List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade & FA 2024

[NMBB]

Ned Guy was in charge of trading out Treloar and Graham Wright was in charge of trading out Grundy.

And Eddie recruited Ned Guy and was in charge of him (poor Ned)

 

[Gone Critical]

Ned Guy was in charge of trading out Treloar and Graham Wright was in charge of trading out Grundy.

Do you really believe Ned was in charge of any big decisions. He may have been charged with implementing them but Walsh, Dekka, Bucks and Eddie would have been the final decision makers ticking off what happenend.

 

[Apex36]

If this is our trade page 6 months after a flag, and 18 after a prelim, I wonder what the saints page is like

Calmer than ours, because after so long with no success they’ve been forced to just accept mediocrity.

 

[sr36]

We know Dekka is the problem and we get pushed around with trades either paying too much or accepting too little.

Dekka has explained how we do drafting multiple times. It's not the wizened old pro with an eagle eye making the calls.

We score blokes against criteria. Then rank them based on those scores. Then have philosophy of drafting best available.

Our criteria has clearly changed to valuing pace more highly since the new footy department came in.

If we're not getting enough talls it's the criteria and the best available policy. Not just one bloke at the top of recruiting.

The blokes survived 3 different footy departments with all other roles changing multiple times. He's assembled two different lists that have won flags, I don't think I'm part of the "we" that know that Dekka is a problem.

 

[sam_e]

Collingwood recruiting history of talls since 2001

• Tall = anyone recruited at or > 192 cms
• HIT ie. success = anyone who played 50 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 50 games elsewhere). The definition of a HIT is arguably set at reasonably LOW bar of circa 2 seasons of AFL.
• +HIT ie. real success = anyone who played 100 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 100 games elsewhere).

Observations:

• 213 players (total) brought in to the club 2001-23
• Of those, 67 (31%) have been TALL (192cm or >)
• Of the 67, 58 recruited 2001-19 and 9 recruited since 2020 (for latter cohort, too early to determine HIT or FAIL)
• Of the 67 TALLS, 19 (28%) have been National Draft (ND) selections; 36 (54%) rookie /int'l rooks /MSD /SSP etc; and 12 (18%) traded in (trade/UFA)
  • Of the 19 Tall ND selections, 12 came before 2008
  • In last 10-yrs, only 5 Talls came from ND selections, with 2 of those Father-Sons (Moore, Kelly)
• Of the 58 TALLS (up to 2019), 19 (33%) have been HITS (ie. played >50 games)
• Of the 58 TALLS, (up to 2019), 14 (24%) have been +HITS (ie. played >100 games)
• Of the 14 TALL +HITS (ie. played >100 games), 8 (71%) were ND selections (Reid, Brown, Grundy, Moore, Witts, Goldsack, Dawes, Cloke); 2 were traded in (J.Ceglar, D.Cameron ..only played 74 games but i'm projecting 100+) and 4 were rookies (Miho, Cox, Keeffe, Maxwell)

