List Mgmt. 2025 List Management III 📃

[Aphrodite]

Continued from here:-

List Mgmt. - 2025 List Management II 📃

www.bigfooty.com

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Who said Ben should play Wing or HB?

Apparently me because I'm severely hungover and misread the post

 

[SurreyBlue]

If we don’t change our midfield mix to add run and carry with ONE inside bull at ONE time, we have learnt nothing and are going nowhere. Opposition coaches who can counter our inside game with spread, have been laughing at us.

 

[Soapy V]

If we don’t change our midfield mix to add run and carry with ONE inside bull at ONE time, we have learnt nothing and are going nowhere. Opposition coaches who can counter our inside game with spread, have been laughing at us.

Lions last year had only Dunkley as a pure in and under. Neale McLuggage Ashcroft Bailey with bursts from Rayner Cameron & Lohman are all skilful creators that can also win their own ball.

That is the modern midfield and what we need

Their other advantage is Zorko Fletcher off HB and Wilmot on a Wing. There is leg speed and they all play like midfielders and they also work brilliantly as a group

If we keep relying on Cripps & Hewett we are in trouble

 

[marcmurphy3]

If we don’t change our midfield mix to add run and carry with ONE inside bull at ONE time, we have learnt nothing and are going nowhere. Opposition coaches who can counter our inside game with spread, have been laughing at us.

I think we'll definately mix it up and get more speed through the midfield. That said, we are limited by the players we have and most our best midfielders aren't quick. Can't dump them in favour of inferior players just because we want speed. I think we'll find a middle ground.

How Jagga progresses could really impact. If he can play big minutes on ball straight away, we can shift our mix alot quicker. If he's playing more wing/half forward, then we'll probably look similar to this year. Cripps, Hewett, Cerra, Walsh with Jagga and some quicker types like Williams/Florent/Motlop pinching hitting. You can argue Lord should get more mid time, but hes not quick either.

 

[Soapy V]

I think we'll definately mix it up and get more speed through the midfield. That said, we are limited by the players we have and most our best midfielders aren't quick. Can't dump them in favour of inferior players just because we want speed. I think we'll find a middle ground.

Inferior players or just young?

Jagga Moir Ison Lord Chesser (Walker) would argue have talent but are just young

Many internally see Ollie & Wilson as potential mids. I’m not sure. Will we see revitalised Elijah?

The issue is you are arguing more of the same and what have that achieved? Cripps Hewett Cerra Walsh as a group will not win us a flag.

In what is an obvious reset of our side I would be disappointed if we see the same midfield in 2026

 

[marcmurphy3]

Inferior players or just young?

Jagga Moir Ison Lord Chesser (Walker) would argue have talent but are just young

Many internally see Ollie & Wilson as potential mids. I’m not sure. Will we see revitalised Elijah?

The issue is you are arguing more of the same and what have that achieved? Cripps Hewett Cerra Walsh as a group will not win us a flag.

In what is an obvious reset of our side I would be disappointed if we see the same midfield in 2026

I think Lord could get more minutes but is more of the same if we are talking about changing the mix.

I think others you mentioned could rotate through, but probably not big minutes. Jagga is obviously the main potential one, depending on how fast he progresses. Lij a great option too if he stays.

Im not saying we shouldn't try change it up. Just need to be realistic about how much and how fast we do that given our personel. Need to balance having our best mids in there, shifting the mix, and also exposing youth.

I definately think we need to modernise our midfield but see it as a multi-year project rather then something that can be forced overnight.

 

[Blue and Silver]

Lions last year had only Dunkley as a pure in and under. Neale McLuggage Ashcroft Bailey with bursts from Rayner Cameron & Lohman are all skilful creators that can also win their own ball.

That is the modern midfield and what we need

Their other advantage is Zorko Fletcher off HB and Wilmot on a Wing. There is leg speed and they all play like midfielders and they also work brilliantly as a group

If we keep relying on Cripps & Hewett we are in trouble

Neale IMO is pretty pure in and under these days.

But it's a quibble and I take your general point

 

[BlueTongue]

Walsh's best seasons have all been playing on ball, including his 3rd season. Cerra has also played his best football on ball. There's no reason we should be trying to push them back out to a wing where they played during their early development stages.

