Society/Culture Why I blame Islam for the fact it's raining today.... part 2

[Chief]

Reminder: This isn't the Israel/Hamas thread. Go to the Israel/Hamas thread if you want to talk about that. Thanks.

Mid East - Israel declare war after Hamas attack II

Part I: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/israel-declare-war-after-hamas-attack.1371828/page-47#post-81443295 Thread Rules: Alright. I recognise that this is a fraught topic for any number of you posting here. Some of you will have family in Israel or Palestine. Some of you will have...

www.bigfooty.com

Thread rules update:

From this point if you're going to make a connection between Islam and the crime rate, you need to demonstrate causation in your post. If you do not, I'm going to infract you for the inherent racism in the position you're taking.

 

[evolved2]

So you aren't able to answer the question? the people have spoken and you are in denial.

Be careful who you argue with here. Some are so biased they'll read things into your words, misconstrue your points, then ban you.

 

[Total Power]

Be careful who you argue with here. Some are so biased they'll read things into your words, misconstrue your points, then ban you.

Oh yeah the good old Islamophobe and you're a racist argument. Nothing new to see here. Amazing, only happens when you criticise Islam. I am indigenous, must have a lot of love for white people i assume.

FFS.

 

[evolved2]

Oh yeah the good old Islamophobe and you're a racist argument. Nothing new to see here. Amazing, only happens when you criticise Islam. I am indigenous, must have a lot of love for white people i assume.

FFS.

You're obviously a white supremicist nazi in disguise!!!

 

[Total Power]

You're obviously a white supremicist nazi in disguise!!!

It's a democracy, unless the voting goes against my choices, then it's no a longer a democracy, it's Nazism. This is exhibit A basically. Proves my point.

 

[Gralin]

Oh yeah the good old Islamophobe and you're a racist argument. Nothing new to see here. Amazing, only happens when you criticise Islam. I am indigenous, must have a lot of love for white people i assume.

FFS.

So what you're going to vote Dutton because someone on bigfooty disagreed with you?
Spare me.
If you vote right you do it because you want to.
There's **** all left of centre to vote for in this country anyway but acting like I or anyone else on here made you vote for a politician is bullshit.

 

[Total Power]

So what you're going to vote Dutton because someone on bigfooty disagreed with you?
Spare me.
If you vote right you do it because you want to.
There's **** all left of centre to vote for in this country anyway but acting like I or anyone else on here made you vote for a politician is bullshit.

It's not happening for a year or two. When Germany opened up the borders, no one listened to the other side and people kept pouring in. Now even the centre left and left voted for deporting migrants as things have gotten out of control. Largely uncontrolled migration in Netherlands have driven the house/rental prices up so much that it's literally unaffordable to live in cities in Amsterdam anymore where even a tiny room would you 1,500 euros a month. Peoples voices been ignored as leftists basically let everyone in, whoever was eligible.

Same shit is happening in Vienna right here where Kickl is going to come to power.

You can have your opinion but it's not grounded in reality. Wake up.

 

[smish]

It's not happening for a year or two. When Germany opened up the borders, no one listened to the other side and people kept pouring in. Now even the centre left and left voted for deporting migrants as things have gotten out of control. Largely uncontrolled migration in Netherlands have driven the house/rental prices up so much that it's literally unaffordable to live in cities in Amsterdam anymore where even a tiny room would you 1,500 euros a month. Peoples voices been ignored as leftists basically let everyone in, whoever was eligible.

Same shit is happening in Vienna right here where Kickl is going to come to power.

You can have your opinion but it's not grounded in reality. Wake up.

I don’t reckon any of the mod squad have been to a major central/Western European city in the past decade by the looks

 

[Total Power]

I don’t reckon any of the mod squad have been to a major central/Western European city in the past decade by the looks

You guys have a massive geographical advantage. God forbid if you say anything else now, you're either an Islamophobe or a racist. Yet the rich Middle eastern countries will not accept refugees. Lebanon haven't granted them legal status, even after a decade. None of the oil rich countries will accept any of them, that's not racist though. Turkey havent granted people refugee status after all this time only temporary protection.