		Ttl Games /Coll games	HIT/ FAIL	age	hght	wght	origin club	goals	votes	awards
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 27	Tom Davidson	1	FAIL	18yr	192cm	87kg	Geelong U18	0​	0​
National Draft pick 72	Tristen Walker	28	FAIL	17yr	195cm	100kg	Claremont	8​	0​
Pre-Season Draft pick 4	Scott Cummings	5	FAIL	27yr	194cm	105kg	Swan Districts	6​	0​
Rookie	James Podsiadly	104 (0)	FAIL	20yr	193cm	100kg	Geelong (VFL)	195​	23​	Prem '11
Rookie	Justin Crow	1	FAIL	18yr	196cm	92kg	Oakleigh U18	0	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)
National Draft (F/S)	Cameron Cloke	58 (21)	FAIL	17yr	196cm	100kg	Eastern U18	36​	1​
Rookie Draft p	Nick Maxwell	208	HIT	19yr	193cm	93kg	St Joseph's College/	29​	3​	AA: 2009; Prem: 2010
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 17	Billy Morrison	0	FAIL	17yr	192cm	98kg	North Hobart	0​	0​
National Draft pick 35	Brent Hall	1	FAIL	17yr	198cm	97kg	South Fremantle	0	0​
Rookie	David Fanning	14	FAIL	19yr	204cm	97kg	Aberfeldie	4​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)
National Draft (F/S)	Travis Cloke	256 (246)	HIT	17yr	196cm	108kg	Eastern U18	452	48​	AA: 2011, 2013; B&F: 2007; Prem: 2010​
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 37	John Anthony	51 (43)	FAIL	17yr	192cm	94kg	Northern U18	83​	1​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)
National Draft pick 8	Ben Reid	152	HIT	17yr	195cm	102kg	Murray U18	73	9​	AA: 2011; Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 10	Nathan Brown	183 (130)	HIT	17yr	195cm	101kg	Ballarat FC/St Patrick's College/North Ballarat U18	7​	0​	Prem: 2010
National Draft pick 28	Chris Dawes	121 (71)	HIT	18yr	193cm	105kg105kg	Sandringham U18	130	3​	Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 63	Tyson Goldsack	165	HIT	19yr	193cm	92kg	Pakenham/Gippsland U18	50​	0​	Prem: 2010
Pre-Season Draft pick 8	Chris Bryan	30	FAIL	24yr	197cm	99kg	U18/Sandringham	10	1​
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Cameron Wood	72 (48)	FAIL	20yr	204cm	105kg	Goodwood/Glenunga HS/West Adelaide	28​	0​
National Draft pick 47	Tobias Thoolen	0	FAIL	17yr	196cm	95kg	Bendigo U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Luke Casey-Leigh	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	88kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)
Trade	Leigh Brown	65	HIT	26yr	194cm	104kg	Gippsland U18	54	1​
Rookie	Lachlan Keeffe	111 (40)	HIT	18yr	204cm	102kg	Marist College Ashgrove/Old Trinity	18​	0​
Rookie	Scott Reed	0	FAIL	18yr	192cm	85kg	NSW-ACT U18	0	0​
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darren Jolly	71	HIT	27yr	200cm	108kg	North Ballarat	52	8​	Prem: 2010​
Rookie	Jack Carter	0	FAIL	17yr	194cm	88kg	West Adelaide	0	0​
Intl Rookie	Shae McNamara	0	FAIL	24yr	204cm	104kg	USA	0​	0​
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jonathon Ceglar	110 (0)	HIT	19yr	204cm	94kg	Wodonga Raiders/Murray U18	43​	4​
Rookie	Tom Young	28 (9)	FAIL	18yr	192cm	90kg	5	0​
Rookie	Thomas Gordon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	90kg	NSW-ACT U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Declan Reilly	0	FAIL	17yr	193cm	85kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Jack Perham	0	FAIL	20yr	192cm	86kg	East Fremantle	0​	0​
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)
National Draft pick 65	Corey Gault	6	FAIL	18yr	198cm	94kg	Swan Districts	4	0​
National Draft pick 67	Jarrod Witts	165 (40)	HIT	19yr	208cm	113kg	NSW-ACT U18	33​	10​	B&F: 2019; AA40: 2022
Rookie	Michael Hartley	49 (0)	FAIL	18yr	199cm	100kg	NSW-ACT U18	2​	0​
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)
Un Free Agent	Quinten Lynch	18	FAIL	29yr	192cm	103kg	Gibson/Aquinas College (WA)/West Perth	9​	0​
National Draft pick 18	Brodie Grundy	194 (177)	HIT	18yr	202cm	101kg	Unley/Cabra Dominican/Sturt	70​	65​	AA: 2018, 2019; B&F: 2018, 2019
Rookie	Jack Frost	56 (54)	HIT	20yr	194cm	89kg	Williamstown	0	1​
Rookie	Ben Hudson	7	FAIL	33yr	199cm	106KG	Werribee	1	0​
Rookie	Ben Richmond	0	FAIL	19yr	196cm	97kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jesse White	56	HIT	25yr	196cm	102kg	Southport	75	0​
National Draft pick 77	Jonathon Marsh	26 (15)	FAIL	17yr	193cm	87kg	Augusta Margaret River/East Fremantle	3​	0​
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)
National Draft (FS)	Darcy Moore	150	HIT	18yr	199cm	93kg	OAKLEIGH U18	67​	12​	AA: 2020, 2023; Prem: 2023
Intl Rookie	Mason Cox	113	HIT	23yr	211cm	110kg	USA	117	8​	Prem: 2023​
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS
Rookie	Darrean Wyatt	0	FAIL	22yr	203cm	98kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Lynden Dunn	33	FAIL	29yr	192cm	98kg	Moonee Valley/Calder U18	2​	0​
National Draft pick 30	Sam McLarty	0	FAIL	18yr	193cm	93kg	Yarra Valley Grammar/Beverley Hills/Oakleigh U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Mitch McCarthy	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Langwarrin/Mount Eliza/Frankston HS/Basketball/Dandenong U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Henry Schade	8	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	Sandy Bay/North Hobart/Tasmania U18	1​	0​
Rookie	Max Lynch	11 (3)	FAIL	18yr	200cm	96kg	Murray U18	4	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)
Unregistered Player Selection	Jack Madgen	49	FAIL	24yr	196cm	95kg	Basketball	2​	0​
Rookie	Brody Mihocek	126	HIT	24yr	192cm	97kg	Port Melbourne	212​	17​	Prem: 2023
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jordan Roughead	63	HIT	27yr	200cm	101kg	North Ballarat	1​	0​
Unregistered Player Selection	Tom Wilson	8	FAIL	21yr	194cm	77kg	Basketball	2	0​
National Draft pick 29	Will Kelly	5	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Oakleigh U18	1	0​
Int'l Rookie	Mark Keane	10 (5)	FAIL	18yr	194cm	96kg	County Cork	0	0​
Int'l Rookie	Anton Tohill	1	FAIL	18yr	198cm	86kg	County Derry	0	0​
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darcy Cameron	71	HIT	24yr	204cm	101kg	North Albany/Hale School/Claremont	51​	4​	Prem: 2023
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC
National Draft pick 31	Liam McMahon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	80kg	Northern U18	0​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 3	Ash Johnson	24	TBC	23yr	193cm	85kg	Sturt	36​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 18	Aiden Begg	3	TBC	17yr	197cm	87kg	Eastern U18	0​	0​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Nathan Kreuger	7	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	South Adelaide	4​	0​
Rookie	Charlie Dean	0	TBC	20yr	195cm	86kg	Williamstown	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Billy Frampton	16	TBC	25yr	200cm	90kg	South Fremantle	16​	7​	Prem: 2023
Un. Free Agent	Daniel McStay	14	TBC	27yr	196cm	87kg	Eastern U18	14​	20​
SSP	Oscar Steene	0	TBC	19yr	201cm	85kg	West Adelaide	0​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); TBC
SSP	Josh Eyre	0	TBC	20yr	197cm	85kg	Calder U18	0	0​
		Ttl players 'in'	Ttl TALLS 'in'	ND Talls	HITS >50	Source of 'HITS'
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	11	5​	2​	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)	12	2​	1​	1​	Rooks
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	8	3​	2​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)	8	1​	1​	1​	ND F/S
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS	9	1​	1​	0​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)	10	5​	4​	4​	4 * ND
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS	6	3​	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)	11	3​	0​	2​	1 Trade, 1 rooks
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	3​	0​	1​	Trade
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	14	6​	0​	1​	Trade
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)	10	3​	2​	1​	ND
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)	13	5​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 Rooks
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	2​	1​	1​	Trade
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)	10	2​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 rooks
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS	10	1​	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS	12	5​	1​	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)	7	2​	0​	1​	Rooks
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	9	5​	1​	1​	Trade
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	4	1​	0​	1​	Trade
Totals '01/'19	180	58	18	19​
32%​	31%​	33%​
TBC ie. too early to tell
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC	10	3​	1​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC	8	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC	9	3​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND)	6	1​	0​
33	9	1
27%	11%
TOTALS	213	67	19
31%​	28%​

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Dekka has explained how we do drafting multiple times. It's not the wizened old pro with an eagle eye making the calls.

We score blokes against criteria. Then rank them based on those scores. Then have philosophy of drafting best available.

Our criteria has clearly changed to valuing pace more highly since the new footy department came in.

If we're not getting enough talls it's the criteria and the best available policy. Not just one bloke at the top of recruiting.

The blokes survived 3 different footy departments with all other roles changing multiple times. He's assembled two different lists that have won flags, I don't think I'm part of the "we" that know that Dekka is a problem.

That is an interesting point you make, because part of that nauseating hard sell of the Reef/Henry/Macrae/Poulter/McMahon draft was the assertion that McMahon was a “needs pick”, i.e. we didn’t think he was best available at that spot, but needed a developing tall.

 

[ThePheonix]

Dekka has explained how we do drafting multiple times. It's not the wizened old pro with an eagle eye making the calls.

We score blokes against criteria. Then rank them based on those scores. Then have philosophy of drafting best available.

Our criteria has clearly changed to valuing pace more highly since the new footy department came in.

If we're not getting enough talls it's the criteria and the best available policy. Not just one bloke at the top of recruiting.

The blokes survived 3 different footy departments with all other roles changing multiple times. He's assembled two different lists that have won flags, I don't think I'm part of the "we" that know that Dekka is a problem.

Hine did some excellent recruiting early on in his career, though the second half of his tenure leaves much to be desired, and we won last year despite of Hine not because of him; the father and son rule played a major part.

I could only pine at what Dynasty we would've been able to produce, the likes of Hawthorn’s or Geelong’s, perhaps, if only we had a head recruiter capable of finding a KPP in a span of 15 years; that’s not a great record.

 

[sr36]

Hine did some excellent recruiting early on in his career, though the second half of his tenure leaves much to be desired, and we won last year despite of Hine not because of him; the father and son rule played a major part.

