Ultimate Glory Welcome to Hawthorn, Jaeger O'Meara

[Bardo State]

Were those odds before or after we traded out Lewis & Mitchell?

I know a few of the "experts" didn't tip us to make the 8 just before the season started.

That was before. After, we barely moved. In fact, our odds came in a bit over the trade period as a whole (5th favourite after Adelaide came in). Here's another source that shows the same for late October once the trade period was largely digested. 6th favourite in late November. 4th favourite by the start of February.

Again, anyone saying that Hawthorn were expected to fall as they did, even after losing Lewis and Mitchell are engaging in revisionist history.

 

[SA HAWK]

That was before. After, we barely moved. In fact, our odds came in a bit over the trade period as a whole (5th favourite after Adelaide came in). Here's another source that shows the same for late October once the trade period was largely digested. 6th favourite in late November. 4th favourite by the start of February.

Again, anyone saying that Hawthorn were expected to fall as they did, even after losing Lewis and Mitchell are engaging in revisionist history.

I thought we would finish about 10th-11th.

Plenty of people on bigfooty tipped us to slide.

 

[Bardo State]

I thought we would finish about 10th-11th.

Plenty of people on bigfooty tipped us to slide.

Firstly, you predicted 7th - 10th

7th - 10th is my prediction.

Secondly, whether you personally or someone you saw on the telly expected Hawthorn to slide is irrelevant to the point I made.

 

[SSSSSS]

Saints have our pick. It doesn't matter where we finish. It's beyond our control now.

If JOM can get fit he will be well worth it. If not then so be it. I don't begrudge Clarkson, Wright and co for going against the grain and dancing with the devil to try and rebuild on the fly.

 

[flinchfree]

............
I totally get the concept that there's an element of luck involved in making these decisions, that not all the variables are known beforehand, that gambles on guys like Burgoyne have paid off for the club, but really the lengths some of you are willing to go to excuse what right now has all the appearances of one of the worst trades in AFL history is downright scary. Is it really going to hurt to open the other eye occasionally?

After half way of the first season the fella has been at the club?
And not because he looks like crap, but because he hasn't reached full fitness for selection?
Has all the appearances of one of the worst early calls in Big Footy History.
I mean, I get wanting to go early. I get throwing your bowl of cornflakes off the table because we live in twitter world and kids who converse in lines of 5 words or less by text......but really?
You don't want to wait until after his second season to say, hmmm, not sure this looks to be heading like working out?
EVEN THEN you'd be going early, because the kid could help deliver us our 14th cup at age 32, perhaps in his last year like Crawf, and I'd call it an unmitigated success.

Still, I guess that's called Hawthorn problems. Having to massage supporters through relatively tiny periods lacking success and picking the rattle up from outside the cot as often as is needed.

 

[Mr Lizard]

The only winnable games are...

Every game is winnable. With Jags due to return, plus the rest, we're still a chance.

The bye before finals has changed the landscape, less imperative to finish top four now.

Go Hawks.

 

[tige19]

Anytime you invest in anything in life and the investment doesn't pay dividends as you like then you get concerned, when the investment doesn't make it out of 1st base at its infancy it's hard to imagine it maturing.

My old man and a few friends spent quite a bit of cash on a colt, they went to the sales with a trainer, picked up a beautifully bred Lohnro boy out of stakes winning mare however when being broken in he showed some sligh ligament damage. Trainer and staff said not a worry, 6 months in the paddock on a restricted training program with regular physio and we've got a bargain.

2 years later, dozens of break downs and 100s of thousand dollars later he is now a pet for one of the stakeholders kids.

Moral of the story, JOM isn't to different to a race horse and like those that invest in horses, a lot of the time they don't make the race track. No-one can deny the deal is looking extremely unfavourable at present, and the problem a large amount of supporters have is the total investment made by the club, that's what really puts this deal in the spot light.

