Tippett's Gone - READ RULES BEFORE POSTING

[Vader]

and when he says get stuffed?

Tell him to take his chances in one of the drafts. I know you think no club will touch him, because he's said that he's only interested in going to Sydney. I think that's bollocks.

Tippett is just too good a talent to pass up - especially if all he's going to cost them is a lowly PSD selection. Worst comes to worst and he requests a trade at the end of next year - net cost to them is only $800k for one season. The reward comes during trade week, when their lowly PSD pick is effectively upgraded to 2x 1st round selections, one of which will be in the top-10. That's called investing for the future.

I'm guessing Tippett might become a bit more reasonable once he's made aware that his chances of getting to Sydney are all but extinct.

 

[Shamus75]

a simple question

did we go into this Tippet trade in a position of strength or a position of weakness (or an even keel)

Very Very weak position! A guy who wants out, will only deal with one club, they have nothing to offer us and no one else looking to take him other than a very thinly veiled threat from Silvagni. We were bent over from day 1 IMHO.

Not the AFC's fault, not Noble's fault, not Harper's fault. 100% Tiprat's fault (be it directly or through his dips**t manager).

Every other club would know our position so i highly doubt we'll be looked at any differently either by other clubs or current players no matter what we do. Yes they may have something we want, but if the players don't want to come to AFC then we're back to square one. There's no point coming out publicly just for the sakes of the BF posters looking for an answer to our own run away train thread. Crap, BF posters are threatening to cut up their memberships. S**t, someone on BF thinks Noble's a knob. Better put out a release so they calm down....If we have nothing official to say, just don't say anything. They don't owe us anything atm. Swans are posturing because they showed their hand early under a false illusion/promise of the 'gentlemens agreement' from Tiprat's manager and they really have to follow through now. Just wait for the play to unfold.

 

[1970crow]

really, we went into trade week with a player who would only talk to 1 party and that party has nothing to offer us.

I'm trying to find the strength here.

our strength comes from being able to say, "give us a good deal or he'll go to the draft and we'll pick him up again. we don't care, we hate him and will do it for pure enjoyment".

but we gave that up about 9500 posts ago.

 

[ruscy002]

what is that ? what would you have done.

and be realistic, try to avoid keyboard heroisms.

Very publically cut Sydney off after week one, giving Blucher/Tippett two weeks to reach terms with another suitor knowing full well that at least both GWS and Carlton are waiting in the PSD - he can't get to Sydney that way.

Seriously, trades bigger than this used to happen within a week. The pressure needed to be on Sydney from the get go, but all we did was talk about how fairly we've traded in the past.

 

[Realslimshady2]

Nick Stevens, John McCarthy...

Bradshaw, slightly different scenario but was traded unwillingly.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

I will be in the minority and hold my thoughts until we have confirmed details

 

[Ravenous Crow]

what is that ? what would you have done.

and be realistic, try to avoid keyboard heroisms.

I think the crucial mistake was the AFC outright dismissing and mocking the idea of redrafting Tippett.

Even if you know internally that there's no chance of it happening, you just don't reveal your hand like that. As Peter J says, our only potential position of strength was that we finished below Syndey, and thus have a higher pick in the PSD.

 

[Vader]

Yep and then what happens when he turns around and says no?

Then he goes in the PSD or ND (his choice).

I will take my chances in the PSD knowing full well Sydney are the only ones who can pick him up?

They're not. Indeed the chances of him still being available by the time Sydney enter the PSD or ND are somewhere between remote and non-existent. GWS & Carlton would both grab him with eager hands. Several other clubs would be reluctant to pass on him as well.

 

[Tex200]

Yep and then what happens when he turns around and says no? I will take my chances in the PSD knowing full well Sydney are the only ones who can pick him up?

You cant possibly know that.

Anyway he could not have got past us, so he never would have nominated. If we had played that card Kurt was snookered.

 

[Cap]

I agree with Ravenous Crow, that was a mistake IMO, purely because it showed out hand.

The only other thing would be to more public in their condemnation of Sydney (does it's absence suggesting something else is happening?)

Ireland brought this trade into the public arena I am disappointed out club has failed to fire a shot.

