ICC Chairman - "Test cricket is dying"

[footyfan1978]

You said above that you don’t have fox and you only just got Kayo.

So aside from Australia touring England, how do you watch any overseas cricket?

Kayo has Foxtel cricket channel on there. Hence recently I been able to watch cricket from West Indies in morning.
BTW, Australia touring England is not only tour overseas that been on FTA tv.
1991 and 1995 tours of West Indies were also on free to air. Pretty sure one or two tours of South Africa were too, a decade or two ago. I also sure saw Kiwi Tests when we played them at times. Not every tour though. Most are never shown now.
Also before had Kayo last year someone in my household had some android box connected to tv and somehow was able to see quite a bit of South Africa Tests.
Was not reliable like Kayo stream though. Pretty happy now can watch all the cricket I want.

 

[PhatBoy]

Kayo has Foxtel cricket channel on there. Hence recently I been able to watch cricket from West Indies in morning.
BTW, Australia touring England is not only tour overseas that been on FTA tv.
1991 and 1995 tours of West Indies were also on free to air. Pretty sure one or two tours of South Africa were to a decade or two ago. I also sure saw Kiwi Tests when we played them at times. Not every tour though. Most are never shown now.
Also before had Kayo last year someone in my household had some android box connected to tv and somehow was able to see quite a bit of South Africa Tests.
Was not reliable like Kayo stream though. Pretty happy now can watch all the cricket I want.

I meant recent ones. I know the ones you mentioned were.

 

[Park cricketer]

I can't wait for the world cup to get over and the test championship to start really. I was immediately attracted at the prospect of having a "grand final" in test cricket to find who is the supreme team when I first heard the idea of test championship being pitched.

It's interesting more so because there's the potential for a final happening at a neutral venue for both teams, which would give you an idea about the versatility of teams and their ability to adapt to alien conditions. Imagine an Australia vs England grand final on a turner in the Eden Gardens or an India vs Pakistan grand final on a quick and bouncy wicket at Perth. It's an awesome idea and I can't wait for the grand final at Lords in 2021, irrespective of whatever team makes it. Even if my team doesn't make it, as a neutral, the prospect of a final for a test championship is so enticing to watch for me. Bring on the test championship!

 

[Richard Pryor]

India - while not amazing - would surely be considered at least competent at all areas wouldn’t they?

No openers

 

[PhatBoy]

No openers

Right at this very instant I’d agree but it hasn’t just been a relentlessly bleak operation over an extensive period

 

[Richard Pryor]

Right at this very instant I’d agree but it hasn’t just been a relentlessly bleak operation over an extensive period

True, but that wasn't really the point I was trying to argue. My point was that while, as you say, there's never been a time where all Test teams have been competitive at the same level, I think what makes this era seem poor in comparison to the past is that every side has players who are arguably not Test standard in their first Test XI, which hasn't really been the case for some time, as usually the top side has at least one full XI of unarguably top class players.

Although will admit I'm basing this on vibe, stat analysis could tank it.

 

[PhatBoy]

True, but that wasn't really the point I was trying to argue. My point was that while, as you say, there's never been a time where all Test teams have been competitive at the same level, I think what makes this era seem poor in comparison to the past is that every side has players who are arguably not Test standard in their first Test XI, which hasn't really been the case for some time, as usually the top side has at least one full XI of unarguably top class players.

Although will admit I'm basing this on vibe, stat analysis could tank it.

De Villiers scuttles an otherwise fairly watertight statistical case for SA - two good openers, Amla and Du Plessis in the middle order, Bavuma who fills that Gus Logie type role at 6 where weight of runs probably takes a back seat to when he makes them, gun keeper batsman and any one of 5-6 quality bowlers including a good spinner. As it stands they have a gap between Amla at 3 and Faf at five. De Bryun looks the most likely to maybe fill it. That doesn’t factor in that Amla isn’t the player he used to be though, either.

NZ have a fairly solid line up bar the spin role.

