Analysis 2016 List Management Discussion

[thylacine60]

No. That would be highly unlikely.

Highly unlikely is nothing.

 

[Azul]

Some posters look at that list and say we could shed 18 players this year. But being 'cutable' is not the same as 'will be cut'.

My mum still thinks I'm cute.

 

[Kramer1]

My mum still thinks I'm cute.

Your mum thinks I'm cute too.

 

[Salt Lake Cities]

Say the Dogs & Eagles were keen on Kreuze, they'll both end up with a pick around the 13/14 mark.

How would MK and our 2nd(23) for 13 and 31 go? Another 1st round pick and then 31 can help us get the GWS boys anyway.

 

[HARKER]

Agree with all of that, but I would just caution one thing (not aimed at you, Harks).

Some posters look at that list and say we could shed 18 players this year. But being 'cutable' is not the same as 'will be cut'.

I think there is a process

- First you target the ones that may get you some trade value
- Next you target the ones that you are sure will never make it
- And only then do you make it to the borderline/limited players.
- Some of these will be kept on the list for another year just by the sheer weight of numbers sent packing before them.

So maybe only 2/3 of that list get shown the door at the end of the year.

Everyone is 'cutable' if there is something better on the other side of the fence.

There are three de-listing windows available to clubs and for a very goods reason.

You first clear the players you have to clear or simply won't give another contract to, because they just haven't shown enough. They're easy.
After the trade period you have to balance up as to what is going to be available to you and how many FA's and then draftees you feel would be better than for what you have.

This is why I feel that someone like Sheehan should be placed on the Primary List, because there will likely be no-one better deep in the main draft or rookie draft.
What's the point of clearing Gowers & JGM, when they've shown enough to persevere with,just to grab another couple of rookies at around picks #50 odd?

 

[thylacine60]

My mum still thinks I'm cute.

She thinks her guide dog is too.

 

[Sector 7G]

Everyone is 'cutable' if there is something better on the other side of the fence.

There are three de-listing windows available to clubs and for a very goods reason.

You first clear the players you have to clear or simply won't give another contract to, because they just haven't shown enough. They're easy.
After the trade period you have to balance up as to what is going to be available to you and how many FA's and then draftees you feel would be better than for what you have.

This is why I feel that someone like Sheehan should be placed on the Primary List, because there will likely be no-one better deep in the main draft or rookie draft.
What's the point of clearing Gowers & JGM, when they've shown enough to persevere with,just to grab another couple of rookies at around picks #50 odd?

It all depends on how many GWS players we pick up in a bundle. If it doesn't go through we would just be filling our list with castoffs like Gorringe. There was a reason he was cut after 5 years of doing nothing.

 

[LordLucifer]

Say the Dogs & Eagles were keen on Kreuze, they'll both end up with a pick around the 13/14 mark.

How would MK and our 2nd(23) for 13 and 31 go? Another 1st round pick and then 31 can help us get the GWS boys anyway.

If there was interest in Kreuzer, no need to get too smart with the trade ideas.

A readymade senior midfielder and a second-round pick would be a very good deal for us, if they wanted to make it two mids (Jong & Webb) then we'd be crazy not to take it and run.

 

[Salt Lake Cities]

If there was interest in Kreuzer, no need to get too smart with the trade ideas.

A readymade senior midfielder and a second-round pick would be a very good deal for us, if they wanted to make it two mids (Jong & Webb) then we'd be crazy not to take it and run.

I was just trying to think of a way to get an extra first rounder mate, wouldn't be averse to your suggestion either.

It'd be pretty tough for me personally, I do love the big fella.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Say the Dogs & Eagles were keen on Kreuze, they'll both end up with a pick around the 13/14 mark.

How would MK and our 2nd(23) for 13 and 31 go? Another 1st round pick and then 31 can help us get the GWS boys anyway.

Values Kreuzer around 17-18, which feels a bit high as far as market value goes.

If we were dealing with WC though, I'd be offering up Clem as steak-knives. He's a WA boy, and it would save him from a likely delistment anyway. Of course, WC may not want him, but he was considered to be a talented player leading up to his draft so they may see an opportunity to try and turn him around.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

If there was interest in Kreuzer, no need to get too smart with the trade ideas.

A readymade senior midfielder and a second-round pick would be a very good deal for us, if they wanted to make it two mids (Jong & Webb) then we'd be crazy not to take it and run.

Not that Jong is a bad player, he's quite good. I just don't see why you'd prefer to trade for, who is all in all a depth midfielder, over a lte first round pick that has a chance to be a star?

If the option was

Jong & 2nd vs A 1st and 3rd (with a 2nd going back) i'd take the first every day.

I only ever see Jong as a 20-22nd guy chosen sort of player, and that type of player will do nothing but keep kids out of the side that have a chance to be better.

 

[Mezzoculo]

If a deal like that was offered, I reckon we'd take it especially if the rumour that we are talking to Longer at the Saints is true.

Nothing against Kreuzer at all, he bleeds for the club all the time. However, he could play finals straight away and be part of a successful team before he hangs up the boots, we may not be able to give him that.

For us, a young midfielder (could be Jong or one of the others, not fussed which) plus a second-rounder to do some trade deals with would be a good result going forward.

EDIT : Dogs do have some problems in the ruck department. They have young kid Goetz who is yet to play a game, Minson who will be 32yo next year & Campbell who is shouldering the load but is out injured now. The only relief they have is if they throw Boyd in there which is not a permanent option.

Goetz is heading for the chopping block and Minno seems cooked. Playing Roughy as #1 really detracts from his capacity to impact a game either back or forward. Not sure what the deal is with Campbell - injuries aside, he just can't cement himself in the ruck role. If they could land a proper ruckman and a tall forward (i.e. Cloke) this offseason then their 'window' would be wide open.