I could only pine at what Dynasty we would've been able to produce, the likes of Hawthorn’s or Geelong’s, perhaps, if only we had a head recruiter capable of finding a KPP in a span of 15 years; that’s not a great record.

Not sure why everyone thinks our recruiting department (or any of our departments) is one bloke making captain's calls. Plus we've recruited well. Personally, I think we've only missed finals during the last 15 in a few years where the coaching wasn't working. The list has been good enough since about 2007 for about 17 years.

 

[Mollythedolly]

I think (admittedly anecdotally given I'm not digging up data points) that it is much harder to find a key forward via trade than a mid, runner, small forward, back or ruck.

Drafting isn't easy, by any means, but the more bets you place the more likely you are to hit. We've drafted so many mids and runners over the years (with success!), but typically good mids come onto the trade market more regularly than key forwards.

Understand your point and I am sympathetic to it. If it was up to me we go draft over trade every time, we’d have had a crack at Schoenmakers last draft. For me though, the issue isn’t that we don’t draft or trade KPF types, it’s that we haven’t been overly successful at either. Hopefully McStay get a decent run at it upon return and redresses that somewhat.

 

[No SPIN]

Hine did some excellent recruiting early on in his career, though the second half of his tenure leaves much to be desired, and we won last year despite of Hine not because of him; the father and son rule played a major part.

I could only pine at what Dynasty we would've been able to produce, the likes of Hawthorn’s or Geelong’s, perhaps, if only we had a head recruiter capable of finding a KPP in a span of 15 years; that’s not a great record.

Not sure how many times I need to say this - Geel are said to have the best recruiters in the game and had a gun KPF for close to 15 years.
And yet inclusive of 2010 they have won the same number of flags as Coll.
So please let’s end this absurd debate that our recruiters are crap and had they found KPF’s we’d now have more flags.
Geel have had both for 15 - and not achieved a dynasty.

People need to stop with these simplistic arguments.

 

[BEEG]

Another year another whinge fest about our trading and draft strategy.

The funny thing is we've heard it all before in the years immediately proceeding our most recent PREMIERSHIP.

We won the flag and it was entirely reasonable to think we'd be making finals again, so a pick in the teens as part of a deal for a contracted 26yo and one destined to be best 23 for the next 5 years, looked to be around market rate for such a player.

In reality if we were sitting 3-0 no one would be batting an eyelid. Well no one outside those who perennially find things to complain about when it comes to our recruitment.

For the record under Hine.....
2006 Elimination Final
2007 Preliminary Final
2008 Semi Final
2009 Preliminary Final
2010 Premiers
2011 Grand Final
2012 Preliminary Final
2013 Elimination Final
2018 Grand Final
2019 Preliminary Final
2020 Semi Final
2022 Preliminary Final
2023 Premiers

A few might well be better over the journey but Hine still remains one of the best talent identifiers in the business despite what some might try to tell you.

Has barely snagged anything with top 30 picks.

The thing that has saved us are some trades and late picks.

If it's not a top 5 pick Hind will butcher it.

 

[The Phantom]

Collingwood recruiting history of talls since 2001

• Tall = anyone recruited at or > 192 cms
• HIT ie. success = anyone who played 50 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 50 games elsewhere). The definition of a HIT is arguably set at reasonably LOW bar of circa 2 seasons of AFL.
• +HIT ie. real success = anyone who played 100 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 100 games elsewhere).

Observations:

• 213 players (total) brought in to the club 2001-23
• Of those, 67 (31%) have been TALL (192cm or >)
• Of the 67, 58 recruited 2001-19 and 9 recruited since 2020 (for latter cohort, too early to determine HIT or FAIL)
• Of the 67 TALLS, 19 (28%) have been National Draft (ND) selections; 36 (54%) rookie /int'l rooks /MSD /SSP etc; and 12 (18%) traded in (trade/UFA)
  • Of the 19 Tall ND selections, 12 came before 2008
  • In last 10-yrs, only 5 Talls came from ND selections, with 2 of those Father-Sons (Moore, Kelly)
• Of the 58 TALLS (up to 2019), 19 (33%) have been HITS (ie. played >50 games)
• Of the 58 TALLS, (up to 2019), 14 (24%) have been +HITS (ie. played >100 games)
• Of the 14 TALL +HITS (ie. played >100 games), 8 (71%) were ND selections (Reid, Brown, Grundy, Moore, Witts, Goldsack, Dawes, Cloke); 2 were traded in (J.Ceglar, D.Cameron ..only played 74 games but i'm projecting 100+) and 4 were rookies (Miho, Cox, Keeffe, Maxwell)

