Why not us? - from gfc.com.au

[Poetic Justice]

Why not us?
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http://www.gfc.com.au/geelongnews/newsarticle/tabid/3933/newsid/90354/default.aspx

There has been plenty of speculation over the preseason about just how long Geelong’s run can go on. Was the thrilling premiership win over St Kilda the end of a brilliant three year run, or is there more to come?

Many have compared the Cats to Brisbane’s teams of 2001-2004, but a better comparison would be to look at the Lions from 1995-2004.

Brisbane had a 10 year run where they made the finals nine times. From those nine top eight finishes they won three flags, lost another grand final, twice went out in the preliminary final and lost at the semi final round in 2000. So in seven of those 10 years they made it to at least the second week of the finals.

http://www.gfc.com.au/geelongnews/newsarticle/tabid/3933/newsid/90354/default.aspx

 

[CatTricks]

ken oath! CATS KRUSH ALL 2010!!!

 

[David the Cat]

100% correct!! I love it that others have basically written off the Cats when just six months ago, we showed we are a power to be dealt with. The ability to suck up the pressure other teams apply then turn it around into victory is a key to winning premierships. And thats what the Cats do!Hard bodies, mature, experienced and very skilled...that sums up the Cats.

VERY hard to beat come September.

 

[And_ROOS]

I thought about this myself, realistically i can only see Hawthorn being the team that matches us. Saints had ONE good year, i doubt they will repeat 2009 again, the Doggies haven't changed except for Hall who is an unknown quantity and the Hawks have the talent and youth but are very up and down over the past few years.

We should be able to compete seriously for a premiership for at least the next 2 years, then maybe tail off after that depending on injuries and how the next group of talent comes through.

 

[Vdubs]

I thought about this myself, realistically i can only see Hawthorn being the team that matches us. Saints had ONE good year, i doubt they will repeat 2009 again, the Doggies haven't changed except for Hall who is an unknown quantity and the Hawks have the talent and youth but are very up and down over the past few years.

We should be able to compete seriously for a premiership for at least the next 2 years, then maybe tail off after that depending on injuries and how the next group of talent comes through.

Unrealistic assessment of Saints and Dogs who are very very close to us in talent. Hawks could get there again, as could Pies and Crows. Any of those 6 are there and abouts. If we are in the last 2 weeks of September, agreed, we'd have to be favourites.

Last year was such an amazing effort to do what we did despite some real personnel concerns that to beat that effort seems out there. Yet SJ could only improve on that GF and some others as well will improve, it's the getting there this year that is as always the challenge for us and the rest

 

[Partridge]

The likes of Joel Corey, Corey Enright, Paul Chapman, Josh Hunt and Max Rooke are 28 or younger, while the Jimmy Bartel, Gary Ablett, Steve Johnson, James Kelly group are just 25. Then look at the younger players that have already tasted premiership success, such as Joel Selwood, Tom Hawkins, Harry Taylor, Travis Varcoe, and the even younger players behind them that have shown good signs such as Tom Gillies, Steve Motlop, Mitch Duncan, Taylor Hunt and Allen Christensen, and there is no reason for any fear about the future.

So while other clubs may be a trendy pick to take the Cats mantle, the real question is, why not Geelong again? And so far nobody has presented a good reason that the Cats can not again be challenging on the last Saturday in September.

What a pleasure to read something positive about our team's chances this year. You'd think half our list had lost limbs judging by the tone of the some of the posters. I've even seen something I cannot fathom - people predicting our lineup 2 or 3 years ahead, assuming that we're not a strong side. For those of us who have followed Geelong longer than 3 years, well we've waited a fair while to have a side this good, so I'm a little reluctant to meekly accept that their run is over and we should look forward to finishing 6th again. Ridiculous.

The fact is, we still have a very strong, very experienced and extremely talented side, with a delightful habit of winning consistently. Proof of that is in the following:

Prior to 2007, the best winning run I'd ever seen from Geelong was 9 in a row, once in 1989 and once in 1992. This current team has won 10 or more in a row four times - 15 straight in 2007, then 12 straight from 2007-2008, another run of 15 straight in 2008, and 13 straight in 2009. If you ever want evidence of how far ahead this Geelong team is of any other (certainly that I've seen), look no further.

This side has also completely destroyed very false notions of what you have to do to succeed in modern football. No priority draft picks, no bottoming out, no early draft picks either. These players don't accept that because they were selected in the 30s or 40s they can't become elite players (evidence - Paul Chapman, Cameron Ling, Darren Milburn and Corey Enright). They are on a different plane and are good enough to win more silverware yet.

And now to Round 1, and the only thing I'm focusing on is putting our strongest available team on the park against Essendon, and then annihilating them. That is all that matters right now.

 

[vinum coupe]

Saints had ONE good year, i doubt they will repeat 2009 again, .

