Today I learned about capitalism

[peetoo]

apologies misunderstood. I dont have an issue with oil being used as a feedstock. just a combustible energy source.

Sorry I wasn’t clear I agree broadly. If raw petrochemicals are really finit and harder to extract, we really should be smart and make that part more sustainable, ie not burn it for energy when we don’t need to.

 

[Gralin]

Capitalism isnt a living being that needs things. Thats people.

capitalism created the ability to consume lots of stuff by the masses because it created considerable wealth. But humans misplaced desire for stuff was there long before capitalism. Go look at the size of old european aristocrats castles. They long preceeded capitalism.

Funny you should mention feudalism....

 

[kalex6251]

rubbish tv aside, have a gander at 'luxe sydney listings' if you want an insight into the psychology of capitalism - sydney style

 

[Seeds]

dude if you can't understand that the resources on this planet itself are finite and that you cannot productivity your way out of that like you are suggesting there is literally no point discussing the topic with you

capitalism requires unending growth to sustain it, this is not possible to achieve indefinitely, at some point there will be a collapse, we're having lots of small collapses now and we're accelerating the destruction of many resources to keep the numbers going up while doing it

So i defined how my humanist definition of infinite was not the same as the physics definition and you are just going to ignore it and keep thinking Im claiming the physics definition and argue against that? You know from physics point of view free will doesnt exist which makes the very concept of argument, choice and consciousness effectively meaningless. Free will does thankfully exist from humanities point of view though so lucky us.

We are going in circles cos you simply dont want to address the point that your finite assumption from the point of view of humanity isnt accurate now that humans are directly harnessing the sun (not to mention benefitting from ongoing developments in genetic engineering, metals recycling and alternative materials).

the sun isnt going anywhere in the next 20 000 years and by then humans will either have destroyed themselves or found ways to move to other solar systems. Likewise developments in genetic engineering, metal recycling and alternative materials is also going to buy us more then enough time before anyone needs to start seeking materials from other planets.

we arent going to run out of fossil fuels like the non economists thought we were just 20 years ago. In fact many thought we would have to stop driving cars by now because oil would already be gone by now. Instead we are going to stop using fossil fuels out of our own volition because harnessing the suns power is far cheaper. You would think so called lefties would be cheering this fact on. the economists turned out to be right on fossil fuels.

we arent going to run out of productive farming land and all die in mass starvation as the malthusians and their disciples have been espousing for well over a century due to exponential population growth. Human agriculture land requirements have already peaked and are now going backwards by our own choice. And this is only going to dramatically accelerate from this point foward. Efficiency is going to win. The forests will come back. Again you would think lefties would be cheering this on. Once again the economists are going to be right.

 

[Gralin]

So i defined how my humanist definition of infinite was not the same as the physics definition and you are just going to ignore it and keep thinking Im claiming the physics definition and argue against that? You know from physics point of view free will doesnt exist which makes the very concept of argument, choice and consciousness effectively meaningless. Free will does thankfully exist from humanities point of view though so lucky us.

We are going in circles cos you simply dont want to address the point that your finite assumption from the point of view of humanity isnt accurate now that humans are directly harnessing the sun (not to mention benefitting from ongoing developments in genetic engineering, metals recycling and alternative materials).

the sun isnt going anywhere in the next 20 000 years and by then humans will either have destroyed themselves or found ways to move to other solar systems. Likewise developments in genetic engineering, metal recycling and alternative materials is also going to buy us more then enough time before anyone needs to start seeking materials from other planets.

we arent going to run out of fossil fuels like the non economists thought we were just 20 years ago. In fact many thought we would have to stop driving cars by now because oil would already be gone by now. Instead we are going to stop using fossil fuels out of our own volition because harnessing the suns power is far cheaper. You would think so called lefties would be cheering this fact on. the economists turned out to be right on fossil fuels.

we arent going to run out of productive farming land and all die in mass starvation as the malthusians and their disciples have been espousing for well over a century due to exponential population growth. Human agriculture land requirements have already peaked and are now going backwards by our own choice. And this is only going to dramatically accelerate from this point foward. Efficiency is going to win. The forests will come back. Again you would think lefties would be cheering this on. Once again the economists are going to be right.

Lol

 

[Ghost Patrol]

So i defined how my humanist definition of infinite was not the same as the physics definition and you are just going to ignore it and keep thinking Im claiming the physics definition and argue against that? You know from physics point of view free will doesnt exist which makes the very concept of argument, choice and consciousness effectively meaningless. Free will does thankfully exist from humanities point of view though so lucky us.

We are going in circles cos you simply dont want to address the point that your finite assumption from the point of view of humanity isnt accurate now that humans are directly harnessing the sun (not to mention benefitting from ongoing developments in genetic engineering, metals recycling and alternative materials).

the sun isnt going anywhere in the next 20 000 years and by then humans will either have destroyed themselves or found ways to move to other solar systems. Likewise developments in genetic engineering, metal recycling and alternative materials is also going to buy us more then enough time before anyone needs to start seeking materials from other planets.

we arent going to run out of fossil fuels like the non economists thought we were just 20 years ago. In fact many thought we would have to stop driving cars by now because oil would already be gone by now. Instead we are going to stop using fossil fuels out of our own volition because harnessing the suns power is far cheaper. You would think so called lefties would be cheering this fact on. the economists turned out to be right on fossil fuels.

we arent going to run out of productive farming land and all die in mass starvation as the malthusians and their disciples have been espousing for well over a century due to exponential population growth. Human agriculture land requirements have already peaked and are now going backwards by our own choice. And this is only going to dramatically accelerate from this point foward. Efficiency is going to win. The forests will come back. Again you would think lefties would be cheering this on. Once again the economists are going to be right.