 

[Heafy83]

Tell him to take his chances in one of the drafts. I know you think no club will touch him, because he's said that he's only interested in going to Sydney. I think that's bollocks.

Tippett is just too good a talent to pass up - especially if all he's going to cost them is a lowly PSD selection. Worst comes to worst and he requests a trade at the end of next year - net cost to them is only $800k for one season. The reward comes during trade week, when their lowly PSD pick is effectively upgraded to 2x 1st round selections, one of which will be in the top-10. That's called investing for the future.

I'm guessing Tippett might become a bit more reasonable once he's made aware that his chances of getting to Sydney are all but extinct.

I think you are living in fantasy land if you believe that Vader. No one is going to touch him if he declares he wants a $1mill, 4 year contract. Plus the disharmony it could bring to a group.

 

[Vader]

I think the crucial mistake was the AFC outright dismissing and mocking the idea of redrafting Tippett.

Even if you know internally that there's no chance of it happening, you just don't reveal your hand like that. As Peter J says, our only potential position of strength was that we finished below Syndey, and thus have a higher pick in the PSD.

It didn't matter where we finished, or the fact that we stated openly that we wouldn't re-draft him. What was crucial is that Sydney finished as minor premiers - meaning that every single club in the league gets to have a go at drafting him before Sydney get a turn. They didn't have a high PSD pick, so they couldn't use that as a weapon against us.

 

[Team DJ]

**** Jesse White is Shit.

Piss Tippett off to the preseason draft the shit bag.

 

[Vader]

I think you are living in fantasy land if you believe that Vader. No one is going to touch him if he declares he wants a $1mill, 4 year contract. Plus the disharmony it could bring to a group.

He's worth it and everyone knows it. Carlton & GWS would be more than happy to pay that contract.

In any case, there's a very good chance that they'd only have to cover the first year of that contract. If he wants out at the end of 2013, then they only have to pay the first year of his contract and his new club pays the last 3 years.

It's all about risk vs reward. In Tippett's case, the potential reward is extremely high - and the risk is relatively low. The cost in $$ terms is mid-range - high, but probably short term. The cost in draft picks is negligible if he opts for the ND, indeed there is significant scope for them to profit massively in terms of draft picks gained vs draft picks used, should he request a trade after year 1 of his contract.

 

[Freddy Bassett]

Declare negotiations with Sydney to be closed, as they couldn't come up with anything even remotely close to acceptable.

Open negotiations with another club - probably Brisbane, Carlton or GWS. Tell Tippett to widen his horizons, because there is now no way for him to get to Sydney. Ask him which of those 3 he prefers and start dealing with a club that actually wants to trade fairly.

Best post of the thread.

 

[Wood_Duck]

I think the crucial mistake was the AFC outright dismissing and mocking the idea of redrafting Tippett.
Even if you know internally that there's no chance of it happening, you just don't reveal your hand like that.

This is not directed at you, but this has been floated by many as the way we should have approached the trade.

If you are going to make such a threat, you have to be believable. I really struggle to believe that anyone with any life experience at all would have ever given such a threat any credibility whatsoever. So much so that threatening something like this knowing full well you had no intention of following through was more likely to cause the club embarrassment than the current situation.

Harper laughed it off and Id be very confident it would have been laughed off by anyone we chose to float it with.

I cannot accept that representatives of any club we were dealing with would have been gullible enough to buy that story.

If you are going to use that sort of threat as your baseball bat, you have to believe that you will follow through with it. If you don't believe it, nor will anyone else.

 

[Bacon8]

Just to throw a spanner in those plans, Vader.

A draftee doesn't automatically get a 2 year contract. If they are drafted after a certain round, it's whatever deal the club wants.

Example: Orren Stephenson - Drafted #78 in 2011, and is out of contract now.

Whether Kirt would last until that cut-off is a different story.

 

[Vader]

I doubt he would have. He would face draft uncertainty. If he did that and by some miracle he slipped to swans...then he wins . But we would have stared him down at each turn with the potential of turning this around. All for the cost of 22 and white

If he slips to the Swans, then they come out evens (if he's in the ND). They still have to use pick #23, which is what they offered us in trade.

