List Mgmt. 2015 general list discussion and speculation - PLEASE START NEW THREAD ON BREAKING NEWS

[Lana]

Unless you can prove that people who are demonstrably connected to the protagonists in each case are fabricating stories to mislead and confuse people, you have to concede that it is possible that these accounts are not fiction.

Just as those of us who post such information do not contend that these accounts of events at the club must be considered facts.

The problem with this is every man and his dog comes out with an inside source or a knows a guy who knows a guy, spreading baseless rumors and accusing players of x and y. Look how bad the Christensen trade thread got, 100+ pages accusing him of every offense under the sun saying things that wouldn't never have been said just a week before the news spread that he was leaving. Did changing clubs suddenly mean that there was something wrong with his character.

 

[Partridge]

Unless you can prove that people who are demonstrably connected to the protagonists in each case are fabricating stories to mislead and confuse people, you have to concede that it is possible that these accounts are not fiction.

Just as those of us who post such information do not contend that these accounts of events at the club must be considered facts.

It's absolutely possible. Anything is possible.

The opposite is also correct - nothing needs to be believed or even considered until it is verified. From people already putting Dangerfield in their best team for 2016 to anything else.

 

[goyoucatters]

The problem with this is every man and his dog comes out with an inside source or a knows a guy who knows a guy, spreading baseless rumors and accusing players of x and y. Look how bad the Christensen trade thread got, 100+ pages accusing him of every offense under the sun saying things that wouldn't never have been said just a week before the news spread that he was leaving. Did changing clubs suddenly mean that there was something wrong with his character.

The general point you make is valid. I don't know anything about the Bundy situation and have never suggested that I do. For that reason, I have not entered into the discussion regarding his supposed indiscretions for one second.

In the specific case of Chappy, however, I was told by a member of Chappy's circle about the 'difference of opinion' between our former #35 and the club regarding his rehab. It's easy to generalise all these matters under the catch-all derision associated with phrases like "every man and his dog" who heard "from a guy who knows a guy". In the end, I can only underline how close the source was to the actual people involved. And the apparent illogic of someone from Chappy's camp passing this on unless it has some basis in fact.

Anyway, everyone who wants to continue to decry the basis of truth in any of these unverified stories can do so. Which is precisely the point I was trying to make in my post above.

But simply belittling those who raise them on the basis that they're unverified does not, in itself, make them unquestionably untrue.

 

[dazbroncos]

The problem with this is every man and his dog comes out with an inside source or a knows a guy who knows a guy, spreading baseless rumors and accusing players of x and y. Look how bad the Christensen trade thread got, 100+ pages accusing him of every offense under the sun saying things that wouldn't never have been said just a week before the news spread that he was leaving. Did changing clubs suddenly mean that there was something wrong with his character.

One clearly does not equal the other. However, the method and means that are attributed to their leaving may sully that character. And therein lies the issue.

Was it upfront and clear and an amicable departure that would leave a welcome return or was it one where the two parties are better apart.

Id say TV is one and Bundy is another.

Go Catters

 

[vinum coupe]

Well considering the title of this thread has the word 'speculation', I think it's fair that people post what they may have heard.

 

[goyoucatters]

It's absolutely possible. Anything is possible.

The opposite is also correct - nothing needs to be believed or even considered until it is verified. From people already putting Dangerfield in their best team for 2016 to anything else.

There are those of us here who will consider matters and situations before they are verified (and despite the fact they can potentially never be verified).

Others who don't embrace this philosophy will have to bear with us.

 

[Lager]

I actually enjoy the rumors. Keeps the forum interesting, gets posters all antsy - love it! If a rumor is completely ridiculous, it probably won't get much airtime anyway...

 

[you pick one]

I still have a connection with one of our remaining 3 time Premiership players, he doesn't talk footy or club ever outside of the work place and I get the feeling that's the norm for players and club staff.If there is information being leaked out of the club I don't expect anyone to be putting their name to it.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I actually enjoy the rumors. Keeps the forum interesting, gets posters all antsy - love it! If a rumor is completely ridiculous, it probably won't get much airtime anyway...

Ridiculous rumours are not a problem.
It's plausible but unverifiable rumours that become "facts" on here, and everywhere else, for that matter.