Totally disagree.
They will win enough games to finish top 3 with that game style and the group of players even if they play with a 85% attitude.

Prelims and GF's are a different story of course. But the saints would be expected to be within 4 points of us after 22 rounds, and most likely ahead.

 

[theCATSfromHELL]

Richie...

Respect.

 

[SriLankanCat]

funny thing is if we hadnt won those 2 flags, everyone would rate us as the team to watch because of the top class players we have who are still so young.

But I guess with success people think there is only one direction to go

I really think this team can go and win at least 2 more flags.

Good thing is, for the old guys we have some good replacements. Out goes Harley and in comes Hunt, Mooney is close to the end but Tomahawk is finding his feet. Selwood and Taylor are in the early stages of their careers. Ablett, Bartel and Kelly are 25 or under.

Scarlett is the key for the next 2 years, hope he remains fit.

Bring on 2010

 

[The Casey Cat]

Tend to agree. Geelong aren't going anywhere soon. Am getting sick of all the WB crap. Fair enough if people fancy the Saints but I still don't think the Dogs are quite with the top 2.

 

[vealesy]

SSSSHHH!!

The more people write us off, the better odds we get down at the TAB!

 

[Copernicus]

Wait, I thought we were done for?

Nice to see a more realistic outlook!

 

[Claude Balls]

You'd think half our list had lost limbs judging by the tone of the some of the posters. I've even seen something I cannot fathom - people predicting our lineup 2 or 3 years ahead, assuming that we're not a strong side.

You're not referring to the thread titled 'our premiership window' are you? I thought the posts that I and several others offered, predicted our lineup in several years, was pretty positive.

 

[Poetic Justice]

Totally disagree.
They will win enough games to finish top 3 with that game style and the group of players even if they play with a 85% attitude.

Well that wouldn't be a repeat of 2009 then.

 

[ninjacat]

Prior to 2007, the best winning run I'd ever seen from Geelong was 9 in a row, once in 1989 and once in 1992. This current team has won 10 or more in a row four times - 15 straight in 2007, then 12 straight from 2007-2008, another run of 15 straight in 2008, and 13 straight in 2009.

That is real sick. yeehaa!

 

[donbooger]

Im convinced, 5 more premierships.

GO CATS.

 

[Reg Hickey]

I reckon we're well and truly still in the "premiership window":

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?p=5640915#post5640915

 

[Cats33]

Watch out 2010 , here come the catterz !

 

[Rubberducky]

Great article.

Whilst a lot of people are writing off Geelong as if age is the issue I think the only issue we face is mental strength.

And I just think we have too many strong leaders to fall too far from the mark.

2010 if we balance the playing list and peak at the tail end I can't see many stopping us come finals.

Doggies and Hawks to be the big contenders in my book.

 

[BotsMaster]

Can't see us falling away just yet.

2010 should be another strong year from this group with the likes of selwood, hawkins and harry taylor all still young and full of talent.

Only problems i see that could emerge is injuries to key players like Scarlett, Moons, Ablett and maybe the hunger to get back to that one day in september.
Other than that everything should run its course.

 

[hbk_aus]

Apart from luck with injuries which every club needs, I agree with other who say its all mental with the Cats. Physically on paper we have the talent to win again, but do we have the same hunger as teams like St Kilda and the Bulldogs who havent climbed the hill yet? Will we be mentally worn out from 3 years of having opposition teams get themselves up especially for games against the yardstick? Time will tell.

 

[Reg Hickey]

Lets not forget how mentally difficult it is to stay at the top. Keeping your performance at that level for a long period is really, really mentally draining. And to win flags you have to maintain the hunger, which I'm sure becomes exponentially harder the more premiership medallions you have in your top drawer.

Its also very tough to go through a longer season, and start the following preseason later, than everyone else for several years on end.

I'm confident we're a real contender again this year, but I'm also confident it can't go on indefinitely.

 

[winty]

funny thing is if we hadnt won those 2 flags, everyone would rate us as the team to watch because of the top class players we have who are still so young.

But I guess with success people think there is only one direction to go

Spot on there SriLankanCat. When you are on the top of the heap, there is only one way to go.

I find it funny how everyone think we're on our last legs as a side, and the Dogs and Saints can have another crack at it, yet they have older lists than we do. I guess perception is a funny thing.

IMO, I think Geelong have a lot more improvement from 2009 than both the Saints and Dogs do. Both those sides weren't hit with injury as much as we were last year. Give us a fit Chappy and SJ for most the year, and give us Otto for a lot more than 6 games, and see how we'll go. Let's see how the Saints would go if Riewoldt was out for seven weeks, or how well the Doggies would go if Lake and Morris were both out for a few weeks at a time.

