Thornton a bigger loss than we realized

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Aren't medial ligament strains normally 4-6 weeks injuries?

I forget what grade Thornton's injury was, but tomorrow will be eactly 4 weeks since he did. If it wasn't that bad, there is a good chance that he is fit and ready to go.

Yes, initially they said a month, then hedged their bets a little. Maybe we have just benefitted from the best case scenario for once.

 

[jonoman89]

Yes, initially they said a month, then hedged their bets a little. Maybe we have just benefitted from the best case scenario for once.

he might be a bit under done, sure, but i doubt ratts would risk aggravating an injury to such a crucial member of the backline.

 

[len_jet]

Aren't medial ligament strains normally 4-6 weeks injuries?

I forget what grade Thornton's injury was, but tomorrow will be eactly 4 weeks since he did. If it wasn't that bad, there is a good chance that he is fit and ready to go.

if there is no tear it is only 2 - 4 weeks depending on pain... tears lead to 4-8 weeks with grade 3 generally leading to 8, but to do an 8 weeker you will almost certainly do some other damage such as an ACL

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

The main thrust of the post wasnt about Thornton being better than Waite or whether thornton can hold Brown etc.

It was more to the point of, Waite and Thornton provide a sense of confidence down back. Some of the younger guys are learning and sometimes make you close your eyes sometimes coming out of defence. Waite and Thornton are not perfect but that age experience made me feel the backline was fine this year. It was also more of a point that combined they mean something to our defence, and that divided, we revert to a rabble (well sort of).

Setanta can hold a key back yes, but when he gets the ball and starts running like a chook without a head, I start to look away in desparation. I'm sure even he doesnt know where he is going sometimes!!

Good to see you rise to the occasion wdgann, i know it must be hard for you being so wrong about a player yet having to continually make hollow statements. I know, I know, them are fighting words, but me thinks you got nuffin LOL!!

 

[len_jet]

The main thrust of the post wasnt about Thornton being better than Waite or whether thornton can hold Brown etc.

It was more to the point of, Waite and Thornton provide a sense of confidence down back. Some of the younger guys are learning and sometimes make you close your eyes sometimes coming out of defence. Waite and Thornton are not perfect but that age experience made me feel the backline was fine this year. It was also more of a point that combined they mean something to our defence, and that divided, we revert to a rabble (well sort of).

Setanta can hold a key back yes, but when he gets the ball and starts running like a chook without a head, I start to look away in desparation. I'm sure even he doesnt know where he is going sometimes!!

Good to see you rise to the occasion wdgann, i know it must be hard for you being so wrong about a player yet having to continually make hollow statements. I know, I know, them are fighting words, but me thinks you got nuffin LOL!!

watch for the "grammar correction" defense...

 

[TorresIsGod]

Yes, initially they said a month, then hedged their bets a little. Maybe we have just benefitted from the best case scenario for once.

Maybe you're right ODN, maybe we have just benefitted from the best case scenario.

I just hope he's fit enough to play out the game, of course, there's going to be a risk of playing him no matter what, but if he were to re-injure himself, or pull up sore and miss the next game, it'd be a massive failure, regardless of whether or not we beat Freo.

 

[thylacine60]

watch for the "grammar correction" defense...

No probs. Checked "nuffin" in the Oz Colloquial Dictionary:

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source - Share This
nuffin

Audio Help / Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[nuhf-in] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –noun

1.a ragged, disreputable person;
2.a child in ragged, ill-fitting, dirty clothes.
3.spawn produced from inter-breeding between collingwood & richmond supporters

 

[blues4flag]

watch for the "grammar correction" defense...

Last I checked, this was an Australian Football forum.

 

[wdgann]

Once again without Thornton we kept our opposition below 100 points. Bower, Waite and O'hailpin all did reasonable jobs. And we moved the ball out of defence quickly

We have the above 3 players (plus Jammo ) that are more than capable of holding down key players.

