Society/Culture Christchurch Mosque mass shooting

[Maggie5]

Wasnt there a black church in the US a year or two ago that was shot up by a white extremist with 30+ fatalities? Where was all the worldwide grief for that? I find it very odd that attacks against Muslims get this much attention where church attacks happen and are glossed over.

Think you may have forgotten but in any case given that it happened in NZ a country that doesn't have a reputation for mass murders and that the shooter is an Australian may have hit home to more people than usual?

 

[its free real estate]

it estimates what proportion of a persons ancestors lived in what places at what times

So it can tell whether your ancestors transited through the Caribbean on the way to Australia?

Or it can tell that your ancestors were part Sub Saharan African, part English, and they produced children whose descendants ended up in Australia?

Weird that you dismiss the precision of pinpoint yet argue in favour of a vague precision yourself.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I think it received more coverage than you're remembering, however people are sadly more accustomed to mass shootings in the U.S.

IIRC this event has outstripped New Zealand's average annual murder rate in one day.

It received saturation worldwide coverage, then the world moved on.

 

[Present Not Past]

Wasnt there a black church in the US a year or two ago that was shot up by a white extremist with 30+ fatalities? Where was all the worldwide grief for that? I find it very odd that attacks against Muslims get this much attention where church attacks happen and are glossed over.

That's ****ed up.
What about Manchester, London and Paris? Or Las Vegas and Florida? And Colombine and need I go on ....

 

[Cooldude]

US mass shootings get glossed over easier because of how frequent they are and the US media also tends to move on and trivialise it.

The media in this part of the world however wouldn't let such a ****ed up thing go that easily

 

[quotemokc]

US mass shootings get glossed over easier because of how frequent they are and the US media also tends to move on and trivialise it.

The media in this part of the world however wouldn't let such a ****** up thing go that easily

Wanna bet?

 

[maryjames]

For this reason, I've never understood 'The Left's' identification with and defence of Muslim radicalism. Right and Left are nearly identical at their extremities. See Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Mussolini & Mao, i.e. all fascists.

Pol pot was created by CIA.

 

[Leeda]

Just knew it had to be somewhere like NZ who are quiet people and who are ostensibly aren't used to these things...

No I didn't know but the point is that these are things that happen when you least expect it..

So utterly sorry and utterly sad and can only say that I am sorry for it .. Kiwis aren't deserving of anything so horrible.
My love and attachment to your pain is with you and may you all be able to sort all this out in your heads and hearts..

 

[ShanDog]

You're not actually trying to talk sense or reason with ol' slithering snake oil are ya?

He has no point except RWNJ rubbish. All predicated on xenophobia & intolerance of people who want a peaceful existence.

He'd & a lot of that sort would be better off accepting the power of demographics. Either get some acceptance of reality & tolerance or suffer the brutal future that type are headed for.

Because that doesn't re-affirm one of the most significant concerns for libertarian/conservative types at all...

 

[Balls In]

I just saw an article on Perth Now entitled "Egghead Anning hits minor in the face"!! Turns out a 17 year old splatted an egg on his 70 year old head ie - assaulted an elderly senator - and he retaliated. Crazy times.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I just saw an article on Perth Now entitled "Egghead Anning hits minor in the face"!! Turns out a 17 year old splatted an egg on his 70 year old head ie - assaulted an elderly senator - and he retaliated. Crazy times.

It's all in the Anning thread.

 

[RupieDupie]

Firstly, it’s not actually anywhere near as precise as the word ‘pinpoint’ suggests. Secondly, it doesn’t pinpoint what ‘race’ people belonged to, it estimates what proportion of a persons ancestors lived in what places at what times. You’re the one putting the construction of ‘race’ onto that. It’s got nothing to do with the actual science.

People of recent “African” ancestry have the most genetic diversity, if a person were to split up people based on ancestry (genetic diversity) alone and they would find multiple races in “Africa” and only one race external to “Africa” including everyone else (depending on how many clusters they want to create = “k”).

Ergo, a randomly chosen Asian (ancestry) and European (ancestry) person can be more closely related in comparison to two randomly chosen people of African origin.

If people were inclined to go down this path they will create not one “black” race, but many “black” races, including black people within the “everyone external to Africa” race...

 

[Balls In]

It's all in the Anning thread.

Apologies but the world is arse up. That knuckledragging neanderthal prick has touched of something arguably worse than the butchery of these innocents.

 

[RupieDupie]

People of recent “African” ancestry have the most genetic diversity, if a person were to split up people based on ancestry (genetic diversity) alone and they would find multiple races in “Africa” and only one race external to Africa including everyone else (depending on how many clusters they want to create = “k”).