Imagine if EU countries did that. Yes now that's racist.

 

[Number37]

I don’t reckon any of the mod squad have been to a major central/Western European city in the past decade by the looks

What's happening in the major EU cities that they should have seen?

 

[Number37]

Yes, opinions are being shut down, just like you are doing here by calling people racists, whoever disagrees with you. I am not saying it, people are. Uncontrolled migration and the woke culture basically. I live here, i know enough people who voted for such politicians. 10,000 miles away you must know more?

This bullshit again.
Uncontrolled immigration? Where? Nowhere!!!!! You are just making shit up.
Woke culture. WTF is that? Just another thing you are making up.

Basically, you are frothing at the mouth over figments of your imagination.

 

[Total Power]

This bullshit again.
Uncontrolled immigration? Where? Nowhere!!!!! You are just making shit up.
Woke culture. WTF is that? Just another thing you are making up.

Basically, you are frothing at the mouth over figments of your imagination.

Ah i see a blocked person replied. You are the most illogical and absurd poster in this forum, let alone in this thread. How some 3.5 million migrants arrived illegally in Europe in 2023 sounds like you? too less? and illegal entry DOES not include legal asylum entries and family reunifications . These are entries where no Dublin rules applies cause refugees don't wish to stay in Italy/Greece/Bulgaria etc. That's roughly about 0.8% of the EU population in just about a year. Would you like the number to be 10 million for your approval? The EU parliament had a resolution some 9 months ago on this

Parliamentary question | Uncontrolled increase in illegal entries to the European Union by immigrants in 2023 | E-001598/2023 | European Parliament

Question for written answer E-001598/2023 to the Commission Rule 138 Jorge Buxadé Villalba (ECR)

www.europarl.europa.eu

Do you know how many people are arriving in the tiny Canary Islands everyday now? do read.

You sound angry in general, what happened to you? hate life? you been blocked for a reason, you can only play the man.

 

[Number37]

Ah i see a blocked person replied. You are the most illogical and absurd poster in this forum, let alone in this thread. How some 3.5 million migrants arrived illegally in Europe in 2023 sounds like you? too less? and illegal entry DOES not include legal asylum entries and family reunifications . These are entries where no Dublin rules applies cause refugees don't wish to stay in Italy/Greece/Bulgaria etc. That's roughly about 0.8% of the EU population in just about a year. Would you like the number to be 10 million for your approval? The EU parliament had a resolution some 9 months ago on this

Parliamentary question | Uncontrolled increase in illegal entries to the European Union by immigrants in 2023 | E-001598/2023 | European Parliament

Question for written answer E-001598/2023 to the Commission Rule 138 Jorge Buxadé Villalba (ECR)

www.europarl.europa.eu

Do you know how many people are arriving in the tiny Canary Islands everyday now? do read.

You sound angry in general, what happened to you? hate life? you been blocked for a reason, you can only play the man.

Copy pasting nonsense to support your pseudo intellectual nonsense again.

There were 5.1 million migrants in 2022. Why didn't you use that figure?
When Covid was a thing the population of the EU declined!
Why did it decline?
It declined because there was huge reduction in migrants.
Without migrants the population of the EU would fall.
It would fall because there are far more deaths than births in the EU.
Basic common sense should tell you that is because the population of the EU is ageing.
The EU needs migrants or all its economies will shrink.
The EU needs migrants to take up the many many jobs that older EU residents can no longer do.

But you wouldn't understand any of that.
Only simpletons look at migration through the lens that you use.

People like you dog whistling far right bullshit are thankfully in the minority.

That far right bullshit that you love to parrot will never get into power because the people of the EU know that that far right bullshit doesn't work for anyone. They've tried it.

 

[evolved2]

Cool rant bro.
You even attempted a bit of balance.
Good for you.
Evolved2, by name and nature.

Thanks. I can be balanced occasionally, but won't make it a habit.

