Opinion Chris Scott's coaching - Part 1 [closed, see Part II]

[Partridge]

Bartel? Seriously?

Named in our best and the vast majority of this board's posters had him in the votes. Very surprised by that call from you Partridge.

Maybe the mistakes were more noticeable from where I was than the good passages. I thought he was much better last week, and obviously it's not like he was alone.

 

[Partridge]

What do you say?

I'm eagerly awaiting the quote. Nothing like evidence over idiotic insinuation.

 

[catempire]

The thing is, he's not exactly a defender though. He's playing like a utility. Has a run on the ball, has a roam around forward and then spends majority of his time lurking around defensive fifty.
You look at the Dogs, they have Easton Wood, Dale Morris who are the very epitome of gun defenders. Bartel is like a Luke Hodge at the moment. Terrific footballer but be honest, when teams are on the breakaway and you have Kersten, Motlop, Menzel or whoever else 1-on-1 with Hodge, you love your chances right? I know I do because I would prefer Hodge down there opposed to Issac Smith, Josh Gibson, Ben Stratton or Shaun Burgoyne.

Mitchell is another one. Great player who spends a lot of time at half back but overall, he's an average defender.
This is what Bartel is in my eyes. He's no Enright or Guthrie but you guys are making him out to be based solely on his overall game as a utility/Mr fix it.

If Bartel is playing there in a final, we're stuffed. His body has declined to the point he barely gets off the ground and he literally has no gears or a turn of speed.

But wouldn't you say in the role he is playing he is doing it well? If I'm reading you right you're saying he's not playing as a lock down defender.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

What do you say?

I am tipping us with confidence .

Like the other cats supporters I assume, I want to see a response, I am not just blindly going to assume it will come .Last 2 games have been poor , keep this up and we wont make the 8 .

The difference is I am looking to our players to turn things around , not our coaches .

I am confident we will win.

 

[Bobby_]

But wouldn't you say in the role he is playing he is doing it well? If I'm reading you right you're saying he's not playing as a lock down defender.

yes, he is doing a very good job but he's playing loose because we can afford the luxury of having a player like that free around that part of the ground.
A lot of players would die to have this luxury because they would probably rack up as many touches as what Bartel is at the moment.
Jimmy is obviously ahead of most when it comes to the little things of our game. His courage is second to none. Only a small percentage have that quality. His ability to read the play is ridiculously good but I cringe when I see him down back and we are under the pump.

If Blicavs and Bartel's roles were revered, I would honestly feel a lot more comfortable. Bartel can tag, he's done it many times. Blicavs has played a defensive role as we have seen it.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

I'm eagerly awaiting the quote. Nothing like evidence over idiotic insinuation.

Well we know your stance , this year in fact this Geelong group is a write of because we have recruited too many long term injury players .

Menzel says hi ,Mcarthy says hi ,Stanley says hi,Smith says Hi

So wrong, wrong ,wrong and wrong .

and yes isn't west doing wonders for the Lions . Wrong again.

 

[catempire]

yes, he is doing a very good job but he's playing loose because we can afford the luxury of having a player like that free around that part of the ground.
A lot of players would die to have this luxury because they would probably rack up as many touches as what Bartel is at the moment.
Jimmy is obviously ahead of most when it comes to the little things of our game. His courage is second to none. Only a small percentage have that quality. His ability to read the play is ridiculously good but I cringe when I see him down back and we are under the pump.

If Blicavs and Bartel's roles were revered, I would honestly feel a lot more comfortable. Bartel can tag, he's done it many times. Blicavs has played a defensive role as we have seen it.

Fair enough. I'm pretty happy with the role he's playing and the job he's doing in it. If he had to play tight on a small forward I'd be worried but that's not happening at the moment.

 

[BlightysCats]

I am tipping us with confidence .

Like the other cats supporters I assume, I want to see a response, I am not just blindly going to assume it will come .Last 2 games have been poor , keep this up and we wont make the 8 .

The difference is I am looking to our players to turn things around , not our coaches .

I am confident we will win.

I can't see how we can win unless GWS have another off day. They have a superior ruckman, midfield, forward line, and defence to us, plus they're far quicker, agile, and more skilful.

 

[Partridge]

Well we know your stance , this year in fact this Geelong group is a write of because we have recruited too many long term injury players .

Menzel says hi ,Mcarthy says hi ,Stanley says hi,Smith says Hi

So wrong, wrong ,wrong and wrong .

and yes isn't west doing wonders for the Lions . Wrong again.

Well I asked for idiotic insinuation, and you threw in rambling unrelated nonsense for good measure.

 

[David the Cat]

To be fair he's been better this year than I'd thought he would be. But he was awful today.

Didn't watch the game...or don't have a clue?

He wasn't awful and was clearly in our best, if not the best for us.

Did someone hack your account?

 

[Partridge]

Didn't watch the game...or don't have a clue?

He wasn't awful and was clearly in our best, if not the best for us.

Did someone hack your account?

A contrary opinion. The type that is always welcomed so warmly.

I thought our best players were Guthrie and Henderson. As I said earlier, maybe the blunders looked more striking.

Can you absorb that, or do you not have a clue?

 

[Cataholic]

A contrary opinion. The type that is always welcomed so warmly.

I thought our best players were Guthrie and Henderson. As I said earlier, maybe the blunders looked more striking.

Can you absorb that, or do you not have a clue?

Yep, Guthrie and Hendo our best. But, and I only watched the Fox broadcast, I thought Bartel was better than a lot of the others too.

 

[David the Cat]

I can't see how we can win unless GWS have another off day. They have a superior ruckman, midfield, forward line, and defence to us, plus they're far quicker, agile, and more skilful.

