The on topic thread 4.0

[Art Vandelay_]

 

[hawkman]

Don't know why they just don't make it based on where the feet are. Would make it so much simpler instead of worrying about if a head or shoulder is just offside

 

[Jatz]

Australian domestic football continuing to be a s**t show in the least surprising news of the day.

Honestly, how much longer will the A League last? Anyone think it’ll be in its current iteration in 5 years? 10?

 

[RossFC]

Australian domestic football continuing to be a s**t show in the least surprising news of the day.

Honestly, how much longer will the A League last? Anyone think it’ll be in its current iteration in 5 years? 10?

What did I miss?

 

[SM]

Australian domestic football continuing to be a s**t show in the least surprising news of the day.

Honestly, how much longer will the A League last? Anyone think it’ll be in its current iteration in 5 years? 10?

I think you pay too much attention to Robbie Slater.

 

[Zidane98]

Australian domestic football continuing to be a s**t show in the least surprising news of the day.

Honestly, how much longer will the A League last? Anyone think it’ll be in its current iteration in 5 years? 10?

This seems rather random.

 

[SM]

This seems rather random.

I presume he's on about the Jets.

 

[99 Problems]

I presume he's on about the Jets.

Think he’s talking about the production company they were getting to do the broadcasts for them collapsing.

Sounds like they’ll be able to use an alternative but at a higher cost. And from reports it sounded like they were struggling financially to handle the much cheaper costs from the company that just went under.

 

[chef]

 

[Jatz]

I presume he's on about the Jets.

Presuming wrong, got nothing to do with the Jets (although that's an absolute shitshow in and of itself).

As has since been pointed out, they were scrambling to get a company to even broadcast their games this week.

In what other serious league (of any sport) does this happen? It's absolutely amateur hour.

Anyone that suggests the A league isn't dying isn't looking closely enough. Desperately need the FA to step back in.

 

[SM]

Presuming wrong, got nothing to do with the Jets (although that's an absolute shitshow in and of itself).

As has since been pointed out, they were scrambling to get a company to even broadcast their games this week.

In what other serious league (of any sport) does this happen? It's absolutely amateur hour.

Anyone that suggests the A league isn't dying isn't looking closely enough. Desperately need the FA to step back in.

How is that their fault? It's an independent production company.

Anyone that thinks the A-League is dying when they've just had a billionaire invest over 20m in a new team isn't paying enough attention. Didn't we have a conversation just last week that you couldn't name two players at your club? Almost every club's crowds are up on last season, WUN finally have a proper home to play out of, Auckland coming in next season (Canberra too supposedly although that's a bit more complicated), and Townsend out of the comp, things will continue to improve.

 

[Zidane98]

Presuming wrong, got nothing to do with the Jets (although that's an absolute shitshow in and of itself).

As has since been pointed out, they were scrambling to get a company to even broadcast their games this week.

In what other serious league (of any sport) does this happen? It's absolutely amateur hour.

Anyone that suggests the A league isn't dying isn't looking closely enough. Desperately need the FA to step back in.

What drugs have you been smoking?

German Bundesliga TV broadcasting deal collapsed just in 2022 mid season:

German government to bail out Bundesliga

The German government is to bail out football clubs after the collapse of the Kirch media company, reports Vivek Chaudhary and John Hooper.

www.theguardian.com

This also has nothing to do with the A-League. It is entirely down to the a broadcasting company going into administration, that can happen to any sporting league anywhere in the world at any time.


Utterly bizarre and unfounded rant. The A-League isn't going anywhere either, there's just been huge investment in the A-League itself (Silver Lake) and multiple clubs.

 

[Bradesmaen]

What drugs have you been smoking?

German Bundesliga TV broadcasting deal collapsed just in 2022 mid season:

German government to bail out Bundesliga

The German government is to bail out football clubs after the collapse of the Kirch media company, reports Vivek Chaudhary and John Hooper.

www.theguardian.com

This also has nothing to do with the A-League. It is entirely down to the a broadcasting company going into administration, that can happen to any sporting league anywhere in the world at any time.


Utterly bizarre and unfounded rant. The A-League isn't going anywhere either, there's just been huge investment in the A-League itself (Silver Lake) and multiple clubs.

Whoever chose the broadcasting company is at fault... The Bundesliga one if you look deeper was a long time established company that went into administration. This was some upstart that was clearly run by morons who thought they could do it on the cheap but it turned out it was more expensive than they thought.

 

[Jatz]

How is that their fault? It's an independent production company.

