Universal Love Not Boo-ing Goodes

[choppychester]

As I stated in another post not every action white Australians was right but we have acknowledged many of those mistakes and over the last 30 or so years made alot of progress as a nation, we do not stop aboriginal people or any other race for that matter from speaking their own language or eating their own foods in fact Australia is one of if not the most multicultural nation in the world and that's what makes this nation great that so many different races can come together as one
The past can not be undone and until people such as Adam Goodes realise that we as a nation can not move forward and make sure we don't make the same mistakes again

how do I reach these kids?

 

[Samcro24]

Media and AFL not helping.

People just love being told what they are thinking, and how to behave.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Paul Roos said last night: "If Goodes feels it's racism, then it's racism."

It really is a cartoon world we're living in now.

Yep, this is utter nonsense for sure.

There are 2 sides to the communication…Goodes may receive it as racist despite the fact the sender of the communication had absolutely zero racist intentions. Further, the comment/boo itself may or may not be racist at all, despite how the receiver of it perceives it!

In the end though, if the person perceives it that then despite it probably NOT being racist, I'd stop doing it.

However, if on the weekend Goodes does some dirty/weird off the ball crap or inflammatory gestures that he's known for, he shouldn't cry if the boos start again.

Oh, and for those who say the spear throwing isn't inflammatory but a wonderful personal expression, surely the reverse argument could be used by the crowd saying "well if i feel it is inflammatory or threatening, then IT IS inflammatory or threatening"!! See how stupid the logic is?!

There are 2 sides to this for sure. Goodes, no matter how well intentioned, is a poor communicator of his message and has got so many people offside. The contrast to McLeod's words mentioned earlier in the thread basically sum up his style.


Over the past decade I've worked among countless members of the indigenous community. The truth to their plight is somewhere in the middle of the left and right arguments. Yes, many have been 'victims' but no way are they poor innocents who can't do much, much better to help themselves, their community and the wider Australian community. I've met many who are wonderful people who are kind, gentle and family orientated. I've also met some absolute scum who waste money on smokes/drugs/alcohol, mistreat property, abuse their family, and threaten others with violence (my experience was a meat cleaver!)…and of course it's never their fault!

The leaders of their community need to not only diplomatically work with wider Australia and segments with racist undertones but also put the heat on their own to lift their game, show some self-determination (along with the many gov benefits to assist the process), stop the victimhood but empower their younger generation to succeed in whatever way they see 'success' to be for them. Reconciliation isn't helped by bagging the s**t out of the wider community while taking no responsibility for your own faults!

 

[baldandbroke]

I find it offensive as it is an attack on all of our ancestors who came across to this great country to start a better life and to call it invasion day is to liken to what happened to American Indians where they were almost completely wiped out, where as we did things differently not that we did those things right in hindsight thow

To call it invasion day was very ignorant of him when I hear the word Invasion I associate it with things like the Nazi's invading Poland, if indigenous people feel we shouldn't celebrate Australia day on the day it is there are better ways to go about it

Well - this is a strange post.

"an attack on all of our ancestors who came across to this great country to start a better life"

If you could step back and see that from an Aboriginal view point - it might be seen a bit differently? Also, a lot of the people that came here weren't here by choice ... and when they arrived it was already a great country and home to the oldest civilisation on earth. Rich in culture and language and history. Do you not think that European arrival was an invasion? Are you claiming Terra nullius ... really ... in 2015 does this view still exist?

You are saying that it was nothing like the "Nazi's invading Poland" - okay - I cannot for the life of me see what your point is. Unless you just wanted to get the Nazi's into the conversation and summon Godwin's Law?

What would you suggest as the "better ways to go about it" in terms of highlighting the offensive nature of the current Australia Day? What part of what Goodes has done is getting your hackles up? Do you mean not talking about it openly? Maybe a nice letter to the editor on Sunday?

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Re Invasion Day, I've got no problem with changing the date of Australia Day from 26/1 to another day with a shared positive symbolism for all Australians (anglo, aboriginal, and every other Australian!) just to stop the divisiveness of Invasion Day rhetoric.

Any ideas? Prob not New Years but something else?

 

[STrAng3C1oUdZ]

In what way is he a s**t bloke? You've met him? You know him personally?

Because of his attitude we will never be able to move forward if people hang onto the past it can't be undone why do you think McLeod and Long go about it the way they do it's because they realise we need to move forward instead if looking back I'm not saying they need to forget the past but don't hold a grudge

 

[jenny61_99]

True that.

The point being, because it seems to be getting missed. People are receptive to the message, but if you want your message to be respected, it needs to be delivered respectfully.

