Scott McLaren fails to recall simple rule

[Ported]

Throw in close to centre wing. Collingwood ruckman jumps, takes the ball, is immediately tackled by Port ruckman. Collingwood ruck scrambles a handball out, play on.

After a few seconds the ball is locked up awaiting a ball up. Peter Burgoyne argues a clear holding the ball at the throw in and, to quote McLaren, "He got the handball out." Peter Burgoyne; "What do you mean!?"

 

[Tomahawk Worshiper]

He wont be remembered for being the greatest umpire thats for sure...

 

[El_Scorcho]

They've been inconsistent with what they think prior opportunity is, but they haven't been too bad today. I don't remember the exact incident you are refering to.

 

[Check-Raise !]

Yep saw it immediately and thought you F&^*##.....anyway one of many frees missed for both sides i'm sure but that is a basic rule that shouldn't get missed.

 

[Generalissimo]

The only rule McLaren takes any notice of is "Look at me! Look at me! LLLOOOOOKK AAAATTT MEEEEEE!!!!"

 

[Willow_2000]

Well i guess it depends how long the port ruckman had him in the tackle before he got the handball away.
If Fraser got it out straight away then you cant really call it holding the ball but if he took like 5 seconds after he took it out of the ruck then fair enough to be pinged.

 

[Pessimistic]

too busy dreaminf up rules which dont exist yet as per gary ablett in 08 GF

 

[FIGJAM]

The scumps have been rubbish both ways.

 

[ziad]

Throw in close to centre wing. Collingwood ruckman jumps, takes the ball, is immediately tackled by Port ruckman. Collingwood ruck scrambles a handball out, play on.

After a few seconds the ball is locked up awaiting a ball up. Peter Burgoyne argues a clear holding the ball at the throw in and, to quote McLaren, "He got the handball out." Peter Burgoyne; "What do you mean!?"

Mc Laren correct, the player correctly disposed of the ball immediatly he was tackled. That is all he needed to do.

What is more interesting that professionals on $500000 dont know the rules.

 

[scattman3]

Thats the rule. If he immediately and legally disposed of the ball than it can't be called holding the ball. So Mclaren got the rule correct. Or am i missing something?

 

[the probe]

Thats the rule. If he immediately and legally disposed of the ball than it can't be called holding the ball. So Mclaren got the rule correct. Or am i missing something?

Nope, the rule was changed a few years ago - at ball-ups and throw-ins, if a player takes it directly, then "prior opportunity" does not apply.

Sandilands gets pinged for this on a regular basis.

 

[scattman3]

Yes. But if he immediately disposes with a handball it can't be holding the ball. Same as if you have a few bounces get tackled and on your way down get a handball out. It shouldn't be holding the ball. Prior opportunity means you have to legally dispose of the ball. If you dont have prior opportunity (the old rule) than you only have to make a reasonable attempt to legally dispose of the ball.

 

[RooDog]

Nope, the rule was changed a few years ago - at ball-ups and throw-ins, if a player takes it directly, then "prior opportunity" does not apply.

Sandilands gets pinged for this on a regular basis.

Yes its the same as any other tackle if they get tackled and have prior opportunity and do not dispose of it then its holding the ball. McLaren was right.

 

[blues4flag]

Hasn't been paid with any regularity this year. Every time a new rule is implemented the umps seem to forget about another rule.

 

[ziad]

Nope, the rule was changed a few years ago - at ball-ups and throw-ins, if a player takes it directly, then "prior opportunity" does not apply.

Sandilands gets pinged for this on a regular basis.

I was going to drop a Port joke, but then a docker supported comes along ...

Sandilands is slow.. and you are....

 

[Team Mo']

Throw in close to centre wing. Collingwood ruckman jumps, takes the ball, is immediately tackled by Port ruckman. Collingwood ruck scrambles a handball out, play on.

What rule did he misinterpret? From what you've said all Fraser did was take the ball out of the and handball it.

