Brexit - The UK referendum on leaving the EU - Reneging, reshmeging!

[Generalissimo]

The issue would be that if the question was May's abomination vs remain. Remain would romp that in.

Probably. But I'm skeptical that there's any version of Brexit that wouldn't be a complete shambles.

Brexit is hurting both the EU and the UK, but the EU are clearly doing better out of it than the UK.

My guess is they'll allow an extension up to shortly before the EU elections, allow the UK to continue haemorrhaging intellectuals and businesses into the EU, then refuse any further extensions and let the UK crash out without a deal.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

Leave received more votes than any political party in UK history.

That is impressive... if you ignore it was a binary vote and there are eight parties in the UK Parliament.

 

[Jello_B]

Picture Queensland handing in notice today they're quitting Australia on 15th March 2021. Then picture the Queensland Government endlessly lying to Queenslanders about how good the deal they're negotiating (after already handing in notice) will be and lying that they have the stronger hand. Everything will change and also not change! Best of both worlds! Picture the Queensland Government failing to plan to replace what Australia does for it. Picture the Queensland Government needlessly insulting Australia in the media. Picture Gold Coast and Tweed Heads people being called dicks for not wanting to go through a border check to get to work and visit their family. Picture a level of ineptitude and obfuscation you didn't know was possible. Picture Queensland not even getting the deal through their own parliament to make it law, so there is no deal. Then on 15th March 2021 picture Queensland blaming Australia for the disaster they wholly brought on themselves.

Sure and great response. But if QLD wants to do that why wouldn’t I just go ok, if that’s what you want.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

Sure and great response. But if QLD wants to do that why wouldn’t I just go ok, if that’s what you want.

Australia does. Australia is diplomatic while regretful. Australia doesn't make any threats or fire a single bullet. But Australia will never put Australia's interests and its states' interests behind Queensland's. Tasmania is now more important than Queensland. Australia gently reminds Queensland of this when they ask for the unreasonable and impossible. It's not Australia's job to make Quexit a success.

 

[Jello_B]

Australia does. Australia is diplomatic while regretful. Australia doesn't make any threats or fire a single bullet. But Australia will never put Australia's interests and its states' interests behind Queensland's. Tasmania is now more important than Queensland. Australia gently reminds Queensland of this when they ask for the unreasonable and impossible. It's not Australia's job to make Quexit a success.

I agree with all of this. So you are happy with Brexit as long as Britain doesn’t have unreasonable or impossible demands of the EU?

 

[Bomberboyokay]

Brexit right from the start has been built on lies about achieving the impossible and everybody else giving them the unreasonable (all the stuff they like but none of the obligations). No I'm not happy about it at all. Britain will be a poorer, meaner and shitter country. It will take decades to get back what it had in 2016. English people were never repressed or life made worse by the EU. England has no enemies besides terrorists.

 

[Badesumofu]

Setting aside that Queensland couldn't leave the Federation without a referendum, it's a good way to look at it. Expecting the EU to put the UK's interests ahead of Ireland's in this negotiation was always ridiculous and unrealistic. Especially with the EU being a confederation it would get hard to hold the whole thing together if the smaller states started wondering who was going to get sold out next.

There is simply no possible Brexit that is not worse than just staying in the EU. The last 2 years should have made that abundantly clear which is why the people should be given a second chance to express their will now that they actually know what they'd be voting for.

 

[Admiral Byng]

The EU always was and still is a protectionist racket. They gang up together as a means of protecting themselves from the outside world. If you're in it you get looked after, but you've got to play by the rules.

Being part of the customs union or the common market means following the EU rules and standards, and being subject to directions from the EU courts. There is no solution to freedom from Brussels and remaining part of the customs union or the common market, because that is within the gift of the EU 27 who are not subject to the will of the British people or the House of Commons.

 

[NSWCROW]

 

[Jello_B]

Brexit right from the start has been built on lies about achieving the impossible and everybody else giving them the unreasonable (all the stuff they like but none of the obligations). No I'm not happy about it at all. Britain will be a poorer, meaner and shitter country. It will take decades to get back what it had in 2016. English people were never repressed or life made worse by the EU. England has no enemies besides terrorists.

Why do you assume that people didn’t consider everything that was presented to them, and that they made a balanced decision that best suited their opinions. The poorer, meaner and shitter country is unknown, possible I agree and certainly more so in the short term.
From what I have read people just felt like they were losing influence over decisons being made that were important to a lot of people. I guess they felt repressed.
I don’t think they have any enemies either. I think if they vote to leave than they should be able to leave.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

They can leave. Everybody is in 100% agreement the UK can leave the EU.

 

[CakeEater]

Deal struck down by the speaker this time.

Britain, what a laughing stock.

 

[baz_machine]

Deal struck down by the speaker this time.

Britain, what a laughing stock.

OOOORDDDERRRR, OOOORRDDDEEERRRR, Order!

 

[Pessimistic]

Broken democracy in the self proclaimed home of democracy

 

[ChappyUK]

Broken democracy in the self proclaimed home of democracy

How is all this undemocratic?

 

[Gough]

Broken democracy in the self proclaimed home of democracy

Broken country. If Britain was a horse you'd shoot it.

 

[ChappyUK]

Broken country. If Britain was a horse you'd shoot it.

Lol.

 

[Gough]

Lol.

Fair point, if England was a horse you'd shoot it, the rest of Britain still has something to offer the world.

 

[ChappyUK]

Fair point, if England was a horse you'd shoot it, the rest of Britain still has something to offer the world.

Even bigger lol.

 

[Crankyhawk]

The issue would be that if the question was May's abomination vs remain. Remain would romp that in.

Should be mays deal v no deal

 

[Total Power]

Probably. But I'm skeptical that there's any version of Brexit that wouldn't be a complete shambles.

Brexit is hurting both the EU and the UK, but the EU are clearly doing better out of it than the UK.

My guess is they'll allow an extension up to shortly before the EU elections, allow the UK to continue haemorrhaging intellectuals and businesses into the EU, then refuse any further extensions and let the UK crash out without a deal.

Pretty much this, well said.

 

[Pessimistic]

What is the final deal for people actually currently living in the UK or Europe without that countries passport?

 

[Gough]

Should be mays deal v no deal

There needs to be a remain option as well. People who voted to leave in the original referendum and who've seen the reality of Brexit, as a opposed to the fantasy version presented to them by the likes of Farage and Johnson may well have changed their minds. In my small circle of British friends, I know three who've flipped two of them live in May's electorate.

 

[Crankyhawk]

There needs to be a remain option as well. People who voted to leave in the original referendum and who've seen the reality of Brexit, as a opposed to the fantasy version presented to them by the likes of Farage and Johnson may well have changed their minds. In my small circle of British friends, I know three who've flipped two of them live in May's electorate.

Putting in remain allows the argument “invalidating the prior referendum “ though. Present to the public the two leave options then we can see what public want.

 

[Admiral Byng]

Putting in remain allows the argument “invalidating the prior referendum “ though. Present to the public the two leave options then we can see what public want.

It would arguably be more democratic if they included all three options and then made it preferential.