We play our best footy when those two are up and running on ball, as we saw in 2023 when Cripps was well down on his best and we still had the most potent midfield in the comp.

I went looking for an update on Walsh's back issues and found this from Andrew Russell

“Overly dramatic”: Former Blues high performance boss weighs in on Sam Walsh injury issues

“He was one of the fittest young guys that I’d met. He spent a lot of time on it.”

www.sen.com.au

I must say I am guilty of getting sucked in by all the negative soft tissue hype that was around him just before he 'retired'.

I have really liked his open honest conversations around the club since his departure (which haven't been 'sour grapes' despite him having good reason). TBH, with the benefit of hindsight and hearing his side of the story, I think we pushed him out too early.

 

[Soapy V]

Neale IMO is pretty pure in and under these days.

But it's a quibble and I take your general point

As I said they do both. Neale can spread and create. Issue for us is Cripps and Hewett are slow and poor users from stoppage. Also get exposed defensively when ball gets out

 

[GoBlues!]

Inferior players or just young?

Jagga Moir Ison Lord Chesser (Walker) would argue have talent but are just young

Many internally see Ollie & Wilson as potential mids. I’m not sure. Will we see revitalised Elijah?

The issue is you are arguing more of the same and what have that achieved? Cripps Hewett Cerra Walsh as a group will not win us a flag.

In what is an obvious reset of our side I would be disappointed if we see the same midfield in 2026

Agree, I think we’ll be in a reset period over the next couple of years with Hewett, Cerra and Cripps playing less midfield time together.

Would like to see Cripps play more forward time and allow more midfield time for the younger players.

 

[Jimmae]

Kemp isn't clean enough below his knees to play on ball imo. Has the body shape and the athletic profile to be a great addition but not the skills and smarts for the role for mine. If I was going to switch anyone around to play that role I'd be giving it to Cowan who is extremely clean at ground level and also provides dash and physicality around contests.

Robey would be great but virtually impossible given the early interest in Dean and the need to bank points for Walker next year.

I think he's fine below his knees as well, I've mostly seen this question get dodged by people who are in industry, so I assume it's considered an aptitude or reactions issue, but he doesn't strike me as incapable of uncoachable. Something should click.

I did forget to include Moir in this conversation as well, ta. Cowan stays in defence so we don't have to swing Ollie or Florent there much, but if Wilson, Lucas, or Charleston kick on that's another option.

RE: banking points, we've already done that, and we're going to be trading out players next year too, that's just the nature of things as players develop and/or get starved of opportunity.

We don't need to turn this year's haul into any boon for 2026, that needs to be an offer to good to refuse, and with so much in flux in terms of ladder position that's a really tough sell.

 

[tarczonandjane]

Cerra is the puzzle for me. I want to get more pace into that onball setup, and I don’t quite see what he brings where other players aren’t ahead of him. Id love to be talked around though.

 

[Soapy V]

Cerra is the puzzle for me. I want to get more pace into that onball setup, and I don’t quite see what he brings where other players aren’t ahead of him. Id love to be talked around though.

Agree. He's an almost player. He's close but hasn't quite broken through to the top level. Good player

I am hoping that with a year under his belt and another pre season after fixing hamstring issues he will go to next level. I also feel he gets stuck too much behind Cripps & Hewett. Putting him to HB didn't help either. Needs to lead and see himself as a leader

He can win his own ball and also run okay. Not quick but not slow. Bit like Neale but no where near as productive (yet?)

At 26 it's now time

 

[marcmurphy3]

Cerra was unreal in 2023 before getting injured. Hope he can get back to that.

Having Cerra, Hewett and Cripps, all who arent quick, and cant really play anywhere else, is a real conundrum for our midfield mix. Cripps is our best player, Hewett just won our b&f and Cerra just signed for 5 years on decent coin, so hard to push one out. But we need to do something or our midfield will be the same. Walsh is more versatile, but pushing him out just makes the problem worse, since hes the one that does provide more spread and run.

Will be really interesting how we tackle this. Cripps more time forward is one obvious option but wouldn't want him to be permanent there. Hes still our best onballer.