Anyone that thinks the A-League is dying when they've just had a billionaire invest over 20m in a new team isn't paying enough attention. Didn't we have a conversation just last week that you couldn't name two players at your club? Almost every club's crowds are up on last season, WUN finally have a proper home to play out of, Auckland coming in next season (Canberra too supposedly although that's a bit more complicated), and Townsend out of the comp, things will continue to improve.

Who do you think chose them?

Auckland are coming in, Newcastle are going out. Canberra is basically out now as well.

We'll see, my bet is the league will be dead within the next 10 years.

 

[Jatz]

Whoever chose the broadcasting company is at fault... The Bundesliga one if you look deeper was a long time established company that went into administration. This was some upstart that was clearly run by morons who thought they could do it on the cheap but it turned out it was more expensive than they thought.

Clearly easier just to say Bundesliga = A League mate.

 

[SM]

Who do you think chose them?

Auckland are coming in, Newcastle are going out. Canberra is basically out now as well.

We'll see, my bet is the league will be dead within the next 10 years.

And how long have they produced the A-League prior to this? What were the alternate options the A-League could have used? You're putting a lot of blame on the A-League because of this obsession with writing the league off.

Having two regional teams in Newcastle and CCM never seemed sustainable to me to begin with. Need teams in bigger population centres. Unfortunate but writing has been on the wall for a while now, and Jets don't produce the same production line of talent that CCM do.

You think a league that is raking in huge transfer fees over the last few years is just going to die off? We're making more money than ever on youth prospects and that's only going to increase.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Who do you think chose them?

Auckland are coming in, Newcastle are going out. Canberra is basically out now as well.

We'll see, my bet is the league will be dead within the next 10 years.

Half the A-league clubs past/present have had ownership issues over the years. Brisbane, Perth, Newcastle, Gold Coast, NQ, Wellington, WSW, CCM...

 

[Zidane98]

Who do you think chose them?

Auckland are coming in, Newcastle are going out. Canberra is basically out now as well.

We'll see, my bet is the league will be dead within the next 10 years.

Who chose the Bundesliga TV broadcast company? Bundesliga going to go bust within 10 years?


Your logic is ridiculous. Silver lake have only just completed a 140m equity investment in the competition.


The A League will be around forever whether you like it or not.

 

[SM]

Half the A-league clubs past/present have had ownership issues over the years. Brisbane, Perth, Newcastle, Gold Coast, NQ, Wellington, WSW, CCM...

Geeze stretching it a bit to include two defunct teams. Which surprisingly happened under the direction of the FA, that organisation Jatz is calling for as a safe pair of hands..

 

[Bradesmaen]

Who chose the Bundesliga TV broadcast company? Bundesliga going to go bust within 10 years?


Your logic is ridiculous. Silver lake have only just completed a 140m equity investment in the competition.


The A League will be around forever whether you like it or not.

Do you need this explained for you some more Zidane? You really dive off the deepend quite quick with absolutely any lack of logic. The bundesliga was produced by a company that had been around for 50 years, they would have done the appropriate checks and it's hard to see a company like that going bust so quickly. On the other hand the APL gave the production rights to a company that had started up basically the same week. That is an incredible risk and it's clearly not paid off.

 

[Jatz]

And how long have they produced the A-League prior to this? What were the alternate options the A-League could have used? You're putting a lot of blame on the A-League because of this obsession with writing the league off.

Having two regional teams in Newcastle and CCM never seemed sustainable to me to begin with. Need teams in bigger population centres. Unfortunate but writing has been on the wall for a while now, and Jets don't produce the same production line of talent that CCM do.

You think a league that is raking in huge transfer fees over the last few years is just going to die off? We're making more money than ever on youth prospects and that's only going to increase.

You're not wrong, they're way too close in a sport that can't sustain them. The NRL could make that work but the A League haven't been able to - football just isn't as popular as a professional sport in and around the Sydney/outer Sydney market.

You think it's sustainable carrying clubs that average 3k people a game? Sydney's average attendances (by far and away the most attended team) are down 20% this season.

You talk about attendances, try this on. 10 years ago, 5 years ago and then this year for average attendances and then the percentage increase/decrease from back then. I'll leave WU and Macarthur out.