Ergo, a randomly chosen Asian and European person can be more closely related in comparison to two randomly chosen people of African origin.

If people were inclined to go down this path they will create not one black race, but many black races, including black people within the “everyone external to Africa” race...

It will make people who use a Munsell colour chart to evaluate the worth of a person have a much more difficult time, as they would have to admit (depending on their number of “k”) that swarthy people exist within their own race (that they constructed based on clustering DNA sequences) or alternatively exclude members with a lower K value (in CMYK) from their master race. This is too difficult a proposition for people like Anning, who prefer the phenotypic Herald Sun brown = bad system of classification.

Why are people trying to make Anning’s life difficult by creating a racial system based on genetic diversity?

 

[carnthemlions]

Yes.

Horseshoe Theory

It's not a real theory you twit. It's a meme for empty headed, idea-less know nothings like yourself.
Here's another theory for you-

Twitter is one of the most politically-oriented platforms there is on social media, and there's and abundance of examples on there from people labelling Candace Owens responsible because she was named as a troll in the manifesto to people continuing to push the "PewDiePie is a white nationalist" narrative because of the terrorist using the meme as he started the rampage. Every conservative pundit - particularly American - who has expressed their condolences has got replies trying to blame them and/or their political POV. This is the current climate from both sides, and it's shit.

There's already articles talking about this problem and the issues with media narratives:
https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/03/15/how-the-christchurch-shooter-played-the-worlds-media/

Yes, racists expressing insincere condolences are the real victims here. This is truly pathetic, you aren't even worthy of contempt.

This is pseudo-scientific rubbish that denies the differences that actually exist in human kind across the genetic landscape of the planet.

Otherwise there wouldn't be certain racial groups at higher risk of developing certain and specific medical conditions.

Denying the reality doesn't bring us closer. We are different and that doesn't reduce the value of any.

Please stop trying to get into debates about things you don't have the slightest understanding of. By calling the self evident truth that race is socially constructed 'pseudo-scientific rubbish' you're implying that race science is valid. You know phrenology (skull measurements), ideas that certain races are inferior/less intelligent/suited to servitude. Congrats, you've made it to the 19th century. So sophisticated.

It will make people who use a Munsell colour chart to evaluate the worth of a person have a much more difficult time, as they would have to admit (depending on their number of “k”) that swarthy people exist within their own race (that they constructed based on clustering DNA sequences) or alternatively exclude members with a lower K value (in CMYK) from their master race. This is too difficult a proposition for people like Anning, who prefer the phenotypic Herald Sun brown = bad.

Why are people trying to make Anning’s life difficult by creating a racial system based on genetic diversity?

Genetic diversity does not= race. 'Race' has been determined in many different ways eg. Irish and Germans in the 19th century US were not always considered to be properly 'white'.

Not just talking about the discourse on here - every social media political pundit is doing the same thing online. "This was horrible and our thoughts and prayers are with the victims' loved ones. (Also, **** anyone who doesn't vote the same as me)".

Haven't read everything here but I am pretty sure I spotted someone calling Trump a white nationalist and implying he has some responsibility here, which by extension is an attack on anyone who voted for him. Just a lazy 50% of the American population...

46% of the 58.1% of eligible voters who actually voted in 2016 voted for Trump so the conclusion here is that you have no idea what you're talking about.

For this reason, I've never understood 'The Left's' identification with and defence of Muslim radicalism. Right and Left are nearly identical at their extremities. See Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Mussolini & Mao, i.e. all fascists.

Left identification with Muslim radicalism? Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot were fascists? Words have no meaning and everything in history is the same, apparently. **** me.

 

[DrEvil_]

I just saw an article on Perth Now entitled "Egghead Anning hits minor in the face"!! Turns out a 17 year old splatted an egg on his 70 year old head ie - assaulted an elderly senator - and he retaliated. Crazy times.

Egging and pieing are time-honoured political expressions protected by freedom of speech.

 

[Taylor]

Even the study you cited basically said those stats aren't conclusive, yet you still cited it to suit your own view point, interesting

The entire study is basically damning on US's state of fire arm deaths

I wasn't arguing that it wasn't an issue, I was saying that their guns stop a huge number of gun violence and that survey backs that up.

All because I said that gun free zones have mass shootings, and that survey would back up the assertion that if guns were in those areas there could be less mass shootings.

