List Mgmt. 2025 Draft/Trade/FA Thread – everything must go!

[Scythe]

Just pinning this, as per previous years. Thanks as always to Lore.

Final trade/FA period results
Out:

• Charlie Spargo
• Judd McVee
• Christian Petracca
• Clayton Oliver
• Picks 28, 42 and 61
• Melbourne Second-Rounder (2026)
• Melbourne Third-Rounder (2026)
• Melbourne Fourth-Rounder (2026)
• Melbourne Fourth-Rounder (2027)

In:

• Jack Steele
• Changkuoth Jiath
• Brody Mihocek
• Max Heath
• Oscar Berry (Rookie)
• Picks 7, 8, 37 and 71 (2025)
• GC First-Rounder (2026)
• GWS Third-Rounder (2026)
• GC Third-Rounder (2027)

 

[I Love Lamb]

Draft sets you up, but trading in key players is crucial. We don't win a flag without Oliver, Trac or Gawn as much as we don't win a flag without May, Lever or Brown. But yeah, particularly for the minnow clubs like us, Saints, Dogs etc, the draft is even more important because attracting good players is near on impossible.

Build a core through draft then wrap players around that core with top ups through trading.

We don’t even have a strong enough young core until we find some more young tall talent and maybe a zippy gun mid who can kick (and some forwards who can win a contest).

Once we have some of that, then we should look at top ups to complement and fill any remaining gaps.

Quickest way is to put anyone over 28 years old (and Sparrow) on the market and take what we can. None of those blokes will be a part of our next premiership and if anything are robbing our youth of experience.

Keep 3-4 of them for “leadership” but the rest can go.

 

[ray_purchase]

Scythe be real sweet if we could just ban this campaigner

Why, Im not allowed an opinion?

Taking Windsor ahead of Curtin was a fail.

 

[Topkent]

I'm more on the side that the windsor/kolt draft was a big miss than it wasn't but **** I'd love to see some of our players under a new coach before completely writing them off.

 

[I Love Lamb]

Why, Im not allowed an opinion?

Taking Windsor ahead of Curtin was a fail.

Low key know whoever this is
, is trying to get me banned but at the same time love the convo they are driving so I am torn.

 

[GrInPoWdErDiAh]

Why, Im not allowed an opinion?

Taking Windsor ahead of Curtin was a fail.

I preferred Curtin over Windsor pre-draft, but you can see what we were trying to do. Curtin isn't exactly blessed with any kind of leg speed, which is something we so desperately lacked (and still do mind you). We would have probably crucified the bloke so much by now that he'd have gone home at the first opportunity.

This is without even mentioning that Windsor's drop in form / stagnated development has been really since he's moved to the backline. Meanwhile Curtin's recent step up aligns with him moving from playing mostly forward to up on the wing, so..

That all being said, Tholstrup is a hard sell for me.

 

[TheBoss]

A lot of people here are trying to excuse Windsor's drop-off by saying he's wasted at half-back. I think that is letting him off the hook too easily.

If he has talent then he would show it, regardless of role. Plenty of elite mids have started across half-back and thrived. Naicos looked like a Brownlow medalist from day one. Walsh spent time behind the ball early and never missed a beat. Whitfield made a career slicing up teams from half-back. It's where smart clubs develop ball users and decision-makers.

If Windsor was a genuine top-10 draft talent then this role should be a springboard, not a roadblock.

Sure, he has pace. But if he can't read the play, apply pressure or use the ball cleanly under pressure then what exactly is his AFL weapon? Half-back is the modern midfielder's proving ground and if he can't cut it there then maybe the issue is the player and not the role.

We might have completely botched the 2023 draft. Tholstrup at pick 13?! A speculative reach at the time and so far he's shown nothing to justify that selection. Other clubs picked up instant contributors with better haircuts later in the draft.

If Windsor and Tholstrup don't come good then the 2023 draft will be an absolute disaster. Especially considering we made those picks under the delusion that we were still in a flag window.