This is one thing that I don't understand about the anti-religion brigade...they are almost always the same people who are tough on borders, nationalistic etc etc.
Every country on the planet has a defence force and police force to stop people from going against the laws of that country. EVERY ****ING COUNTRY!!!

How is defending your country different from defending your religion?
People join the army and are obliged to fight in a war, like the Iraq war, that serves no purpose for our country, but they still do it. Because???? Their country obliges them to.

How is that different to people fighting in the name of their religion?

If there was an attack on atheism, would atheists step up and defend their beliefs?
The answer quite obviously is yes.

That's because it is human nature to defend those things to which we think we belong.

I wouldn't have thought antitheists are stronger on border protection and patriotism than the general population. What gives you that idea?

Defending a country is sometimes necessary and other times a meaningless waste of life and resources. Few people would consider the Iraq war justified or worthwhile.

I can understand why people would fight in the name of a religion or ideology, but that doesn't mean I have to agree with those reasons. Pro-life Christians would say they're standing up for human life, Muslims who flew planes into the WTC thought they were doing gods work. Each group thinks they're doing the right thing and they're passionate about it.

Should women have to wear conservative clothing, should gays be thrown in jail, should atheists be sentenced to death just because a group of people believe they've found the one true god? These are things that happen across the world in Muslim nations, and it's because of Islam. This is what I don't get - these things are the antithesis of progressive values, yet progressives have buddied up with Islam in the same way conservatives have buddied up with Christianity in Australia.

Christianity has been largely tamed in the west, yet even now we see how it rears its ugly head in Australian politics. It's even worse in the US. Islam is just as bad, but hasn't been tamed in the west yet. It could take generations to get there!

Islam is no more valid than a conspiracy theory. The way many see conspiracy theorists is the way I see deeply religious people. If they keep their bullshit away from politics, I'll be happy enough. I don't like the chances of that happening though.

There's no doctrine of atheism. The only unifying 'belief' (if you want to call it that) is the lack of belief in deities. We have no book of commandments, no heaven to sacrifice ourselves for, no list of do's and donts to guide our morality. Therefore we have nothing to impose on others from a religious standpoint. We won't even fly planes into buildings just because there is no god! Atheists typically push for secularity, so we are the least dangerous 'religion' you'll ever find.

There is an attack on atheism, and I have a lot of compassion for my fellow non-believers living in hostile nations. The most hostile nations for atheists are Islamic.

Defending something purely because someone belongs to a group or unified belief system doesn't make it good. If it were, we'd have to agree the nazis are justified. As I've posted on another thread, I believe Islam to be a bigger threat to our freedoms than nazism purely because of the relative number of adherents of each.

 

[Total Power]

Copy pasting nonsense to support your pseudo intellectual nonsense again.

Copy pasting what? i provided links, didn't copy paste anything. Too hard to understand?

There were 5.1 million migrants in 2022. Why didn't you use that figure?

I was using the LATEST figures, if you didn't realise, 2023 was the previous year. 5.1 million migrants is actually more than 1.1% of the EU population, so...that's basically 2% of the EU population.

Not enough for you i assume?

When Covid was a thing the population of the EU declined!
Why did it decline?

Relevance? people are not having children, many Eastern european countries have negative population growth right now.

It declined because there was huge reduction in migrants.

Yes due to Covid and restrictions were in place, including regular citizens like us who had trouble moving from one country to another. Also 2.4 million isn't a small figure.

Hardly rocket science.

Why did you pick 2020 to 2022? why not highlight 2015 and 2016 when over 5 million migrants came in?

ah it doesn't serve a purpose does it?

Without migrants the population of the EU would fall.

Yep, not illegal though. How is Australia doing? Asking to check who is coming to your country is racist is it? anyone can walk into your country according to you? cool.

It would fall because there are far more deaths than births in the EU.

Again, rubbish. UK/US has plenty of migration policies in place that works just fine. What percentage of these migrants stay in poorer EU countries? not many. Why? Is Romania failing? is Hungary failing? Germany will be dead without migrants is it?

