Who will be 40th man. Nominated rookie?

[jackcass]

Otherwise (if we were allowed to nominate Cox), we would have a list of 45 players (senior plus Cat A).
So we would have 40 senior players plus 5 Cat A rookies...which we cannot... max is 44 plus Cat B rookies.

Not sure that's right, Mooney played seniors when he was listed as a Cat B rookie unless I'm mistaken.

EDIT: My bad, you're only referring to the 40th player upgrade and I think you're right. LTI and midseason different.

 

[Kilmo]

So you are telling me we can upgrade a Cat B rookie, thereby bringing our senior list to 40, whilst having 5 Cat A rookies, hence we start the season with 45 players (40 senior + 5 Cat A rookies).
Good luck with convincing the AFL on that one.
The ONLY reason we can upgrade a nominated rookie, is because we chose to finalise our list with 39 senior & 5 rookies, if we had gone for 40 & 4 then we could NOT upgrade prior to season (except for LTI, which is a seperate situation).
List choices are:
38 & 6 (with 2 nominated rookies)
39 & 5 (with 1 nominated rookie)
40 & 4 (with no nominated rookies)

Yeah I reckon you can

 

[wicksy]

We have no idea and you are all guessing. Smith over Golds? Its a guess based on what?

You're back!!!

 

[Baltimore Jack]

So you are telling me we can upgrade a Cat B rookie, thereby bringing our senior list to 40, whilst having 5 Cat A rookies, hence we start the season with 45 players (40 senior + 5 Cat A rookies).
Good luck with convincing the AFL on that one.
The ONLY reason we can upgrade a nominated rookie, is because we chose to finalise our list with 39 senior & 5 rookies, if we had gone for 40 & 4 then we could NOT upgrade prior to season (except for LTI, which is a seperate situation).
List choices are:
38 & 6 (with 2 nominated rookies)
39 & 5 (with 1 nominated rookie)
40 & 4 (with no nominated rookies)

I'm not saying you are wrong.
I'm saying in my research I cannot find any rule which prohibits a club from doing it

 

[Kilmo]

So you are telling me we can upgrade a Cat B rookie, thereby bringing our senior list to 40, whilst having 5 Cat A rookies, hence we start the season with 45 players (40 senior + 5 Cat A rookies).
Good luck with convincing the AFL on that one.
The ONLY reason we can upgrade a nominated rookie, is because we chose to finalise our list with 39 senior & 5 rookies, if we had gone for 40 & 4 then we could NOT upgrade prior to season (except for LTI, which is a seperate situation).
List choices are:
38 & 6 (with 2 nominated rookies)
39 & 5 (with 1 nominated rookie)
40 & 4 (with no nominated rookies)

I reckon there's no difference between having 40 senior, 4 Cat A and 1 Cat B and having 40 senior and 5 Cat A... either way it's 45 players.

 

[jackcass]

I reckon there's no difference between having 40 senior, 4 Cat A and 1 Cat B and having 40 senior and 5 Cat A... either way it's 45 players.

Senior lists are restricted to 44 for TPP calculations. Cat B rookies outside of TPP.

 

[MyManLynch]

I'm not saying you are wrong.
I'm saying in my research I cannot find any rule which prohibits a club from doing it

Page 201 Appendix 1 List Sizes

We currently have 39 & 5 (plus 2 Cat B).
After we promote a nominated rookie (deadline before season starts) our senior list changes from 39 to 40, hence our Cat A list must reduce to 4.
The nomination therefore must be a Cat A rookie.
Cannot be a Cat B rookie, otherwise our list would be 40 & 5 (plus 1 Cat B).
We would be breaking AFL list rules.
We can promote a Cat B rookie at anytime via LTI or at the mid season upgrade.

 

[12kilos]

I would think we can elevate 2 rookies. Due to Sharanbergs long term injury.
I would think Golds or Smith could best cover Sharanbergs role. Who ever shows the better form.
Then possibly one tall Cox? Unless Whyatt shows form and comes from left feild.
At the same time i cant see us doing any elevations until maybe midway through the season or if one of the rookies just kills it with form or a injury crisis occurs.
Otherwise our senior listed players will have first crack

 

[Knightmare]

Definitely Mason Cox should be that nominated rookie at the right time. He can play senior footy next year and it's not out of the question he passes Jarrod Witts by.

I see no need to upgrade any of our other rookies, even with Scharenberg and his ACL. We should have a strong enough senior group to keep all other rookies out of the senior side and I'd be more concerned than encouraged if the likes of Gault, Golds or to a lesser extent Smith are required to play senior footy.

 

[MyManLynch]

Definitely Mason Cox should be that nominated rookie at the right time. He can play senior footy next year and it's not out of the question he passes Jarrod Witts by.

I see no need to upgrade any of our other rookies, even with Scharenberg and his ACL. We should have a strong enough senior group to keep all other rookies out of the senior side and I'd be more concerned than encouraged if the likes of Gault, Golds or to a lesser extent Smith are required to play senior footy.