 

[Lukeblueboy]

The midfield has always been a big watch for mine and how we go about things this preseason. Can’t get stuck with the slower brigade or we will be in trouble again imo
Very interesting to see what the coaching team muster up

 

[gbatman]

Lions last year had only Dunkley as a pure in and under. Neale McLuggage Ashcroft Bailey with bursts from Rayner Cameron & Lohman are all skilful creators that can also win their own ball.

That is the modern midfield and what we need

Their other advantage is Zorko Fletcher off HB and Wilmot on a Wing. There is leg speed and they all play like midfielders and they also work brilliantly as a group

If we keep relying on Cripps & Hewett we are in trouble

I don't think all of Cripps, Hewett and Cerra will be on the list in 1-2 years time. Especially if things go our way.

 

[gbatman]

High rotations through the midfield will be a key for us. We lack quality pace onball but not too badly if we have those forwards going through there. It's always been an issue in Voss' era, not rotating the mids enough. Will it change?

 

[gbatman]

Have a look at other teams and their lists, we are so far behind.We are not close to finals or a flag.

Lions, Suns, Cats, Hawks, Suns, Dogs, Swans, Saints, Giants, Crows, Pies - most, if not ALL of these teams are ahead of us.
Dons, Eagles, Tigers, Port, Dees, Norf - these are who we are mixing with in the short term

We just lost our BEST ruckman our BEST forward and our 2nd BEST defender. We have to take a couple of steps back to go forward and forward is at LEAST a couple of years away. As you said Jagga is pencil thin and Walker is 18 months from playing so we have a long long time to go before we challenge again.

Ok you are focusing too heavily on what we have lost and not what we have gained.

Our forward line should be improved, we have got rid of our biggest issue and that is only having 2 targets. We now have many. We have also got rid of the issue where we don't have any genuine smaller forwards.

Opposition sides used this heavily against us and now will not be able to do so unless our ball movement is shut right down.
We have one of the best tall forwards in the game as a target and a good young target as well so we are good for height, as good as this year's premier.

DeKoning was a good around the ground ruck and an ok ruck. As a ruck, he was only ok. We lose his around the ground work but that should be mopped up by better players on our flanks and midfield. Not worried here, hoping we get better ruckwork and that balances things. I know we won't get better around the ground stuff and I am ok with that.

Not worried about losing defenders, what we have is good and going to be really good.

We will be a lot quicker and have a better spread of pace and talent. We have more depth on game day and on our list. We have fixed a lot of what has been wrong for a long time on our list. Our only real main issue is pace and mobility in the centre.

We will be better than we have been the last two years. Don't underrate our list. It's ok, it will get better.

 

[Soapy V]

Cerra was unreal in 2023 before getting injured. Hope he can get back to that.

Having Cerra, Hewett and Cripps, all who arent quick, and cant really play anywhere else, is a real conundrum for our midfield mix. Cripps is our best player, Hewett just won our b&f and Cerra just signed for 5 years on decent coin, so hard to push one out. But we need to do something or our midfield will be the same. Walsh is more versatile, but pushing him out just makes the problem worse, since hes the one that does provide more spread and run.

Will be really interesting how we tackle this. Cripps more time forward is one obvious option but wouldn't want him to be permanent there. Hes still our best onballer.

This is the issue. Indivudually you could make a case for all .

Cripps is a star and a great of the club. 31 at start of season and always seems to me if he isn't 100% fit he struggles to keep up. Pace and disposal are his main problems. Things that won't get better with age. BUT no one in our side will do more to lift the side when needed. Is it enough now?

Could Cripps do the Greg Williams role of 1995?

Hewett. Had an awesome year. Same weaknesses as Cripps and 30 next season. Also, couldn't have played any better but we still struggled. Exposed defensively when sides worked us out

Cerra is still young enough and not as slow

Sadly, I don't think either are part of next Flag. So what do we do?

In 2026 I would not play them both in same midfield for most of games. Can Cripps go forward? Can we play them for 15 games each and keep them fresh when they can be more effective

Will the 5 man bench help and we cna rest/rotate them a bit more?

