Tippett's Gone - READ RULES BEFORE POSTING

[Mattrox]

There are more than 23 good players in this draft. Better we try and get one of them than give away that opportunity out of spite. A bird in the hand and all that.

Im not pissed at the club, Im pissed at the AFl that comes up with a system that allows a player to effectively hold us to ransom. It's a particular issue for interstate clubs because of the "go home" factor. Clubs in Victoria are rarely in this position and when they are they are still in a stronger position because there's always Victorians playing interstate willing to come home. This is just another inequity in the system and unfortunately we have copped a fair whack in all of this.

Im with Carl on this in that we should look more to local talent, but Id go one step further and suggest that there needs to be some mechanism put into the draft system that gives us priority access to local talent. Perhaps a bidding system of some sort similar to the F/S rule. Whatever, the whole player movement framework needs to be overhauled, or else we will continue to be screwed.

Zorko went to Brisbane as QLD pick. Perhaps there should be an SA area pick Port get one we get one. But if it were in effect this year they would get Toumpas.

 

[feenix67]

There may well be more than 23 good players, will one of those 23 players be in our first 18 next year as we compete with the Swans (potentially in a finals setting)
If not we've strengthened them and weakened ourselves in the short-medium term

As opposed to strengthening them and weakening ourselves over the short-long term?

Kurt will get to Sydney one way or the other. We may as well get something for him.

 

[bobshoby]

Perhaps he would have, we'll never know since it seems we're going to eagerly accept the scraps we've been offered

 

[feenix67]

Zorko went to Brisbane as QLD pick. Perhaps there should be an SA area pick Port get one we get one. But if it were in effect this year they would get Toumpas.

.... we'd get Grundy/Menzel... everyone's happy.

 

[Johnny Rutten]

Zorko went to Brisbane as QLD pick. Perhaps there should be an SA area pick Port get one we get one. But if it were in effect this year they would get Toumpas.

Zorko was actually listed by Gold Coast as a Queensland zone selection, then traded to Lions. I bet the Suns are kicking themselves, he is a beauty.

 

[Hodgy]

There are more than 23 good players in this draft. Better we try and get one of them than give away that opportunity out of spite. A bird in the hand and all that.

Im not pissed at the club, Im pissed at the AFl that comes up with a system that allows a player to effectively hold us to ransom. It's a particular issue for interstate clubs because of the "go home" factor. Clubs in Victoria are rarely in this position and when they are they are still in a stronger position because there's always Victorians playing interstate willing to come home. This is just another inequity in the system and unfortunately we have copped a fair whack in all of this.

Im with Carl on this in that we should look more to local talent, but Id go one step further and suggest that there needs to be some mechanism put into the draft system that gives us priority access to local talent. Perhaps a bidding system of some sort similar to the F/S rule. Whatever, the whole player movement framework needs to be overhauled, or else we will continue to be screwed.

I would be surprised if any go home factor hasn't worked against Victorian clubs more often than it has non Vicorian clubs. Even this year we have seen players wanting to go back to WA and surely Thompson and Jacobs makes the ledger swing in our favour over the journey. Players like Brett James, Koster, Darren Jarman, Scott Welsh, Begley, Carey the list goes on and on. Some haven't worked out while some have been great but I can only really think of Stenglein, Kane Johnson and Gunstan that have wanted to go home the other way, and none of them has proven to hurt us too much. The often quoted theory that we get reemed by go homes just doesn't stack up as far as I am concerned.

And BTW if we took home grown all the time we wouldn't have Dangerfield, Sloan, Mckay and Van Berlo in our midfield next year, I think I'll back our recruiting staff in on this one.

 

[feenix67]

Perhaps he would have, we'll never know since it seems we're going to eagerly accept the scraps we've been offered

Carlton or Freo would be potential PSD seagulls.... aren't they contenders as well?

Im as pissed as anyone about this situation, but the club needs to remain rational about it.

 

[Realslimshady2]

My Girlfriend added into her vows a few weeks ago: I... take you.... on the understanding that there will always be another man in my life, Jim Beam... (of course, she also walked up the aisle to the strains of the JAWS theme )

Love it! Theres something to be said for being original in your wedding, doesnt have to be big, just something quirky

 

[Tex Support]

Pick 22, which would have a 10% strike rate at best, is a small price to pay for respect at the trade table in the future, and taking a stand might just lead to a better deal this year anyway.

