Whats a greater threat to Australia Climate Change deniers or terrorists?

[Contra Mundum]

I'm guided by the failures of predictions made by eco-catastrophists, to come true.

None of their climate models panned out, none of them work going backwards with carbon levels, yet still the Warmies insist we follow their religion.

I didn't end up being an atheist, to then start worshipping the pagan religion of Global Warming.

What failures? - can I have some peer reviewed journal articles on these failures rather than the bullshit opinions of non-experts. When did we give up on the enlightenment and science? Anti-vaxxers, climate change denialists, herbal medicine devotees etc etc.

 

[Contra Mundum]

I'm not challenging the science I dont fully understand it. Not that its relevent to the two seperate issues, 1) whether you believe in climate change and 2) if so what you can do about it. Right now climate change proponents are too closely aligned with the "redistriubution a taxes" political agenda crowd for my liking. The same political dolts who wont talk about overpopulation or nuclear energy which is a HUGE disconnect in this whole dialogue. I smell a rat.

OK so every scientist who is researching anthropomorphic client change is part of the "redistrubtion and taxes political agenda crowd". A more compelling argument is those who refute it are either not climate scientists or in the employ or receive money from think tanks

 

[Contra Mundum]

 

[Xsess]

OK so every scientist who is researching anthropomorphic client change is part of the "redistrubtion and taxes political agenda crowd". A more compelling argument is those who refute it are either not climate scientists or in the employ or receive money from think tanks

Most are, some aren't and there are vastly different scientific opinions on all sides of that equasion. The scary part is the politicisation of the debate, that has complete science numpities declaring the science "settled" even calling others out as "denialists".

 

[Danny Cullen]

I reckon its crao.

Oh look, another prediction (involving Flannery's mob of course):

http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/w...le-climate-change-report-20150224-13n3wx.html

 

[Contra Mundum]

I reckon its crao.

Oh look, another prediction (involving Flannery's mob of course:

http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/w...le-climate-change-report-20150224-13n3wx.html

 

[Contra Mundum]

Most are, some aren't and there are vastly different scientific opinions on all sides of that equasion. The scary part is the politicisation of the debate, that has complete science numpities declaring the science "settled" even calling others out as "denialists".

No there is not - the consensus is that it is happening. There is a division of opinion whether creation science has explanatory power to - science does not work like that - its the semantics about theory - germ theory is a theory, Newtonian physics and observations of gravity are a theory.

 

[Danny Cullen]

View attachment 111733

So arrest me, which is the ridiculous premise of the OP.

 

[Qsaint]

What failures? - can I have some peer reviewed journal articles on these failures rather than the bullshit opinions of non-experts. When did we give up on the enlightenment and science? Anti-vaxxers, climate change denialists, herbal medicine devotees etc etc.

When the believers don't offer any solutions, if it was that serious we would replace all coal powered stations with Nuclear Reactors. Not a few wind turbines and solar panels that do jack all to reduce emissions.

No one wants to do anything, so therefore nothing to worry about

 

[Contra Mundum]

it was that serious we would replace all coal powered stations with Nuclear Reactors. Not a few wind turbines and solar panels that do jack all to reduce emissions.

No one wants to do anything, so therefore nothing to

When the believers don't offer any solutions, if it was that serious we would replace all coal powered stations with Nuclear Reactors. Not a few wind turbines and solar panels that do jack all to reduce emissions.

No one wants to do anything, so therefore nothing to worry about

You will find most climate scientists (the CSIRO people in particular) reckon the sooner we get to nuclear the better its a TINA and to our irish friend of course scientists who refute the science of climate change have no agenda:

Cato Fellow Patrick Michaels Runs Climate Denial PR Firm
Patrick Michaels, a former professor of environmental sciences at the University of Virginia, is a senior fellow at the Cato Institute and an outspoken climate change denier. On its website, Michaels is listed as Cato's only speaker on climate change. (Three others are also listed in the "Energy and Environment" category -- Jerry Taylor on "gas and oil prices, energy policy, energy conservation and regulation", Peter Van Doren on "energy regulation, gas and oil prices," and Randal O'Toole on broader environmental policies.)[36]

Pat Michaels represented the Cato Institute as a reviewer on Working Group III of the fourth Assessment Report of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.[37]


Michaels is the Editor of the World Climate Report, a blog published by New Hope Environmental Services, "an advocacy science consulting firm" he founded and runs.[38] Michaels' biographical note on the Cato Institute website does not mention his role with New Hope Environmental Services.[39]


