Draft Watcher Young Talent Time - A 2012 Mock Draft

[ThePuppetMaster]

If we ended up with that draft Chris, I would be very, very happy.

 

[Trav 20]

Good selection Chris; I know for a fact that the Melbourne recruiting staff rate Plowman VERY highly.

So Trav, I think you've got it wrong here.

That's the beauty of the internet, we're all on record.

Btw, rating someone and drafting them at 3 or 4, when you desperately need quality mids, is an entirely different matter. It won't happen.

 

[Chris25]

Well, if that's the only pick I get wrong then I'll be one happy poster.

 

[Trav 20]

Well, if that's the only pick I get wrong then I'll be one happy poster.

That makes two of us.

 

[Chris25]

Chris, you originally had Josh Porter in front of Michael Close, now you have dropped him off completely. What happened there?

Nothing sinister.

I would have Close ahead of Porter, they were only the other way around because of what I perceived as 'needs' - what with Porter being a big body. I still rate him as a late round chance, just that I wanted to include Tom Langford and in the end he was squeezed out by Spencer White (who I've been talking about since the start of the year).

I'm sure Porter will feature again in the future.

Chris, many KPPs in the past have been considered KPFs (Schoenmakers) and gone back, and others have been considered KPDS (Hurley and to a degree Roughead) and have become good forwards. I'd like to know what you think of Lachie Plowmans versitility? Could he go forward? if so, would that be a better option than taking a Shaw or Jaksch?

Not to say he couldn't do it, but I think he would be better down back. He just looks a natural CHB. And if for some reason it didn't work down there, I'd be throwing him into the midfield before he went forward. But who knows, he is a talented player. He could surprise.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

That's the beauty of the internet, we're all on record.

Btw, rating someone and drafting them at 3 or 4, when you desperately need quality mids, is an entirely different matter. It won't happen.

Who would you propose we take ahead of him?
- Wines?
- O'Rourke?
- Garlett?
- Kennedy?

To be honest apart from Toumpas and Whitfield (and Viney IMO, but I know Chris doesn't rate him as highly as some) no other midfielder really screams 'potential superstar'.

There are a whole lot of guys in the 5-15 range who could fall pretty much anywhere from what I've seen.

It wouldn't surprise me if we take Plowman, in fact I'd be pretty happy if we did.

 

[Jordie_tackles]

Who would you propose we take ahead of him?
- Wines?
- O'Rourke?
- Garlett?
- Kennedy?

To be honest apart from Toumpas and Whitfield (and Viney IMO, but I know Chris doesn't rate him as highly as some) no other midfielder really screams 'potential superstar'.

There are a whole lot of guys in the 5-15 range who could fall pretty much anywhere from what I've seen.

It wouldn't surprise me if we take Plowman, in fact I'd be pretty happy if we did.

I like the sounds of both Grundy and Plowman PM, it will all come down to Viney though imo, we need 2 of the absolute cream Mids atm, and i could love Plowman or Grundy at 3 but MFC need 2 of the top 5 or so mids imo and then another crack with pick 13 or so, i would say around 3 of our 4 picks will be mids or players who can play so like, Garlett and Kennedy and Stinger and Menzel

 

[Godogs247]

I like the sounds of both Grundy and Plowman PM, it will all come down to Viney though imo, we need 2 of the absolute cream Mids atm, and i could love Plowman or Grundy at 3 but MFC need 2 of the top 5 or so mids imo and then another crack with pick 13 or so, i would say around 3 of our 4 picks will be mids or players who can play so like, Garlett and Kennedy and Stinger and Menzel

 

[Godogs247]

I really hope Garlett and Mayes go to the dogs -will happen if Melbourne don't have use pick 3on Viney both players would fit perfect

 

[josh the gent]

Nice PD Chris.

Jake Stringer seems to have slipped a bit on a few of the PDs out there, but I am still hoping we take him at pick 5. Pick 6 (if we don't trade it for a mini-draft pick) has to be used on a midfielder I reckon.

Would be awesome if Toumpas is available, but I am tipping he'll be gone. In that case, I reckon we will go with Oliver Wines (not that we lack hard, young mids, but he fits in with McCartney's approach).

If we do take Wines, no midfield will be happy playing against the Bulldogs in 2014 onwards - think, a midfield of:

Wines, Clay Smith, Liberatore, Wallis

I'm tipping there will be some big tackling numbers in that lot...

 

[Trav 20]

Who would you propose we take ahead of him?
- Wines?
- O'Rourke?
- Garlett?
- Kennedy?