 

[GrInPoWdErDiAh]

A lot of people here are trying to excuse Windsor's drop-off by saying he's wasted at half-back. I think that is letting him off the hook too easily.

I'm not letting him off the hook, but it does take all types. All the blokes you listed are superstars to be fair, they would be good in just about any position. Windsor is therefore highly unlikely to be a star, so yes he is probably a miss at his draft position. But he could still quite easily yet be a solid contributor on a wing for 150-200 games.

If we get the same out of Tholstrup however I will be surprised. There are a lot of guys from that draft still contributing little to none, Morris and Freijah are the clear outliers of the pool after Tholstrup was picked. Probably something still to be said about Covid impacting the development pathways of these guys pre-draft.

 

[Demon Attack]

A lot of people here are trying to excuse Windsor's drop-off by saying he's wasted at half-back. I think that is letting him off the hook too easily.

If he has talent then he would show it, regardless of role. Plenty of elite mids have started across half-back and thrived. Naicos looked like a Brownlow medalist from day one. Walsh spent time behind the ball early and never missed a beat. Whitfield made a career slicing up teams from half-back. It's where smart clubs develop ball users and decision-makers.

If Windsor was a genuine top-10 draft talent then this role should be a springboard, not a roadblock.

Sure, he has pace. But if he can't read the play, apply pressure or use the ball cleanly under pressure then what exactly is his AFL weapon? Half-back is the modern midfielder's proving ground and if he can't cut it there then maybe the issue is the player and not the role.

We might have completely botched the 2023 draft. Tholstrup at pick 13?! A speculative reach at the time and so far he's shown nothing to justify that selection. Other clubs picked up instant contributors with better haircuts later in the draft.

If Windsor and Tholstrup don't come good then the 2023 draft will be an absolute disaster. Especially considering we made those picks under the delusion that we were still in a flag window.

You listed 2 number 1 picks and the best player in the comp, who probably would have gone 1 if he wasn't father son.

Windsor will never be a huge ball winner but he showed plenty last year in his proper position. Just play him there ffs. Adjust in-season when a pre-season concept doesn't work. Even this year he has had moments, eg the goal against Eagles.

 

[I Love Lamb]

You listed 2 number 1 picks and the best player in the comp, who probably would have gone 1 if he wasn't father son.

Windsor will never be a huge ball winner but he showed plenty last year in his proper position. Just play him there ffs. Adjust in-season when a pre-season concept doesn't work. Even this year he has had moments, eg the goal against Eagles.

What about Rozee? Sheezal? Zorko? Nick Martin? Jack Crisp? Max Holmes?

Plenty have gone behind the ball and sometimes impressed more. The boss makes a good point.

I noticed in 2024, Windsor had next to no accountability for his opposing Wingmen which is why he was able to get ahead of the ball loose a few times. Partially was because he was so far off his opponent when we got a turn over. So I can see the thinking of trying to make him accountable down back

Re Tholstrupp he is just becoming Sparrow 2.0

 

[TheBoss]

For clarity, I think Windsor will be a good player eventually.

When all our *players are down on their 2024 form it screams that it is an issue with coaching, preparation and fitness. I don't see any other reason for 40 odd players to have career worse seasons simultaneously.

*Gawn, Bowey and Pickett are exceptions

 

[Demon Attack]

What about Rozee? Sheezal? Zorko? Nick Martin? Jack Crisp? Max Holmes?

Plenty have gone behind the ball and sometimes impressed more. The boss makes a good point.

I noticed in 2024, Windsor had next to no accountability for his opposing Wingmen which is why he was able to get ahead of the ball loose a few times. Partially was because he was so far off his opponent when we got a turn over. So I can see the thinking of trying to make him accountable down back

Re Tholstrupp he is just becoming Sparrow 2.0

Those guys were/are the number one distributor. Bowey is the player we look for to get it moving. Which just adds to the move being a bust that makes little sense. JT drafted an attacking weapon and they are turning him into a low impact defender.

 

[I Love Lamb]

People’s thoughts of U22 best 22? Not biding well for Taylor.