 

[viking12]

will probably get shot down fir this but any chance Blues will go after Michael Hibberd ?

 

[Mezzoculo]

Not that Jong is a bad player, he's quite good. I just don't see why you'd prefer to trade for, who is all in all a depth midfielder, over a lte first round pick that has a chance to be a star?

If the option was

Jong & 2nd vs A 1st and 3rd (with a 2nd going back) i'd take the first every day.

I only ever see Jong as a 20-22nd guy chosen sort of player, and that type of player will do nothing but keep kids out of the side that have a chance to be better.

I know that the club tried to prise Hrovat loose last offseason. Would take him over Jong (who is Kedge like in his abilities).

 

[Salt Lake Cities]

Values Kreuzer around 17-18, which feels a bit high as far as market value goes.

If we were dealing with WC though, I'd be offering up Clem as steak-knives. He's a WA boy, and it would save him from a likely delistment anyway. Of course, WC may not want him, but he was considered to be a talented player leading up to his draft so they may see an opportunity to try and turn him around.

Yeah mid 20's seems more like it. The fact these clubs are in what they'd perceive as a premiership window, that could hopefully help us a little.

 

[Blue__Balls]

will probably get shot down fir this but any chance Blues will go after Michael Hibberd ?

Pretty much locked in with Melbourne, by all accounts.

 

[Jeremias]

will probably get shot down fir this but any chance Blues will go after Michael Hibberd ?

Wouldn't have thought so.

Looks like he's certain to join Melbourne.

 

[LordLucifer]

Goetz is heading for the chopping block and Minno seems cooked. Playing Roughy as #1 really detracts from his capacity to impact a game either back or forward. Not sure what the deal is with Campbell - injuries aside, he just can't cement himself in the ruck role. If they could land a proper ruckman and a tall forward (i.e. Cloke) this offseason then their 'window' would be wide open.

Kreuzer & Casboult to the Dogs for Jong, Webb & Hrovat ??

 

[FlowersByIrene]

will probably get shot down fir this but any chance Blues will go after Michael Hibberd ?

Mind set on Melbourne isn't he? And older half backs/utilities aren't really what we need. Like him as a player though.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Kreuzer & Casboult to the Dogs for Jong, Webb & Hrovat ??

Trading two key position players for three depth midfielders? I'd rather take the draft picks.

Midifeld DEPTH is not what we need, we have Kerridge, Wright, Whiley and Graham. Whilst those three may be equal or better than each of those players none are what we need. Which is midfield guns. We need one to two gun midfielders, not three to five depth players.

 

[LordLucifer]

Trading two key position players for three depth midfielders? I'd rather take the draft picks.

Midifeld DEPTH is not what we need, we have Kerridge, Wright, Whiley and Graham. Whilst those three may be equal or better than each of those players none are what we need. Which is midfield guns. We need one to two gun midfielders, not three to five depth players.

Those three would walk into our senior team without fail, the coach just stated on the weekend that we are desperate for midfield depth. Whiley is going to be delisted, Graham is 50/50 to stay, Wright is a short-term option even though he is more of a small forward whilst Kerridge has his deficiencies (ie. terrible below his knees)

Three players who are proven at senior level versus two unknown draft picks ??

By the way, this draft is full of players who are small forward/mids, there are no standout midfield guns apart from the first three.

You are off your rocker !!!

 

[Azul]

Goetz is heading for the chopping block and Minno seems cooked. Playing Roughy as #1 really detracts from his capacity to impact a game either back or forward. Not sure what the deal is with Campbell - injuries aside, he just can't cement himself in the ruck role. If they could land a proper ruckman and a tall forward (i.e. Cloke) this offseason then their 'window' would be wide open.

Goetz already done. Liked the first year uni lifestyle a little too much.

 

[The Flying Doormat]

Kreuzer & Casboult to the Dogs for Jong, Webb & Hrovat ??

To lose Kreuzer and Casboult and claim some sort of trade vickery, we'll need to have a ready made replacement all tyed up.





Sorry.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Those three would walk into our senior team without fail, the coach just stated on the weekend that we are desperate for midfield depth. Whiley is going to be delisted, Graham is 50/50 to stay, Wright is a short-term option even though he is more of a small forward whilst Kerridge has his deficiencies (ie. terrible below his knees)

Three players who are proven at senior level versus two unknown draft picks ??

By the way, this draft is full of players who are small forward/mids, there are no standout midfield guns apart from the first three.

You are off your rocker !!!

You create midfield depth by filling up the top end of your midfield making the current depth you have.. more depth. If you just replace the depth part of your midfield, the midfield hasn't actually changed, it's just gotten slightly deeper.

We need one to two more elite midfielders. Depth is and will be handy, and we should also look at midfield depth elsewhere, but if we were trading Casboult and Kreuzer i'd want more than depth.

Also i'd love to see how all of Hrovat, Webb and Jong would "walk" into our best 22. One or two maybe, certainly not all three/

 

[F_therest]

I wasn't advocating trading him, just answering the question. I'm not sure where I stand on Kreuz to be honest.
His output isn't really getting me excited, but I'm aware that he's effectively splitting the ruck duties down the middle with Phillips.

He's been ok doesn't dominate in the ruck contests but rarely gets dominated...usually breaks even and contributes around the ground.

His contested marking has actually been pretty good this year.

He's taken quite a few grabs in the F50...unfortunately he's missed most of his shots.
He used to be a good shot for goal so if he tidies that up and can score close to a goal a game he's a useful ruckman.

Id say he can contribute as much as a McEvoy or Ceglar