Hardest thing for Voss will be to have this conversation and will he do it especially when he will be under massive pressure next season

This is where Wright/Davies need to step in and with Voss have a clear direction and all be on same page

 

[BluStreak]

Thoughts on maybe making Hewitt in to a Luke Hodge / Sam Mitchell type Mid/HB with Cripps focused on Mid/Fwd role.
Regardless of which bull is in the midfield, Their main objective should be to get it to a runner, rather than bursting out of midfield themselves.

 

[gbatman]

I don’t want a star. I want a functioning forward line.

100% the two tall guns and very low quality flanks and pockets killed us.

There was a reason why the last few years we have only been somewhat of a threat to the better sides when Jack Martin was fit.

This is the thing that opposition coaches have used against us and has made us easy to coach against. It has forced us to kick to only two of our forwards all the time.

This is all about to change with more genuine forwards who have overhead games.

McKay will relish not having to play around Curnow. O'Keeffe will do really well as a second foil who goes into the ruck. Moir, Kemp, Hayward and Ainsworth are all going to give us really strong targets. Our forward line resembles Brisbane and Geelong's more now than it has in Voss' era.

 

[gbatman]

I can see us look to trade Cerra at some stage. Cripps and Hewett, we have a bigger bench now so possibly could spend more bench time there.

I would be inclined to have Cripps play more in the forward half of the ground, swap with one of the half forward after the bounce at times.

I want to see Camporeale play games next season and Lord play more.

Lord was better than Cerra last season when he got the opportunity and the team's performance benefitted from that, so that can no be forgotten despite what injuries Cerra may have been carrying.

Cerra out to a wing is another option.

Reality is what we did to our forward line this year, let a player go for some real currency and bring in a whole heap of new faces. The same needs to be down to our midfield at the end of next season.

I would be all in in regards to Butters and I would be going pretty hard at another. We let go of however many we need to of Cripps, Cerra and Hewett and bust this team right open into a modern AFL side with pace, skill and two way run.

 

[Soapy V]

100% the two tall guns and very low quality flanks and pockets killed us.

There was a reason why the last few years we have only been somewhat of a threat to the better sides when Jack Martin was fit.

This is the thing that opposition coaches have used against us and has made us easy to coach against. It has forced us to kick to only two of our forwards all the time.

This is all about to change with more genuine forwards who have overhead games.

McKay will relish not having to play around Curnow. O'Keeffe will do really well as a second foil who goes into the ruck. Moir, Kemp, Hayward and Ainsworth are all going to give us really strong targets. Our forward line resembles Brisbane and Geelong's more now than it has in Voss' era.

Surely, a good coach would be salivating at this. Look at the different types, sizes and X factor options we have

McKay - KPF
HOK - KPF
Young - Back up KPF
Kemp - Third tall
Hayward - Third tall
Moir- Taller and mobile fowd. Genuine X factor
Williams - Smart small forward with good marking skills. Midfield minutes
Ainsworth - Smart small forward that can play effective midfield minutes
Motlop - Get fit and genuine X factor small foward that reads ball well
Cottrell - Defensive forward with good skills
Elijah - Talent but........?
McGovern - great mark and kick. Has the talent to win a game
Evans - Revelation late in season. Good skills, tough and kicks goals
Ison - Young but skills and talent are there. Reminds me on Pendles

Cripps - Can play forward and worries defenders. Mark and create space

Tobyn Murray - Goal kicker from Cats being seriously looked at

Mids pushing forward

 

[Triniboy]

Can’t disagree more on Ollie v Acres.

Acres went at just over 50% efficiency by foot, Ollie at 70%. Ollie covered the ground much better than Acres last year. Acres goalkicking was horrible last year 28% lol, and the smart ass grin every time he butchered a shot for goal. We tried to shop Acres around and there were not takers so we are stuck with him.

thanks for the stats … out of interest what was Cerra’s efficiency ?

 

[Big Delut]

Thoughts on maybe making Hewitt in to a Luke Hodge / Sam Mitchell type Mid/HB with Cripps focused on Mid/Fwd role.
Regardless of which bull is in the midfield, Their main objective should be to get it to a runner, rather than bursting out of midfield themselves.

I just don't think Hewett has the kicking ability to play that role well. We want players who can kick as well as provide run and carry from that position and he can do neither unfortunately.