		Ttl Games /Coll games	HIT/ FAIL	age	hght	wght	origin club	goals	votes	awards
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 27	Tom Davidson	1	FAIL	18yr	192cm	87kg	Geelong U18	0​	0​
National Draft pick 72	Tristen Walker	28	FAIL	17yr	195cm	100kg	Claremont	8​	0​
Pre-Season Draft pick 4	Scott Cummings	5	FAIL	27yr	194cm	105kg	Swan Districts	6​	0​
Rookie	James Podsiadly	104 (0)	FAIL	20yr	193cm	100kg	Geelong (VFL)	195​	23​	Prem '11
Rookie	Justin Crow	1	FAIL	18yr	196cm	92kg	Oakleigh U18	0	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)
National Draft (F/S)	Cameron Cloke	58 (21)	FAIL	17yr	196cm	100kg	Eastern U18	36​	1​
Rookie Draft p	Nick Maxwell	208	HIT	19yr	193cm	93kg	St Joseph's College/	29​	3​	AA: 2009; Prem: 2010
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 17	Billy Morrison	0	FAIL	17yr	192cm	98kg	North Hobart	0​	0​
National Draft pick 35	Brent Hall	1	FAIL	17yr	198cm	97kg	South Fremantle	0	0​
Rookie	David Fanning	14	FAIL	19yr	204cm	97kg	Aberfeldie	4​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)
National Draft (F/S)	Travis Cloke	256 (246)	HIT	17yr	196cm	108kg	Eastern U18	452	48​	AA: 2011, 2013; B&F: 2007; Prem: 2010​
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 37	John Anthony	51 (43)	FAIL	17yr	192cm	94kg	Northern U18	83​	1​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)
National Draft pick 8	Ben Reid	152	HIT	17yr	195cm	102kg	Murray U18	73	9​	AA: 2011; Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 10	Nathan Brown	183 (130)	HIT	17yr	195cm	101kg	Ballarat FC/St Patrick's College/North Ballarat U18	7​	0​	Prem: 2010
National Draft pick 28	Chris Dawes	121 (71)	HIT	18yr	193cm	105kg105kg	Sandringham U18	130	3​	Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 63	Tyson Goldsack	165	HIT	19yr	193cm	92kg	Pakenham/Gippsland U18	50​	0​	Prem: 2010
Pre-Season Draft pick 8	Chris Bryan	30	FAIL	24yr	197cm	99kg	U18/Sandringham	10	1​
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Cameron Wood	72 (48)	FAIL	20yr	204cm	105kg	Goodwood/Glenunga HS/West Adelaide	28​	0​
National Draft pick 47	Tobias Thoolen	0	FAIL	17yr	196cm	95kg	Bendigo U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Luke Casey-Leigh	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	88kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)
Trade	Leigh Brown	65	HIT	26yr	194cm	104kg	Gippsland U18	54	1​
Rookie	Lachlan Keeffe	111 (40)	HIT	18yr	204cm	102kg	Marist College Ashgrove/Old Trinity	18​	0​
Rookie	Scott Reed	0	FAIL	18yr	192cm	85kg	NSW-ACT U18	0	0​
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darren Jolly	71	HIT	27yr	200cm	108kg	North Ballarat	52	8​	Prem: 2010​
Rookie	Jack Carter	0	FAIL	17yr	194cm	88kg	West Adelaide	0	0​
Intl Rookie	Shae McNamara	0	FAIL	24yr	204cm	104kg	USA	0​	0​
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jonathon Ceglar	110 (0)	HIT	19yr	204cm	94kg	Wodonga Raiders/Murray U18	43​	4​
Rookie	Tom Young	28 (9)	FAIL	18yr	192cm	90kg	5	0​
Rookie	Thomas Gordon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	90kg	NSW-ACT U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Declan Reilly	0	FAIL	17yr	193cm	85kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Jack Perham	0	FAIL	20yr	192cm	86kg	East Fremantle	0​	0​
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)
National Draft pick 65	Corey Gault	6	FAIL	18yr	198cm	94kg	Swan Districts	4	0​
National Draft pick 67	Jarrod Witts	165 (40)	HIT	19yr	208cm	113kg	NSW-ACT U18	33​	10​	B&F: 2019; AA40: 2022
Rookie	Michael Hartley	49 (0)	FAIL	18yr	199cm	100kg	NSW-ACT U18	2​	0​
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)
Un Free Agent	Quinten Lynch	18	FAIL	29yr	192cm	103kg	Gibson/Aquinas College (WA)/West Perth	9​	0​
National Draft pick 18	Brodie Grundy	194 (177)	HIT	18yr	202cm	101kg	Unley/Cabra Dominican/Sturt	70​	65​	AA: 2018, 2019; B&F: 2018, 2019
Rookie	Jack Frost	56 (54)	HIT	20yr	194cm	89kg	Williamstown	0	1​
Rookie	Ben Hudson	7	FAIL	33yr	199cm	106KG	Werribee	1	0​
Rookie	Ben Richmond	0	FAIL	19yr	196cm	97kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jesse White	56	HIT	25yr	196cm	102kg	Southport	75	0​
National Draft pick 77	Jonathon Marsh	26 (15)	FAIL	17yr	193cm	87kg	Augusta Margaret River/East Fremantle	3​	0​
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)
National Draft (FS)	Darcy Moore	150	HIT	18yr	199cm	93kg	OAKLEIGH U18	67​	12​	AA: 2020, 2023; Prem: 2023
Intl Rookie	Mason Cox	113	HIT	23yr	211cm	110kg	USA	117	8​	Prem: 2023​
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS
Rookie	Darrean Wyatt	0	FAIL	22yr	203cm	98kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Lynden Dunn	33	FAIL	29yr	192cm	98kg	Moonee Valley/Calder U18	2​	0​
National Draft pick 30	Sam McLarty	0	FAIL	18yr	193cm	93kg	Yarra Valley Grammar/Beverley Hills/Oakleigh U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Mitch McCarthy	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Langwarrin/Mount Eliza/Frankston HS/Basketball/Dandenong U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Henry Schade	8	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	Sandy Bay/North Hobart/Tasmania U18	1​	0​
Rookie	Max Lynch	11 (3)	FAIL	18yr	200cm	96kg	Murray U18	4	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)
Unregistered Player Selection	Jack Madgen	49	FAIL	24yr	196cm	95kg	Basketball	2​	0​
Rookie	Brody Mihocek	126	HIT	24yr	192cm	97kg	Port Melbourne	212​	17​	Prem: 2023
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jordan Roughead	63	HIT	27yr	200cm	101kg	North Ballarat	1​	0​
Unregistered Player Selection	Tom Wilson	8	FAIL	21yr	194cm	77kg	Basketball	2	0​
National Draft pick 29	Will Kelly	5	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Oakleigh U18	1	0​
Int'l Rookie	Mark Keane	10 (5)	FAIL	18yr	194cm	96kg	County Cork	0	0​
Int'l Rookie	Anton Tohill	1	FAIL	18yr	198cm	86kg	County Derry	0	0​
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darcy Cameron	71	HIT	24yr	204cm	101kg	North Albany/Hale School/Claremont	51​	4​	Prem: 2023
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC
National Draft pick 31	Liam McMahon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	80kg	Northern U18	0​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 3	Ash Johnson	24	TBC	23yr	193cm	85kg	Sturt	36​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 18	Aiden Begg	3	TBC	17yr	197cm	87kg	Eastern U18	0​	0​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Nathan Kreuger	7	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	South Adelaide	4​	0​
Rookie	Charlie Dean	0	TBC	20yr	195cm	86kg	Williamstown	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Billy Frampton	16	TBC	25yr	200cm	90kg	South Fremantle	16​	7​	Prem: 2023
Un. Free Agent	Daniel McStay	14	TBC	27yr	196cm	87kg	Eastern U18	14​	20​
SSP	Oscar Steene	0	TBC	19yr	201cm	85kg	West Adelaide	0​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); TBC
SSP	Josh Eyre	0	TBC	20yr	197cm	85kg	Calder U18	0	0​
		Ttl players 'in'	Ttl TALLS 'in'	ND Talls	HITS >50	Source of 'HITS'
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	11	5​	2​	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)	12	2​	1​	1​	Rooks
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	8	3​	2​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)	8	1​	1​	1​	ND F/S
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS	9	1​	1​	0​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)	10	5​	4​	4​	4 * ND
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS	6	3​	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)	11	3​	0​	2​	1 Trade, 1 rooks
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	3​	0​	1​	Trade
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	14	6​	0​	1​	Trade
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)	10	3​	2​	1​	ND
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)	13	5​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 Rooks
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	2​	1​	1​	Trade
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)	10	2​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 rooks
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS	10	1​	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS	12	5​	1​	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)	7	2​	0​	1​	Rooks
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	9	5​	1​	1​	Trade
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	4	1​	0​	1​	Trade
Totals '01/'19	180	58	18	19​
32%​	31%​	33%​
TBC ie. too early to tell
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC	10	3​	1​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC	8	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC	9	3​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND)	6	1​	0​
33	9	1
27%	11%
TOTALS	213	67	19
31%​	28%​

Awesome effort and genuinely interesting.
I wonder how that benchmarks against other clubs?
And I also wonder what it would look like if the height criteria was the new tall of 196cm?
(Not that I expect you to work out either)

 

[Bussie]

Collingwood recruiting history of talls since 2001

• Tall = anyone recruited at or > 192 cms
• HIT ie. success = anyone who played 50 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 50 games elsewhere). The definition of a HIT is arguably set at reasonably LOW bar of circa 2 seasons of AFL.
• +HIT ie. real success = anyone who played 100 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 100 games elsewhere).

