Update On The Pagan Petition

[Napolean]

Hypotheticals here, mate. Point I'm trying to make is that, no-one can predict the future, and there's no point in worrying about it, as all you'll end up doing is forgetting the present.

Ridiculous statement. That's why the club is in the position it is in now. Under Elliott, no one bothered with the future and when the future arrived, well, look at us now.

Seriously, what will be gained by sacking Pagan and what will be lost?


Benefits

• New coach who may get the list to perform better. I don't think anyone would disagree if I say (sarcastically) a new coach is all that lies between us and a flag
• Club releases the pressure for calls from people like CammoAU to replace Pagan.

What else will we get? I can't think of any other benefits.

Downsides

• Payout Pagan's contract. Big $'s the club cannot afford right now.
• A new coach doesn't make the team perform any better than Pagan.
• The club's reputation suffers negative publicity over the sacking. Will this be as bad as the negative publicity we are getting now? I think so, but others may disagree. We already have been flogged by the media as being a rabble, this will be like throwing fresh meat to the wolves.

These are some quick thoughts I came up with. Others I am sure will have more relevant points but I think it is important to state what we gain and what we lose by sacking Pagan. In my opinion, and in an attempt to predict the future, the losses will far outway the gains. And that is saying something considering where we are at now.

 

[avid blue supporter]

you are a disgrace and not a true blue put it in the bin

How would you know what a true blue was like. The petition is a waste of time and space.

Have a look at Essendon, don't they remind you of Carlton in 2002. Imagine what they would be like if they were kept out of the draft for 2 years. Pagan, after inheriting a basket case in 2002 has in reality had only had 1 and a bit years to have a good crack at rebuiding the side. 2003 & 2004 were basically years where all he could do was to put a cobbled together side on the park and hope it would be competitive. We are now starting to see some of the kids coming through. Apart from a hickup against Collingwood (who are looking like a very good side) in the second half, all of the games this year have been reasonable and if we had had Waite on the ground for all matches Carlton could easily have pinched 1 or 2 more of these games.

The best time to have a look at Pagan will be at the end of next year when he would have had a reasonable preiod under normal circumstances to build a team.

Relax and enjoy the ride for this year

 

[leonidas]

Seems to be fair bit of condemnation for poor old Cammo.
People seem to be getting rather worked up.

The thing is that if Cammo's petition gets a whole swag of signatures then it will be an indication of a general dissatisfaction with the coaches performance

If he gets just a few there is nothing for people to get steamed up about as it will be disregarded as a bit of a joke.

If your expressing concern about the petition it can only mean that you don't have a lot of faith in the coach's ability to convince the Carlton masses he's the right man for the job and/or little faith in the judgement of your fellow supporters.

 

[ryan2000]

I too am a VERY FRIM believer in that our list is not as crap as most make it out to be...........and the sad thing, some of the negitivity towards our list comes directly from the club itself on occasions!

Let me tell you (and any other club supporter reading this post, please feel free to aggree/disaggree on what i'm about to say) any other of the 15 clubs out there would KILL to have a forward line including either a Fevola, a Waite or a Whitnall! And we have all three!

Simpson, Waite, Thornton, Betts, Walker, Bentick, Carrazzo..........these are some great kids that i have a lot of belief in.
Add youngsters such as Murphy/Kennedy/Bower (My personal fav!!!)/Harlett to that!

YES! I fully believe we have a good list - of course it could be better, but who's list couldn't!

Cast your mind back a few years ago - The Adelaide Crows......... Most were putting their houses on the Crows winning the wooden spoon "Due to their list being poor!!!!!!"
A new coach comes into play - with the same list (minus a few actually) AND ALMOST WINS A #$*&ING PREMIERSHIP!

I think Pagan is one of the best coaches of all time and has proven it time and time again, and he has every right to be remembered as a legend of this game!
But i don't think he is the right coach for us with were we are at the moment!

I think we have some GREAT players on our list, i'll argue that with anybody - even if it is my own club!

 

[bibi01]

I too am a VERY FRIM believer in that our list is not as crap as most make it out to be...........and the sad thing, some of the negitivity towards our list comes directly from the club itself on occasions!

Let me tell you (and any other club supporter reading this post, please feel free to aggree/disaggree on what i'm about to say) any other of the 15 clubs out there would KILL to have a forward line including either a Fevola, a Waite or a Whitnall! And we have all three!

Simpson, Waite, Thornton, Betts, Walker, Bentick, Carrazzo..........these are some great kids that i have a lot of belief in.
Add youngsters such as Murphy/Kennedy/Bower (My personal fav!!!)/Harlett to that!

YES! I fully believe we have a good list - of course it could be better, but who's list couldn't!

Cast your mind back a few years ago - The Adelaide Crows......... Most were putting their houses on the Crows winning the wooden spoon "Due to their list being poor!!!!!!"
A new coach comes into play - with the same list (minus a few actually) AND ALMOST WINS A #$*&ING PREMIERSHIP!

I think Pagan is one of the best coaches of all time and has proven it time and time again, and he has every right to be remembered as a legend of this game!
But i don't think he is the right coach for us with were we are at the moment!

I think we have some GREAT players on our list, i'll argue that with anybody - even if it is my own club!

potential its an ugly word and we have a lot of players with potential.

true our list is not that crap, but based on performcances of individuals we have a lot of guys who just are not upto being quality AFL players.
too good for VFL but not good enough for AFL.

we have a lot of guys who battle and at the best of times to break even, every now and again they come out on top but not often enough.

our best 22 is good, but we fall away very quickly, we lack depth.
we don't have players on the fringe who are good enough to step straight in.
we don't have players on the fringe who dominate at VFL level and when they finally get their chance at AFL level they grab it with both hands, too many guys get promoted and don't take their chance (there are a variety of reasons for this, not all the players fault)

we have a few injuries and we are scratching our heads as to who we should bring in.

yes we have some kids as mentioned but they are still developing and learning the game, they are going to be inconsistent. They are our future.

we need the guys who have been in the system for 4-6 years to step up and take us back up the ladder.