The likes of Varcoe, Hawkins, Hogan, Gillies, Laidler and Selwood are only in their early 20's, and as such can and should improve in 2010. Then we have the nucleus of our side - blokes like Ablett, Bartel, Blake, Byrnes, S.Johnson, Kelly, Mackie and Taylor who are aged between 23 and 26. In other words, the prime of their careers. The likes of Chapman, Corey, Enright, J.Hunt and Rooke are only a couple of years older still, and could feasibly play for another two or three seasons too.

I think the Bulldogs gaining Barry Hall in the off-season actually helps us. In the two H&A games against us last year, the Bulldogs were their most effective against us when their smaller forwards would work up the ground, and then catch us out by ducking back and having the ball sail over their defender's head as they ran towards goal. By having Barry Hall camped in the goal square with Scarlo beside him, that tactic would be less effective, as Scarlett could peel off Hall and spoil these smaller forwards.

People might think Geelong might lack motivation to go back-to-back after winning two of the last three premierships. With the Gold Coast and Western Sydney sniffing around with cheque books open, this will be the last chance the current side has to win another premiership together. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that sounds like enough motivation for me. I'd imagine Gaz, Jimmy, SJ, Selwood and co. would love to be able to sit around in 20 years time after their careers are over and reminisce about winning three premierships together.

 

[Partridge]

Lets not forget how mentally difficult it is to stay at the top. Keeping your performance at that level for a long period is really, really mentally draining. And to win flags you have to maintain the hunger, which I'm sure becomes exponentially harder the more premiership medallions you have in your top drawer.

Which is why they're elite athletes. It comes with the job. I honestly don't see that as being part of the problem. I think they are still every bit as hungry as the other teams. Personally I don't think Geelong have ever had a true dynasty (except maybe the VFA team in the 1880s). In other words, to me 2 premierships is nowhere near enough. I'm greedy for many more, and I'm sure the playing group is too.

The amount of tripe written about this makes it seem that hunger alone will win flags; it won't. A hungry shit player is still a shit player. Geelong's list is still stronger than either St.Kilda's or the Dogs. I'd take Chappy v Raph Clarke in a Grand Final any day of the week.

Its also very tough to go through a longer season, and start the following preseason later, than everyone else for several years on end.

But isn't that what we should be aiming for? Hard to win premierships if your season ends in August. Excellence comes at a cost.

Again, I don't see that as a problem. Trust your support staff to know how much work each player needs before the season starts. Steven Hocking said early this week they've done all that is required for Round 1. It's just yet another ready made excuse that gets trotted out for not succeeding.

 

[Reg Hickey]

Which is why they're elite athletes. It comes with the job. I honestly don't see that as being part of the problem. I think they are still every bit as hungry as the other teams. Personally I don't think Geelong have ever had a true dynasty (except maybe the VFA team in the 1880s). In other words, to me 2 premierships is nowhere near enough. I'm greedy for many more, and I'm sure the playing group is too.

The amount of tripe written about this makes it seem that hunger alone will win flags; it won't. A hungry shit player is still a shit player. Geelong's list is still stronger than either St.Kilda's or the Dogs. I'd take Chappy v Raph Clarke in a Grand Final any day of the week.

I'd take Shannon over Raph Clarke. But I'd also take Riewoldt over Mooney or Hawkins, Hayes over Kelly, and Goddard over Wojcinski. Its a silly comparison.

Yes, a hungry shit player is still shit, but he's a little less shit than a less hungry shit player. So lets be realistic and apply that principle to this case, where the Saints and Dogs clearly aren't shit. In fact your implied assessment of them is ridiculously biased. There's not nearly as much difference between the lists as you seem to think, and in sport played at this elite level, attitude and hunger can make all the difference.

Do you remember Bomber's comment last year about how when it got tight in the GF we would remember '08? Its unknowable, but personally I'm not sure we would have won last year had we beaten Hawthorn the year before.

But isn't that what we should be aiming for? Hard to win premierships if your season ends in August. Excellence comes at a cost.

Again, I don't see that as a problem. Trust your support staff to know how much work each player needs before the season starts. Steven Hocking said early this week they've done all that is required for Round 1. It's just yet another ready made excuse that gets trotted out for not succeeding.

Duh, of course we should be aiming to play in September. Thats not the point.

The point is that when we play in a GF, it makes the following season more difficult to properly prepare for. You even acknowledged that yourself when you said: "Excellence comes at a cost".

I don't doubt that the club is extremely professional and does a fantastic job of getting our boys ready for the season, but they clearly ARE starting at a slight disadvantage. One that increases for every successive year we play in the GF. And why should we assume that our support staff are that much BETTER than those at other clubs and can make up the difference?

Again, in a competition where the inherent edges are increasingly small, these things matter.

Last year we weren't the dominant side we were in 2008, and this is part of the reason.

This year, with another long season to overcome and without the burning hunger that comes from losing a GF last year, I think its very realistic to expect the challenge from other sides to be even harder to overcome.