Observations:

• 213 players (total) brought in to the club 2001-23
• Of those, 67 (31%) have been TALL (192cm or >)
• Of the 67, 58 recruited 2001-19 and 9 recruited since 2020 (for latter cohort, too early to determine HIT or FAIL)
• Of the 67 TALLS, 19 (28%) have been National Draft (ND) selections; 36 (54%) rookie /int'l rooks /MSD /SSP etc; and 12 (18%) traded in (trade/UFA)
  • Of the 19 Tall ND selections, 12 came before 2008
  • In last 10-yrs, only 5 Talls came from ND selections, with 2 of those Father-Sons (Moore, Kelly)
• Of the 58 TALLS (up to 2019), 19 (33%) have been HITS (ie. played >50 games)
• Of the 58 TALLS, (up to 2019), 14 (24%) have been +HITS (ie. played >100 games)
• Of the 14 TALL +HITS (ie. played >100 games), 8 (71%) were ND selections (Reid, Brown, Grundy, Moore, Witts, Goldsack, Dawes, Cloke); 2 were traded in (J.Ceglar, D.Cameron ..only played 74 games but i'm projecting 100+) and 4 were rookies (Miho, Cox, Keeffe, Maxwell)

		Ttl Games /Coll games	HIT/ FAIL	age	hght	wght	origin club	goals	votes	awards
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 27	Tom Davidson	1	FAIL	18yr	192cm	87kg	Geelong U18	0​	0​
National Draft pick 72	Tristen Walker	28	FAIL	17yr	195cm	100kg	Claremont	8​	0​
Pre-Season Draft pick 4	Scott Cummings	5	FAIL	27yr	194cm	105kg	Swan Districts	6​	0​
Rookie	James Podsiadly	104 (0)	FAIL	20yr	193cm	100kg	Geelong (VFL)	195​	23​	Prem '11
Rookie	Justin Crow	1	FAIL	18yr	196cm	92kg	Oakleigh U18	0	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)
National Draft (F/S)	Cameron Cloke	58 (21)	FAIL	17yr	196cm	100kg	Eastern U18	36​	1​
Rookie Draft p	Nick Maxwell	208	HIT	19yr	193cm	93kg	St Joseph's College/	29​	3​	AA: 2009; Prem: 2010
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 17	Billy Morrison	0	FAIL	17yr	192cm	98kg	North Hobart	0​	0​
National Draft pick 35	Brent Hall	1	FAIL	17yr	198cm	97kg	South Fremantle	0	0​
Rookie	David Fanning	14	FAIL	19yr	204cm	97kg	Aberfeldie	4​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)
National Draft (F/S)	Travis Cloke	256 (246)	HIT	17yr	196cm	108kg	Eastern U18	452	48​	AA: 2011, 2013; B&F: 2007; Prem: 2010​
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 37	John Anthony	51 (43)	FAIL	17yr	192cm	94kg	Northern U18	83​	1​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)
National Draft pick 8	Ben Reid	152	HIT	17yr	195cm	102kg	Murray U18	73	9​	AA: 2011; Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 10	Nathan Brown	183 (130)	HIT	17yr	195cm	101kg	Ballarat FC/St Patrick's College/North Ballarat U18	7​	0​	Prem: 2010
National Draft pick 28	Chris Dawes	121 (71)	HIT	18yr	193cm	105kg105kg	Sandringham U18	130	3​	Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 63	Tyson Goldsack	165	HIT	19yr	193cm	92kg	Pakenham/Gippsland U18	50​	0​	Prem: 2010
Pre-Season Draft pick 8	Chris Bryan	30	FAIL	24yr	197cm	99kg	U18/Sandringham	10	1​
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Cameron Wood	72 (48)	FAIL	20yr	204cm	105kg	Goodwood/Glenunga HS/West Adelaide	28​	0​
National Draft pick 47	Tobias Thoolen	0	FAIL	17yr	196cm	95kg	Bendigo U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Luke Casey-Leigh	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	88kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)
Trade	Leigh Brown	65	HIT	26yr	194cm	104kg	Gippsland U18	54	1​
Rookie	Lachlan Keeffe	111 (40)	HIT	18yr	204cm	102kg	Marist College Ashgrove/Old Trinity	18​	0​
Rookie	Scott Reed	0	FAIL	18yr	192cm	85kg	NSW-ACT U18	0	0​
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darren Jolly	71	HIT	27yr	200cm	108kg	North Ballarat	52	8​	Prem: 2010​
Rookie	Jack Carter	0	FAIL	17yr	194cm	88kg	West Adelaide	0	0​
Intl Rookie	Shae McNamara	0	FAIL	24yr	204cm	104kg	USA	0​	0​
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jonathon Ceglar	110 (0)	HIT	19yr	204cm	94kg	Wodonga Raiders/Murray U18	43​	4​
Rookie	Tom Young	28 (9)	FAIL	18yr	192cm	90kg	5	0​
Rookie	Thomas Gordon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	90kg	NSW-ACT U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Declan Reilly	0	FAIL	17yr	193cm	85kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Jack Perham	0	FAIL	20yr	192cm	86kg	East Fremantle	0​	0​
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)
National Draft pick 65	Corey Gault	6	FAIL	18yr	198cm	94kg	Swan Districts	4	0​
National Draft pick 67	Jarrod Witts	165 (40)	HIT	19yr	208cm	113kg	NSW-ACT U18	33​	10​	B&F: 2019; AA40: 2022
Rookie	Michael Hartley	49 (0)	FAIL	18yr	199cm	100kg	NSW-ACT U18	2​	0​
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)
Un Free Agent	Quinten Lynch	18	FAIL	29yr	192cm	103kg	Gibson/Aquinas College (WA)/West Perth	9​	0​
National Draft pick 18	Brodie Grundy	194 (177)	HIT	18yr	202cm	101kg	Unley/Cabra Dominican/Sturt	70​	65​	AA: 2018, 2019; B&F: 2018, 2019
Rookie	Jack Frost	56 (54)	HIT	20yr	194cm	89kg	Williamstown	0	1​
Rookie	Ben Hudson	7	FAIL	33yr	199cm	106KG	Werribee	1	0​
Rookie	Ben Richmond	0	FAIL	19yr	196cm	97kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jesse White	56	HIT	25yr	196cm	102kg	Southport	75	0​
National Draft pick 77	Jonathon Marsh	26 (15)	FAIL	17yr	193cm	87kg	Augusta Margaret River/East Fremantle	3​	0​
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)
National Draft (FS)	Darcy Moore	150	HIT	18yr	199cm	93kg	OAKLEIGH U18	67​	12​	AA: 2020, 2023; Prem: 2023
Intl Rookie	Mason Cox	113	HIT	23yr	211cm	110kg	USA	117	8​	Prem: 2023​
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS
Rookie	Darrean Wyatt	0	FAIL	22yr	203cm	98kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Lynden Dunn	33	FAIL	29yr	192cm	98kg	Moonee Valley/Calder U18	2​	0​
National Draft pick 30	Sam McLarty	0	FAIL	18yr	193cm	93kg	Yarra Valley Grammar/Beverley Hills/Oakleigh U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Mitch McCarthy	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Langwarrin/Mount Eliza/Frankston HS/Basketball/Dandenong U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Henry Schade	8	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	Sandy Bay/North Hobart/Tasmania U18	1​	0​
Rookie	Max Lynch	11 (3)	FAIL	18yr	200cm	96kg	Murray U18	4	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)
Unregistered Player Selection	Jack Madgen	49	FAIL	24yr	196cm	95kg	Basketball	2​	0​
Rookie	Brody Mihocek	126	HIT	24yr	192cm	97kg	Port Melbourne	212​	17​	Prem: 2023
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jordan Roughead	63	HIT	27yr	200cm	101kg	North Ballarat	1​	0​
Unregistered Player Selection	Tom Wilson	8	FAIL	21yr	194cm	77kg	Basketball	2	0​
National Draft pick 29	Will Kelly	5	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Oakleigh U18	1	0​
Int'l Rookie	Mark Keane	10 (5)	FAIL	18yr	194cm	96kg	County Cork	0	0​
Int'l Rookie	Anton Tohill	1	FAIL	18yr	198cm	86kg	County Derry	0	0​
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darcy Cameron	71	HIT	24yr	204cm	101kg	North Albany/Hale School/Claremont	51​	4​	Prem: 2023
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC
National Draft pick 31	Liam McMahon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	80kg	Northern U18	0​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 3	Ash Johnson	24	TBC	23yr	193cm	85kg	Sturt	36​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 18	Aiden Begg	3	TBC	17yr	197cm	87kg	Eastern U18	0​	0​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Nathan Kreuger	7	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	South Adelaide	4​	0​
Rookie	Charlie Dean	0	TBC	20yr	195cm	86kg	Williamstown	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Billy Frampton	16	TBC	25yr	200cm	90kg	South Fremantle	16​	7​	Prem: 2023
Un. Free Agent	Daniel McStay	14	TBC	27yr	196cm	87kg	Eastern U18	14​	20​
SSP	Oscar Steene	0	TBC	19yr	201cm	85kg	West Adelaide	0​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); TBC
SSP	Josh Eyre	0	TBC	20yr	197cm	85kg	Calder U18	0	0​
		Ttl players 'in'	Ttl TALLS 'in'	ND Talls	HITS >50	Source of 'HITS'
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	11	5​	2​	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)	12	2​	1​	1​	Rooks
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	8	3​	2​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)	8	1​	1​	1​	ND F/S
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS	9	1​	1​	0​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)	10	5​	4​	4​	4 * ND
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS	6	3​	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)	11	3​	0​	2​	1 Trade, 1 rooks
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	3​	0​	1​	Trade
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	14	6​	0​	1​	Trade
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)	10	3​	2​	1​	ND
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)	13	5​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 Rooks
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	2​	1​	1​	Trade
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)	10	2​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 rooks
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS	10	1​	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS	12	5​	1​	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)	7	2​	0​	1​	Rooks
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	9	5​	1​	1​	Trade
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	4	1​	0​	1​	Trade
Totals '01/'19	180	58	18	19​
32%​	31%​	33%​
TBC ie. too early to tell
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC	10	3​	1​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC	8	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC	9	3​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND)	6	1​	0​
33	9	1
27%	11%
TOTALS	213	67	19
31%​	28%​

