
To the North game last night, I haven't see this before, but unlike other teams this year, North or more accurately Clarko attempted to spread or widen the Pies team d zone set up to take away the Pies contest game and attempt to chip / mark through the widened team d zone. That requires a high efficiency possession game to achieve it. This worked well for the first 2 and a half qtrs.
Is this the blueprint to dismantle the Pies system? Maybe yes but you need to apply this for 4 qtrs, could a highly talented list team like Bris or Giants apply this for 4 qtrs?
Clearly these systems are / were better than the sum of their parts. Some will argue that Richmonds list was the best in their flag years, I'd argue the system they played gave that impression. For example, I'd argue the Giants they destroyed in 2019 were better list wise.
So how does a coaching panel optimize their lists to generate a very hard to defeat system? What is Fly's and previously Dimma's secret? Was it a secret?
Why can't teams defeat these 'systems'?