Absolutely garbage argument that we need illegal migration for this. Seasonal work visas and EU blue card residency is just fine for this. You do not need people with skills to come in without having their backgrounds checked.

Basic common sense should tell you that is because the population of the EU is ageing.

Again. see above.

The EU needs migrants or all its economies will shrink.

Australia is shrinking? have you checked on the migration figures in Australia? we need open borders to stop shrinking???? you are mixing up regular migration data with illegal migration. How does Australia function without illegal migration? There will be no one to pick fruits in Germany if there are no illegal migration is it?

This is as dumb and radical as the replacement theory, just the leftist version of it.

The EU needs migrants to take up the many many jobs that older EU residents can no longer do.

Ah yes, only in western european countries i assume? why don't migrants wish to live in the poorer nations? why such disparity in distribution of migrants? even if granted residence in Hungary, do you know what percentage actually stay there?

Do you understand why?

But you wouldn't understand any of that.

I understand it very well, you obviously failed basic economics and geopolitics.

Only simpletons look at migration through the lens that you use.

Ah yes, the leftist 'open up borders and let everyone in' argument, cause 'we can't drive buses , so we need Pakistani bus drivers.

FFS.

Do you realise what percentage of unskilled labor in EU come from eastern european countries? India? philippines? vietnam? not many are illegal btw.

Economic migration and asylum seekers are two different categories.

People like you dog whistling far right bullshit are thankfully in the minority.

Minority lol take a look at European elections. From Portugal to Austria, to Sweden to Netherlands. France was almost done for, saved at the last minute, but don't worry, next time maybe with people like you around. People have spoken. While people like you are in denial.

That far right bullshit that you love to parrot will never get into power because the people of the EU know that that far right bullshit doesn't work for anyone. They've tried it.

You deserve what you get. People like Wilders are in power cause people like exist.

Absolutely rubbish post and this is why you were on ignore. If you wish to rant, make sure it's an educated rant atleast.

 

[JackOutback]

Woke culture, ****ing spare me. Is there a more meaningless phrase in use right now?

As for the world going right, France just voted the left into power, England voted Labor, before that Australia, before that the US rejected Trump. It’s hardly one-way traffic.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Either works fine. I thought it was clear I wasn't discussing something that's actually possible.

A lot of posters here have trouble differentiating Islam from brown people - mostly those defending Islam and Muslims.

I was attempting to help them along, but it proved unsuccessful.

Not at all. Tell me if you disagree with any of the following points:

Islam is based on an ancient god created by earlier religions (predating Judaism really), modified through Judaism, Christianity, and having a final chapter called the Quran.

Therefore it's reasonable to state that the morality of the Quran is based on 7th century morality of Middle East Asia and earlier times.

Islam has evolved, but it is still based on 7th century morality as defined by a religious book. To some extent, it's stagnant, as any book based religion will be.

Despite Islam's evolution, it retains elements that are misogynistic, homophobic, and hateful towards other religious beliefs as well as atheism.

Muslims, like all people, don't live in a bubble. They're largely a product of the cultures they develop and live in. Also, the Quran is open to interpretation so not all Muslims will read it the same way.

In conclusion, not all Muslims are misogynistic, homophobic or transphobic. We get a good picture of how Muslims think through surveys on women's rights and sexuality.

The books on which Islam is based are inherently mysogynistic, violent, homophobic, and anti-choice in a number of areas. They also contain good elements, words of peace and wisdom. Like the bible, the Quran is a mix of good and bad, but the overall morality is horrible to me.

Having faith doesn't make anyone better. Religious people who are good have the capacity to be just as good or better without it. It mostly depends on their ability to live without the religious crutch of delusion.

So after all that, we've come to the conclusion that religion is equally terrible in any guise. Something we totally agree on.

So what is your investment in the criticism of Islam given the fact it has zero threat to our liberal democratic way of life?

