Play Nice 2016 Presidential Election Part 4 - President-Elect Trump

[Todman]

Yep straight from the hip old Donnie. Tells it like it is
[/MEDIA]

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Why do you think that China holds all the cards? I thought that any fight involving China and US, the US would win.

Us doesnt have the stomach for the casualties this kind of conflict would inflict. Unlike iraq or afghanistan, this is a foe who could take out a carrier.

The only way to "beat" china would be a land invasion. Even if their navy was smashed they could still attack us vessels from the land and air, and the us has no want to invade a country as large as china. Home team always has the advantage, and with a massive chinese army and land mass, you cant just take qingdao and sit back and chill

 

[Jello_B]

Us doesnt have the stomach for the casualties this kind of conflict would inflict. Unlike iraq or afghanistan, this is a foe who could take out a carrier.

The only way to "beat" china would be a land invasion. Even if their navy was smashed they could still attack us vessels from the land and air, and the us has no want to invade a country as large as china. Home team always has the advantage, and with a massive chinese army and land mass, you cant just take qingdao and sit back and chill

And does China have the stomach to take down a US carrier?
TBH I'm not sure what we are debating, my only point was that China do not hold all the cards against the US. I suspect the countries will largely continue with business as usual.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

And does China have the stomach to take down a US carrier?
TBH I'm not sure what we are debating, my only point was that China do not hold all the cards against the US. I suspect the countries will largely continue with business as usual.

China has the stomach to lose lives to make a point

Forgotten tiananmen and tibet already?

 

[awaremind]

Chinese would probably be laughing at him right now

They'd outright mock him when he visits there, probably. China's all in on the humiliation game

Like they out right mocked obama?

 

[awaremind]

The only thing US really has over China is war, but they would be incredibly stupid to get to that. Economically China has still got the world by the balls. If it ever gets to a world war we're all stuffed anyway, but the US won't have the advantage, China and Russia bandy together and that's trouble

There's just no way US confronting China wouldn't end in a cluster****

Especially for us and Europe
I'm pretty sure the US is willing to fight china to the last Australian

 

[awaremind]

Look at the crap posted on Big Footy. Talk to people who think Clinton is 'worse' than Trump. There's a shedload of BS people think is true about Clinton. As I said before, I don't think it's 'fake news' as much as ridiculous spin.

The difference between the two is fake news is the Pedophile claims, or murder claims, or crime claims, or 'she's actually dead/really, really sick' claims, etc. But spin can be 'She took money from Saudis. Saudis also did 9/11.' or 'She voted for the Iraq War. She has Iraqi blood on her hands'. You can justify those statements as factual and of course people spin far worse than that to say '9/11 was an inside job' and 'Clinton is a war criminal'. It becomes non-factual, but when challenged they will reach for those initial facts while calling you a lefty corporate media war-monger elitist shill. Spin spin spin.

As for re-writing history, you may recall the softball interviews Trump got on talk shows which were criticised for not holding him to account for his extreme comments or impractical policies. You can also look at the fact the media rarely discussed just how impractical his policies were. They obviously thought he'd make a bad President. That was obvious to everyone and he directly went against Democratic principles which people had spent decades saying they believed in so consistency suggested they should be against his comments.

The actual 're-writing' going on is the claim that the election was all about the rust-belt. There's been far less comment about how Republicans still voted for Trump despite him being 'socialist' in his protectionism, or despite Republican leaders saying he wasn't fit to be Pres. Immediately they wanted to ignore the fact anti-immigration was the likely major cause, and instead they reached for an explanation friendlier to their narrative - that the poor had been left behind and were just playing up by voting for an outsider. That's much nicer spin than thinking 'maybe a lot of white people want to make America whiter'.

Maybe a very large part of it is the attitude of people like you, who have a holier than thou air and think you are smarter than you actually are, and you and the journalists and the politicians are just that far out of touch with reality, that you didn't even see it coming. Stuck in 1998

 

[Cooldude]

Like they out right mocked obama?

Why are you people's response to everything "but but OBAMA", it's kinda pathetic

And does China have the stomach to take down a US carrier?
TBH I'm not sure what we are debating, my only point was that China do not hold all the cards against the US. I suspect the countries will largely continue with business as usual.

Yes they will, people underestimate China's ingrained hatred for the west since the days of the unequal treaty.

Let's not forget the tactics they used to beat back the Japanese back in WW2, it was basically just throwing peasants at it until they throw enough to overwhelm them. Not caring about war casualties is how China works

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Why are you people's response to everything "but but OBAMA", it's kinda pathetic



Yes they will, people underestimate China's ingrained hatred for the west since the days of the unequal treaty.

Let's not forget the tactics they used to beat back the Japanese back in WW2, it was basically just throwing peasants at it until they throw enough to overwhelm them. Not caring about war casualties is how China works

Yep. Chinese have not forgotten that there WERE the worlds super power, and they had a massive trade surplus with the world until the brits became the biggest drug dealers in human history. thr way the west put them in their place hasnt been forgotten

 

[Betty Noir]

She was hammered relentlessly by the people, not the MSM. They spent about 10 minutes on the Podesta emails while giving Trump's pussygate 24/7 coverage. If you mean her email server, she was a presidential candidate under investigation by the FBI. So yeah, it's kind of in the public interest to hear about it every now and then.