Mcleod delivered his message with dignity and understanding, not looking to inflame or blame.

Goodes didnt.

And how much has McLeod achieved with his "acceptable" way of doing things? Most people go "isn't that nice, that nice boy says things so eloquently" and then go on about their daily lives without giving a second thought to the issue.

 

[STrAng3C1oUdZ]

how do I reach these kids?

By educating them properly In our schools so they don't make the same mistakes

 

[VSTone]

Man, if we're going to boo every self entitled flog who plays the game then my voice would be hoarse every week.

I'll save my booing for the snipers and the umpires.

yep and that's why you'll be booing Goody too shoes by qtr time... boo the sniper!

 

[baldandbroke]

<snip>
Over the past decade I've worked among countless members of the indigenous community. The truth to their plight is somewhere in the middle of the left and right arguments. Yes, many have been 'victims' but no way are they poor innocents who can't do much, much better to help themselves, their community and the wider Australian community. I've met many who are wonderful people who are kind, gentle and family orientated. I've also met some absolute scum who waste money on smokes/drugs/alcohol, mistreat property, abuse their family, and threaten others with violence (my experience was a meat cleaver!)…and of course it's never their fault!<snip>

I too have worked in Aboriginal communities - with sport as my way in - but have also worked in non-Indigenous communities doing the same stuff.

You aren't talking about Aboriginals in your comment above - you are talking about ALL people.

Not sure why you need to associate a race as being all of these things ... "absolute scum who waste money on smokes/drugs/alcohol, mistreat property, abuse their family, and threaten others with violence" ... when actually race has nothing to do with it. that is people in general. I know you also said that there are also nice people ... but really?

Same as the "victim" stuff - seriously? "Never their fault" ? Are you implying that this is more common occurrence in Aboriginal communities than other non-Aboriginal communities? Hope not.

 

[Mckaye17]

I've seen this all over my facebook and news in the last 24 hours now having to see it again in our Crows forum....

For * sakes!!! He's a flog and racist that's final leave it at that

 

[VSTone]

I'd love to see Betts or Cameron do the war dance on the SCG after a goal this week.

i'd prefer they concentrate on getting the next footy! team first style

 

[choppychester]

By educating them properly In our schools so they don't make the same mistakes

Why do you think you are you so ignorant?

 

[baldandbroke]

By educating them properly In our schools so they don't make the same mistakes

Huh? Schools? Are you serious?

I've seen this all over my facebook and news in the last 24 hours now having to see it again in our Crows forum....

For **** sakes!!! He's a flog and racist that's final leave it at that

Well maybe steer clear of the "Not Boo-ing Goodes" thread ???

 

[VSTone]

Some people boo Goodes because they're racists, some people boo him because they don't like him as a person, some boo him because they think he's a dirty player, some people are sheep following the crowd and others are just morons. The reason they boo him doesn't really matter, and here's why:

The booing has gotten to the point where it is being interpreted by the aboriginal community as being racially driven. Now knowing that fact, and still choosing to boo him makes you a what:

Option A: racist
Option B: moron
Option C: troll
Option D: all of the above

how do i express my disgust for his dirty playing tactics?
how are you going to react after he digs the knee into levers back? cheer him, clap him? please

 

[SpeciousArgument]

I don't know your skin colour ...

What makes you think that Adam Goodes thinks you are a racist? Talk about thought police !!

When did he call you a racist because of your skin colour?

EFF ME! Walk a mile in Adam's shoes, and see how you feel about racism. Show some empathy for what he deals with everyday - and see how your comments come across as ignorant.

Unbelievable to me how insensitive some of the comments in this discussion are to what is a real issue - racism is very real - and very nasty - and will cut you down for nothing more than the colour of your skin. We all need to understand that any racism is awful, it needs to be stamped on whenever it rears it's head. By everyone.

Is Goodes getting racism in Australia raised as a discussion point? or is he getting 'is it racist to boo Adam Goodes' raised as a discussion point.

The fact that Goodes has dealt with racism in his life does not give him the right to turn around and call me a racist for disliking him.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

And how much has McLeod achieved with his "acceptable" way of doing things? Most people go "isn't that nice, that nice boy says things so eloquently" and then go on about their daily lives without giving a second thought to the issue.

What crap.

When I hear about what McLeod has done/is doing then I have utmost respect for the work he is doing and it gives me hope that the next generation will progress positively.

I do think about the issue and from my perspective McLeod has done much better.

It's a shame. All Goodes has to do is be a better communicator. I actually love the fact he wants to do something for his people. I love the reconciliation ads that have a positive tone of coming together (much like the Bulldogs multicultural ad). I can understand why the hurt and bitterness is still there but 'we' as a nation have said sorry…there's no point continually rubbing peoples noses in the past that we can't change and sure as hell didn't do ourselves…lets move forward together.

