- Sep 25, 2005
- 9,720
- 6,297
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Gippy Power
- Thread starter
- #76
Thats how I see it.
Snoops Annual Player Review, List and Draft Strategy
- Thread starter Snoop Dog
- Start date
- Tagged users None
Thats how I see it.
- Sep 25, 2005
- 9,720
- 6,297
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Gippy Power
- Thread starter
- #77
I was talking about the coach lauding. He fwd 50 defensive work was very good early and he was good in the back half to seasons end.
- Sep 25, 2005
- 9,720
- 6,297
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Gippy Power
- Thread starter
- #78
I am of the view that they did ok.
Am a firm believer (despite what others say) is we were always a club that bc of our list turnover did not have enough depth to cover a serious injury problem. To that end I know the club said they had 213 injuries this year but I worked out over 100 of them were to players who at start of year were in the best 22. To give you a comparison Essendon had less than 40. That makes a big difference and hence I think its hard to judge the coaching staff. Remember we were 8:3 and we didnt have an issue but that Dogs game was a turning point. I have heard people inside the club say that is when the injuries became to much and they couldnt get the team right.
In saying all that, there wasnt a huge amount of injuries in the midfield and the fwd 50 entries and set up seemed really poor to me. I would love to see a stat around effective fwd 50 entries as a percentage of the total. I would bet we were well down and I would think our DE through that part of the ground would be equally poor. Structure and game plan has to be a part of that. Defensively I think Maxwell out was massive, Brown pretty bad and to not have Reid to swing back there at times bad as well so I think that end of the ground stood up as well as could have been expected.
- Sep 25, 2005
- 9,720
- 6,297
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Gippy Power
- Thread starter
- #79
I agree but GWS would never do it.
- Sep 25, 2005
- 9,720
- 6,297
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Gippy Power
- Thread starter
- #80
yeah I was a fan of that kid in his draft year and the little I have seen of him since suggests he should get another go.
- Sep 25, 2005
- 9,720
- 6,297
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Gippy Power
- Thread starter
- #81
Lets move the chat on a bit.
Who is trade bait and what would you want for them?
Also what type of players do you think we will go after and if you've seen some junior footy who do you think fits the bill?
Who is trade bait and what would you want for them?
Also what type of players do you think we will go after and if you've seen some junior footy who do you think fits the bill?
Gone Critical
Moderator
- Moderator
- #82
The three that stand out as trade bait would be Thomas, Sinclair and Ramsay. Goldsack if he wants to go will be a FA I think. Its our younger guys who have shown a bit so have some currency but haven't yet established a best 22 spot that are most likely to generate some interest. Don't think any of them would be worth much, so low end trading. Don't see any big trades on our horizon
To be honest, the only trade bait we have is Nathan brown.
If we land a guy like frawley then this comes into the equation. Otherwise I would do let him go.
I actually think we need to be cautious and not trade any more premiership players. I think the 12 on our list need to remain. You need this core group of experience to lead the team. They know how to win and reach the top.
I reckon brown could bet us a top 20 pick.
Eg: brown + pick 27 for GC pick 13. GC have no depth for key backs. They would consider it I reckon and probably don't have a real need for 2 first round picks this year. They have talent but need maturity more than anything.
But again, brown is a premiership player, and our defence is also very inexperienced and lacks depth.
We can't bank on Moore coming straight in to fill the void.
The only way is consider it was if we got frawley, but I reckon he's off to Geelong.
This may just be a year we go into the draft with 3 picks and try to nail each one. Maybe we will again look for a delisted free agent (eg a Raines to cover for Macaffer) with our 4th pick or through free agency.
From what I understand of our rebuild, the hard work was done in 2012 and 2013, so it may be time to consolidate on what we have.
I wouldn't even be against trying to snare a jack watts as I think we have enough youth on our list.
If we land a guy like frawley then this comes into the equation. Otherwise I would do let him go.
I actually think we need to be cautious and not trade any more premiership players. I think the 12 on our list need to remain. You need this core group of experience to lead the team. They know how to win and reach the top.
I reckon brown could bet us a top 20 pick.
Eg: brown + pick 27 for GC pick 13. GC have no depth for key backs. They would consider it I reckon and probably don't have a real need for 2 first round picks this year. They have talent but need maturity more than anything.
But again, brown is a premiership player, and our defence is also very inexperienced and lacks depth.
We can't bank on Moore coming straight in to fill the void.
The only way is consider it was if we got frawley, but I reckon he's off to Geelong.
This may just be a year we go into the draft with 3 picks and try to nail each one. Maybe we will again look for a delisted free agent (eg a Raines to cover for Macaffer) with our 4th pick or through free agency.
From what I understand of our rebuild, the hard work was done in 2012 and 2013, so it may be time to consolidate on what we have.
I wouldn't even be against trying to snare a jack watts as I think we have enough youth on our list.