 

[Park cricketer]

No openers

Early days, but I think Shaw and Agarwal are promising openers. Both were knocking down on the door heavily with prolific performances for India A across the world. Murali Vijay was past it about an year and half ago and Rahul was mentally lost after he lost his test technique to T20 cricket form.

I guess the selectors were reluctant to pick two rookie openers for a tough overseas year and Shaw only got picked in England at last because he made it so hard for the selectors to ignore him with his performances in the Ranji trophy and India A setup, and Vijay and Rahul's failures in SA and England made it an easier task. As we're speaking, Agarwal has just fallen short of a brisk century by 5 runs in the Irani trophy match (basically a match up that happens after every Ranji trophy between that year's Ranji trophy winners and a Rest of India team made up of the best players of that Ranji season) happening right now.

 

[MC Bad Genius]

Early days, but I think Shaw and Agarwal are promising openers. Both were knocking down on the door heavily with prolific performances for India A across the world. Murali Vijay was past it about an year and half ago and Rahul was mentally lost after he lost his test technique to T20 cricket form.

I guess the selectors were reluctant to pick two rookie openers for a tough overseas year and Shaw only got picked in England at last because he made it so hard for the selectors to ignore him with his performances in the Ranji trophy and India A setup, and Vijay and Rahul's failures in SA and England made it an easier task. As we're speaking, Agarwal has just fallen short of a brisk century by 5 runs in the Irani trophy match (basically a match up that happens after every Ranji trophy between that year's Ranji trophy winners and a Rest of India team made up of the best players of that Ranji season) happening right now.

That sort of thing would be interesting to see in Australia after the Shield final!

 

[Leeda]

very good lads.. commentation on these few stars of the game is going to equal the viagra... no n... viagra falls.. shit..

I don't make this stuff up.. you know what you need to do.. splash and foam and get the Smith and Warner on board...
Quick Smart... Very Smart...

 

[Leeda]

So India and Sth Africa are the lads to challenge in 'all' forms of the game.. Everyone else is just chatting about the
way of the world and the level of the spinners, run makers, tiny small bowlers, and even those whiny keepers are
giving us something/nothing..

goofer all of us..

 

[Park cricketer]

That sort of thing would be interesting to see in Australia after the Shield final!

Apparently England has one too.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/cricket...broad-named-mcc-captain-champion-county-match

 

[DamoESP]

I don't think its dying, I just think they can't make as money from Tests as they can T20. Also, not everyone likes T20, I think its Mickey Mouse cricket that is good for a bit of hit and giggle but thats it. So they continue to push BBL down our throats and all it does is make people turn off.

I spent more time staying up to watch the Eng vs WI test series (and also SA vs Pak when it was on), than I did any of the BBL this summer.

 

[King Elvis]

"If you look at the TRPs of the broadcasters, T20 has the maximum TRP."
In other words, it is dying because the ICC like most sporting bodies (and all national cricket bodies) will be putting money ahead of the sport they are supposed to be custodians of.

Bingo.

If Test cricket is dying, it’s because the governing bodies are murdering it.

 

[Kappa]

I think the problem is that administrators (and the mainstream media to a lesser extent) completely underestimate the patience and intelligence of the sporting public. It’s often assumed that we’re the great unwashed and all we want are sixes every over and wickets tumbling left right and centre, loud music playing, fireworks going off, pre-match entertainment and cheerleaders dancing whenever there’s a lull in play. T20 leagues around the world provide that hit-and-giggle style of cricket that it’s assumed we’re all craving, hence statements from administrators and articles from the media proclaim that test cricket is dying because it’s boring and no one has the patience for it anymore.

Maybe I’m naive in thinking that most cricket followers (and even more casual sports followers) have a thirst for a deeper contest than shorter forms of the game can provide, but I just don’t buy the simple line of thinking that test cricket has no future. In my opinion it has a fair way to run yet.

Attendances and ratings prove that the cricket public greatly prefers T20 cricket over Test cricket unfortunately.