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The Influx of Immigrants into Europe and the Increase in Sexual Violence | Hungarian Conservative

Hirsi Ali establishes a link between immigration and increasing sexual violence against women, and traces back the root of the problem to the cultural diffe ...

www.hungarianconservative.com

 

[Total Power]

Woke culture, ****ing spare me. Is there a more meaningless phrase in use right now?

As for the world going right, France just voted the left into power, England voted Labor, before that Australia, before that the US rejected Trump. It’s hardly one-way traffic.

The far right party won 1 out of 3 votes. By FAR the biggest since the ww2. That is not concerning to you? It was only saved by their left wing alliance and they still couldn't for majority. Give it 5 more years.

And how convenient for you to leave out Italy, sweden, switzerland, netherlands, portugal, austria, poland, finland etc etc.

Even Fein Gael has caught up in Ireland.

 

[Gralin]

The far right party won 1 out of 3 votes. By FAR the biggest since the ww2. That is not concerning to you? It was only saved by their left wing alliance and they still couldn't for majority. Give it 5 more years.

And how convenient for you to leave out Italy, sweden, switzerland, netherlands, portugal, austria, poland, finland etc etc.

Even Fein Gael has caught up in Ireland.

And you think Islan is the reason the far right is getting votes, and also that no racism is involved?

 

[Total Power]

And you think Islan is the reason the far right is getting votes, and also that no racism is involved?

Uncontrolled migration is. I stated it time and time again, most of the people who are now arriving are mostly economic migrants.

And why do you think all the Islamic countries have turned their back from the refugees? the burden is on EU to take them all in is it? what about those refugees who are not granted refugee status in turkey even after 10 years?

Also what you think about all the refugees going to the richer countries breaking the Dublin rule? you are ok with it?

I was in Denmark just a few weeks ago, they don't have issues with Bosnian Muslims and Turks. Arabs are a different story. Cause they often don't integrate in their society. This comes from the Danes themselves.

 

[Gralin]

Uncontrolled migration is. I stated it time and time again, most of the people who are now arriving are mostly economic migrants.

So why are you posting about it in a thread about Islam?

And why do you think all the Islamic countries have turned their back from the refugees? the burden is on EU to take them all in is it? what about those refugees who are not granted refugee status in turkey even after 10 years?

So it is about Islam?

Also what you think about all the refugees going to the richer countries breaking the Dublin rule? you are ok with it?

What's this got to do with Islam

I was in Denmark just a few weeks ago, they don't have issues with Bosnian Muslims and Turks. Arabs are a different story. Cause they often don't integrate in their society. This comes from the Danes themselves.

Well that's just good old fashioned racism

 

[Total Power]

So why are you posting about it in a thread about Islam?

So it is about Islam?

What's this got to do with Islam

Well that's just good old fashioned racism

lol racism. Didn't take long. Ok, what you think about this:

A poll by the Danish Ministry of Justice in 2020 showed that 76% of Muslim immigrants and their descendants from Turkey, Lebanon, Pakistan and Somalia agreed that criticising Islam should be outlawed, compared to 18% of the total population. The Danish law against blasphemy was abolished in 2017.


Your thoughts?

 

[Gralin]

lol racism. Didn't take long. Ok, what you think about this:

A poll by the Danish Ministry of Justice in 2020 showed that 76% of Muslim immigrants and their descendants from Turkey, Lebanon, Pakistan and Somalia agreed that criticising Islam should be outlawed, compared to 18% of the total population. The Danish law against blasphemy was abolished in 2017.


Your thoughts?

I think you're incapable of posting in good faith

 

[Total Power]

I think you're incapable of posting in good faith

I asked you a question, since you told me to stay on subject. I am.

Can you kindly state your opinion on the poll results?

Should we outlaw criticising Islam?

 

[Gralin]

I asked you a question, since you told me to stay on subject. I am.

Can you kindly state your opinion on the poll results?

Should we outlaw criticising Islam?

You're all over the shop
Apparently it's the left's fault people vote right wing
Then its immigration but not racism, Muslims but not Islamophobia

Now you're making up dumb questions About outlawing criticism of Islam

Getting really wobbly here