In an affidavit in a Vermont court case, Michaels described the "mission" of the firm as being to "publicize findings on climate change and scientific and social perspectives that may not otherwise appear in the popular literature or media. This entails both response research and public commentary."[40] In effect, New Hope Environmental Services is a PR firm. Michaels' firm does not disclose who its clients are,[41] but in 2006 a leaked memo revealed that Michaels' firm had been paid $100,000 by an electric utility, Intermountain Rural Electric Association (IREA), to counter concern about global warming.[42] An affidavit by Michaels also stated that "public disclosure of a company's funding of New Hope and its employees has already caused considerable financial loss to New Hope. For example, in 2006 Tri-State Generation & Transmission Association, Inc., an electric utility, had requested that its support of $50,000 to New Hope be held confidential. After this support was inadvertently made public by another New Hope client, Tri-State informed me that it would no longer support New Hope because of adverse publicity."[40]


On a 2007 academic CV, Michaels disclosed that prior to creating his firm, he had received funding from the Edison Electric Institute -- an electric utility trade group -- and the Western Fuels Association -- an entity that provides coal and transportation services to electric utilities. He has also been a frequent speaker at events organized by leading coal and energy companies as well as coal and other industry lobby groups.[43]


In 2009, the Center for Media and Democracy's PRWatch noted that, "in its returns, Cato reports that since April 2006 it has paid $242,900 for the 'environmental policy' services of Michaels' firm. (In preceding years, New Hope Environmental Services was not listed amongst the five highest paid independent contractors supplying professional services to Cato.) In response to an email inquiry, Michaels stated that the Cato funding 'largely supported the extensive background research for my 2009 book, Climate of Extremes, background research on climate change, mainly in the areas of ice melt and temperature histories, and background research required for invited lectures around the world.' (Climate of Extremes was published by the Cato Institute in January of ... [2009].) Asked whether the funding came from a specific company, donor or foundation, Michaels wrote via email that there wasn't 'for this or for any of my activities.' (In case the Cato Institute knew of dedicated funding sources for Michaels work that he was unaware of, I also emailed an inquiry to the think tank's media office. They did not respond.)"[44]

 

[Xsess]

No there is not - the consensus is that it is happening. There is a division of opinion whether creation science has explanatory power to - science does not work like that - its the semantics about theory - germ theory is a theory, Newtonian physics and observations of gravity are a theory.

Climate is changing, absolutely, it's been in a perpetual state of change for all of time. The extent that man has contributed to the rate of natual climate variation, is debateable. What it means to the future existence of man, is debateable. The extent that man can reverse the damage of our existance, is dubious. What is 100% certain however, is my bullshit-meter redlining whenever I hear some hack socialist politician telling us they can fix all these improbabilities with a tax.

 

[Contra Mundum]

So arrest me, which is the ridiculous premise of the OP.

Progress in the West has been brought about by the reliance and belief in experts. The fact that you now have laypeople who have the audacity to question peer reviewed science means our society is headed for the tip. The belief that the IPCC is in the business of enslaving the world is the sort of stuff you would expect by hillbilly doomsday preppers - not from intelligent people that have reaped the fruits of the science.

Ironic that someone like Bolt is a post modernist

 

[Contra Mundum]

Climate is changing, absolutely, it's been in a perpetual state of change for all of time. The extent that man has contributed to the rate of natual climate variation, is debateable. What it means to the future existence of man, is debateable. The extent that man can reverse the damage of our existance, is dubious. What is 100% certain however, is my bullshit-meter redlining whenever I hear some hack socialist politician telling us they can fix all these improbabilities with a tax.

So your saying that we should still treat pollution as an externality? - it was a false assumption from the beginning of classical economics. What you are implying is that the IPCC is engaged in a conspiracy to enslave the world in a socialist world government - that frankly is laughable.

Also an ETS is a market model designed to get around this mythical assumption

 

[Xsess]

So your saying that we should still treat pollution as an externality? - it was a false assumption from the beginning of classical economics. What you are implying is that the IPCC is engaged in a conspiracy to enslave the world in a socialist world government - that frankly is laughable.

Also an ETS is a market model designed to get around this mythical assumption

Interestingly a one world government is nirvana to the far left. Bob Brown, the UK Greens have all stated this. Now I think about it, how much Australian carbon tax money did Gillard siphon off to the UN?

