We are not arrogant enough

[Slippery Pete]

For the last 6 seasons under Craigy, I reckon we've been the fairest and most disciplined unit going around (could count on one hand the number of players we've had at the tribunal).

In the first couple of years, I reckon this mentality was complimented beautifully by Mark Ricciuto's leadership style. Though the team was decent and honest, Roo added that bit of mongrel that was required in the trenches.

Since his depature, we have really lacked that on-field arrogance. We are, without a doubt, the nicest team in the competition. We're not soft, we dont shirk contests or any of that stuff. But we ARE incredibly inoffensive.

What is it they say about nice guys??

 

[srv23]

So who in our current side could step up to the plate and add that bit of mongrel/arrogance. Danger and Sloane love to get their hands dirty in the contest but neither are arrogant or cocky. Vince could be cocky, certainly doesn't mind the rough stuff and seems to thrive on it - see Essendon final last year but he's no enforcer. Jaensch likes a scrap. Thompson had it in his game when he first came to the club but that seems to have been ironed out of his game over the last few years. Maybe Johncock. Maric definitely.

Walker is the one I reckon. At the moment he's focussing on getting his game right and thinking through all the instruction from the coaches in his head. I reckon once he starts to feel more comfortable at the top level and his natural goal kicking game starts to flow he will be an arrogant cocky so and so and he certainly likes the rough stuff.

I guess the question is whether Craigy will allow the players with natural aggression to let it show on the ground.

 

[iamjason]

I'm all for hardness, but I think it's going over the top to be "arrogant" and "offensive". It's generally a waste of energy. I'd rather the team just focus on playing hard, fast, skillfull, attacking football.

Geelong is the blueprint for success going forward, and this is usually how they play. Bomber was once asked if his team was becoming arrogant. He seemed genuinely disgusted at the idea. "I hope not" was his response.

I like how we're playing right now, I think we're going in the right direction.

 

[Slippery Pete]

I'm all for hardness, but I think it's going over the top to be "arrogant" and "offensive". It's generally a waste of energy. I'd rather the team just focus on playing hard, fast, skillfull, attacking football.

Geelong is the blueprint for success going forward, and this is usually how they play. Bomber was once asked if his team was becoming arrogant. He seemed genuinely disgusted at the idea. "I hope not" was his response.

I like how we're playing right now, I think we're going in the right direction.

Did you see Paul Chapman a couple of weeks ago getting into the taggers that were trying to scrag Ablett and co??

Geelong are certainly arrogant, and it's a healthy arrogance. All great teams have it.

 

[Cap]

I've noticed the people complaining about on field agro have died off since the likes of Sloane, Walker, Maric, VB, Thommo and to a lesser extent Symes and Sellar have got games, heck even Bernie gets in there at some point.

these guys seem to have brought back flying the flag for your club, sure none of them are stupid enough to get suspended but that is a good thing surely.

 

[iamjason]

Did you see Paul Chapman a couple of weeks ago getting into the taggers that were trying to scrag Ablett and co??

Geelong are certainly arrogant, and it's a healthy arrogance. All great teams have it.

I think we might have a different understanding of the word arrogance. I wouldn't call what Chapman did "arrogance" - he's just helping out his mates. I've seen that from our boys too. There may be improvement required in this area, for sure, but I don't think it's due to some "nice guy" mentality, it just comes with experience, training and harder bodies. We're playing a lot of kids right now, I am actually pretty happy with how hard they're going at it, and how they're trying to help eachother out.

 

[taylor_walker_13]

Thats why I would love Beau Waters at he club, hard and tough nut.

 

[AngelEyes]

Did you see Paul Chapman a couple of weeks ago getting into the taggers that were trying to scrag Ablett and co??

Geelong are certainly arrogant, and it's a healthy arrogance. All great teams have it.

I don't think being "physical" is being arrogant. Thats called be aggressive and competitive. Paul Chapman is sticking up for his team mate - thats not arrogant, that's expected nor is it unfair etc.

I associate arrogance with players like Didak waving the ball in his opponent's face. Geelong aren't "arrogant" like that. How often do you see the Geelong players smiling like Saints player did last year when they would get asked about being premiership favorites or the arrogance coming out of Collingwood this year? I don't think Geelong are arrogant. Physicality isn't arrogant.