Amazing work. Well done.
I wouldn't consider Ceglar and Witts a Hit though, not for Collingwood, we should have persisted. We persisted with some not so good types.

 

[sam_e]

Amazing work. Well done.
I wouldn't consider Ceglar and Witts a Hit though, not for Collingwood, we should have persisted. We persisted with some not so good types.

they count bc this was about trying to assess the performance of the recruiting dept in identifying & bringing in players that could sustain afl level output.

 

[No SPIN]

Collingwood recruiting history of talls since 2001

• Tall = anyone recruited at or > 192 cms
• HIT ie. success = anyone who played 50 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 50 games elsewhere). The definition of a HIT is arguably set at reasonably LOW bar of circa 2 seasons of AFL.
• +HIT ie. real success = anyone who played 100 games or more at COLL once drafted or traded in (or went on to play > 100 games elsewhere).

Observations:

• 213 players (total) brought in to the club 2001-23
• Of those, 67 (31%) have been TALL (192cm or >)
• Of the 67, 58 recruited 2001-19 and 9 recruited since 2020 (for latter cohort, too early to determine HIT or FAIL)
• Of the 67 TALLS, 19 (28%) have been National Draft (ND) selections; 36 (54%) rookie /int'l rooks /MSD /SSP etc; and 12 (18%) traded in (trade/UFA)
  • Of the 19 Tall ND selections, 12 came before 2008
  • In last 10-yrs, only 5 Talls came from ND selections, with 2 of those Father-Sons (Moore, Kelly)
• Of the 58 TALLS (up to 2019), 19 (33%) have been HITS (ie. played >50 games)
• Of the 58 TALLS, (up to 2019), 14 (24%) have been +HITS (ie. played >100 games)
• Of the 14 TALL +HITS (ie. played >100 games), 8 (71%) were ND selections (Reid, Brown, Grundy, Moore, Witts, Goldsack, Dawes, Cloke); 2 were traded in (J.Ceglar, D.Cameron ..only played 74 games but i'm projecting 100+) and 4 were rookies (Miho, Cox, Keeffe, Maxwell)