Yeah we have some great players, even some GUN's, but without the next tier of players stepping up we are going to struggle. We can't be carried by our top tier only.

 

[linchpin]

Cammo....

No disresect, what ever you may think...If you want PM me....

What do you base, the Kerna vs board member argument on....

What do you base the Ratten
not welcome bit on?

How old are you, by the way? To give me some further insight.

I am just asking the questions, no more....

 

[1980GFVideo]

Your petition is picking up publicity.

Herald Sun Article relating to petition

Shame they put a space in the url.

The poster is right about Richmond never having success from coaching changes. We replaced one man not right for the job with another man not right for the job since the early eigthies.

 

[mediumsizered]

Some questions for Cammo. Why are you doing this? Is this part of an assignment you must do for university? Are you a publicity junky? Do you actually think this is helping the club? At the moment you are just providing cannon fodder for the Herald Sun. We had a win last week. There are positive noises coming out of the club. We do not need negative vibes out there in the football community. Sit back and watch the development of Walker, Bentick, Betts, Murphy, Kennedy, Blackwell etc. There is much to be excited about and we will see improvement, maybe before this year is out, but definitely next year.

 

[Stig O'Hara]

20 year old armchair expert,
now organising football clubs.

"Another season at or near the bottom of the ladder will result in a sustained fall in membership numbers, less free-to-air television coverage, loss of sponsors and less venue revenue."

And he has mastered stating the obvious.

Shouldn't you be stoned watching "Motorcycle Diaries" in a green mohair jumper?

 

[linchpin]

The big question will be..........

Will he actually follow through with his convictions....

He has talked the talk....Will he walk the walk.....

It will not only take guts, which I would respect...

I think what he is doing is disgraceful, but to follow through with it????

I do not think he will....

But while Johnny Howard is out of the country, his bodyguards maybe of use!!!



The boy who cried wolf.......

We should start a book...

4/3 on a no show no protest.

10/1 on doing something.

5/2 On an assault of some sort if he does!

Do I have any takers?

 

[darren waitee]

Hi All
Did some checking on our friend Cam Read seems Cam is not a full Carlton member surprise surprise but a AFL Carlton support member with no other Carlton membership Oh course this is fine but all the people i know have two memberships AFL and Carlton as with Cam 1/2 his money goes to the AFL and this from a worm that wants to change the club
Also his comments about worrying about childrens safety with a petition at the MCG this Sunday are crap no one will have a go at a 15 year old child and since when do we have adult members who are 15 as only adult members can sign a petition so i put forward to Cam meet at light tower two this Sunday at 1pm with your petition and lets see if he has a spine
No need to worry about your safety just a chance to put forward your views and a chance for me to do the same and anyone else who wants to attend can also do so
As i am sure Cam wont show and as i said before stop being the problem and support your club by 1 being a Carlton member and the money going back to Carlton 100% 2 stop trying to make a name for yourself in the media as if you really thought what you were doing was right you would not have gone to the media for support when 4 out of 5 members on this site told you to stick it we are a great club but every club has people like Cam Read worms that like to make a big name for themselves move on Cam you are nothing short of a scum bag on an ego trip and if you have the guts to show on Sunday I would have told you that hope to see some loyal Carlton and Pagan members at light tower 2 at 1pm for a coffee and a chat

Darren

 

[murmont]

Hi All
Did some checking on our friend Cam Read seems Cam is not a full Carlton member surprise surprise but a AFL Carlton support member with no other Carlton membership Oh course this is fine but all the people i know have two memberships AFL and Carlton as with Cam 1/2 his money goes to the AFL and this from a worm that wants to change the club
Also his comments about worrying about childrens safety with a petition at the MCG this Sunday are crap no one will have a go at a 15 year old child and since when do we have adult members who are 15 as only adult members can sign a petition so i put forward to Cam meet at light tower two this Sunday at 1pm with your petition and lets see if he has a spine
No need to worry about your safety just a chance to put forward your views and a chance for me to do the same and anyone else who wants to attend can also do so
As i am sure Cam wont show and as i said before stop being the problem and support your club by 1 being a Carlton member and the money going back to Carlton 100% 2 stop trying to make a name for yourself in the media as if you really thought what you were doing was right you would not have gone to the media for support when 4 out of 5 members on this site told you to stick it we are a great club but every club has people like Cam Read worms that like to make a big name for themselves move on Cam you are nothing short of a scum bag on an ego trip and if you have the guts to show on Sunday I would have told you that hope to see some loyal Carlton and Pagan members at light tower 2 at 1pm for a coffee and a chat

Darren

Well said go blues

 

[blue-insider]

Just had a read of your website....Darren Hulme...legend?

Here Here. Easily one of the club's worst players of the last 5 years. Disposal was always appalling and not a consistent player. Would never have got a game anywhere else and is just an embarrassment to the club to have his name on a locker. Franchina too for that fact! Both useless.

Just goes to show what Cammo really knows about football. Just a 20 year old little punk with too many stupid opinions being pushed out in front of everyone here. Wake up Cammo and know where you're not wanted.

Interesting Cammo's not a true Carlton member.
Even less credibility than before.
What a tool you are!

 

[linchpin]

Blue Insider. PULL UP!


He was talking about the Frankston Bombers wasnt he?


Let me have a look...

He he, Oh my lord!