 

[Contra Mundum]

 

[Contra Mundum]

Interestingly a one world government is nirvana to the far left. Bob Brown, the UK Greens have all stated this. Now I think about it, how much Australian carbon tax money did Gillard siphon off to the UN?

You have lost me

 

[Xsess]

You have lost me

But I'm right here..

 

[blackcat]

Progress in the West has been brought about by the reliance and belief in experts. The fact that you now have laypeople who have the audacity to question peer reviewed science means our society is headed for the tip. The belief that the IPCC is in the business of enslaving the world is the sort of stuff you would expect by hillbilly doomsday preppers - not from intelligent people that have reaped the fruits of the science.

Ironic that someone like Bolt is a post modernist

paradox of Dunning Kruger.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect
Dunning and Kruger proposed that, for a given skill, incompetent people will:[4]

• fail to recognize their own lack of skill
• fail to recognize genuine skill in others
• fail to recognize the extremity of their inadequacy
• recognize and acknowledge their own previous lack of skill, if they are exposed to training for that skill

that those who dont know cannot actually reconcile this.

I think it is more meta D-K. Because, most will appreciate they do not understand, but feel they are insignificant, and cannot look themselves in the eyes in the mirror, so they compensate with a mask and pantomime, enter:Bolta stage right, or stage gauche. I think they do recognise the inadequacy, but cannot adequately process it, and you see a manifestation of "feeling" inadequacy. They are acting inadequacy out. do you ever feel embarrassed when you have erred and someone tells you that you are a dumb cnut. it happens to me all the time.

 

[Xsess]

You have lost me

Bob Brown advocates the one world government you dismiss. Yet he convinced Gillard to betray Australia with a carbon tax and siphon a blank cheque off to the socialist UN. In the name of "climate change".

 

[Contra Mundum]

Bob Brown advocates the one world government you dismiss. Yet he convinced Gillard to betray Australia with a carbon tax and siphon a blank cheque off to the socialist UN. In the name of "climate change".

You are trolling now

 

[Lebbo73]

And you certainly wouldn't believe in the 'religion' of science. Preferring rather to mindlessly swallow the propaganda fed to you by obviously vested interests.

Clever you.

Stop repeating this so called science lie. It has been found out to be false. The planet hasn't warmed since 1998. Your mates like Al Gore lied. The IPCC fudged the figures. They can't even predict the weather. Your avatar really is quite appropriate.

 

[blackcat]

I think it is more meta D-K. Because, most will appreciate they do not understand, but feel they are insignificant, and cannot look themselves in the eyes in the mirror, so they compensate with a mask and pantomime, enter:Bolta stage right, or stage gauche. I think they do recognise the inadequacy, but cannot adequately process it, and you see a manifestation of "feeling" inadequacy. They are acting inadequacy out. do you ever feel embarrassed when you have erred and someone tells you that you are a dumb cnut. it happens to me all the time.

also, you go to your grandparents who have never studied theoretical physics, about "scale" and putting "time" in context. They cannot adequately process the insignificance of their years on the planet in terms of the lifetime of the planet, whilst inversely, considering anthropogenic influence as immaterial. An eyeblink in their life relative to humans time on earth, as diametric opposed to the environmental catalyst.

 

[Contra Mundum]

also, you go to your grandparents who have never studied theoretical physics, about "scale" and putting "time" in context. They cannot adequately process the insignificance of their years on the planet in terms of the lifetime of the planet, whilst inversely, considering anthropogenic influence as immaterial. An eyeblink in their life relative to humans time on earth, as diametric opposed to the environmental catalyst.

Testify!

 

[Lester Burnham]

What failures? - can I have some peer reviewed journal articles on these failures rather than the bullshit opinions of non-experts. When did we give up on the enlightenment and science? Anti-vaxxers, climate change denialists, herbal medicine devotees etc etc.

You've jumped the shark Contra. You missed Holocaust Denial.

we find that the continued warming stagnation over fifteen years, from 1998 -2012, is no longer consistent with model projections even at the 2% confidence level.​

http://www.academia.edu/4210419/Can_climate_models_explain_the_recent_stagnation_in_global_warming

 

[blackcat]

Testify!

i)is that Bolta invective wanting to see me in county court, or ii), as evo and i like to say "word" semi exclamation mark but not quite threshold demanding exclamation mark