I reckon most clubs, given the option between nothing and pick 22, would take pick 22. I understand the moral stance, but from a business stand point, it makes no sense. My opinion is based on the fact we cant get a better deal this year anyway, which you've acknowledged too.

If they don't think like that it's a problem with our club's management, i guarentee they think like that at Collingwood (as one obvious example)

Losing Tippett for nothing to Sydney is the worst case scenario, pick 23 and a list clogger is so close to effectively being nothing that i'd rather just roll the dice and hope someone else grabs him. (Or at least posture on that basis and increase the pressure on the Swans and Tippett to make a decent deal)

Pick 23, in AFL terms, is not 'effectively nothing'.

Letting Tippett leave the club for free would be a disaster. There's every chance we get screwed no matter what here, so why make it worse. The fact that Tippett has so publically declared Sydney as his new team is the biggest spanner in the works. Either he gets traded there, or he goes there for free because they're the only ones he'll play for, and coincidentally, are probably the only ones happy to pay him his asking price.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

Accepting pick 22/23 is a double edged sword

On one side we get an opportunity to hopefully identify a future star 200 gamer and on the other hand we deny Syd the opportunity

The club should not make decisions based on emotion but I'm now leaning towards taking the pick and not ending up in a situation where they get Tippett in the draft and they pick a very good player with their first selection

Would hate for Menzel to slide and he plays in the forward 50 along side Kurt

 

[JasRulz63]

Zorko went to Brisbane as QLD pick. Perhaps there should be an SA area pick Port get one we get one. But if it were in effect this year they would get Toumpas.

Zorko was on-traded to Brisbane from GC who took him as a zone selection, we couldn't take him as a zone selection ourselves as GC got first dip (more concessions)

 

[marvin]

"The Swans are reportedly able to meet Tippett's wage demands, but their apparent offers of a second-round pick or out-of-favour forward/ruck White are short of the Crows' expectations."

From the AFL draft winds article for today. An offer of a second round pick or White are short of Crow's expectations? I would have thought they were even short of crazy Vossy's expectations!

I wish the AFL trade winds would catch up with what everyone else realised a long time ago.

Jesse White is Brad Moran with more tatts and less bleach.

Forget crazy Vossy, even Gerard Neesham doesn't think that's good.

 

[feenix67]

I would be surprised if any go home factor hasn't worked against Victorian clubs more often than it has non Vicorian clubs. Even this year we have seen players wanting to go back to WA and surely Thompson and Jacobs makes the ledger swing in our favour over the journey. Players like Brett James, Koster, Darren Jarman, Scott Welsh, Begley, Carey the list goes on and on. Some haven't worked out while some have been great but I can only really think of Stenglein, Kane Johnson and Gunstan that have wanted to go home the other way, and none of them has proven to hurt us too much. The often quoted theory that we get reemed by go homes just doesn't stack up as far as I am concerned.

And BTW if we took home grown all the time we wouldn't have Dangerfield, Sloan, Mckay and Van Berlo in our midfield next year, I think I'll back our recruiting staff in on this one.

What about all the players we approach for trades that wont come to Adelaide?

You listed 6 players that have come back to Adelaide. 3 that have left. So lets do the maths:

Adelaide 3
Collingwood 1
Bulldogs 1
Hawthorn 1
North 1 (technically 2 although they already sacked Carey)
Saints 1

See the maths? Less clubs in a state = higher chance of being bitten by go home factor.

 

[bobshoby]

Carlton or Freo would be potential PSD seagulls.... aren't they contenders as well?

Im as pissed as anyone about this situation, but the club needs to remain rational about it.