Edit - and the reason he got away with a bit in the Primaries wasn't anything to do with the media - it was his charisma, & outsider status. The Republican machine did everything they could to stop him.

She had been cleared by the FBI... still to this day his clan are screaming lock her up...
She had been cleared. There was no case. Do you understand?
The media pursued a non event while letting things like vilifying Mexicans, women and Muslims go through. Pussy grabbing (gate is demeaning to gates), was all that marginally warmed the media, and that was because it came at a stage when the reality of their bias was becoming self evident. And they felt the need to correct the path. It was their guilt in being complicit in allowing trump to occur through inept reportage that started to become their ethical burden .. this is the reality, or you can believe trump.
You do realise that most of what comes out of his mouth is falsehood... or is this a point of contention? LOL

 

[Betty Noir]

Us doesnt have the stomach for the casualties this kind of conflict would inflict. Unlike iraq or afghanistan, this is a foe who could take out a carrier.

The only way to "beat" china would be a land invasion. Even if their navy was smashed they could still attack us vessels from the land and air, and the us has no want to invade a country as large as china. Home team always has the advantage, and with a massive chinese army and land mass, you cant just take qingdao and sit back and chill

A land invasion would fall. Clearly the only way to defeat China is with nuclear weapons. And this won't happen. Most nations don't enjoy the idea of war. Certainly the Chinese.
It is of critical importance that relations remain cordial. China has limited expansionist intentions. Nothing that can't be worked out through diplomacy.
Russia is different. It's domestic outlook is bleak. I was there recently... the people and the landscape is harsh and unforgiving. The Chinese are happier and possess a completely different outlook.
China is rising, in a good way, Russia is in descent.

 

[Betty Noir]

Why are you people's response to everything "but but OBAMA", it's kinda pathetic



Yes they will, people underestimate China's ingrained hatred for the west since the days of the unequal treaty.

Let's not forget the tactics they used to beat back the Japanese back in WW2, it was basically just throwing peasants at it until they throw enough to overwhelm them. Not caring about war casualties is how China works

The Chinese don't have an ingrained hatred of the west. They are pragmatists. I know China and the Chinese very well, having lived there for several years and speaking the language fluently.
The Chinese are easy to work with if you understand them. If you don't, then it can be difficult. If you honour the cultural sensitivities and demonstrate empathy it is easy to achieve mutual respect.
Obviously this will be very difficult for Trump...LOL

 

[madmug]

A land invasion would fall. Clearly the only way to defeat China is with nuclear weapons. And this won't happen. Most nations don't enjoy the idea of war. Certainly the Chinese.
It is of critical importance that relations remain cordial. China has limited expansionist intentions. Nothing that can't be worked out through diplomacy.
Russia is different. It's domestic outlook is bleak. I was there recently... the people and the landscape is harsh and unforgiving. The Chinese are happier and possess a completely different outlook.
China is rising, in a good way, Russia is in descent.

Yep.
China will assert itself in the area its sees as its region. Whether their is any conflict will depend on the US ego. Even the Philippines can see the reality of the situation & are showing an understanding if not just acceptance of the Chinese direction in the SCS.
Remember that China has huge internal problems. Economic growth & equality, pollution, corruption. Then trying to maintain one party dominance.
Trying to coral China will play into their nationalistic card. 'Fighting' the rise of China is totally counter productive.
Its a matter of working with it. The one party state will crumble in time if its left to its own devices.

 

[Lebbo73]

Yep.
China will assert itself in the area its sees as its region. Whether their is any conflict will depend on the US ego. Even the Philippines can see the reality of the situation & are showing an understanding if not just acceptance of the Chinese direction in the SCS.
Remember that China has huge internal problems. Economic growth & equality, pollution, corruption. Then trying to maintain one party dominance.
Trying to coral China will play into their nationalistic card. 'Fighting' the rise of China is totally counter productive.
Its a matter of working with it. The one party state will crumble in time if its left to its own devices.

I have no problem with what Trump has done. However, you do make a good point in your last paragraph. If China does suffer a massive economic downturn, there will be a major revolt from within by its own citizens.

 

[madmug]

I have no problem with what Trump has done. However, you do make a good point in your last paragraph. If China does suffer a massive economic downturn, there will be a major revolt from within by its own citizens.

Trump really hasnt done much yet. Wait until he gets real power. It could be very interesting, if not a bloody disaster altogether.

 

[Cooldude]

The Chinese don't have an ingrained hatred of the west. They are pragmatists. I know China and the Chinese very well, having lived there for several years and speaking the language fluently.
The Chinese are easy to work with if you understand them. If you don't, then it can be difficult. If you honour the cultural sensitivities and demonstrate empathy it is easy to achieve mutual respect.
Obviously this will be very difficult for Trump...LOL

I'm a Chinese, I know a thing or two. CCP drives the ultranationalist rhetoric all the time based on the humiliation they faced in the unequal treaty and opium war and so forth, it is not forgotten. You start a war there then you're basically galvanising billions of people

No one argued that China are expansionists, we're talking about US starting a war with China and them not having the advantage at all.