Whether the liberal group of posters on this board like it or not the footy club brought the heat on them themselves. The one thing I am gathering from this thread is every single damn poster is desperate for Jags to have a successful career, that's not in question, what's in question and what is being dissected is the amount that we needed to give up to facilitate it.

 

[tige19]

I want to add, what is causing this heightened angst about the deal is the very real and worrisome feeling we are going to be a very poor football side for a long time. Absolutely people have faith in the history of the club being successful, but past achievements don't guarantee future success.

The draft is always the core of a successful team, we have forfeited that right for a while now (Burton the odd one out) so that is where I feel a lot of the concern and hysteria stems from.

 

[Coathanger]

Bottom line is even with a bionic knee, he's a turnover merchant.
And losing Mitchell & Lewis has broken the clubs heart, fans & players included.
From Round 1 there has been no spirit in this group.

And to rub it in, we'll watch the second best kid in the country go to St Kilda in Nov.

 

[Qlder_19]

The draft was the core before free agency arrived also the current CBA will have an affect
Those A graders decide to stay and the A- can shift easier now
We need to move with the future of player movement's which I have faith Graham Wright and his people are all over it like a cheap suit

 

[Hawk Dork]

And to rub it in, we'll watch the second best kid in the country go to St Kilda in Nov.

Kosi V2.0

 

[Crankyhawk]

Saints have our pick. It doesn't matter where we finish. It's beyond our control now.

If JOM can get fit he will be well worth it. If not then so be it. I don't begrudge Clarkson, Wright and co for going against the grain and dancing with the devil to try and rebuild on the fly.

We shall just rely on the saints to stuff up pick yet again.

Or lobby AFL for priority picks ++ for Brisbane to help out Fagan.

 

[daniel23]

we overpaid simple as that you can't sit back and say we didnt , i think even wrighty would admit to it to . They overated the list at the time which is fair enough considering the names that are still at the club and thinking the mid tier players would s fill the roles of the older boys, the club would have never thought we would slip this far . Im happy we have jaeger no doubt but the fact we have gone most of the season without him i would be more excited having probably pick 2-3 and an early second. The game moves so fast these days fyfe atm is a prime example he looks a shell of his former self so who knows what we are getting with jaeger , but the most concerning thing is his inability to recover after 2 and a half years out .

 

[ahhhhhh]

Bottom line is even with a bionic knee, he's a turnover merchant.
And losing Mitchell & Lewis has broken the clubs heart, fans & players included.
From Round 1 there has been no spirit in this group.

And to rub it in, we'll watch the second best kid in the country go to St Kilda in Nov.

Not a word of that is true.

Emotional negative dribble.

 

[Hawk Dork]

The draft is always the core of a successful team, we have forfeited that right for a while now (Burton the odd one out) so that is where I feel a lot of the concern and hysteria stems from.

#Cough Melbourne, StKilda, Carlton, GCS #Cough

Its going to be impossible to go to a draft and build a team that can compete with the Frankenchise/GWS today
The AFL has guaranteed they won that method for the next decade and have academy to keep it topped up
You need to approach this from a different angle to have a chance and it requires surgical precision and luck,through FA, trade,academy, FS,B grade rookie,regular rookie with the fingers crossed in the late picks of the draft and using the PSD when available.

 

[burger09]

Not a word of that is true.

Emotional negative dribble.

No. Hold on....

100% of players I've come across with bionic knees have, indeed, been 'turnover merchants'. FACT.

 

[smeltitdeltit]

We shall just rely on the saints to stuff up pick yet again.
.

And the same posters who are excercising twenty twenty hindsight now, will use that ability again to say that The Hawks would have picked up someone different who was a gun.

 

[Qlder_19]

As they say in the classics
You are unable to please all of the people all of the time

 

[Billyc]

Based on what we have seen/heard, I don't think anyone can be confident the O'Meara gamble will pay off. We all hope he comes good, hope he's an excellent long-term player for us and it was never about 2017. But I don't think anyone at the club would honestly say they're feeling good about it if he's coming up sore in the knee every time they increase his load to that expected of an AFL player. Plenty of players can overcome the odds but the odds aren't with him I reckon.