 

[Kappa]

Bingo.

If Test cricket is dying, it’s because the governing bodies are murdering it.

It's more than that, it's a changing culture. Nowadays people are so busy and have 1 million different entertainment options all coming at them on demand at lightning speed that it's becoming increasingly hard for people to spend time watching slow test cricket, technology is training us to prefer instant gratification and our patience is decreasing.

Make no mistake, Test Cricket is not in a healthy state outside of a small handful of countries. It doesn't help that Test Cricket shoots itself in the foot so often, constantly looking at ways to stop play and waste time. The fact that the majority of Test series have no "greater" context or meaning also hurts, like what was the point of beating Sri Lanka? It's a meaningless series like so many are.

 

[corbies]

Attendances and ratings prove that the cricket public greatly prefers T20 cricket over Test cricket unfortunately.

In Australia, Test cricket out rates the Big Bash the majority of the time.

 

[Blue1980]

The discrepancy between sides home and away needs to be addressed. Either more warm up matches or neutral curators, whatever.

It would be like in the AFL if say if West Coast beat their closest rivals like collingwood, Melbourne and Richmond by 12+ goals everyone they played at home and then lost by 12+ every time they played away. Sure the blowouts happen (like the prelim last year) but their an exception as opposed to the rule.

Look at the ashes series from 06-07 onwards, very one sided to the home side except 10-11.

 

[big_e]

The discrepancy between sides home and away needs to be addressed. Either more warm up matches or neutral curators, whatever.

It would be like in the AFL if say if West Coast beat their closest rivals like collingwood, Melbourne and Richmond by 12+ goals everyone they played at home and then lost by 12+ every time they played away. Sure the blowouts happen (like the prelim last year) but their an exception as opposed to the rule.

Look at the ashes series from 06-07 onwards, very one sided to the home side except 10-11.

Funny you should mention West Coast - they have built a ground the same dimensions as the MCG at their new training base so they can train effectively for games they will play there.

On a similar note, CA built a sub-continent style pitch at the Centre of Excellence



So theoretically, more warm-up matches aren't necessarily needed, it's about having better facilities, training better, and being smarter about planning and execution. That may be more warm-up matches or it could be sending A teams on tour a year earlier to give fringe players a look at the wickets and conditions. It could be taking their own chef on tour. Anything that makes it easier for the touring players.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

Attendances and ratings prove that the cricket public greatly prefers T20 cricket over Test cricket unfortunately.

What can we make of that though? You look at the average BBL crowd and it's inundated with kids flossing away to their hearts' content. I'm not sure I wish to think of them as the "cricket public". Those kids would be there no matter what was going on out in the middle. It could be a monster truck rally for all they care. Dads simply cannot drag 4 kids along to Test matches because looking after them and catering for them for 6 hours would drive anyone insane. IMHO the true "cricket public" prefer Test matches, it's just that many of them are unable to attend for one reason or another.

 

[PhatBoy]

The discrepancy between sides home and away needs to be addressed. Either more warm up matches or neutral curators, whatever.

It would be like in the AFL if say if West Coast beat their closest rivals like collingwood, Melbourne and Richmond by 12+ goals everyone they played at home and then lost by 12+ every time they played away. Sure the blowouts happen (like the prelim last year) but their an exception as opposed to the rule.

Look at the ashes series from 06-07 onwards, very one sided to the home side except 10-11.

If you actually look deep into the figures, the advantage for home sides has barely changed in 50 years.

Between 1970 and 1990, in all games with a result, the home side won 62 per cent.

Since 2000, the home side has won 63.3 per cent.

Now the draw numbers I imagine would have changed significantly but as far as results go, you’re statistically barely more likely to get a win at home nowadays than you were 30-40 years ago.

