How Crow Can You Go? An Adelaide Football Club Saga

[Arr0w]

Currently pick #1 for pick #15 and pick #19. It's a terrible trade no matter how you spin it, and we'd definitely be wanting to see it improve.

Irrespective of how good Stocker ends up, there's better ways to have obtained pick 19 than the above option, should that be how it pans out.

Nothing has happened as yet, sit back and enjoy the ride

 

[Jeremias]

Currently pick #1 for pick #15 and pick #19. It's a terrible trade no matter how you spin it, and we'd definitely be wanting to see it improve.

Irrespective of how good Stocker ends up, there's better ways to have obtained pick 19 than the above option, should that be how it pans out.

Another keen to judge the trade whilst ignoring a significant part of it.

Very odd way to operate really.

 

[Arr0w]

That's my take on it, I could still see Carlton finishing anywhere from 18th, to maybe 13th though that doesn't take anything away from the improvement shown. It's definitely there from what I've seen, it's just the side needs to remain a bit more composed and learn to win some of these close ones. Regardless the gap has closed and the only reason I'd still see them maybe finishing last is purely due to tiring bodies or lack of depth if you get some more injuries, throw in failing to win some of the ones probably should have early season. Similar I could see you winning a few games yet and going past some of the other struggling sides if the side doesn't drop off as the season goes on.

**When I say last I'm not saying thats the most likely option, I don't really have any strong feelings where exactly beyond that loose range. Too many variables to say with any confidence.

Stated before the season, that we would be bottom 6, while predicting Crows were a bottom half of the final 8 contender

While many of your supporters predicted(generally through hope, which is understandable) that we were a definite bottom 2 side, still a fair bit to play out, especially is we remain competitive, unlike the North game.

Crows also have an interesting period coming up

 

[thylacine60]

That's my take on it, I could still see Carlton finishing anywhere from 18th, to maybe 13th though that doesn't take anything away from the improvement shown. It's definitely there from what I've seen, it's just the side needs to remain a bit more composed and learn to win some of these close ones. Regardless the gap has closed and the only reason I'd still see them maybe finishing last is purely due to tiring bodies or lack of depth if you get some more injuries, throw in failing to win some of the ones probably should have early season. Similar I could see you winning a few games yet and going past some of the other struggling sides if the side doesn't drop off as the season goes on.

**When I say last I'm not saying thats the most likely option, I don't really have any strong feelings where exactly beyond that loose range. Too many variables to say with any confidence.

click on this thread of lunacy expecting madness and happen to land on this post of calm and insight - has anarchy evolved?

 

[Eiffel 65]

I was at the game yesterday and it was not ordinary umpiring it was pathetic, I didnt know the numbers until today watching the sunday footy show where they said it was 24-8 and bloody well felt like it. forget about the end result but if the umpiring was good when you guys were leading in the last quarter by 10 carlton would have won and deserved to win the game.

I dont usually say it makes the difference but this week it did - Blooz were robbed

You take the good with the bad with free kicks. Can't go your way all the time.

What I thought was strange was that in the last quarter, Jack Crisp received a 50m penalty, ran down the ground, played on, kicked the ball to the goal square and it rolled through. However, the ball was touched by the Collingwood player at the top of the goal square and this was picked up on the replay prior to the ball being bounced in the centre.

Umpires call the game as they see it. That's fine, I have no issue there. But I would like an explanation as to why this review was overlooked. That goal was the catalyst that changed the momentum of the game.

 

[Eiffel 65]

Stated before the season, that we would be bottom 6, while predicting Crows were a bottom half of the final 8 contender

While many of your supporters predicted(generally through hope, which is understandable) that we were a definite bottom 2 side, still a fair bit to play out, especially is we remain competitive, unlike the North game.

Crows also have an interesting period coming up

After GWS, we've got a run of winnable games.

Our results leading into the bye round will determine where we finish.

 

[Jeremias]

After GWS, we've got a run of winnable games.

Don't know why people continue with this line of thinking.

Play as we did yesterday, every game is winnable - even GWS.

 

[SE_Blue]

Media will be obsessed with picking a winner and a loser, but it looks like a win-win, especially if we can trade out Adelaide's pick for a good player.

 

[Bluechip66]

Until people realise the end game...meaning the actual player / players u get rather than some number allocated to a pick ..it means nothing.
Eg. Maybe crows pick turns into a watts (#1), schache (#2)
ours turns into a Chris grant (#105), hird (#79), fevola (#38), Robbie Gray (#55)
You never know...& we got Stocker already.

 

[Sector 7G]

The idea of needing high draft picks is flawed.

Geelong have rebuilt without getting high picks. We need to worry more about getting the picks we have right.

 

[jezzajay]

I have no doubt Adelaide will be happy with the trade. Chances are they will get a top player in this years draft.
But i don't care - i see this trade being win/win, which is how trades ultimately should be.

Adelaide have never had a top 5 pick and will certainly get one, maybe even pick 1. It's a big thing for them.

We have enough top draft picks on our list, so adding another is less valuable to us than it is for them. We saw a bargain in Stocker and went for it, while we'll likely try to trade Adelaide's first this year. If not, still a good chance of drafting a good kid.

The media might draw attention to this trade and say we lost, Adelaide fans might poke fun at us for it as well, but ultimately i don't care since i agree with the clubs decision at the time and still think it sets us up for our rise up the ladder.

You nailed it.