 

[jenny61_99]

Actually, his comment "racism has a face, and it's a 13 year old girl" shows he DID know her age, and gender.

He only said that after he found out how old she was. It is absolutely telling. He expected when he heard that statement for it to have come from an adult. It has happened before. But when you realise it was a child, that makes it so much worse. If you can't see that, there's no hope.

 

[baldandbroke]

how do i express my disgust for his dirty playing tactics?

Talk about a First World Problem ...

 

[STrAng3C1oUdZ]

Well - this is a strange post.

"an attack on all of our ancestors who came across to this great country to start a better life"

If you could step back and see that from an Aboriginal view point - it might be seen a bit differently? Also, a lot of the people that came here weren't here by choice ... and when they arrived it was already a great country and home to the oldest civilisation on earth. Rich in culture and language and history. Do you not think that European arrival was an invasion? Are you claiming Terra nullius ... really ... in 2015 does this view still exist?

You are saying that it was nothing like the "Nazi's invading Poland" - okay - I cannot for the life of me see what your point is. Unless you just wanted to get the Nazi's into the conversation and summon Godwin's Law?

What would you suggest as the "better ways to go about it" in terms of highlighting the offensive nature of the current Australia Day? What part of what Goodes has done is getting your hackles up? Do you mean not talking about it openly? Maybe a nice letter to the editor on Sunday?

You only want to see it from your point of view he could have just as easily came out and said something along the lines of to celebrate this nation moving forward and recognising aboriginal people in the constitution that Australia should be celebrated on this day as the day we have become a nation combined

 

[SpeciousArgument]

Some people boo Goodes because they're racists, some people boo him because they don't like him as a person, some boo him because they think he's a dirty player, some people are sheep following the crowd and others are just morons. The reason they boo him doesn't really matter, and here's why:

The booing has gotten to the point where it is being interpreted by the aboriginal community as being racially driven. Now knowing that fact, and still choosing to boo him makes you a what:

Option A: racist
Option B: moron
Option C: troll
Option D: all of the above

Stopping booing him now would confirm that it has been racially motivated.

Goodes "stop booing me its racist"

Me "Im booing you because you are a dirty player that appeals for free kicks because youre used to being taken care of by the umpires, and now im booing you twice as loudly because you called me a racist when you should know perfectly well that there are other reasons to boo you"

Goodes "But im black and therefore booing me is racist"

Me "No it isnt. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO"

 

[FantasticShirt]

Well this thread went down hill quickly.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

I too have worked in Aboriginal communities - with sport as my way in - but have also worked in non-Indigenous communities doing the same stuff.

You aren't talking about Aboriginals in your comment above - you are talking about ALL people.

Not sure why you need to associate a race as being all of these things ... "absolute scum who waste money on smokes/drugs/alcohol, mistreat property, abuse their family, and threaten others with violence" ... when actually race has nothing to do with it. that is people in general. I know you also said that there are also nice people ... but really?

Same as the "victim" stuff - seriously? "Never their fault" ? Are you implying that this is more common occurrence in Aboriginal communities than other non-Aboriginal communities? Hope not.

100% agree that this is people in general, please don't misread me!

However, would you agree that there are systematic issues regarding the indigenous population that THEY and OTHERS add to the generalised conditions as being important to their plight.

Why are they singled out as a separate group by both sides of the argument?

 

[baldandbroke]

Is Goodes getting racism in Australia raised as a discussion point? or is he getting 'is it racist to boo Adam Goodes' raised as a discussion point.

The fact that Goodes has dealt with racism in his life does not give him the right to turn around and call me a racist for disliking him.

Have you ever heard Goodes speak in person? Or are you basing your view on the Media grabs and reports?

What fuels your dislike of him? Is it purely on-field? Anyone else come close to the level of dislike in the AFL - or is he head and shoulders above for you?

When and where did Goodes call you a racist? It seems you might be projecting a little there? What quote made you feel this?

 

[SpeciousArgument]

Have you ever heard Goodes speak in person? Or are you basing your view on the Media grabs and reports?

What fuels your dislike of him? Is it purely on-field? Anyone else come close to the level of dislike in the AFL - or is he head and shoulders above for you?

When and where did Goodes call you a racist? It seems you might be projecting a little there? What quote made you feel this?

I am Australian. Goodes has said publicly that Australians are racist. Do i need to draw you a picture?

Ive explained elsewhere what he has done to be disliked as a player, as have dozens of others in this thread and theres no point repeating it because you wont believe it isnt racially motivated anyway.