Well if we concede 12 goals 5 from turnovers, we'll get smashed. Full credit to Carlton, but we were pathetic today....

Its time the players took some responsibility for turnovers of that magnitude....you can have tactics and strategy and moves all you like, but if the players hand over 77 points to the opposition, there's not much the coaches can do on match day.

 

[David the Cat]

A contrary opinion. The type that is always welcomed so warmly.

I thought our best players were Guthrie and Henderson. As I said earlier, maybe the blunders looked more striking.

Can you absorb that, or do you not have a clue?

I agree about Guthrie and Henderson being in our best so it seems both of us have some sort of clue.........but your assessment of Bartel as "awful" just wasn't right....

 

[Partridge]

I agree about Guthrie and Henderson being in our best so it seems both of us have some sort of clue.........but your assessment of Bartel as "awful" just wasn't right....

It happens. We disagree. No issue there.

 

[BlightysCats]

A contrary opinion. The type that is always welcomed so warmly.

I thought our best players were Guthrie and Henderson. As I said earlier, maybe the blunders looked more striking.

Can you absorb that, or do you not have a clue?

He only went at 70% DE which is clearly the lowest for the top players of both sides. When 30% of your disposals aren't hitting the target in defence they can lead to a lot of problems for your team.

 

[vinum coupe]

I will say it again, Bartel is a shit defender but a terrific footballer.
Stop twisting my words around NSFB.

He may not be a good defender.
But he's doing a bloody terrific job playing in defence.

 

[David the Cat]

He only went at 70% DE which is clearly the lowest for the top players of both sides. When 30% of your disposals aren't hitting the target in defence they can lead to a lot of problems for your team.

When your midfield turnover the ball like we did, the backs are under enormous pressure...Enright had 77 , Mackie 66, Harry 73...and Bartel was often saving us in the goal square under enormous pressure......The midfield were responsible for the pressure on our backline...some of the turnovers were comical...at times I felt almost sorry for our backs...

We were smashed in centre clearances when the game was on the line.......beaten in clearances around the ground...and they had 60 inside 50's...and 77 points from turnovers...you can't win with stats like that.

 

[BlightysCats]

Well if we concede 12 goals 5 from turnovers, we'll get smashed. Full credit to Carlton, but we were pathetic today....

Its time the players took some responsibility for turnovers of that magnitude....you can have tactics and strategy and moves all you like, but if the players hand over 77 points to the opposition, there's not much the coaches can do on match day.

We've created a patient kicking based game plan to help our old slow defence and play to its strength of dealing with the high ball rather than having to deal with balls kicked in to space for opposition forwards to run on to. While it obviously worked well early in the season teams have figured out that if they manically forward press us our defenders can't easily spot up a short pass to slow the game down so we can play our patient build up way and instead we're forced to either try to handball through it or panic kick and turn it over, either way we're forced in to not playing our game plan. The thing is we can't play any other way either because if we try to play a handball run based game out of defence or quick end to end footy rather than our patient footy we'll be hopelessly exposed defensively, that's why when we get behind by any half significant margin this year we'll never be able to come back because we simply can't play the open quick footy we need to because in the process we'll make it too easy for oppositions to expose our slow lumbering defence.

We won't win the flag or do anything come finals because we don't have the personnel defensively that will allow us to play a different game style at points in games when we'll need to.

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

I can't see how we can win unless GWS have another off day. They have a superior ruckman, midfield, forward line, and defence to us, plus they're far quicker, agile, and more skilful.

This, this and this.

GWS having an off day is what will get us the win. What's in our favour is it is at home, hopefully that is enough but GWS will respond after the defeat to Adelaide, Leon will want a scalp away from home and we are cherry ripe for the picking next week.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

When your midfield turnover the ball like we did, the backs are under enormous pressure...Enright had 77 , Mackie 66, Harry 73...and Bartel was often saving us in the goal square under enormous pressure......The midfield were responsible for the pressure on our backline...some of the turnovers were comical...at times I felt almost sorry for our backs...

We were smashed in centre clearances when the game was on the line.......beaten in clearances around the ground...and they had 60 inside 50's...and 77 points from turnovers...you can't win with stats like that.

It's why last year a lot of defenders were in the best regularly despite high scores against. If we had a worse defence we'd leak far far more.

Today was no different, the defence stopped this from blowing out to a much more comfortable loss.

 

[BlightysCats]

When your midfield turnover the ball like we did, the backs are under enormous pressure...Enright had 77 , Mackie 66, Harry 73...and Bartel was often saving us in the goal square under enormous pressure......The midfield were responsible for the pressure on our backline...some of the turnovers were comical...at times I felt almost sorry for our backs...

We were smashed in centre clearances when the game was on the line.......beaten in clearances around the ground...and they had 60 inside 50's...and 77 points from turnovers...you can't win with stats like that.

Our mids did turn it over, but our backs did quite bit as well due to the pressure. You're obviously right though that if our mids won more clearances and worked harder then the opposition would have less inside 50s and less quality inside 50s. The main problem I see as I tried to express above is that our whole game style is set up to help the obvious speed and agility weaknesses of our defence.

 

[Bobby_]

He may not be a good defender.
But he's doing a bloody terrific job playing in defence.

he's been very solid but he has had a couple of poor ones and today was one of them.
He will get tested out like never before in the coming weeks as the team continues to suffer injury blows and fatigue sets in to younger bodies.
I remember James Kelly looking very steady for about half a season back in 2014 and he received a 1 year extension. By seasons end he was suspect. The following year, he went through the motions and was virtually playing on fumes while still putting in top performances every now and again.

 

[BlightysCats]

 

[Stig_90]

If Scott was the big problem, I don't think we would have had the start to the season that we did with a lot of new names in the squad.