To be honest apart from Toumpas and Whitfield (and Viney IMO, but I know Chris doesn't rate him as highly as some) no other midfielder really screams 'potential superstar'.

There are a whole lot of guys in the 5-15 range who could fall pretty much anywhere from what I've seen.

It wouldn't surprise me if we take Plowman, in fact I'd be pretty happy if we did.

My opinion on any of the available players isn't worth a pinch of salt. I've only seen them on tv during the championships (other than Viney who I've seen live). There's a reason recruiters watch them play copious amounts of time, pore over tapes, interview the player, talk to family and old school coaches, etc. I'm talking more about 'type'.

Imo, Melbourne have the worst midfield in the league. Jones is having a great year, but he's the only midfielder to have improved, or reached a decent level. We don't have a big bodied quality inside mid, we don't have a classy outside mid, and we lack quality 'predator' mids, to use a Wisbey term. I have very high hopes for Trengove, despite his poor year and obviously Scully isn't there. The last thing we need is a quality 'third tall' defender at pick 4. Plowman may be worth pick 4 and may turn out to be one of the best players in the draft, but we need quality where games are won, i.e. the midfield. We even lost the clearances to the Suns on the weekend. And when we get clearances they're often poor.

In my view the most valuable players in the competition to nearly every side are their best inside mids, or their big key forward/s. There's the odd exception, such as a ruckmen like Cox, Sandi, or even a defender such as Glass, or Scarlett, but typically the big damaging key forwards, or inside mids have the most influence on the game. At Hawthorn it's Buddy/Roughead, + Mitchell/Sewell (Rioli more the icing and Hodge injured), Carlton - Judd (Murphy improving his inside game), Essendon - Watson, Adelaide - Thompson/Dangerfield, Geelong - Selwood & Hawkins, Sydney - Goodes or Kennedy/Jack, Dogs - Boyd, Melb - Clark or Jones, Richmond - Cotchin or Riewoldt, North - Petrie or Swallow, Saints - Riewoldt or Hayes, Freo - Pavlich or Fyfe, etc.

Usually I don't like taking a tall too early, because it's difficult to know how they'll progress/develop. For the same reason I don't like taking rucks early, especially when players such as Sandi, Jolly, Jamar, Cox, etc came off rookie lists. I'm also not overly keen on taking defenders early unless, like Hurley, they've proven themselves as key forwards at junior level. And on a needs basis a tall defender is down our pecking order. That leaves quality inside mids (preferably big bodied inside mids), or more outside types that can win their own ball.

I see the merit of mixing it up a bit, so I'd like a big bodied inside mid (Wines/Stringer ?), plus maybe someone like Toumpas or O'Rourke ? But, as stated, I haven't seen enough of the individuals. I've seen Whitfield and no doubt he's quality, but he could go down the Deledio and Gibbs path, i.e. be a terrific 200+ game player, but not an inside mid and not the best player from their draft. If I had to err, it would be on the side of the quality inside bigger bodied mid. But the proviso is that they aren't slow. Being slow doesn't mean you won't be one of the best players from the draft, but you're starting to gamble and I don't want to do that at picks 3 and 4. Use a second, or third rounder on a slow one you like.

That's an insight into my (possibly flawed) logic when it comes to drafting early.

 

[blueiris]

so you think brisbane will let shaw or jaksch fall and pick up mids before they pick a forward but not pick papa intresting to know your thoughts on this chris

 

[Chris25]

If we do take Wines, no midfield will be happy playing against the Bulldogs in 2014 onwards - think, a midfield of:

Wines, Clay Smith, Liberatore, Wallis

I'm tipping there will be some big tackling numbers in that lot...

They'll have to tackle hard, what with the number of times that midfield would turn the ball over.

so you think brisbane will let shaw or jaksch fall and pick up mids before they pick a forward but not pick papa intresting to know your thoughts on this chris

If the draft falls as I have it, Brisbane should definitely take a midfielder over a KPP - any one of Mayes, Wines or O'Rourke would be better value than either of Shaw or Jaksch, and worthy of even a top 5 pick.

As for not taking Paparone, I just don't rate the kid as highly as others. I've said all along that I consider him to be a midfielder in a tall forward's body. At best, I think he'll be a good third tall forward - not someone you'd build a forward line around. There would probably be more value in taking a tall forward later on. Or as I have it, someone like Tim O'Brien.

 

[stefoid]

They'll have to tackle hard, what with the number of times that midfield would turn the ball over.

Indeed - Two of Toumpas, Martin, Garlett and Mayes is what we need.