Thornton cannot play the quarterback role because his kicking is not good enough and he is too slow. Contrast this with Jordan MacMahon who has averaged 23 possessions this year playing that role, has pace and great kicking skills. Contrast Thornton with Macleod who also plays that role

I struggle to see a justification for including Thornton next week even with Jammo still out - especially against geelong who will maul slow takeouts out of defence. Further he is incapable in holding down their 2nd/3rd tall - possibly Hawkins

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

Once again without Thornton we kept our opposition below 100 points. Bower, Waite and O'hailpin all did reasonable jobs. And we moved the ball out of defence quickly

We have the above 3 players (plus Jammo ) that are more than capable of holding down key players.

Thornton cannot play the quarterback role because his kicking is not good enough and he is too slow. Contrast this with Jordan MacMahon who has averaged 23 possessions this year playing that role, has pace and great kicking skills. Contrast Thornton with Macleod who also plays that role

I struggle to see a justification for including Thornton next week even with Jammo still out - especially against geelong who will maul slow takeouts out of defence. Further he is incapable in holding down their 2nd/3rd tall - possibly Hawkins

I knew you would take one game and use it as proof. You need to keep the bigger picture in mind. Yesterday Setanta looked great, yet if you take all his games into account, he doesnt look so good. Carlton go up and down...they look great one week, then they look very poor defensively the next. Thornton helps lessen the swing between good and v/poor due to his experience, and due to his ability to play 2nd/3rd defensive tall and rebounding defender.

Contrast this with Jordan MacMahon who has averaged 23 possessions this year playing that role, has pace and great kicking skills.

This is slightly funny. If you had checked AFL stats, Thornton's disposal efficency is higher than Jordan's. Jordan could not stand any second/third tall in defense with success. He can only rebound and is suspect under pressure. He provides NO in-and-under. Thornton on the other hand gives you decent but not flash rebound, decent defence, and in and under contests. Really poor comparison IMO. Richmond were poor to give up anything for Jordan and the doggies got rid of a soft outside player with glee!

BTW
Beating Freo is a reasonable achievement but lets not overrate them and say our defence it strong. Lets review this after next week against a rebounding Cats rather than a rabble that is Fremantle right now.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Thornton cannot play the quarterback role because his kicking is not good enough and he is too slow. Contrast this with Jordan MacMahon who has averaged 23 possessions this year playing that role, has pace and great kicking skills. Contrast Thornton with Macleod who also plays that role

How many times have you seen McLeod or McMahon take a tall? Not a clever comparison.

Incidentally, Setanta had a great game yesterday although his disposal efficiency was only 52%.

Some stats for you - McMahon vs Thornton. It's a pity that stats for spoils aren't available.

Games

McMahon 9
Thornton 5 (injured in first few minutes of round 6 so won't include)

Possessions/Possession Average

McMahon 215 @ 23.88 per game
Thornton 104 @ 20.80 per game

Contested Possessions/Average

McMahon 36 @ 4.0 per game
Thornton 27 @ 5.4 per game

Clangers/Average

McMahon 23 @ 2.55 per game
Thornton 12 @ 2.40 per game

Disposal Efficiency Average

McMahon 77%
Thornton 76%

Rebound 50s/Average

McMahon 33 @ 3.66 per game
Thornton 21 @ 4.20 per game

Marks/Average

McMahon 56 @ 6.22 per game
Thornton 43 @ 8.6 per game

Contested Marks/Average

McMahon 1 @ 0.11 per game
Thornton 3 @ 0.6 per game

Tackles/Average

McMahon 16 @ 1.77 per game
Thornton 5 @ 1.00 per game

1%ers/Average

McMahon 18 @ 2.1 per game
Thornton 18 @ 3.6 per game

So if you think these guys are performing the same role, most of these stats are relevant.

Interesting that disposal was your big issue with Thornton, yet we find a 1% difference in efficiency compared to McMahon. Thornton also have less clangers and more contested possessions on average. Contested possessions generally affect the efficiency rate as well.

Thornton also does the team things more often as evidenced by the 1%ers and gives us a touch more drive out of defence and provides a marking option more often.

Does 3 less possessions per game take away from all the areas he is doing better in? I think not.

Pays to do some research before making comment.