We need more physicality and players who are determined to step up for their team mates and attack the ball. I don't think arrogance is any part of it at all. It's all about the attitude, Adelaide needs 28 guys who can on any moment go out their and give it there absolute all like a Paul Chapman. Adelaide have the talent but not the players in the right mindset. Geelong aren't the most talented but the most committed when they need to be.

 

[cammo6556]

maric... he could play the big rough boofhead role well, ala brogan, even if he isnt a total meathead

 

[Sekaj]

Win a premiership or two and we'll have a right to be arrogant.

 

[Slippery Pete]

I think there was a definite arrogance in what Chapman was doing. It was nothing untoward, but he was certainly letting the opponent know who was superior on the day.

If you look back at the premiership sides, players like Jarman and Smart had this type of arrogance.

Win a premiership or two and we'll have a right to be arrogant.

It's a good point. When you've got a record behind you, it's easier. Next year - with no premiership players in the squad - is uncharted waters for us.

 

[VSTone]

I fear we will be perennial bridesmaids under NC...

clearly impotent when the big moments arrive

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

honestly how does arrogance win you footy games

talent, skill, decision making, work ethic, committment, team work and hardness wins you footy games, winning footy games breeds confidence and success breeds success

arrogance is a personal trait that has no connection with success and is more to do with how some people chose to handle success, certainly not my choice of a personal trait

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

Win a premiership or two and we'll have a right to be arrogant.

agree

walk the walk before you talk the talk

 

[AngelEyes]

I think there was a definite arrogance in what Chapman was doing. It was nothing untoward, but he was certainly letting the opponent know who was superior on the day.

If you look back at the premiership sides, players like Jarman and Smart had this type of arrogance.




It's a good point. When you've got a record behind you, it's easier. Next year - with no premiership players in the squad - is uncharted waters for us.

He was standing up for a team mate and saying a heavy tag is not acceptable and we will do whatever it takes to stop it. He imposed himself physically. I don't know how that is arrogant?? I would expect the Crows to do that more often. Is kicking better than your opponent being arrogant using the same logic? He used his physical presence to create an advantage. Thats not being arrogant. Thats being a winner and committed to winning.

Arrogance played no part in it.

 

[AngelEyes]

honestly how does arrogance win you footy games

talent, skill, decision making, work ethic, committment, team work and hardness wins you footy games, winning footy games breeds confidence and success breeds success

arrogance is a personal trait that has no connection with success and is more to do with how some people chose to handle success, certainly not my choice of a personal trait

I agree with the bolded. I think Chapman was/is committed to doing whatever it takes to win and I don't see trying to win as being arrogant.

I don't think he was arrogant at all on the football field in that sense as he is "creating" success not "revealing" in it.

 

[cmndstab]

For that matter, I don't really see being tough and hard on the field, and being arrogant, as the same thing. "Playing angry" is something that works for some players, but not for others. I don't see it at arrogance, just an individual fashion of firing yourself up.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I don't reckon we can wait to be successful, then add some confidence and swagger to our arsenal.

There is an issue with our body language at the moment IMO. When the tide goes against us we are meek, you can almost see the players thinking 'oh noes, here we go again.' As supporters we get a sinking feeling in the pit of our stomach and soon after the remote goes flying. This is reflected in the way we try to play when under pressure - careful, sideways, Doughty-style football returns and we find it difficult to get out of this rut.

During our best years, even when there were goals being scored against us there was a belief that we would still win - the likes of Smart, Rehn and Jarman didn't bat an eyelid. Now if the opposition kick the first goal of the third quarter we have a collective heart attack and try to hide behind our mum's skirt.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

The sports psychologist from the Brisbane Lions glory years (forget his name) gave a talk a little while ago to our company. Somewhat ironically given the ongoing discussions re our game plan, he spoke of Plan A's and Plan B's.

He used the analogy that if he lay a plank of wood along the ground and asked us to walk from one end to the other we'd just get up and walk across it. Quickly, easily, no fuss. Plan A.

If he set up that same plank of wood 50m above the ground and asked us to walk from one end to the other... different story. We'd be scared, worried about falling, would slow down, might choose to crawl along because it is safer. Plan B.

So even though the task is essentially the same, we modify our approach due to the consequences of failure being much, much higher.

It is the same with the Crows when we measure how we perform in the first half of the Collingwood semi versus how we perform in the second half. Chalk and cheese. Plan A, Plan B.

