Analysis The Rebuilds of Carlton and Fremantle and their future prospects

[VolgaBoatman]

Cripps, McKay, Walsh, Weitering and Curnow are good, you're right. You carry on like we drop off a cliff though. You know who else is good?

Hewett, Cerra, Kennedy, Saad, Docherty, Williams, Pittonet.

Salary dumps were 6 years ago now, you seriously cannot keep holding on to that argument. SOS hasn't been list manager for 2 years.

Interesting comment about a strong group of 30. Our AFL team is 5-2 and VFL is 5-1 & 3rd on the ladder. What more indication do you need that we're rounding out the 22?

We no longer have guys like Murphy, Casboult, Betts running around; we're seeing less of players like Newnes, Plowman, Setterfield and more young talent like Carroll, Honey and Durdin. The sooner guys like the latter are a permanent fixture the better the list will appear and the results will follow.

Cerra wasn't paid overs for either, I believe Freo might have offered more for him to stay. So he obviously saw his life back home plus a team that is on a reasonable trajectory as a good option. Was probably a win-win in the end as Freo ended up with an early draft pick - which we used for Erasmus who looks good, plus got in Brodie for cover who we might have taken otherwise. Also ended up not paying too much to keep Cerra.

Liking both rebuilds - I hope they both continue on the path for this year, and contend, would make the finals series more interesting.

 

[chunkylover53]

This is exactly right. But Carlton's problem as I see it is threefold:
1. I don't think you have the young talent on your list;
2. I don't think you have the ability to develop that young talent into a premiership contending team;
3. If the talent is developed, salary cap pressure will result before the team can get itself into premiership contention.

1. Fair enough you wouldn't look at our list very closely - I certainly don't know the ins and outs of the other 17 other competitions yoof.

2. Fair enough, we have been s**t developers in the past. Our VFL program looks way better this year though.

3. Always find it hilarious when Bigfooty posters, or footy fans in general pretend to know about a teams salary cap. There's an entire List Management team probably paid $1-2m in total to look after this full time, yet someone who's read a few HS articles think they are in a position to comment and predict. I'm sure the people in charge are aware there's a salary cap and have planned accordingly.

 

[chunkylover53]

Cerra wasn't paid overs for either, I believe Freo might have offered more for him to stay. So he obviously saw his life back home plus a team that is on a reasonable trajectory as a good option. Was probably a win-win in the end as Freo ended up with an early draft pick - which we used for Erasmus who looks good, plus got in Brodie for cover who we might have taken otherwise. Also ended up not paying too much to keep Cerra.

Liking both rebuilds - I hope they both continue on the path for this year, and contend, would make the finals series more interesting.

Yeah we gave up a total of 0 picks for Martin and apparently that's overs, so doesn't surprise me he's included Cerra as overs too.

Was a trade done by both clubs in good faith and healthy negotiation which usually results in win-win.

 

[Fadge]

3. Always find it hilarious when Bigfooty posters, or footy fans in general pretend to know about a teams salary cap. There's an entire List Management team probably paid $1-2m in total to look after this full time, yet someone who's read a few HS articles think they are in a position to comment and predict. I'm sure the people in charge are aware there's a salary cap and have planned accordingly.

Yes, you would like to think so, wouldn't you...

 

[chunkylover53]

Yes, you would like to think so, wouldn't you...

Unless.....

'In a bind': Pies admit salary cap pressure led to 'painful' fire sale

Collingwood was forced to offload four players to rival clubs during last week's Trade Period

www.afl.com.au

 

[BarbieITFC]

Yeah we gave up a total of 0 picks for Martin and apparently that's overs, so doesn't surprise me he's included Cerra as overs too.

Was a trade done by both clubs in good faith and healthy negotiation which usually results in win-win.

I think both sets of fans can hand on heart say that we were winners in the 2021 trade period - although Gold Coast certainly helped Freo's hand.

Sure, it hurt losing Cerra at the time, but once the dust has settled both sets of fans realise they got a fair price (he's a damn fine player but he's not a generational talent) and in the end we managed to cover his loss.

Given our trading ended up netting us Amiss, Johnson and Brodie - we may in 3-4 years time be seen as the club that won the 2021 trade period overall - very much counter to the narrative coming into the season that the loss of Cerra would see us fall back 2-3 spots on the ladder.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

No backtracking.

I backed them for the spoon because they were well over the odds.

The bookies must love people like you.

There are so many great charities out there if you don’t want to hold onto your hard earned.

 

[LordLucifer]

We no longer have guys like Murphy, Casboult, Betts running around; we're seeing less of players like Newnes, Plowman, Setterfield and more young talent like Carroll, Honey and Durdin. The sooner guys like the latter are a permanent fixture the better the list will appear and the results will follow.

Those three are always the first picked if fit which is a big part of the problem, yes, the young guys should be played in preference to those duds but that is just not happening.

 

[chunkylover53]

Those three are always the first picked if fit which is a big part of the problem, yes, the young guys should be played in preference to those duds but that is just not happening.