 

[vinum coupe]

Ridiculous rumours are not a problem.
It's plausible but unverifiable rumours that become "facts" on here, and everywhere else, for that matter.

As long as it's not slander, where's the issue?

 

[vinum coupe]

i.e I was told via pm that Danger called his manager within an hour of Sando being sacked.
I'd call that normal.

I was told his manager was talking to 4 clubs due to that call.
Plausible.

But if we share that 'information', and it grows legs and gets distorted, when does it stop being worthy of being mentioned?

 

[Cat Addict]

Yes, he was fit enough to do the draft camp, apparently.
I don't know who we should pick at 10.
Nor do I have any idea who we will pick, I never do.
I just think we shouldn't add another injury risk, and we shouldn't pick mids who are only 179-181cm and therefore too small by modern standards to play as insiders.
Our immediate need is for big inside mids, and our medium-term need is for KPDs, so that's where I'd be aiming.
And big inside mids don't necessarily come from those who've been playing as such in the juniors - they might have been playing other positions, provided our recruiters think they are adaptable to our most pressing needs.

I knew you where going to say that. It's years of Wells picks that has us all running scared to predict his next move. For me I can see plans in place for the majority of our list but baring Toohey there is no one I can see with the potential to be our next FB, hence I think with the quality of the key tall early in this years draft we will take one. Next year is the year of the midfield as far as draft talent goes so we will add mid class then, and maybe a free agent if we are lucky.

I can understand your concern regarding Levers knee, it's our first top 10 pick since 2006, don't want to waste it. Emma Q from the age said if he played this year he would have been close to pick 1. Seems like a Wells risk move, I would be happy with Goddard to be honest. Let GWS take the risk they have 3 picks to burn.

 

[CatRiot]

Given that we have Kolo as our 3rd tall defender in the making, and it is more than likely that we will recruit a KPD in this draft (either one of Lever, Durdin, Goddard, McDonald or Nielson).

I wonder what position does James Toohey try to make his own? He seems quick off the mark, has played in defence and has a big frame, so could he turn into the stopper (Eg Lonergan's role)?

Whichever KPD the Cats draft in 2014 could then develop into the CHB role.

Its fair to say with Stanley, Clark, Vardy and Walker as natural forwards, Toohey will have to try and make the defence his home.

Goodness knows what this means for the Blitz...

 

[Turbocat]

Given that we have Kolo as our 3rd tall defender in the making, and it is more than likely that we will recruit a KPD in this draft (either one of Lever, Durdin, Goddard, McDonald or Nielson).

I wonder what position does James Toohey try to make his own? He seems quick off the mark, has played in defence and has a big frame, so could he turn into the stopper (Eg Lonergan's role)?

Whichever KPD the Cats draft in 2014 could then develop into the CHB role.

Its fair to say with Stanley, Clark, Vardy and Walker as natural forwards, Toohey will have to try and make the defence his home.

Goodness knows what this means for the Blitz...

We may have a lot options but my guess if look at history of talls ,we probably need them. My guess our strike rate wouldn't be great. Anyone care to build a list of KPP's the last 10 years?

 

[CatRiot]

Fantastic website to look at AFL Draft prospects:
http://www.afl.com.au/draft/draft-machine

Of the bigger midfielders, I like the look of Nick Mellington.

 

[The rabbi]

It's absolutely possible. Anything is possible.

The opposite is also correct - nothing needs to be believed or even considered until it is verified. From people already putting Dangerfield in their best team for 2016 to anything else.

Next you will be suggesting that people put Frawley in their best 22 for 2015.

 

[The rabbi]

As long as it's not slander, where's the issue?

People may have the right to post them, but people also have the right to call "bullshit" on unverifiable rumours. Seems fair to me.

 

[Lana]

not sure who said it but I think the chances of players making it from the Rookie draft are very, very low. He seemed very inconsistent in his first year.
The rabbi, how would you compare Toohey to Kolodjashnij in terms of their development as first year players at Geelong?

Just under 80% of players drafted in he rookie draft play less than 50 games, 56% of rookies don't play a single game.
For the first 20 players drafted, just under 75% of players drafted don't reach the 50 game milestone and 50% of players don't play a game.