We come out losers in the short term, but re-gain some respect as a club and will almost certainly come out winners in the longer term.

It's impossible for Adelaide to come out significantly worse off, given that pick #23 has so little value in the first place.

I still think the chance of him sliding all the way through the draft to Sydney, either in the ND or PSD, are somewhere between remote and non-existent.

 

[Mattrox]

He's worth it and everyone knows it. Carlton & GWS would be more than happy to pay that contract.

In any case, there's a very good chance that they'd only have to cover the first year of that contract. If he wants out at the end of 2013, then they only have to pay the first year of his contract and his new club pays the last 3 years.

It's all about risk vs reward. In Tippett's case, the potential reward is extremely high - and the risk is relatively low. The cost in $$ terms is mid-range - high, but probably short term. The cost in draft picks is negligible if he opts for the ND, indeed there is significant scope for them to profit massively in terms of draft picks gained vs draft picks used, should he request a trade after year 1 of his contract.

And it means a team above us in the draft uses a pick on Tippett and one more rookie passes down the Draft order!

 

[Vader]

**** Jesse White is Shit.

Piss Tippett off to the preseason draft the shit bag.

Eloquent as usual DJ? Agree with the sentiments, but "I find your lack of eloquence disturbing".

 

[Wood_Duck]

Best post of the thread.

Really?

It was sheer fantasy.

 

[Stiffy_18]

really, we went into trade week with a player who would only talk to 1 party and that party has nothing to offer us.

I'm trying to find the strength here.

But he also had only one way of getting to that party and that was via trade!

The problem with the AFC is that they get narky when they get crossed, come out puffing their chest and talking tough but when it comes to walking the walk we become soft and can't do it. That is a MASSIVE problem with our "leadership" and I use that term very loosely.

Sometimes it actually pays off to stand up for a principle and what you believe in. The weakest are those that constantly "do the right thing" so that we don't make anyone feel uncomfortable.

I could not see any of the great leaders in the AFL or anywhere do what AFC are doing right about now. Do you think Bucky Cunningham would have bent over like this?!

We are talking about a man with great leadership and a resume that our own Steven Trigg won't achieve in he lived for another 500 years.

I am sick and tired of forking out $1000s EVERY single year to a club that is run by a bunch of pussies that could not lead their way out of a phone box. If this deal goes down as reported, they should not bother sending out my membership renewal packs because I am just not interested in being associated with a bunch of muppets that lack principle and leadership.

We will come out with a spin, play the victim in all this! Well guess what?! You are only victim in life if you allow yourself to be one and those running the show keep doing it over and over and over again, expecting a different results. That in itself is a definition of insanity!

 

[PyroCrow]

Best post of the thread.

Really?

It was sheer fantasy.

To be fair its competition isn't exactly top notch.

 

[Heafy83]

Then he goes in the PSD or ND (his choice).

They're not. Indeed the chances of him still being available by the time Sydney enter the PSD or ND are somewhere between remote and non-existent. GWS & Carlton would both grab him with eager hands. Several other clubs would be reluctant to pass on him as well.

This is BS and you know it. When is the last time a club picked up a $1mill a year contract in the PSD against his will?

If these clubs were prepared to grab him they would be in his ear now. Bulcher has even been quoted as saying they had not been approached by GWS.

I'm willing to bet my bigfooty account if it got that far he would still make it all the way to Sydney in the PSD. However it wont get that far because the Crows know this and they'd rather get something for him than nothing by the looks of it.

 

[Freddy Bassett]

He's worth it and everyone knows it. Carlton & GWS would be more than happy to pay that contract.

In any case, there's a very good chance that they'd only have to cover the first year of that contract. If he wants out at the end of 2013, then they only have to pay the first year of his contract and his new club pays the last 3 years.

It's all about risk vs reward. In Tippett's case, the potential reward is extremely high - and the risk is relatively low. The cost in $$ terms is mid-range - high, but probably short term. The cost in draft picks is negligible if he opts for the ND, indeed there is significant scope for them to profit massively in terms of draft picks gained vs draft picks used, should he request a trade after year 1 of his contract.

He is worth it if you can trade him for peanuts.
He is not worth it if you have to give up 2 first round draft picks for him