The only issue with the nominated rookie is that we MUST activate before season commences (then the door closes & doesn't reopen until after round 11).
Our Primary list is currently 39 with 5 Cat A rookies (maximum 44 allowed plus up to 3 Cat B rookies).
Hence we either up grade Gault, Smith or Golds before the season commences or we do not nominate/upgrade & go into the season with 39 & 5 (rather than 40 & 4).
We can obviously upgrade Cox at anytime via LTI (or any other rookie for that matter).
I agree that there should be no need for any upgrades before season commences.
Therefore we should go in with 39 & 5 plus 2 Cat B.
We then wait until a rookie demands selection due to form or injuries to senior players, then we use LTI to upgrade.

 

[Old Spice]

Page 201 Appendix 1 List Sizes
View attachment 198227
We currently have 39 & 5 (plus 2 Cat B).
After we promote a nominated rookie (deadline before season starts) our senior list changes from 39 to 40, hence our Cat A list must reduce to 4.
The nomination therefore must be a Cat A rookie.
Cannot be a Cat B rookie, otherwise our list would be 40 & 5 (plus 1 Cat B).
We would be breaking AFL list rules.
We can promote a Cat B rookie at anytime via LTI or at the mid season upgrade.

I'm not sure that reading is correct. I reckon that is what it should be at the end of the last list lodgment but that changes pre round 1 and post round 11 when players can be elevated from either category. Also don't we only have 3 Cat A rookies in Golds, Smith and Gault?

 

[AmellyPies]

Definitely Mason Cox should be that nominated rookie at the right time. He can play senior footy next year and it's not out of the question he passes Jarrod Witts by.

I see no need to upgrade any of our other rookies, even with Scharenberg and his ACL. We should have a strong enough senior group to keep all other rookies out of the senior side and I'd be more concerned than encouraged if the likes of Gault, Golds or to a lesser extent Smith are required to play senior footy.

Why? If they can play footy they play footy. No different to a senior player.

 

[Knightmare]

The only issue with the nominated rookie is that we MUST activate before season commences (then the door closes & doesn't reopen until after round 11).
Our Primary list is currently 39 with 5 Cat A rookies (maximum 44 allowed plus up to 3 Cat B rookies).
Hence we either up grade Gault, Smith or Golds before the season commences or we do not nominate/upgrade & go into the season with 39 & 5 (rather than 40 & 4).
We can obviously upgrade Cox at anytime via LTI (or any other rookie for that matter).
I agree that there should be no need for any upgrades before season commences.
Therefore we should go in with 39 & 5 plus 2 Cat B.
We then wait until a rookie demands selection due to form or injuries to senior players, then we use LTI to upgrade.

Unless Cox looks like a best 22 player going into the season then I would not nominate him. Same applies for all others.

My plan was to update Cox along the lines of via Scharenberg's ACL, and just do that when he is pushing for selection.

Why? If they can play footy they play footy. No different to a senior player.

Why promote guys who shouldn't be playing senior footy? Only Cox should be regarded a top 30 on list standard player.

Golds and Gault certainly aren't.

Smith to be determined but I'd hope we have a strong enough senior group for Smith not to be required to play.

 

[MyManLynch]

I'm not sure that reading is correct. I reckon that is what it should be at the end of the last list lodgment but that changes pre round 1 and post round 11 when players can be elevated from either category.

My understanding re the difference between
(a) the pre round 1 nominated rookie up grade &
(b) the post round 11 upgrade

A team can only nominate a pre round 1 rookie upgrade IF the primary list is either 38 or 39.
Hence, if your list is 38 & 6, then you can upgrade up to 2 rookies to bring your list to 40 & 4 prior to season commencement 0R if you are 39 & 5 then can upgrade 1 rookie.
If the list is already 40 & 4 then NO nominated rookie upgrade prior to round 1 is allowed.
Hence you start the season with 44 (plus Cat B) of which only 40 are available for selection.
LTI nominations are in addition to this.

The post round 11 upgrade is a free hit, allowing a free upgrade (irrespective of list size or LTI status), hence you could the operate with a list of 41 players available for selection.

 

[Old Spice]

My understanding re the difference between
(a) the pre round 1 nominated rookie up grade &
(b) the post round 11 upgrade

A team can only nominate a pre round 1 rookie upgrade IF the primary list is either 38 or 39.
Hence, if your list is 38 & 6, then you can upgrade up to 2 rookies to bring your list to 40 & 4 prior to season commencement 0R if you are 39 & 5 then can upgrade 1 rookie.
If the list is already 40 & 4 then NO nominated rookie upgrade prior to round 1 is allowed.
Hence you start the season with 44 (plus Cat B) of which only 40 are available for selection.
LTI nominations are in addition to this.

The post round 11 upgrade is a free hit, allowing a free upgrade (irrespective of list size or LTI status), hence you could the operate with a list of 41 players available for selection.