FULL TEAM

B: N. Wanganeen-Milera (STK), M. Andrew (GCS), J. Fletcher (BRL)
HB: J. Weddle (HAW), C. O’Sullivan (GEE), L. Humphries (GEE)
C: O. Dempsey (GEE), W. Ashcroft (BRL), D. Curtin (ADE)
HF: H. Sheezel (NTH) (vc), A. Cadman (GWS), B. Humphrey (GCS)
F: P. Curtis (NTH), L. Morris (BRL), J. Rachele (ADE)
R: S. Darcy (WBD), N. Daicos (COL) (c), F. Callaghan (GWS)
I/C: J. Horne-Francis (PTA), J. Freijah (WBD), H. Reid (WCE), N. Watson (HAW)

 

[Daemon]

People’s thoughts of U22 best 22? Not biding well for Taylor.

FULL TEAM

B: N. Wanganeen-Milera (STK), M. Andrew (GCS), J. Fletcher (BRL)
HB: J. Weddle (HAW), C. O’Sullivan (GEE), L. Humphries (GEE)
C: O. Dempsey (GEE), W. Ashcroft (BRL), D. Curtin (ADE)
HF: H. Sheezel (NTH) (vc), A. Cadman (GWS), B. Humphrey (GCS)
F: P. Curtis (NTH), L. Morris (BRL), J. Rachele (ADE)
R: S. Darcy (WBD), N. Daicos (COL) (c), F. Callaghan (GWS)
I/C: J. Horne-Francis (PTA), J. Freijah (WBD), H. Reid (WCE), N. Watson (HAW)

Nope. I'm not doing this. Good day.

 

[Lampers]

People’s thoughts of U22 best 22? Not biding well for Taylor.

FULL TEAM

B: N. Wanganeen-Milera (STK), M. Andrew (GCS), J. Fletcher (BRL)
HB: J. Weddle (HAW), C. O’Sullivan (GEE), L. Humphries (GEE)
C: O. Dempsey (GEE), W. Ashcroft (BRL), D. Curtin (ADE)
HF: H. Sheezel (NTH) (vc), A. Cadman (GWS), B. Humphrey (GCS)
F: P. Curtis (NTH), L. Morris (BRL), J. Rachele (ADE)
R: S. Darcy (WBD), N. Daicos (COL) (c), F. Callaghan (GWS)
I/C: J. Horne-Francis (PTA), J. Freijah (WBD), H. Reid (WCE), N. Watson (HAW)

14 of those 22 players Taylor/Melbourne didn’t have access to.

Father/Sons or picked prior to Melbourne’s first natural pick.

Melbourne tried to get all of Reid, Watson and Humphrey. Without a rule change they would’ve landed Andrew instead of JVR.

The only realistic picks that could potentially be seen as misses in all of that - realistic being Melbourne selected a different prospect in favour of a somewhat equally rated junior - are Curtin and O’Sullivan when Windsor was favoured. So only one of those can be considered a miss as both couldn’t have been drafted instead of Windsor.

The remaining players either slid reasonably deep which means hardly anyone rated them, or they were considered bolters or a bit of a surprise to be picked as high as they were.

This isn’t a “gotcha” moment.

 

[I Love Lamb]

14 of those 22 players Taylor/Melbourne didn’t have access to.

Father/Sons or picked prior to Melbourne’s first natural pick.

Melbourne tried to get all of Reid, Watson and Humphrey. Without a rule change they would’ve landed Andrew instead of JVR.

The only realistic picks that could potentially be seen as misses in all of that - realistic being Melbourne selected a different prospect in favour of a somewhat equally rated junior - are Curtin and O’Sullivan when Windsor was favoured. So only one of those can be considered a miss as both couldn’t have been drafted instead of Windsor.

The remaining players either slid reasonably deep which means hardly anyone rated them, or they were considered bolters or a bit of a surprise to be picked as high as they were.

This isn’t a “gotcha” moment.

Fair take.

 

[Demon Attack]

17/22 in top 9 teams too. Bit of chicken and the egg but if our senior players actually played well this year you'd probably see some of our young guys in there.