		Ttl Games /Coll games	HIT/ FAIL	age	hght	wght	origin club	goals	votes	awards
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 27	Tom Davidson	1	FAIL	18yr	192cm	87kg	Geelong U18	0​	0​
National Draft pick 72	Tristen Walker	28	FAIL	17yr	195cm	100kg	Claremont	8​	0​
Pre-Season Draft pick 4	Scott Cummings	5	FAIL	27yr	194cm	105kg	Swan Districts	6​	0​
Rookie	James Podsiadly	104 (0)	FAIL	20yr	193cm	100kg	Geelong (VFL)	195​	23​	Prem '11
Rookie	Justin Crow	1	FAIL	18yr	196cm	92kg	Oakleigh U18	0	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)
National Draft (F/S)	Cameron Cloke	58 (21)	FAIL	17yr	196cm	100kg	Eastern U18	36​	1​
Rookie Draft p	Nick Maxwell	208	HIT	19yr	193cm	93kg	St Joseph's College/	29​	3​	AA: 2009; Prem: 2010
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 17	Billy Morrison	0	FAIL	17yr	192cm	98kg	North Hobart	0​	0​
National Draft pick 35	Brent Hall	1	FAIL	17yr	198cm	97kg	South Fremantle	0	0​
Rookie	David Fanning	14	FAIL	19yr	204cm	97kg	Aberfeldie	4​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)
National Draft (F/S)	Travis Cloke	256 (246)	HIT	17yr	196cm	108kg	Eastern U18	452	48​	AA: 2011, 2013; B&F: 2007; Prem: 2010​
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS
National Draft pick 37	John Anthony	51 (43)	FAIL	17yr	192cm	94kg	Northern U18	83​	1​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)
National Draft pick 8	Ben Reid	152	HIT	17yr	195cm	102kg	Murray U18	73	9​	AA: 2011; Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 10	Nathan Brown	183 (130)	HIT	17yr	195cm	101kg	Ballarat FC/St Patrick's College/North Ballarat U18	7​	0​	Prem: 2010
National Draft pick 28	Chris Dawes	121 (71)	HIT	18yr	193cm	105kg105kg	Sandringham U18	130	3​	Prem: 2010​
National Draft pick 63	Tyson Goldsack	165	HIT	19yr	193cm	92kg	Pakenham/Gippsland U18	50​	0​	Prem: 2010
Pre-Season Draft pick 8	Chris Bryan	30	FAIL	24yr	197cm	99kg	U18/Sandringham	10	1​
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Cameron Wood	72 (48)	FAIL	20yr	204cm	105kg	Goodwood/Glenunga HS/West Adelaide	28​	0​
National Draft pick 47	Tobias Thoolen	0	FAIL	17yr	196cm	95kg	Bendigo U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Luke Casey-Leigh	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	88kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)
Trade	Leigh Brown	65	HIT	26yr	194cm	104kg	Gippsland U18	54	1​
Rookie	Lachlan Keeffe	111 (40)	HIT	18yr	204cm	102kg	Marist College Ashgrove/Old Trinity	18​	0​
Rookie	Scott Reed	0	FAIL	18yr	192cm	85kg	NSW-ACT U18	0	0​
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darren Jolly	71	HIT	27yr	200cm	108kg	North Ballarat	52	8​	Prem: 2010​
Rookie	Jack Carter	0	FAIL	17yr	194cm	88kg	West Adelaide	0	0​
Intl Rookie	Shae McNamara	0	FAIL	24yr	204cm	104kg	USA	0​	0​
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jonathon Ceglar	110 (0)	HIT	19yr	204cm	94kg	Wodonga Raiders/Murray U18	43​	4​
Rookie	Tom Young	28 (9)	FAIL	18yr	192cm	90kg	5	0​
Rookie	Thomas Gordon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	90kg	NSW-ACT U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Declan Reilly	0	FAIL	17yr	193cm	85kg	Sandringham U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Jack Perham	0	FAIL	20yr	192cm	86kg	East Fremantle	0​	0​
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)
National Draft pick 65	Corey Gault	6	FAIL	18yr	198cm	94kg	Swan Districts	4	0​
National Draft pick 67	Jarrod Witts	165 (40)	HIT	19yr	208cm	113kg	NSW-ACT U18	33​	10​	B&F: 2019; AA40: 2022
Rookie	Michael Hartley	49 (0)	FAIL	18yr	199cm	100kg	NSW-ACT U18	2​	0​
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)
Un Free Agent	Quinten Lynch	18	FAIL	29yr	192cm	103kg	Gibson/Aquinas College (WA)/West Perth	9​	0​
National Draft pick 18	Brodie Grundy	194 (177)	HIT	18yr	202cm	101kg	Unley/Cabra Dominican/Sturt	70​	65​	AA: 2018, 2019; B&F: 2018, 2019
Rookie	Jack Frost	56 (54)	HIT	20yr	194cm	89kg	Williamstown	0	1​
Rookie	Ben Hudson	7	FAIL	33yr	199cm	106KG	Werribee	1	0​
Rookie	Ben Richmond	0	FAIL	19yr	196cm	97kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jesse White	56	HIT	25yr	196cm	102kg	Southport	75	0​
National Draft pick 77	Jonathon Marsh	26 (15)	FAIL	17yr	193cm	87kg	Augusta Margaret River/East Fremantle	3​	0​
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)
National Draft (FS)	Darcy Moore	150	HIT	18yr	199cm	93kg	OAKLEIGH U18	67​	12​	AA: 2020, 2023; Prem: 2023
Intl Rookie	Mason Cox	113	HIT	23yr	211cm	110kg	USA	117	8​	Prem: 2023​
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS
Rookie	Darrean Wyatt	0	FAIL	22yr	203cm	98kg	Basketball	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS
Trade	Lynden Dunn	33	FAIL	29yr	192cm	98kg	Moonee Valley/Calder U18	2​	0​
National Draft pick 30	Sam McLarty	0	FAIL	18yr	193cm	93kg	Yarra Valley Grammar/Beverley Hills/Oakleigh U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Mitch McCarthy	0	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Langwarrin/Mount Eliza/Frankston HS/Basketball/Dandenong U18	0​	0​
Rookie	Henry Schade	8	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	Sandy Bay/North Hobart/Tasmania U18	1​	0​
Rookie	Max Lynch	11 (3)	FAIL	18yr	200cm	96kg	Murray U18	4	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)
Unregistered Player Selection	Jack Madgen	49	FAIL	24yr	196cm	95kg	Basketball	2​	0​
Rookie	Brody Mihocek	126	HIT	24yr	192cm	97kg	Port Melbourne	212​	17​	Prem: 2023
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Jordan Roughead	63	HIT	27yr	200cm	101kg	North Ballarat	1​	0​
Unregistered Player Selection	Tom Wilson	8	FAIL	21yr	194cm	77kg	Basketball	2	0​
National Draft pick 29	Will Kelly	5	FAIL	18yr	196cm	87kg	Oakleigh U18	1	0​
Int'l Rookie	Mark Keane	10 (5)	FAIL	18yr	194cm	96kg	County Cork	0	0​
Int'l Rookie	Anton Tohill	1	FAIL	18yr	198cm	86kg	County Derry	0	0​
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)
Trade	Darcy Cameron	71	HIT	24yr	204cm	101kg	North Albany/Hale School/Claremont	51​	4​	Prem: 2023
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC
National Draft pick 31	Liam McMahon	0	FAIL	18yr	194cm	80kg	Northern U18	0​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 3	Ash Johnson	24	TBC	23yr	193cm	85kg	Sturt	36​	0​
Mid-Season Draft pick 18	Aiden Begg	3	TBC	17yr	197cm	87kg	Eastern U18	0​	0​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Nathan Kreuger	7	FAIL	22yr	196cm	86kg	South Adelaide	4​	0​
Rookie	Charlie Dean	0	TBC	20yr	195cm	86kg	Williamstown	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC
Trade	Billy Frampton	16	TBC	25yr	200cm	90kg	South Fremantle	16​	7​	Prem: 2023
Un. Free Agent	Daniel McStay	14	TBC	27yr	196cm	87kg	Eastern U18	14​	20​
SSP	Oscar Steene	0	TBC	19yr	201cm	85kg	West Adelaide	0​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); TBC
SSP	Josh Eyre	0	TBC	20yr	197cm	85kg	Calder U18	0	0​
		Ttl players 'in'	Ttl TALLS 'in'	ND Talls	HITS >50	Source of 'HITS'
2001​	11 players in; 5 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	11	5​	2​	0​
2002​	12 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (Rooks)	12	2​	1​	1​	Rooks
2003​	8 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 0 HITS	8	3​	2​	0​
2004​	8 players in; 1 tall (1 ND as F/S); 1 HIT (ND F/S)	8	1​	1​	1​	ND F/S
2005​	9 players in; 1 tall (1 ND); 0 HITS	9	1​	1​	0​
2006​	10 players in; 5 talls (4 ND); 4 HITS (all ND)	10	5​	4​	4​	4 * ND
2007​	6 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 0 HITS	6	3​	0​	0​
2008​	11 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 2 HITS (1 trade /1 rooks)	11	3​	0​	2​	1 Trade, 1 rooks
2009​	8 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	3​	0​	1​	Trade
2010​	14 players in; 6 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	14	6​	0​	1​	Trade
2011​	10 players in; 3 talls (2 ND); 1 HIT (ND)	10	3​	2​	1​	ND
2012​	13 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 Rooks)	13	5​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 Rooks
2013​	8 players in; 2 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	8	2​	1​	1​	Trade
2014​	10 players in; 2 talls (1 ND as F/S); 2 HITS (1 ND, 1 rooks)	10	2​	1​	2​	1 ND, 1 rooks
2015​	10 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 0 HITS	10	1​	0​	0​
2016​	12 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 0 HITS	12	5​	1​	0​
2017​	7 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); 1 HIT (rooks)	7	2​	0​	1​	Rooks
2018​	9 players in; 5 talls (1 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	9	5​	1​	1​	Trade
2019​	4 players in; 1 tall (0 ND); 1 HIT (trade)	4	1​	0​	1​	Trade
Totals '01/'19	180	58	18	19​
32%​	31%​	33%​
TBC ie. too early to tell
2020​	10 players in; 3 talls (1 ND); TBC	10	3​	1​
2021​	8 players in; 2 talls (0 ND); TBC	8	2​	0​
2022​	9 players in; 3 talls (0 ND); TBC	9	3​	0​
2023​	6 players in; 1 tall (0 ND)	6	1​	0​
33	9	1
27%	11%
TOTALS	213	67	19
31%​	28%​

