Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 8 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[_Mike_]

Opposition supporters coming to troll , you have been warned

 

[Lindsay_Gilbee]

He is not getting hate, warranted or unwarranted.

People are simply questioning where he is at in terms of his development and whether he will indeed be able to make it. This should be expected for a high draft pick who hasn't established himself at the level after three years in the system, and after being passed by a rookie selection who came in a year and a bit later.

If he was at another less patient club, he might have been delisted already.

The fact that the role he is being developed to fill has been the Bulldog's regularly exploited Achillies heal, has also added some additional focus. If he was a midfielder who was taking a bit longer than hoped, there would be less scrutiny as the care factor would be a lot lower.

The issue for Busslinger is that by this stage, the club needed him to be looking like a long-term cornerstone of our defence at AFL level, not like a decent developing back in the VFL who might still make it if we show a bit more patience.

I think this is pretty selective. O’Donnell is two years older than Jedd. Comparing a 21 year old to a 23 year old when it comes to key backs is massive.

How many key defenders establish themselves before the age of 22?

Having a look at at key defenders who were taken before pick 20 in the draft from the last few years. COS at 11 in 2023 and Sam De Koning at 19 in 2020 are the only ones who’ve shown anything close to AFL level in their early years.

 

[Bulldog Banana]

The new ruck rule coming in next season should help English.

 

[yebach]

Re Buss, I'm not suggesting he'll reach these heights. For mine Alex Rance was the best defender I've seen. But after his first 10-20 games I thought he was worse than a VFL level player.
Again, for mine Buss has so far shown enough that we should give him a fair crack.

 

[Lindsay_Gilbee]

Looking at other key defenders. The only ones who’ve shown have made an impact from the get go are Andrews, Weitering and Talia imo. Over the last decade pretty much every other gun key back has taken a while to develop.

I’m not saying Buss is gonna be a gun, but to say other clubs would’ve delisted him by now is laughable. Even Denver Granger-Barrass got four years! Same with Fischer Mcacey.

 

[Lindsay_Gilbee]

The new ruck rule coming in next season should help English.

I’m not sure if it does. Surely a more predictable bounce (or throw I guess) means the big bastards will be able to put it on a plate for their mids?

 

[Foxman98]

Looking at other key defenders. The only ones who’ve shown have made an impact from the get go are Andrews, Weitering and Talia imo. Over the last decade pretty much every other gun key back has taken a while to develop.

I’m not saying Buss is gonna be a gun, but to say other clubs would’ve delisted him by now is laughable. Even Denver Granger-Barrass got four years! Same with Fischer Mcacey.

Weitering didn't was thrown forward because he was struggling early

 

[Foxman98]

I’m not sure if it does. Surely a more predictable bounce (or throw I guess) means the big bastards will be able to put it on a plate for their mids?

Means they can't wrestle without it being a free

 

[Libbaaaa]

I’m not sure if it does. Surely a more predictable bounce (or throw I guess) means the big bastards will be able to put it on a plate for their mids?

Have the actually announced the ruck rule change or is it just that there will always be ball ups? Sick of watching Xerri, ROB and co just stand bang in the middle of centre circle and wrestle.

 

[dogwatch]

Have the actually announced the ruck rule change or is it just that there will always be ball ups? Sick of watching Xerri, ROB and co just stand bang in the middle of centre circle and wrestle.

They’ve decided not to write down the rules any more. They just get too much scrutiny which then causes the AFL a whole lot of trouble.

Instead they will have a general statement of intent along the lines of “Two big blokes (definitely not three) will contest a ball thrown in the air by an umpire”.

Then every month (or every week or whenever they feel like it, possibly even mid-match) they will announce the current “vibe” relating to the rule. This will naturally change the interpretation of the rule.

The new vibe will be published on Insta. Or sometimes on the Geelong FC website, depending on their mood. They won’t directly inform the umpires about the new vibe. It will be up to the umpires to check their social feed (or GFC website).

To facilitate all this a new Vibe Panel will be established. It will be chaired by Chris Scott (in a part time capacity of course).