Need to move on from the draft pick trade. It's an expensive lesson but no guarantee we would have taken a decent player anyway. No shortage of early draft pick busts.

 

[Qlder_19]

It's like the old story
Tell someone a simple sentence and after it is passed onto 6 people it resembles nothing like it
Clarko stated
' it is taking the load fine its the recovery the next day is not happy with'
We have had only 7 months to work with Jaeger sometimes these things take extra time and we just need to give Jaeger extra encouragement at this point in time

 

[TallyHawk]

Enough of the chicken little bs, we under paid for Tom and may have over paid for Jag's. Saying we are in trouble because we traded out 1st rounders is bs, Jags and Tom are elite 22 & 23 y/o.

Now let's get constructive can anyone provide some insight on this training block, are they stripping size off him to ease the load on the knee?


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[badgrill]

#Cough Melbourne, StKilda, Carlton, GCS #Cough

Its going to be impossible to go to a draft and build a team that can compete with the Frankenchise/GWS today
The AFL has guaranteed they won that method for the next decade and have academy to keep it topped up
You need to approach this from a different angle to have a chance and it requires surgical precision and luck,through FA, trade,academy, FS,B grade rookie,regular rookie with the fingers crossed in the late picks of the draft and using the PSD when available.

"Frankenchise" [emoji23]

 

[Qlder_19]

Okay from my limited understanding and reading between the lines of what Clarko said
It's about getting the load correct to enable recovery so the next step can progress this may or may not have happened previously for a variety of these reasons may have added to where we are now
He had asolid boxing session last Thursday so imho if there was a major issue he would not have been able to get through it
Tallyhawk I think it will be an all round cocncept and taking into all factors some that gralin and abassi have mentioned in earlier posts
Lots of players that get injured have a intensive training block to make up for missing game fitness this is the extra Jaeger needs to do on top of getting the injury fixed

 

[VandoHawk]

I don't think anyone at the club was expecting us to collapse this hard this year. Internally there would have been confidence we could play finals with this list. They probably would've thought out first round pick would be between 9-18; certainly not Pick 2 as it currently stands.

But an extremely rocky start to the season - I think partially because of the lack of three previously vital structural players in Sammy, Lewis and Hill - combined with one of the longest injury lists we've had since 09 - left us in a position we didn't expect. Not only are our A-Grade players injured, but all our (already thin) midfield depth has been decimated.

So there's no doubt we overpaid on this one, and if Cochrane wasn't such a stupid individual Gold Coast would have a top selection. I bet they wouldn't have been so hard to deal with in hindsight.

We have overpaid on face value but a) it depends on what Jaegar delivers to the club and b) what the players taken for the picks we traded turn out to be. One exceptional finals series 4-5 years down the track that leads us to a Premiership immediately justifies that trade. Certainly did with Burgoyne, because I remember people complaining we gave up too much until 2013 (I know different injuries but I think it applies)

 

[Dangerousfield]

After the weekend result I wondered how you guys would be feeling about the O'Meara trade.

On the face of it, giving up 2, 20, 23 & 36 over two drafts looks to be well overs but I watched O'Meara play as an 18yo and he was special, you guys just need to give him time to come good.

Also look at the full picture, you gave up 2, 14, 20, 23 & 36 for Mitchell and O'Meara. You probably got shafted by GC with O'Meara but Swans gave you a bargain with Mitchell.

St.Kilda are the real bandits here, gave up pick 10 for picks 2, 23 & 26 - nice.

Not all doom & gloom, we got pinged four top picks for Tippettgate and right now things looking great. You probably need to keep all your better players and just rely on growth from within and getting lucky with late draft picks and rookies and injuries!