Because we are dearth of any depth in their positions.

Newnes started in the VFL until injuries hit and LOB's form dropped. Ditto Plowman until McGovern was injured. Setterfield dropped this week after being given plenty of chances.

Nobody is immediately abandoned, players like these will be phased out of the best 22.

 

[_Mike_]

You predicted we would finish anywhere between 9th and 18th, then stated you were backing us for the spoon

i backed Essendon to finish ahead of Carlton this year, based on last years form, which I’m clearly wrong, doesn’t imply I’m a Carlton hater.

Posters make predictions all the time, they get some right, some wrong. The main board doesnt provide sanctuary from criticism for any club, it’s fair game.

 

[Arr0w]

i backed Essendon to finish ahead of Carlton this year, based on last years form, which I’m clearly wrong, doesn’t imply I’m a Carlton hater.

Posters make predictions all the time, they get some right, some wrong. The main board doesnt provide sanctuary from criticism for any club, it’s fair game.

Difference with making a prediction based on a balanced view or analysis and that of a poster that has a history of trolling Carlton threads

 

[Jeremias]

i backed Essendon to finish ahead of Carlton this year, based on last years form, which I’m clearly wrong, doesn’t imply I’m a Carlton hater.

Posters make predictions all the time, they get some right, some wrong. The main board doesnt provide sanctuary from criticism for any club, it’s fair game.

Comparing yourself to Fadge?

Surprised to read you hold yourself in such low esteem.

We think you're better than that, even if you don't.

 

[Thrawn]

Gee what a surprise, who would've thought too much Fudge means a lot of s**t?

 

[Fadge]

i backed Essendon to finish ahead of Carlton this year, based on last years form, which I’m clearly wrong, doesn’t imply I’m a Carlton hater.

Posters make predictions all the time, they get some right, some wrong. The main board doesnt provide sanctuary from criticism for any club, it’s fair game.

What a breath of fresh air you are, Mike

Unfortunately, that hasn't historically been the case on this board...

 

[Robertio]

What a breath of fresh air you are, Mike

Unfortunately, that hasn't historically been the case on this board...

Have a look at the ladder mate and then have a look at who played for us on the weekend and then get back and tell me how many Carlton players taken after pick 27 played.

 

[Fadge]

Have a look at the ladder mate and then have a look at who played for us on the weekend and then get back and tell me how many Carlton players taken after pick 27 played.

I took your advice and looked at the ladder, and couldn't help but notice you've only played one team who are currently in the top 8 - Fremantle - and were comprehensively beaten by them.

As I said, the next 4 to 6 weeks will be very interesting for Carlton...

 

[Robertio]

I took your advice and looked at the ladder, and couldn't help but notice you've only played one team who are currently in the top 8 - Fremantle - and were comprehensively beaten by them.

As I said, the next 4 to 6 weeks will be very interesting for Carlton...

Five players taken after pick 27 who are developing very nicely, you have been right in some of the things you say but you've been wrong on plenty.

 

[Fadge]

Five players taken after pick 27 who are developing very nicely, you have been right in some of the things you say but you've been wrong on plenty.

FIVE players from 22 taken after pick 27 played on the weekend, and you are using that to say I'm wrong about Carlton's ability to develop players taken late in the draft?

 

[Robertio]

FIVE players from 22 taken after pick 27 played on the weekend, and you are using that to say I'm wrong about Carlton's ability to develop players taken late in the draft?

In the past you may have been right but 5 out of 22 who are playing decent footy means in 2022 you are wrong.

 

[Fadge]

In the past you may have been right but 5 out of 22 who are playing decent footy means in 2022 you are wrong.

Just as a comparison, of the 22 players from my own team who took to the field on the weekend, 14 came from later than pick #27 in the draft...

 

[Robertio]

Just as a comparison, of the 22 players from my own team who took to the field on the weekend, 14 came from later than pick #27 in the draft...

Don't give a stuff about your team, you made the statement yesterday that Carlton can't develop players not taken in the first round, 5-22 proves you wrong.

 

[Fadge]

Don't give a stuff about your team, you made the statement yesterday that Carlton can't develop players not taken in the first round, 5-22 proves you wrong.

I would go as far as predicting that 5 from 22 would be the lowest ratio of any team fielded on the weekend.

 

[Robertio]

I would go as far as predicting that 5 from 22 would be the lowest ratio of any team fielded on the weekend.

Mate leave the goal posts where they are.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

Five players taken after pick 27 who are developing very nicely, you have been right in some of the things you say but you've been wrong on plenty.

West Coast had about 20 who didn’t even go through the draft when they beat the Pies a few weeks ago.

 

[Jeremias]

Just as a comparison, of the 22 players from my own team who took to the field on the weekend, 14 came from later than pick #27 in the draft...

Whilst I am amazed you have finally - finally - posted something about Collingwood, this is not the thread for it.

Piss off troll.