 

[Testekill]

One year extensions for Baker and Coffield.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Have the actually announced the ruck rule change or is it just that there will always be ball ups? Sick of watching Xerri, ROB and co just stand bang in the middle of centre circle and wrestle.

It's been announced with wording of "league confirmed":

AFL scraps centre bounce and sub rule, All-Aus team tweaked

The centre bounce and the substitute have been removed ahead of next season

www.afl.com.au

I think the logic goes that given the unpredictable nature of centre bounces in terms of height, angle etc. a successful strategy is to simply wrestle and wait for the ball to drop from its centre bounce, because it's hard to time a jump for a hitout because it's hard to predict where and when the ball will be at its height for your natural jumping arc and for you to time it. So wrestling becomes the better strategy.

On the other hand tossing the ball up, which umpires will generally do straight and with some consistency of height, allows for the rucks to have some ability to predict the drop of the ball, so they can time their runs and jump and tapwork.

English has always been quite a good ruck at directing his taps to the midfield provided he actually gets his hands on the ball. He's not great at winning the first hands to the ball ruck contests or winning contests on the physical side of things (like taking it out of the ruck).

I don't agree with the logic. Only a small amount of stoppages are at centre bounces, enough bounces had some consistency of height anyway, and they would toss the ball up in the current rules when recalling bounces or in wet weather. And with the three types of stoppages (centre, throw-in and around the ground ball up), English's weakness is clearly throw ins, where using strength to get to front position is far more important. As much as the "lack of physicality" argument is valid I don't think it's found in the centre bounces as much as it's found mainly in throw ins.

 

[DiamondDogs8]

Can’t wrap my head around the Coffield extension. Oh well

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Can’t wrap my head around the Coffield extension. Oh well

Weak draft.

 

[weltschmerz]

Can’t wrap my head around the Coffield extension. Oh well

Guess we're just not in any position to drop another defender.

 

[Testekill]

Can’t wrap my head around the Coffield extension. Oh well

Can't fire everyone

 

[Mantis Toboggan]

Weak draft.

So keep JJ and/or Poulter. Coffield offers nothing.

 

[JohnnySteel]

One year extensions for Baker and Coffield.

Assuming this is on the main list? Which would mean we only have two spots left on the main list with Baker & JOD needing to be upgraded & two spots available for rookie?

If that’s the case it would all but confirm that we’re likely to trade up with our first two picks & leave a late pick for Darcy perhaps?

EDIT: didn’t account for Budarick incoming..

Someone better with numbers & have some idea on spots available - please advise

 

[Bulldogs85]

 

[ossie_21]

Can’t wrap my head around the Coffield extension. Oh well

If you haven’t learnt football by now, you probably never will

 

[JohnnySteel]

If Coff kicks on next year it will be an inspired signing. Needs to do whatever he can to regain some athleticism & find some confidence in his disposal again for that to happen.

 

[Doggies7]

So we won't have a pick now in the PSD for a mature depth KPD ie Frost?

I think we are pretty thin and need a Jones replacement. Our KPDs had decent health last year, but one injury to Lobb or JOD and we are in Gardner territory (with nobody backing him up) very quickly.

 

[Distinctive_]

So we won't have a pick now in the PSD for a mature depth KPD ie Frost?

I think we are pretty thin and need a Jones replacement. Our KPDs had decent health last year, but one injury to Lobb or JOD and we are in Gardner territory (with nobody backing him up) very quickly.

Assuming baker will be upgraded so that should be a spot freed up

 

[DiamondDogs8]

If you haven’t learnt football by now, you probably never will

?

 

[Doggies7]

Assuming baker will be upgraded so that should be a spot freed up

ah ok, I was very confused with list spots and JOD etc needing to be upgraded. I thought if we took 3 picks in the draft, we wouldn't have any list spots yet, but will we have 1 rookie spot to either sign a Frost, Derksen, Blight etc OR keep it for train ons in the pre-season / mid season draft spot?

 

[Dogsfan1]

Zak and bont at the same Nba game