 

[CFC18]

Until people realise the end game...meaning the actual player / players u get rather than some number allocated to a pick ..it means nothing.
Eg. Maybe crows pick turns into a watts (#1), schache (#2)
ours turns into a Chris grant (#105), hird (#79), fevola (#38), Robbie Gray (#55)
You never know...& we got Stocker already.

Trading pick #1 for pick #79 isn't a good trade just because the players turn out to be Watts and Hird.

Teams have few commodities at their disposal, so failing to maximise your return is simply poor management.

 

[1970crow]

More likey pick 1 for 19 and 12

I think you guys will close the gap on Saints and GC as the year progresses. Plus the Roos are a genuine chance to end up beneath you. I’d be thrilled with 1, but I won’t be shocked if it’s 4. You just seem to be heading in the right direction despite giving a bit of a head start to your immediate competitors.

Currently pick #1 for pick #15 and pick #19. It's a terrible trade no matter how you spin it, and we'd definitely be wanting to see it improve.

Irrespective of how good Stocker ends up, there's better ways to have obtained pick 19 than the above option, should that be how it pans out.

That ignores the reality that Stocker was rated much higher than 19. If he was rated at 19 SOS wouldn’t have considered doing a deal. It’s the player that you traded for, not to get into the first part of the second round.

 

[F_therest]

Media will be obsessed with picking a winner and a loser, but it looks like a win-win, especially if we can trade out Adelaide's pick for a good player.

Yep and even if in isolation we do slightly 'lose' the trade, so what?
As long as in the big picture, it's helped us rise up the ladder that's all that matters. And i'm sure it will.

Fk no club is perfect anyway...before Richmond won a premiership they wasted a few first round picks on Lennon and Ellis. They also gave us 19 for Yarran. I don't think anyone really cares though since they still won a premiership and are a top team.

Hawks made some first round draft pick blunders before their 2008 premiership. Like Thorp over Selwood. This in isolation is the one of the biggest draft blunders of all time...but no one cares because Hawks became a good team anyway.

Dogs were in tatters when Griffen wanted out and they gave up him and pick 6 for Boyd.

Point is, media and fans will give the 'loser' of the trade a lot of flak, but we know better than anyone that high draft picks don't equal success.

 

[F_therest]

I think you guys will close the gap on Saints and GC as the year progresses. Plus the Roos are a genuine chance to end up beneath you. I’d be thrilled with 1, but I won’t be shocked if it’s 4. You just seem to be heading in the right direction despite giving a bit of a head start to your immediate competitors.


That ignores the reality that Stocker was rated much higher than 19. If he was rated at 19 SOS wouldn’t have considered doing a deal. It’s the player that you traded for, not to get into the first part of the second round.

Pretty funny seeing a Crows fan defending the trade with that argument to a Carlton fan instead of the other way around lol.

What's done is done. Internally we probably didn't expect to be handing over a top 3 pick to you at the time, but if that eventuates due to a bit of bad luck and us not quite being good enough, then so be it. The decision at the time was still a sound and logical one.

 

[1970crow]

Pretty funny seeing a Crows fan defending the trade with that argument to a Carlton fan instead of the other way around lol.

What's done is done. Internally we probably didn't expect to be handing over a top 3 pick to you at the time, but if that eventuates due to a bit of bad luck and us not quite being good enough, then so be it. The decision at the time was still a sound and logical one.

Agree, future trading is always going to include an element of risk. I think both clubs made the right call. If Stocker fails it’s a talent ID issue not a bad trade issue. Similarly if we pick a spud with a top 4 pick it’s not on Reid. He doesn’t grade talent.

 

[Go the Guts]

Until people realise the end game...meaning the actual player / players u get rather than some number allocated to a pick ..it means nothing.
Eg. Maybe crows pick turns into a watts (#1), schache (#2)
ours turns into a Chris grant (#105), hird (#79), fevola (#38), Robbie Gray (#55)
You never know...& we got Stocker already.

*Sloane - pick 44

 

[Michael Jezz]

The idea of needing high draft picks is flawed.

Geelong have rebuilt without getting high picks. We need to worry more about getting the picks we have right.

You don't need high draft picks when you start with father/sons like Hawkins, Ablett and existing players like selwood and Dangerfield puts up his hand to go to your club. Carlton didn't need high draft picks in 92 when it rebuilt off a base of kernahan, bradley, silvagni and snared williams

 

[Dadda Dave]

*Sloane - pick 44

You do know you will be stoned to death when you go back to your board posting sensible posts like that here don't you..

 

[Arr0w]

Trading pick #1 for pick #79 isn't a good trade just because the players turn out to be Watts and Hird.

Teams have few commodities at their disposal, so failing to maximise your return is simply poor management.

Poor management is not being able to identify talent

 

[jooce8891]

the *? what is with all the of the sensible and reasonable discussion that is going on...

 

[CFC18]

Poor management is not being able to identify talent

Sure but they are not mutually exclusive.

 

[thylacine60]

the ****? what is with all the of the sensible and reasonable discussion that is going on...

people might think it's funny...........it's not funny..........

 

[Arr0w]

Sure but they are not mutually exclusive.

They are exclusive

Trading for players that have a formline, is dramatically easier, than picking young talent that will mature better than their cohorts

Picks have nothing to do with spotting the right talent. History is littered with players being selected late that turn out being better than the original top 10

 

[CFC18]

Picks have nothing to do with spotting the right talent.

Yes, that's the point I made.