Humans aren't the only species on this planet. Stop trying to ruin it for them.

 

[Seeds]

Humans aren't the only species on this planet. Stop trying to ruin it for them.

its actually consciousness that I value and human consciousness vastly exceeds other species thus we use the word humanism. mammals are also worth caring about because they too have emotional states and can experience happiness at varying levels. Fish, bugs, reptiles and plants not so much.

 

[Seeds]

Funny you should mention feudalism....

Why? Do you have an actual point or are you just posting the intuitional associations forming in your head out loud for some reason?

 

[Seeds]

Lol

As per usual you withdraw from the argument when you dont have a response. Dont try to question something or learn or reconsider. Just withdraw so you can remain in your ideolgical bubble where you dont have to consider changing your mind.

 

[Gralin]

As per usual you withdraw from the argument when you dont have a response. Dont try to question something or learn or reconsider. Just withdraw so you can remain in your ideolgical bubble where you dont have to consider changing your mind.

oh ok we can do the extended version of the lol if you prefer

So i defined how my humanist definition of infinite was not the same as the physics definition and you are just going to ignore it and keep thinking Im claiming the physics definition and argue against that?

when you're talking about resources in the physical world I'm not really sure what "your humanist definition" of infinite or even what it would mean

You know from physics point of view free will doesnt exist which makes the very concept of argument, choice and consciousness effectively meaningless. Free will does thankfully exist from humanities point of view though so lucky us.

you're like a first year philosophy student going checkmate science!

We are going in circles cos you simply dont want to address the point that your finite assumption from the point of view of humanity isnt accurate now that humans are directly harnessing the sun (not to mention benefitting from ongoing developments in genetic engineering, metals recycling and alternative materials).

pie in the sky stuff right here, also not sure what the benefits of engineering have to do with physically finite resources and diminishing returns from increasing efficiency unless you're going all matrix and breeding human batteries

the sun isnt going anywhere in the next 20 000 years

well I'm glad about that, how long do you think we have, 21 000 years?

and by then humans will either have destroyed themselves or found ways to move to other solar systems.

I'm betting on the first option and it not taking another 200 years at our current rate of ******* up the planet

Likewise developments in genetic engineering, metal recycling and alternative materials is also going to buy us more then enough time before anyone needs to start seeking materials from other planets.

so you are going for human batteries, totally cool and normal response to the problem of capitalism

we arent going to run out of fossil fuels like the non economists thought we were just 20 years ago.

we aren't? we have unlimited fossil fuels? also by non economists do you mean actual scientists? or just normal people, kind curious about who you are attacking with the slur of non economist?
we had car manufacturers saying it in the last decade and Shell and BHP saying it in the last 3 years

In fact many thought we would have to stop driving cars by now because oil would already be gone by now.

many who?

Instead we are going to stop using fossil fuels out of our own volition because harnessing the suns power is far cheaper.

which we currently still use fossil fuels to do and what do you mean of our own volition?
you don't think the finite resource destroying the planet that led to research into alternatives had anything to do with it? we just decided nah we're going to stop using you for no reason

You would think so called lefties would be cheering this fact on. the economists turned out to be right on fossil fuels.

economists again..... they'd generally be in the gulags with the pollies and ceo's boards and billionaires if I had a gulag and the ability to end capitalism
maybe I should get a gulag?

we arent going to run out of productive farming land and all die in mass starvation as the malthusians and their disciples have been espousing for well over a century due to exponential population growth.

oh that's a relief, wait its going to be increasing extreme weather events killing off people faster than we can breed causing population collapse and the death of capitalism instead isn't it

reckon there will be a bit of starvation in that when crops and animals are destroyed in the events, food security is definitely going to be an issue

Human agriculture land requirements have already peaked and are now going backwards by our own choice. And this is only going to dramatically accelerate from this point foward. Efficiency is going to win.

yay efficiency, we're going to grow more and more food with less and less resources required and that food is going to be more and more nutritious with less and less input and yay humanism

The forests will come back.

they will? yay, I'm glad they will, we shouldn't have told them to leave in the first place and change weather cycles creating deserts
I'm glad they'll just return of their own volition and save us

Again you would think lefties would be cheering this on. Once again the economists are going to be right.

I didn't realise it was lefties vs economists

but it makes sense going to go tell antifa to stop going after the nazis and start going after the economists brb

Why? Do you have an actual point or are you just posting the intuitional associations forming in your head out loud for some reason?

you can't see the association?
I thought an amatuer economist and humanist such as yourself would get this one, but maybe you've not really looked into history much?

 

[Over The Post]

Cliffs?

 

[Gralin]

View attachment 1808837

Cliffs?

cliffs would be seeds wrote dumb stuff and got annoyed when i just said lol the first time so I expanded on my lol

 

[Number37]

View attachment 1808837

Cliffs?

Already provided the Cliffs.

Lol