His point was that you needed to identify exactly what were the instigators of the Plan B behaviour. What did you change? What were the controllable things you did during Plan A? Will leave it there, could write an essay on this. Was quite interesting stuff.

 

[Slippery Pete]

The sports psychologist from the Brisbane Lions glory years (forget his name) gave a talk a little while ago to our company. Somewhat ironically given the ongoing discussions re our game plan, he spoke of Plan A's and Plan B's.

He used the analogy that if he lay a plank of wood along the ground and asked us to walk from one end to the other we'd just get up and walk across it. Quickly, easily, no fuss. Plan A.

If he set up that same plank of wood 50m above the ground and asked us to walk from one end to the other... different story. We'd be scared, worried about falling, would slow down, might choose to crawl along because it is safer. Plan B.


It is the same with the Crows when we measure how we perform in the first half of the Collingwood semi versus how we perform in the second half. Chalk and cheese. Plan A, Plan B.

This.

Expectation plays a huge role too. Though there's always huge expectations on the Crows because of the city we live in and the huge supporter base, coming from further down the ladder in the premiership years helped us deal better with that. And a lot of the teams we played in those years - Bulldogs, St Kilda, Geelong... were teams weighed down with 50 odd years of pressure and expectation. They were dealing with huge demons and we were really just there for the ride.

Fast forward to 2005, and finishing minor premiers. Suddenly expectation is greater. We're expected to win, and win well. We're expected to at least make a Grand Final. Suddenly, a couple of goals behind, and the pressure rises. This pressure can only rise when there are perceived dire conseuquences of losing.

You can trace all our finals losses back to that 2005 Qualifying Final against St Kilda. That was the turning point in our finals history. That game planted the seed of doubt in the playing group's mind.

Win that game, then a home prelim against our bunny Sydney....and possibly a flag in Neil Craig's first year. Things would have been so much different.

It's a very fine line.

 

[subaru]

Arrogance implies being better than you are. At the moment we are worse than what we really are.

It's confidence that we need...

 

[TARANTULA]

Now if the opposition kick the first goal of the third quarter we have a collective heart attack and try to hide behind our mum's skirt.

Sad but true

 

[Kickin_Goals]

Your not after arrogance/confidence, you want dominance, what's been preached is competitiveness.
That's crap, it leaves your opponents in the game it lets you rest on a good performance so far.

Need some training from the dog whisperer here.
Dominating mindsets transcend confidence and arrogance with expected entitlement, there is no questioning of ability only the knowing of what you are going to do, doubt is invalidated logically as you know your mood alters your performance and constantly summon your focused mindset simplifying all behaviours. Nothing is stopping you and your going through them everything is yours to lose only, nothing is lacking, the opposition peasants don't matter your going to go hard feel like a god and love it.
It is more difficult in action but simple conditioning gets it done and no longer is confidence a question you then either can match it or can't.

If you have made it to the AFL arrogance isn't really an option you are that damn good and if your not appearing arrogant on the field your not confident and your not representing, media soundbites have no bearing on anything screw all the brand image bs, enough of princess town, enough of things that have nothing to do with on field performance clubs aren't meant to be grooming schools, players don't need to conform to some jackass mouthpiece that hasn't strapped on the boots in 10 years doesn't even know the rules or has never even played.

 

[The Karma Bus]

Did anyone see a few weeks ago when the Pies smashed the Blues and Leigh Brown had Warnock i think it was by the jumper and Warnock was doing those pathetic hits on Brown's hand to tell him to let go? Brown just looking at him like he was a toy, like you're under me and i'm going to make you feel that mentally..

Was such a dominance display.. Just an interesting event in relation to dominance/mind games/arrogance thing..

 

[subaru]

We also need some mongrel . Not smack in the head behind the game mongrel, but fly the flag mongrel.

I remeber D Jarman fronting to Mick Martyn in the 98 GF when Martyn hit Johnson outside the boundary. I remember his hit on Pickett in the centre square - Pickett and Jars took a while to get up but Pickett did not touch the ball again. I also believe Jars was instructed by Blight to hit Pickett (legally) at some stage during the game.

Roo also would never have left any sort of roughing up of a young player go by without challenging the player that did it.

Even when Vince was copping it from Essendon last year, (?) the reaction was almost meek.

Maric has it ...but obviously is not allowed to use it.
Thompson had it ...drilled out of him.