And in the next world war, if anyone is losing then they'll probably resort to nukes, that's the sorta crazy time we're in

 

[madmug]

I'm a Chinese, I know a thing or two. CCP drives the ultranationalist rhetoric all the time based on the humiliation they faced in the unequal treaty and opium war and so forth, it is not forgotten. You start a war there then you're basically galvanising billions of people

No one argued that China are expansionists, we're talking about US starting a war with China and them not having the advantage at all.

And in the next world war, if anyone is losing then they'll probably resort to nukes, that's the sorta crazy time we're in

Thats why we dont want cowboy politicians in the Whitehouse . We need adults with cool heads & a good knowledge base.
Its not a reality show they are running. It is reality. You cant rewind or redo a scene. You cant make decisions based on thick headed ideology. You need to have respect & understanding of situations. Thats what diplomacy is. Its the art of the possible. Not just showing off for the home audience.

 

[frenchfri12]

A trustworthy source from inside the RNC is reporting that they have called all 306 republican electors, and all but the one in Texas will cast their vote for Trump.

 

[Sol Invictus]

On the eve of America's "darkest" hour, one hooded man steps from the shadows to save America from it's fate!

It's JEB!

Slow and steady.

 

[yebiga]

She had been cleared by the FBI... still to this day his clan are screaming lock her up...
She had been cleared. There was no case. Do you understand?
The media pursued a non event while letting things like vilifying Mexicans, women and Muslims go through. Pussy grabbing (gate is demeaning to gates), was all that marginally warmed the media, and that was because it came at a stage when the reality of their bias was becoming self evident. And they felt the need to correct the path. It was their guilt in being complicit in allowing trump to occur through inept reportage that started to become their ethical burden .. this is the reality, or you can believe trump.
You do realise that most of what comes out of his mouth is falsehood... or is this a point of contention? LOL

The media did a hit job on Trump Like it's never hit anyone before.

The very poor opinion you have of him was formed by that same media. The reason you defend Hillary is because of the self same media.

Every day prior and every day since the election they continue to hammer him. Some of it is fair and much of it is just malicious and increasingly deranged.

What your really trying to say is that the medias' attempt to destroy Trump could have been more effective. I agree but to do that they would need to have a level of credibility they have long lost.

 

[awaremind]

I mean hey I just read an article that claimed because he misspelled unprecedented as unpresidented it means he no longer wants to be president! The media is really becoming a steaming pile of tripe.

 

[Crow54]

The media did a hit job on Trump Like it's never hit anyone before.

The very poor opinion you have of him was formed by that same media. The reason you defend Hillary is because of the self same media.

Every day prior and every day since the election they continue to hammer him. Some of it is fair and much of it is just malicious and increasingly deranged.

What your really trying to say is that the medias' attempt to destroy Trump could have been more effective. I agree but to do that they would need to have a level of credibility they have long lost.

My opinion of Trump has been formed by watching him, listening to the words coming out of his mouth, and reading his tweets. Nothing to do with "the media". The trouble is that he's done and said so many bizarre, stupid things his supporters have become used to it and just shrug it off. True brainwashing: they believe what he says and would probably drink the Kool Aid as he smilingly poured it for them.

 

[Crow54]

I mean hey I just read an article that claimed because he misspelled unprecedented as unpresidented it means he no longer wants to be president! The media is really becoming a steaming pile of tripe.

Please share the link. I'd love to read that article.

 

[Seeds]

she passed out & was dragged lifelessly into a van. That's not fake news, people could watch with their own eyes & draw their own conclusions. Great example of the spin you;re talking about too - suddenly a 20 degree day is "unbearably hot, no wonder she passed out in all that clothing" etc etc. Pedo is post election and not focused on Hilary herself, criminal is not a an unfair position given her handling of classified info, not sure what the murder claims are.



Yep. They are factual.



Lol, you wanted Fallon to play reporter & hold him to account on his comedy show? He really played hardball with Hilary huh. Re: policy - you think the media ignored that to help him? They thought their best bet in sinking him was to go all in on scandals. That's what usually works. This time it didn't.



The Rustbelt swing won him the election. That's a fact. Exactly why any of those individuals voted for him is just speculation.

Since when did passing out mean really sick? Most people have passed out at some points in their lives and most are perfectly healthy at the time. Running for an election is a brutal exercise of flights, rallies and speeches and tv interviews. Most people couldn't take it.

 

[Seeds]

The only thing US really has over China is war, but they would be incredibly stupid to get to that. Economically China has still got the world by the balls. If it ever gets to a world war we're all stuffed anyway, but the US won't have the advantage, China and Russia bandy together and that's trouble

There's just no way US confronting China wouldn't end in a cluster****

That's not true economically at all. China's financial system is minuscule compared to the US and its net ownership of Us assets is completely overplayed. It's not that big. And let's not even talk about that China's lending system is a giant house of cards.