 

[Lampers]

Fair take.

Ok, I’d like to report a hacker takeover of Mich0 ’s account.

 

[Daemon]

Ok, I’d like to report a hacker takeover of Mich0 ’s account.

I think we should point the detective in the ray_purchase direction

 

[I Love Lamb]

I think we should point the detective in the ray_purchase direction

Missing my new best mate ray_purchase, where you at

 

[markm106]

The draft is so comprised. Northern states should be in finals every season with the players they seemingly have coming through most years. F/S and academy have helped Collingwood win a flag and Geelong’s ability to attract players helped them to one.
Hopefully the AFL tighten academy rules. I’d be happy if we just scrapped all academy and F/S. just make it a level playing field. It makes it very hard for a team that bottoms out to work their way up. North have missed out on talents like Daicos and Ashcroft. They’ll never ditch F/S or northern academies but surely they can tighten it up.
I think we have a decent group of youth but we got to be very careful not to fall off a cliff.

 

[markm106]

There’s an argument to be made for Windsor and JVR to be having down years but will
Still be very good players. Not uncommon for young players to have a dip in form.
Jefferson I have less confidence in. But want to see him with a decent run. I’ll hold fire on Tholstrup given he had no pre season.

 

[I Love Lamb]

The draft is so comprised. Northern states should be in finals every season with the players they seemingly have coming through most years. F/S and academy have helped Collingwood win a flag and Geelong’s ability to attract players helped them to one.
Hopefully the AFL tighten academy rules. I’d be happy if we just scrapped all academy and F/S. just make it a level playing field. It makes it very hard for a team that bottoms out to work their way up. North have missed out on talents like Daicos and Ashcroft. They’ll never ditch F/S or northern academies but surely they can tighten it up.
I think we have a decent group of youth but we got to be very careful not to fall off a cliff.

Saw an article recently that talked about the northern academies booming with talent due to the cash being injected into the region whereas Victorian talent was falling away due to lack of cash injection.

While I get that if they develop these kids off there own merit, but if they are being boosted by cash from the AFL on top of that then it’s a bit of a piss take.

Fair enough if all regions got the same cash injection and same talent coming through but now it’s magnified in one region, priority access to that region should be scrapped as they are basically gaming the whole system in favor of a few teams.

 

[Charlie_s123]

Not sure it’s time to write off Windsor in a year where our ‘AA’ players have completely shit the bed. The club is obviously not a place for careers to flourish at the moment.

 

[Charlie_s123]

I think we should point the detective in the ray_purchase direction

 

[Lampers]

Saw an article recently that talked about the northern academies booming with talent due to the cash being injected into the region whereas Victorian talent was falling away due to lack of cash injection.

While I get that if they develop these kids off there own merit, but if they are being boosted by cash from the AFL on top of that then it’s a bit of a piss take.

Fair enough if all regions got the same cash injection and same talent coming through but now it’s magnified in one region, priority access to that region should be scrapped as they are basically gaming the whole system in favor of a few teams.

I think what gets a little bit lost is the academies in NSW and QLD are a strategic play. That’s why the AFL will keep them there until such time (if ever) that Australian football is the natural first choice football code for locals - which is the case in the other states already.

The AFL are trying to grow the code and the pool of available players. To grow the code they need to have at least one of each of the QLD and NSW teams being good at any time so they stay in the local news. So kids want to watch their local team and choose Australian footy over League.

The AFL don’t give a stuff if in 2023 St Kilda or North have missed out on some talent as a result. That’s short term thinking and the AFL isn’t and shouldn’t be concerned with the impacts on one club in one year.

So I think what many see as a negative the AFL see as a massive positive.

Over time the idea would be Gold Coast, for example, due to salary cap won’t be able to retain all their talent anyway. So those players, who without the academy probably never existed, will flow to other clubs. It also should solve the go home factor that Brisbane, Gold Coast and GWS (but strangely not Sydney so much) have suffered from as the core of their lists should be locals.

I actually think it’s the right strategic call and they are calls of at least a quarter of a century type timeframes to see the payoff.