You are allowed to do that.

 

[Ported]

From the official AFL rules:

15.2.3 Holding the Football — Prior Opportunity/No Prior Opportunity Where the field Umpire is satisfied that a Player in possession of the football:

(a) has had a prior opportunity to dispose of the football, the field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against that Player if the Player does not Kick or Handball the football immediately when he or she is Correctly Tackled; or

(b) has not had a prior opportunity to dispose of the football, the field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against that Player if, upon being Correctly Tackled, the Player does not Correctly Dispose or attempt to Correctly Dispose of the football after being given a reasonable opportunity to do so.

(c) Except in the instance of a poor bounce or throw, a Player who takes possession of the football while contesting a bounce or throw by a field Umpire or a boundary throw in, shall be regarded as having had prior opportunity.

The ruckman handballed after being tackled. McLaren was completely wrong.

 

[Art Corvelay]

I must be missing something - it's a free kick if he doesn't dispose of the ball correctly or holds it in. If he's correctly disposed through a handball or kick whilst been tackled it's play on?

Edit

The ruckman handballed after being tackled. McLaren was completely wrong.

I think you've missed the important part of Rule A there champ. Rule C is essentially saying in a ruck contest it's treated as a prior opportunity, i.e. follow Rule 15.2.3.A, which says

(a) has had a prior opportunity to dispose of the football, the field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against that Player if the Player does not Kick or Handball the football immediately when he or she is Correctly Tackled

 

[the probe]

I was going to drop a Port joke, but then a docker supported comes along ...

Sandilands is slow.. and you are....

My goodness sir, that some rapier-like wit you've got on you. Why are you wasting time on an internet discussion group when you could be queen of the stand-up scene?

 

[Ported]

I must be missing something - it's a free kick if he doesn't dispose of the ball correctly or holds it in. If he's correctly disposed through a handball or kick it's play on?

Not from a bounce or throw in. If a player is tackled after taking possession directly from a throw in, he is deamed to have had prior opportunity and should be penalised with a holding the ball decision.

 

[ziad]

From the official AFL rules:



The ruckman handballed after being tackled. McLaren was completely wrong.

Mate, you are out of your depth, as bright as two Corns.

a) has had a prior opportunity to dispose of the football, the field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against that Player if the Player does not Kick or Handball the football immediately when he or she is Correctly Tackled; or

He had prior opportunity so go to A above, but he DID correctly dispose of it.

McLaren correct.

Bit tought when you have to juggle two facts.

 

[Art Corvelay]

Not from a bounce or throw in. If a player is tackled after taking possession directly from a throw in, he is deamed to have had prior opportunity and should be penalised with a holding the ball decision.

I've amended my post - you're ignoring rule A which is what happens in a ruck situation. Rule C is saying apply rule A.

 

[the probe]

Mate, you are out of your depth, as bright as two Corns.

a) has had a prior opportunity to dispose of the football, the field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against that Player if the Player does not Kick or Handball the football immediately when he or she is Correctly Tackled; or

He had prior opportunity so go to A above, but he DID correctly dispose of it.

McLaren correct.

Bit tought when you have to juggle two facts.

He didn't immediately dispose of it. That's the whole point.

 

[Team Mo']

He didn't immediately dispose of it. That's the whole point.

So he handbaled after the tackle was complete?

The rule doesn't state that he must handball before contact. It just says taking the ball out of the ruck is treated as prior opportunity.

 

[scattman3]

I suggest you all get your hands on a copy of laws of the game DVD. It's quite insightful and helps you realize the umpires aren't as blind/soft as you may think.
In relation to this situation it makes it clear that if a player takes the ball out of the ruck, is legally tackled and immediately and correctly disposes of the ball than a holding the ball decision will not be payed.
If the ruckmen takes possesion, is legally tackled and doesn't immediately and correctly dispose of the ball, than a free kick will be awarded.