Greatly appreciate the time and effort you’ve taken to produce this data.
Thanks

 

[Ugene41]

Do you really believe Ned was in charge of any big decisions. He may have been charged with implementing them but Walsh, Dekka, Bucks and Eddie would have been the final decision makers ticking off what happenend.

That's what I meant, he obviously didn't just make the decision but he was in charge of implementing and negotiating the Treloar trade. Incidentally in hindsight actually managed to get a better result than the Grundy salary dump that GW negotiated.

 

[memoryofmchale]

Begg will likely be delisted at the end of the year.

So we will be looking for a ruck and most likely, he will be a mature ager.

 

[memoryofmchale]

Ok so I’ve been reading through the posts re the tall KPF debate in drafting them early etc blah blah blah.
So in the AFL team our KPF is 193cm Reef who’s a midfielder or AJ who’s a third tall at best. So let’s go to the VFL, oops we can’t because we have no one but Krueger who if he sneezes to hard breaks a rib and is really a crap forward.
My point being that they don’t draft them in any round and if they make a trade they get McStay who again is not really a key forward but we give him a long contract and a truck load of money.

We know Dekka is the problem and we get pushed around with trades either paying too much or accepting too little. The Grundy deal was terrible as was Treloar. We got screwed by other clubs and by terrible list management and we’re expected to deal with it.

I’ve said it many times I’m so glad we won the flag but what’s the cost long term. I have to remind myself that we won in 2023 and not go all “sack them all” “burn the place down” like Ive sometimes done. Mind you I was right about getting rid of Eddie and Bucks.

Dekka isn’t to blame for trades. That was Wright.

Grundy and Treloar were Ned Guy specials. He was a player agent and acted like one in a role where you have to try and secure players at the lowest price.

We have the tallest player in AFL history (allegedly - Cox isn’t sure of his height) and a proud tradition of key forwards.

 

[doofdoof]

Observations:

• 213 players (total) brought in to the club 2001-23
• Of those, 67 (31%) have been TALL (192cm or >)
• Of the 14 TALL +HITS (ie. played >100 games), 8 (71%) were ND selections (Reid, Brown, Grundy, Moore, Witts, Goldsack, Dawes, Cloke); 2 were traded in (J.Ceglar, D.Cameron ..only played 74 games but i'm projecting 100+) and 4 were rookies (Miho, Cox, Keefe, Maxwell)

So 14 Tall + Hits from 213 players, and of those 14 we had 6 rucks, 5 backs and 3 (Cloke, Dawes and Checkers) forwards.

 

[doofdoof]

Not sure how many times I need to say this - Geel are said to have the best recruiters in the game and had a gun KPF for close to 15 years.
And yet inclusive of 2010 they have won the same number of flags as Coll.
So please let’s end this absurd debate that our recruiters are crap and had they found KPF’s we’d now have more flags.
Geel have had both for 15 - and not achieved a dynasty.

People need to stop with these simplistic arguments.

Alanis could have used this in her song.

 

[sam_e]

So 14 Tall + Hits from 213 players, and of those 14 we had 6 5 rucks (Cox, Witts, Ceglar, Grundy, D.Cameron), 5 6 backs (Reid, Brown, Keffee, Goldsack, Maxwell, Moore) and 3 (Cloke, Dawes and Checkers) forwards.

would classify Keeffe primarily as a key back

 

[sr36]

I think (admittedly anecdotally given I'm not digging up data points) that it is much harder to find a key forward via trade than a mid, runner, small forward, back or ruck.

Drafting isn't easy, by any means, but the more bets you place the more likely you are to hit. We've drafted so many mids and runners over the years (with success!), but typically good mids come onto the trade market more regularly than key forwards.

It's much harder to find a KPF full stop. However, over the last 15 years - the good ones have moved clubs more than mids have.

 

[partypie]

Begg will likely be delisted at the end of the year.

So we will be looking for a ruck and most likely, he will be a mature ager.

Ned Moyle come on down.

 

[gouki88]

Ned Moyle come on down.

He would be an awesome pickup, which makes me doubt it

 

[Ugene41]

So 14 Tall + Hits from 213 players, and of those 14 we had 6 rucks, 5 backs and 3 (Cloke, Dawes and Checkers) forwards.

Reid and Moore were originally drafted as forwards.