Up to a point, i don't think he ever would've reached the PSD if anyone took our threat somewhat seriously but if he had then both of those clubs would be preferable to Sydney

 

[Johnny Rutten]

Accepting pick 22/23 is a double edged sword

On one side we get an opportunity to hopefully identify a future star 200 gamer and on the other hand we deny Syd the opportunity

The club should not make decisions based on emotion but I'm now leaning towards taking the pick and not ending up in a situation where they get Tippett in the draft and they pick a very good player with their first selection

Would hate for Menzel to slide and he plays in the forward 50 along side Kurt

Agreed. I'm relenting as well (sorry to be a pussy). Would be a bad business decision to pass on 22/23 if that is all that is offered. Just cop it in the face, and move on. I think we should also demand their 2nd round pick as well (42/43). That pick can then be bundled up with our pick 40/41 for a higher pick. No Jesse White. please.

 

[Canberra Based Crow]

Zorko was on-traded to Brisbane from GC who took him as a zone selection, we couldn't take him as a zone selection ourselves as GC got first dip (more concessions)

That would be great, but the purpose of that pick is for states where AFL isnt the first choice option and is in direct competition with other codes, so the level of quality overall is lower than somewhere like the VFL and the SANFL.

 

[Johnny Rutten]

Jesse White is Brad Moran with more tatts and less bleach.

Best description of Jesse White, period.

 

[Tex Support]

If not we've strengthened them and weakened ourselves in the short-medium term

The fact we can cover Tippett so easily (again, thats only my opinion) is what makes pick 22 not so bad for mine. We can use it, either directly or indirectly (packaged in another deal) to help address other needs on our list.

Losing Tippett is not a worry. Losing him for absolute zero is. Pick 19 and 22 for example, starts to look better if we're looking at other players.

You absolutely never give anything away for free in business. Port did it, and look at them. Congrats on the moral high ground, but hows you balance sheet.

 

[Vader]

If we take 22.
I wouldnt mind trying to package up 22 and 19 to try and get something closer to pick 10.

If all we get are picks, then I hope we grab Sydney's 1st, 2nd & 3rd picks - packaging them up for something closer to 10. I think we'll still want 2x selections in the first round, hence not trading 19 & 23 together.

 

[JasRulz63]

That would be great, but the purpose of that pick is for states where AFL isnt the first choice option and is in direct competition with other codes, so the level of quality overall is lower than somewhere like the VFL and the SANFL.

Pretty much. It's why the two Queensland and NSW (including your best buddies Sydney) clubs, have a new academy system in place where they get the first dibs at local talent using the same bidding system as the F/S system.

 

[feenix67]

Up to a point, i don't think he ever would've reached the PSD if anyone took our threat somewhat seriously but if he had then both of those clubs would be preferable to Sydney

what part of "he refuses to speak to anyone but Sydney" don't you understand? The only way he gets to anywhere apart from Sydney is in the PSD, unless the AFL step in and mediate, which they wont.

 

[Johnny Rutten]

You absolutely never give anything away for free in business. Port did it, and look at them. Congrats on the moral high ground, but hows you balance sheet.

In fairness to Port, they won the flag the year after their Nick Stevens stance. But, generally-speaking, you are absolutely spot on.

 

[Mattrox]

Agreed. I'm relenting as well (sorry to be a pussy). Would be a bad business decision to pass on 22/23 if that is all that is offered. Just cop it in the face, and move on. I think we should also demand their 2nd round pick as well (42/43). That pick can then be bundled up with our pick 40/41 for a higher pick. No Jesse White. please.

If it was only picks we would need their 1st 3 picks as Vader has suggested.

 

[Canberra Based Crow]

The fact we can cover Tippett so easily (again, thats only my opinion) is what makes pick 22 not so bad for mine. We can use it, either directly or indirectly (packaged in another deal) to help address other needs on our list.

Losing Tippett is not a worry. Losing him for absolute zero is. Pick 19 and 22 for example, starts to look better if we're looking at other players.

You absolutely never give anything away for free in business. Port did it, and look at them. Congrats on the moral high ground, but hows you balance sheet.

I agree too, we definitely have the cover but its more to do with Principle and the future.

Look at how the Gunston trade went down and potentially this one....other clubs will think they can walk all over us.

 

[feenix67]

If all we get are picks, then I hope we grab Sydney's 1st, 2nd & 3rd picks - packaging them up for something closer to 10. I think we'll still want 2x selections in the first round, hence not trading 19 & 23 together.

who the hell is going to take 2nd and 3rd round picks in this draft?