I haven't had a look at our senior list numbers but sounds like we have 39 and maybe only 4 Cat A anyway.

Meh, sure we'll find out soon enough.

 

[AmellyPies]

Unless Cox looks like a best 22 player going into the season then I would not nominate him. Same applies for all others.

My plan was to update Cox along the lines of via Scharenberg's ACL, and just do that when he is pushing for selection.



Why promote guys who shouldn't be playing senior footy? Only Cox should be regarded a top 30 on list standard player.

Golds and Gault certainly aren't.

Smith to be determined but I'd hope we have a strong enough senior group for Smith not to be required to play.

If they are performing in the reserves at a great standard, they'll get a chance.

 

[MyManLynch]

I haven't had a look at our senior list numbers but sounds like we have 39 and maybe only 4 Cat A anyway.

Meh, sure we'll find out soon enough.

We are currently 39 Primary 5 Rookie plus 2 Rookie Cat B.
So we have a choice to upgrade a nominated rookie & go in with 40 & 4 or we do nothing & go in with 39 & 5.
I have a feeling we may go in with 39 & 5 (no nominated rookie upgrade), as we already have an LTI upgrade up our sleeve to activate as & when required.
As Knightmare intimated, if we have to use our rookies early next season...it's probably bad news...either our list has been hit hard with injuries (again) or our senior list form is bad/we are losing & need to look for other alternatives to replace non performing players.
The perfect scenario is that our rookies are showing great form in the VFL, however our AFL team is playing well & there are no open spots as individual players are standing up & holding their places in the team.

 

[Old Spice]

We are currently 39 Primary 5 Rookie plus 2 Rookie Cat B.
So we have a choice to upgrade a nominated rookie & go in with 40 & 4 or we do nothing & go in with 39 & 5.
I have a feeling we may go in with 39 & 5 (no nominated rookie upgrade), as we already have an LTI upgrade up our sleeve to activate as & when required.
As Knightmare intimated, if we have to use our rookies early next season...it's probably bad news...either our list has been hit hard with injuries (again) or our senior list form is bad/we are losing & need to look for other alternatives to replace non performing players.
The perfect scenario is that our rookies are showing great form in the VFL, however our AFL team is playing well & there are no open spots as individual players are standing up & holding their places in the team.

Who are the 5 Cat A rookies?

 

[MyManLynch]

Who are the 5 Cat A rookies?

Gault, Smith, Golds, Keeffe & Thomas

 

[Old Spice]

Gault, Smith, Golds, Keeffe & Thomas

Cheers

 

[Kilmo]

Who are the 5 Cat A rookies?

Keeffe, Thomas, golds, smith, Gault.


MML I'm still pretty sure your nominated rookie can be Cat A or Cat B, they aren't being promoted to the senior list, that would be done on draft day like Frost. In that case it couldn't be Cox. However the rookie we nominate to play seniors can be cat A or B, doesn't make a difference to the total number of players.

 

[Old Spice]

Keeffe, Thomas, golds, smith, Gault.


MML I'm still pretty sure your nominated rookie can be Cat A or Cat B, they aren't being promoted to the senior list, that would be done on draft day like Frost. In that case it couldn't be Cox. However the rookie we nominate to play seniors can be cat A or B, doesn't make a difference to the total number of players.

Yeah I reckon you're right.

The 38/6 - 40/4 I reckon is for last list lodgment dates then once that is set you can move them: pre rd 1, post rd 11, for any LTI's. Category shouldn't matter imo.

 

[MyManLynch]

Yeah I reckon you're right.

The 38/6 - 40/4 I reckon is for last list lodgment dates then once that is set you can move them: pre rd 1, post rd 11, for any LTI's. Category shouldn't matter imo.

You cannot use a pre round 1 nominated rookie upgrade on a Cat B rookie, otherwise your list would be 40 & 5.
You can only commence season with:
38 + 6
39 + 5
40 + 4

Cannot commence with 40 & 5.
It's against AFL list rules.
I'm bashing my head against a brick wall here.

 

[MyManLynch]

Keeffe, Thomas, golds, smith, Gault.


MML I'm still pretty sure your nominated rookie can be Cat A or Cat B, they aren't being promoted to the senior list, that would be done on draft day like Frost. In that case it couldn't be Cox. However the rookie we nominate to play seniors can be cat A or B, doesn't make a difference to the total number of players.

Yes it does.
AFL list rules clearly state:
Max primary list 40
Cat A list max 6
However combined they must come to no more than 44.
38 + 6 = 44
39 + 5 = 44
40 + 4 = 44

Cat B rookies are outside main list & can be up to max 3.
Overall max is 47 of which 3 would have to be Cat B rookies.
We have 46 players. 39 + 5 + 2 = 46
However we cannot have 40 + 5 + 1 = 46

There are also strict TPP rules that govern how rookie salaries are handled.

 

[pablo disco bar]

If smith dominates NAB cup i say.......JUST PLAY HIM!!