 

[speedybundy]

Sure it's been mentioned but I'll be damned if I'm going back through 371 pages to find out, I think the amount of unlucky players to be delisted is really promising for our future
Burbury = Unlucky
Hunt = Unlucky
Hamling = Unlucky
Brown = probably fair, would've got one more year

Not saying any of these players would've been superstars, but 3/4 have had reasonable game time this year. Somethings afoot

 

[vinum coupe]

Just had a look at the Lever highlights for the first time.
He's another Harry Taylor.

 

[vinum coupe]

Well, I've just had a look. And I'd be pulling the trigger on either Garlett or Lever.

 

[The rabbi]

not sure who said it but I think the chances of players making it from the Rookie draft are very, very low. He seemed very inconsistent in his first year.
The rabbi, how would you compare Toohey to Kolodjashnij in terms of their development as first year players at Geelong?

I would have Kolo ahead of Toohey even though I thought that Kolo tapered off toward the end of the year.
Toohey is supposed to be quick but I confess that I never really noticed it. Maybe because I thought that he seemed to get lost at times on the ground and be caught in the wrong position. Kolo seems to have really nice foot skills and did not seem to panic under pressure. He looked the most likely defender (other than the one that got delisted), and has a physique that will develop in reasonable time to play AFL.

Toohey is also quick. He ran a 3.05sec 20m sprint at the Victorian state combine.

http://www.geelongcats.com.au/player-profile/james-toohey

 

[The rabbi]

not sure who said it but I think the chances of players making it from the Rookie draft are very, very low.

Although I can think of four Geelong players who in fairly recent years came off the Rookie List to gain a spot in the team and they have Premiership medals to prove it.

 

[CatRiot]

I like these "late" draft or rookie prospects (http://www.afl.com.au/draft/draft-machine):

Daniel Davie, Pioneers
190cm, 93kgs
Medium Defender / Forward
Age: 18
A member of the Bendigo Pioneers, Davie made 16 appearances in this year's TAC Cup, averaging 18 possessions, almost five marks and four rebound 50s per game. At 190cm, he is a medium-sized defender who finished runner-up in the Pioneers' best and fairest award this year and also took out most improved honours. The 18-year-old also demonstrated his versatility by getting forward to kick eight goals for Bendigo.

Nick Newman, Frankston Dolphins
187cm, 81kgs
Medium Defender / Midfielder
Age: 21
An outstanding season saw Newman go from Frankston's development team in 2013 to second in its senior best and fairest in 2014. He's a terrific athlete and a prolific ball winner. Newman generally plays as a medium defender but can move up into the midfield. The 21-year-old averaged 24 touches at 70 per cent efficiency for the Dolphins.

Nick Mellington, Bushrangers
187cm, 88kgs
Midfielder (Inside)
Age: 18
The in-and-under midfielder got better as the TAC Cup season wore on and capped his campaign with a stellar 30-disposal, 10 clearance performance against Angus Brayshaw's Sandringham Dragons in a losing elimination final. Mellington is a strong left-foot kick, good decision-maker and prolific ball-winner. After overcoming illness early in the year, he finished like a steam train, averaging 25 disposals and six clearances over the final five games for the Bushrangers.

Tyler Roos, Dragons
185cm, 73kgs
Midfielder
Age: 18
Athletic medium midfielder who can outwork his opponents. Uses the ball well by foot and has good game sense. Played for Sandringham Dragons in TAC Cup but was eligible to play for NSW/ACT in the NAB AFL Under-18 Championships. Averaged 19 touches and four clearances in three appearances at the carnival. Played 18 games at TAC Cup level, averaging 23 disposals. Son of Melbourne coach Paul Roos.

Damien Cavka,
184cm, 79kgs
Midfielder / Small Forward
Age: 18
Elite endurance player with the capacity to run all day. Can play variety of roles, including shutting down opponents through the midfield, as well as rebounding from half-back. Shows excellent character and work ethic. Performed well at NAB AFL Under-18 Championships, averaging 18 possessions, seven tackles, five marks and three clearances at 70 per cent efficiency in four matches. Averaged 23 possessions in 11 games and kicked 17 goals for Calder Cannons in the TAC Cup.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Just had a look at the Lever highlights for the first time.
He's another Harry Taylor.

Lever is a gun. I rate him as highly as i did troy menzel in 2012. While i think we have too many injury prone players, i would take him at 10.

He wont be there anyway though because gws will take him.