 

[FredLeDeux]

It's not a real theory you twit. It's a meme for empty headed, idea-less know nothings like yourself.
Here's another theory for you-
View attachment 636273

Yes, racists expressing insincere condolences are the real victims here. This is truly pathetic, you aren't even worthy of contempt.

Please stop trying to get into debates about things you don't have the slightest understanding of. By calling the self evident truth that race is socially constructed 'pseudo-scientific rubbish' you're implying that race science is valid. You know phrenology (skull measurements), ideas that certain races are inferior/less intelligent/suited to servitude. Congrats, you've made it to the 19th century. So sophisticated.

Genetic diversity does not= race. 'Race' has been determined in many different ways eg. Irish and Germans in the 19th century US were not always considered to be properly 'white'.

46% of the 58.1% of eligible voters who actually voted in 2016 voted for Trump so the conclusion here is that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Left identification with Muslim radicalism? Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot were fascists? Words have no meaning and everything in history is the same, apparently. **** me.

Nice start, you're on a roll, don't stop now, plenty more flatheads in the barrel for you to shoot yet.

 

[Frank Bunn]

Regarding the sharing of the video - I'm not advocating that it should be OK at all. Was just throwing a thought-bubble out there regarding using the video as a disincentive. I think that unless you have a genuine reason to watch the video or read the manifesto (for critical commentary / journalism / study) then there's probably no need. I get the morbid curiosity thing and don't hold it against anyone, but it's really not worth giving in to that desire IMO.

I got the jist of the video from people's comments and had no curiosity to watch it.

I did scan through his manifesto though, curious to see how someone could justify doing such evil. He seems to be intelligent, fairly well read and sane (ie he doesn't show signs of being delusional). He does however display some spectacularly warped thinking.

Much of his arguments are based on race eg

- my blood is European
- racial replacement of Europeans is happening
- non European immigrants to 'our lands' including Australia and New Zealand are 'invaders'
- fertility rates are part of those racial differences and that the immigrants in our lands with high fertility must be forced out to ensure the existence of our race

For a several thousand word manifesto based on race and justifying killing masses of people you would think that he would spend some time on his underlying beliefs about race. But there's almost nothing.

Q: What makes you believe there are racial differences and that those differences matter?​

​

Research and data. Haplogroups, phenotypes and globalized testing. In time, the truth will be revealed.​

One of his other main beliefs is Eco-Fascism. And it's the same complete lack of rational justification.

I mostly agree with Sir Oswald Mosley’s views and consider myself an Eco-fascist by nature.​

​

The nation with the closest political and social values to my own is the People’s Republic of China.​

​

the environment is being destroyed by over population, we Europeans are one of the groups that are not over populating the world. The invaders are the ones over populating the world. Kill the invaders, kill the overpopulation and by doing so save the environment.​

I wonder if the real danger signs are when people jump around extreme ideologies and are equally convinced in their beliefs for each one?

when I was young I was a communist, then an anarchist and finally a libertarian before coming to be an eco-fascist.​

 

[Taylor]

Please stop trying to get into debates about things you don't have the slightest understanding of. By calling the self evident truth that race is socially constructed 'pseudo-scientific rubbish' you're implying that race science is valid. You know phrenology (skull measurements), ideas that certain races are inferior/less intelligent/suited to servitude. Congrats, you've made it to the 19th century. So sophisticated.

I was never making that point.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I wasn't arguing that it wasn't an issue, I was saying that their guns stop a huge number of gun violence and that survey backs that up.

All because I said that gun free zones have mass shootings, and that survey would back up the assertion that if guns were in those areas there could be less mass shootings.

Nope, first of all that's not what you said; secondly nowhere does the study say that guns stop any (never mind a "huge" amount of) gun violence; all it says is that an unspecified number of people who use guns to defend themselves against criminals have a lower (unspecified) rate of injury than other victims.

 

[Taylor]

Nope, first of all that's not what you said, and secondly all that study says is that an unspecified number of people who use guns to defend themselves against criminals have a lower rate of injury than other victims.

I said the mass shootings happen a lot in the gun free zones and that the study noted 30,000 events of someone with a gun preventing gun violence, but the study had a much higher number.

 

[DrEvil_]

Wanna bet?

NZ is going to implement strict gun laws.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I said the mass shootings happen a lot in the gun free zones and that the study noted 30,000 events of someone with a gun preventing gun violence, but the study had a much higher number.

No, it had absolutely no number at all for "events of someone with a gun preventing gun violence", and didn't even address the issue.

 

[quotemokc]

NZ is going to implement strict gun laws.

Sort of sounds like you think its ok for media to play a hand in dictating policy.