If we can get a pick in the 20-30's for Blair or lumumba we could look at that but I suspect the club would be keen to keep the around due to the lack of leadership at the moment.
Could look at upgrading our 3rd rounder to a 2nd somehow, but unsure how we go about that.
I agree with Dave in that we should consolidate the list and not make too many changes. Things would look so much different if shaz and Freeman, or even one of, got going this year.
Could look at upgrading our 3rd rounder to a 2nd somehow, but unsure how we go about that.
I agree with Dave in that we should consolidate the list and not make too many changes. Things would look so much different if shaz and Freeman, or even one of, got going this year.
How is it that you know it is not true?
If the non-surgical treatment was a realistic option then he would not have slipped to no 6. Further, in hindsight, it is evident that surgery was a successful option.
Sesamoiditis "just requires rest": http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...st-requires-rest/story-fni5f22o-1226764594594
Both the club and player were more hopeful than certain that non-surgical treatment would be a success. Evidently it was not.
Defending the indefensible seems to be a common problem with Collingwood. From the weeks that Beams, Reid and Freeman have missed in the past two seasons regarding soft tissue injuries versus those missed by players from other clubs, a factual conclusion can be drawn that Collingwood did not allow the muscles to heal properly before ramping up the workload.
I am not sure why one would need a large body of medical evidence to draw conclusions from facts.
Gone Critical
Moderator
- Moderator
- #87
I dont see value in trading out our KPB unless as Dave put it we get a Frawley in. Also agree trading out premiership players should be largely a no go.
We showed in the Bulldogs and GC game this year we have lost for now the ability to bunker down and win games we should win when challenged. Those losses were an indictment on our mental effort. I didn't take much from the GWS game as they had a big number of serious outs also and ther was an element tof that game that was the 2nds playing the 2nds. Lose many moe flag players and we may as well just admit we have gone the total rebuild option
We showed in the Bulldogs and GC game this year we have lost for now the ability to bunker down and win games we should win when challenged. Those losses were an indictment on our mental effort. I didn't take much from the GWS game as they had a big number of serious outs also and ther was an element tof that game that was the 2nds playing the 2nds. Lose many moe flag players and we may as well just admit we have gone the total rebuild option
So what is happening with Cyril at the Hawks? Are the Hawks incompetent too?
You, quite knowingly and conceitedly, reference one player who has widely-known chronic hamstring issues.
If we are referencing only one player why don't you reference Sam Mitchell.
"HAWTHORN star Sam Mitchell will be sidelined for about two months after scans revealed a serious hamstring injury suffered during the Hawks' 145-point win over St Kilda on Saturday."
Injured: 3 May 2014
Returned: 4 July 2014
Nigh on exactly two months as initially expected. Further, he has not missed any further games or re-injured himself since returning.
speedytiger
Club Legend
If anyone knows Kyle Martin or Ben Kennedy personally could you please tell them to turn up to pre season shredded. Not an ounce of fat on them should remove any excuse not to play them.
My point of using Cyril is that as you say he has a long history of hamstring problems that the Hawks have not been able to address. Therefore either the Hawks medical staff are incompetent or sometimes these things are out of the control of mere mortals.
Nothing conceited in that.
Beams, Mitchell and Freeman do not have a long history of soft tissue problems. How is Rioli example relevant?
Gone Critical
Moderator
- Moderator
- #93
Non surgical treatment is not a guarantee and doesnt preclude a prolonged recovery. He slipped to no 6 because of the injury not the treatment.
There is a great saying in surgery "1st do no harm". That makes you think of the risk of surgery causing complications before you stick the knife in.
Also there is no doubt that you need proper medical knowledge and the intimate details of an individual case before you judge the appropriateness of any treatment. We are just not in any position to judge how good or not the care has been
Of course we can agree that there is logic is waiting an initial time to see how the injury heals. The body is an amazing thing.
However, conclusions drawn from facts does not require the additional knowledge you refer to. It is not an opinion or judgment based on medical evidence. It is something that can be said to be certain derived from factual knowledge. For eg. a VCAT member or Court Judge is not required to made an assessment on an injury using his or her own medical knowledge. He or she will make a finding of fact based on the evidence presented before him.
Based on what factual evidence we have it is not incomprehensible to draw a conclusion that there has been mistreatment.
Gone Critical
Moderator
- Moderator
- #95
I will agree if we were given information from an expert with knowledge of the case it would lead us to being able to make some judgement. What evidence do you have to draw your conclusions.
- Sep 13, 2013
- 31,411
- 28,204
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Juventus
Yeah we should get rid of the defender with the best kicking skills.
4QTRTIME
Team Captain
Least I could do.
- Sep 13, 2013
- 31,411
- 28,204
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Juventus
or we should keep the defender with the best defensive skills
why don't we have both
Gone Critical
Moderator
- Moderator
- #100
Good idea