It’s always been tough, and the ability to win away from home is precisely what makes the great sides stand out - the three greatest statistical dynasties in the last 50 years (WI, Aus, SA) have all achieved that status because they could compete overseas.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

I just do not see that happening. The schedule around the world with T20 tournaments has too much money it is just not going to happen. Players just do not make themselves available if they are doing well for themselves in T20 circuit as they have money to make. We already see guys like Chris Lynn basically just forego longer form cricket for T20 cricket as he commits to T20 tournaments around the world. He has money to make and who can blame him. Unless our board gives him monetary incentive to make first class cricket worthwhile to skip some T20 tournaments things are not changing on that front any time soon. It really is up to boards around the world have the will to want to make Test cricket more important in the schedule and giving enough lead up games to allow touring teams to adjust. ICC are pretty toothless on these matters.

Suppressing Twenty20 or using it as a shield for Tests won't work for long. The money's too good and the people working will want it.

The SANFL took money from the Crows and Power for a while. And then eventually the Crows and Power got jack of it.

State of Origin was a big deal in Australian rules football. Then one day the AFL and supporters realised they just didn't care anymore. The club competition had surpassed it.

Test cricket will end like this.

What can we make of that though? You look at the average BBL crowd and it's inundated with kids flossing away to their hearts' content. I'm not sure I wish to think of them as the "cricket public". Those kids would be there no matter what was going on out in the middle. It could be a monster truck rally for all they care. Dads simply cannot drag 4 kids along to Test matches because looking after them and catering for them for 6 hours would drive anyone insane. IMHO the true "cricket public" prefer Test matches, it's just that many of them are unable to attend for one reason or another.

30 years from now those kids will be adults with memories of supporting a BBL team all their life and get their own kids into it. Today's 40-year-old Test devotees will be dribbling shit in a nursing home.

 

[footyfan1978]

State of Origin was a big deal in Australian rules football. Then one day the AFL and supporters realised they just didn't care anymore. The club competition had surpassed it.

Test cricket will end like this.

Very poor analogy. Does not really apply. State of Origin was always a one off game. Nothing like Test cricket that is an ongoing series.
State of Origin is not off the schedule because supporters did not care. It got taken away because they put it on at the worst time possible and the best teams were not being put on field. People will lose interest if it is not the real thing and in the 90's we got watered down version. Clubs paying players higher and higher money were influencing enough players to not risk injury it just not worth doing in the club season. That is why it is no longer programmed.

There are about 10 to 12 Tests per side, not one game a year like State of Origin had. As good as State of Origin was in 80's when still had most top players taking part it still was an exhibition game of skill rather than something you put months and months of training into. Test cricket is stagnant for vastly different reasons.

 

[PhatBoy]

Suppressing Twenty20 or using it as a shield for Tests won't work for long. The money's too good and the people working will want it.

The SANFL took money from the Crows and Power for a while. And then eventually the Crows and Power got jack of it.

State of Origin was a big deal in Australian rules football. Then one day the AFL and supporters realised they just didn't care anymore. The club competition had surpassed it.

Test cricket will end like this.



30 years from now those kids will be adults with memories of supporting a BBL team all their life and get their own kids into it. Today's 40-year-old Test devotees will be dribbling shit in a nursing home.

The club competitive surpassed origin because it was the same product only better.

Tests and T20 are not the same product, and by any score the best contest and highest quality cricket will always remain the test format so there will always be people who care

 

[corbies]

Suppressing Twenty20 or using it as a shield for Tests won't work for long. The money's too good and the people working will want it.

The SANFL took money from the Crows and Power for a while. And then eventually the Crows and Power got jack of it.

State of Origin was a big deal in Australian rules football. Then one day the AFL and supporters realised they just didn't care anymore. The club competition had surpassed it.

Test cricket will end like this.



30 years from now those kids will be adults with memories of supporting a BBL team all their life and get their own kids into it. Today's 40-year-old Test devotees will be dribbling shit in a nursing home.

This time last year you were stating the Big Bash's long term ambition will be it running from October to March and how the increased length of this season would be great so you will forgive me for taking your predictions with a grain of salt.