Sydney - 18,862 - 13,464 - 13,450 - -28.7%
Victory - 21,736 - 20,298 - 12,632 - -41.9%
Brisbane - 18,056 - 9,632 - 6,384 - -64.6%
Wanderers - 15,171 - 9,312 - 10,778 - -29%
Jets - 11,949 - 9,079 - 5,459 - -54.31%
Adelaide - 11,225 - 9,295 - 9,842 - -12.3%
Heart/City - 9,799 - 8,133 - 9,283 - -5.3%
Perth - 9,418 - 13,705 - 5,847 - -37.9%
Mariners - 9,374 - 5,562 - 7,589 - -19%
Phoenix - 8,186 - 8,533 - 8,620 - 5.3%

Those figures speak for themselves, it's really poor. Sydney/Melbourne/Brisbane/Wanderers/Jets/Perth all down over 25%.

 

[SM]

You're not wrong, they're way too close in a sport that can't sustain them. The NRL could make that work but the A League haven't been able to - football just isn't as popular as a professional sport in and around the Sydney/outer Sydney market.

You think it's sustainable carrying clubs that average 3k people a game? Sydney's average attendances (by far and away the most attended team) are down 20% this season.

You talk about attendances, try this on. 10 years ago, 5 years ago and then this year for average attendances and then the percentage increase/decrease from back then. I'll leave WU and Macarthur out.

Sydney - 18,862 - 13,464 - 13,450 - -28.7%
Victory - 21,736 - 20,298 - 12,632 - -41.9%
Brisbane - 18,056 - 9,632 - 6,384 - -64.6%
Wanderers - 15,171 - 9,312 - 10,778 - -29%
Jets - 11,949 - 9,079 - 5,459 - -54.31%
Adelaide - 11,225 - 9,295 - 9,842 - -12.3%
Heart/City - 9,799 - 8,133 - 9,283 - -5.3%
Perth - 9,418 - 13,705 - 5,847 - -37.9%
Mariners - 9,374 - 5,562 - 7,589 - -19%
Phoenix - 8,186 - 8,533 - 8,620 - 5.3%

Those figures speak for themselves, it's really poor. Sydney/Melbourne/Brisbane/Wanderers/Jets/Perth all down over 25%.

So Sydney flat on 5 years ago, WSW up, Adelaide up, City up, Mariners up, Phoenix up, and some clubs like Victory, Brisbane and Perth impacted by playing in smaller stadia. Jets the big stand out there which is why I don't see them as sustainable. Thanks for making my point for me that crowds aren't spiralling down?

 

[Jatz]

So Sydney flat on 5 years ago, WSW up, Adelaide up, City up, Mariners up, Phoenix up, and some clubs like Victory, Brisbane and Perth impacted by playing in smaller stadia. Jets the big stand out there which is why I don't see them as sustainable. Thanks for making my point for me that crowds aren't spiralling down?

Aren't spiralling down? Did you not see the percentages?

The aggregate of the average crowd 5 years ago across these clubs was 103,393 fans. This season, 89,844. That's 13,459 less people on average across the clubs. You're getting excited by teams that are 'up' when they're up less than 1k people on average, meanwhile the number of people actually attending is well down.

As for playing at smaller stadia? The Victory are playing at AAMI and aren't getting close to filling that out. Why would they play in bigger stadiums? Brisbane are exactly the same (Suncorp holds 50k odd), as are Perth (20k capacity). None of those crowd figures are impacted due to the size of their home grounds.

Not even close to making the point you're trying to make out.

 

[Jatz]

And that's only the well supported clubs. We're still not even talking about the laughable expansion clubs.

 

[SM]

Aren't spiralling down? Did you not see the percentages?

The aggregate of the average crowd 5 years ago across these clubs was 103,393 fans. This season, 89,844. That's 13,459 less people on average across the clubs. You're getting excited by teams that are 'up' when they're up less than 1k people on average, meanwhile the number of people actually attending is well down.

As for playing at smaller stadia? The Victory are playing at AAMI and aren't getting close to filling that out. Why would they play in bigger stadiums? Brisbane are exactly the same (Suncorp holds 50k odd), as are Perth (20k capacity). None of those crowd figures are impacted due to the size of their home grounds.

Not even close to making the point you're trying to make out.

Victory crowd averages were boosted by derby crowds at marvel, Perth 5 years ago was when they were flying under Poppa so naturally attracted bigger crowds. Roar have really dropped off but they've had a run of lack of success. Pretty sure Richmond's crowds will have a similar drop off.

The crowds aren't surging, but those %s are on 10 years ago, not 5 years ago. The crowds when taking out those outliers are pretty stable which doesn't suggest the death spiral you seem to think.

As I started with, WUN finally moving into a home and Macarthur this season showing some positive signs, but both expansion clubs were hand-picked by the FA, the organisation you think would better run the league.