 

[IanW]

26. Melbourne - Jack Viney (178cm midfielder - Oakleigh)

But in terms of F/S bidding, I think the Gold Coast will genuinely bid on him - with the intention of drafting him, not just to force Melbourne to take him early.

If thats what you think, then he goes at 3 and the affects of that rebound through the top 10.

 

[Chris25]

That was my write up from a few months ago. I've changed my mind since then.

 

[IanW]

That was my write up from a few months ago. I've changed my mind since then.

All good

 

[tigs2010]

That was my write up from a few months ago. I've changed my mind since then.

How dare you...

 

[Chris25]

I edited my Viney write up, just so there is no more confusion.

My money is still on the Gold Coast trading the #2 pick to GWS for Jack Martin and maybe the Giants' second rounder, or something like that though. If they didn't do that, maybe they'd seriously think about bidding on Viney - considering he would fill a real need. But I just don't consider him a top 2 talent. And really, that's all it should come down to. Gold Coast might be better served just taking the best player available, not worrying about Viney and stocking up on the likes of Lonergan, Pongracic, Atkins, Johnson, Kent and McKay with the rest of their picks.

 

[Demonheart]

I edited my Viney write up, just so there is no more confusion.

My money is still on the Gold Coast trading the #2 pick to GWS for Jack Martin and maybe the Giants' second rounder, or something like that though. If they didn't do that, maybe they'd seriously think about bidding on Viney - considering he would fill a real need. But I just don't consider him a top 2 talent. And really, that's all it should come down to. Gold Coast might be better served just taking the best player available, not worrying about Viney and stocking up on the likes of Lonergan, Pongracic, Atkins, Johnson, Kent and McKay with the rest of their picks.

From memory the father/son bids come first before anything else so they would have to make a decision on whether they want Viney prior to anything else. Does Viney represent greater value than Martin?

Also, i thought you said that there'd be no more Jack Viney talk other than that other thread you created?

 

[manny100]

I edited my Viney write up, just so there is no more confusion.

My money is still on the Gold Coast trading the #2 pick to GWS for Jack Martin and maybe the Giants' second rounder, or something like that though. If they didn't do that, maybe they'd seriously think about bidding on Viney - considering he would fill a real need. But I just don't consider him a top 2 talent. And really, that's all it should come down to. Gold Coast might be better served just taking the best player available, not worrying about Viney and stocking up on the likes of Lonergan, Pongracic, Atkins, Johnson, Kent and McKay with the rest of their picks.

Big rumor on AFL 360 tonight that Tippet will be heading home to either Lions or GC. If that is the case then there is no way GC will risk nominating JV as that will put them straight out of the Tippet chase, the Martin option or any other possible 'once in a lifetime' opportunities during trade week. So it looks like bottom placed GWS is the only possible bidder.
With pick 2 , Couch and a late first rounder Adelaide can set themselves up for a long run at or near the top if they chose wisely. Who knows they even bid for Martin!!! Or maybe Grundy or Toumpas? If Tippet wants to go North you can bet they will be pushing him to GC!! Its going to an interesting trade/draft time.

 

[manny100]

......................or maybe push for a trade with Day for Tippett who is from SA???

 

[blueiris]

Big rumor on AFL 360 tonight that Tippet will be heading home to either Lions or GC. If that is the case then there is no way GC will risk nominating JV as that will put them straight out of the Tippet chase, the Martin option or any other possible 'once in a lifetime' opportunities during trade week. So it looks like bottom placed GWS is the only possible bidder.
With pick 2 , Couch and a late first rounder Adelaide can set themselves up for a long run at or near the top if they chose wisely. Who knows they even bid for Martin!!! Or maybe Grundy or Toumpas? If Tippet wants to go North you can bet they will be pushing him to GC!! Its going to an interesting trade/draft time.

you do realise gold coast wouldn't have to give up anything if they didn't want to to get tippett just take him in the pre-season adelaide's best bet is to trade with brisbane not gold coast

 

[Igloo]

you do realise gold coast wouldn't have to give up anything if they didn't want to to get tippett just take him in the pre-season adelaide's best bet is to trade with brisbane not gold coast

Agreed. No chance in hell Gold Coast will give Adelaide pick 2 for Tippett. Adelaide would be much better off dealing with Brisbane.

If he does go, that is.

 

[BrownPearHookers]

GC or Brisbane only have to give up a 2nd round draft pick for Tippett, it was written in Tippetts contract that if he chooses to go home Adelaide would only recieve a 2nd round pick.