Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion Part II

[Beer n Skittles]

Pretty sure that's wrong HBF. On Friday night footy, Ralph mentioned Kelly has been offered $800K * 2 and Hopper has been offered $450K * 2. I don't think anything would've changed from last Friday night to increase Hopper's value by so much

Could be resigned to losing Kelly, and now using the freed up cash to make sure they don't lose Hopper.

It's what I expect them to do, and why I don't think anyone will be able to pry multiple players out of GWS.

 

[dumb]

Carlton wouldn't be interested in Elton or Griffiths, and I'm not sure the Northern Blues would either.

no doubt about that. a few of the richmond forwards would have to be assessing their own options if it comes about. you're a tall on the richmond list, your team likes a lot of small forwards running around and you've been leapfrogged by casboult. time for your manager to earn his money.

 

[Azul]

well then... perhaps we should swoop on a todd elton or a ben griffiths. neither are going to get a game while casboult is in the team.

Griffiths can play, somewhat - he's been out injured all year.

 

[Arr0w]

I am very supportive and feel necessary that the clubs that finish in the bottom 3-4 need more than just 1 draft pick per round to help turn over their list and climb the ladder.

Think we could create a thread to discuss all the permutations on how to improve the level of competitiveness of the competition.

I agree, we need slight changes and perhaps the NFL FA model will not work here, but needs to be considered.

Another option would be to increase the level of compensation for the teams outside the top 8 who lose a FA. While sticking to the same formula to determine where the first compensation pick should be, an additional pick could be added.

Example: If Gibbs was a UFA and we lost him to AFC, if that compensation pick was directly after our 1st, we would also obtain pick 3, then an extra pick could be added at the end of the 1st round. That would not restrict players moving to their club of choice and CFC being compensated better to help to secure better players through trade/draft.

Personally, I would remove the PP altogether, in favour of slight amendments such as above

 

[Jeremias]

no doubt about that. a few of the richmond forwards would have to be assessing their own options if it comes about. you're a tall on the richmond list, your team likes a lot of small forwards running around and you've been leapfrogged by casboult. time for your manager to earn his money.

Elton has managed to stay on Richmond's list for 6 years and has played just the 10 senior games, including 6 this year.

I'd say his manager has done a great job convincing the Tigers to keep him on for as long as they have.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

I am very supportive and feel necessary that the clubs that finish in the bottom 3-4 need more than just 1 draft pick per round to help turn over their list and climb the ladder.

I've always thought this as well. The bottom team only gets one pick before the top team and then you always pick after them. If the top team and the bottom side have the same success rate at the draft then the bottom side only gains one player a year. If the bottom side stuffs up thier first pick they actually fall further behind the top side.
I think all non final sides should be given an extra pick after the second round

 

[Wily trout]

Think we could create a thread to discuss all the permutations on how to improve the level of competitiveness of the competition.

I agree, we need slight changes and perhaps the NFL FA model will not work here, but needs to be considered.

Another option would be to increase the level of compensation for the teams outside the top 8 who lose a FA. While sticking to the same formula to determine where the first compensation pick should be, an additional pick could be added.

Example: If Gibbs was a UFA and we lost him to AFC, if that compensation pick was directly after our 1st, we would also obtain pick 3, then an extra pick could be added at the end of the 1st round. That would not restrict players moving to their club of choice and CFC being compensated better to help to secure better players through trade/draft.

Personally, I would remove the PP altogether, in favour of slight amendments such as above

Maybe also add, that losing a player to FA, and then picking up a FA doesn't do your club's compensation pick/s any harm either. This would reduce any player backlash at clubs not wanting to go after FA because of fear of losing picks.

 

[Jimthegreat]

Griffiths can play, somewhat - he's been out injured all year.

Been out with concussion issues for a long time.

 

[Funk]

How could asking for a PP possibly destroy our culture?

Excellent question!!!!

 

[Jimthegreat]

Retirement of Denis Armfield. .

"Dear xxx,

It is with a heavy heart that I write to you to declare that I will retire at season’s end.

After consulting with a number of my loved ones and close friends, I have decided that it’s time to start the next chapter of my life and bid farewell to my AFL career.

What a ride it’s been! Coming over from Perth to one of the biggest footy clubs in the country at the end of 2007, I could never have imagined that I’d still be here 10 years later. I was just aiming to play one game, so to have played 143 so far and receive Life Membership is something I’m certainly very proud of.

There are so many people to thank.

I want to thank everyone who has been at the Carlton Football Club over my ten-year career. You’ve taught me so much, and I truly consider you all my family.

To the men who have served as senior coach throughout my career, Brett Ratten, Mick Malthouse, John Barker and Brendon Bolton, thank you for having faith in me and for all of your guidance. Thanks also to Shane Rogers, who was the man responsible for getting me to the Blues via the 2007 National Draft, and to all of the assistant coaches/development coaches that I have worked with throughout the years. Your patience and support won’t soon be forgotten.

To my teammates and everyone I’ve played with over the years, thank you for the memories. I’ll miss being in at the Club every day, and I’ll certainly miss all the laughs, but I’m determined to stay in touch. You won’t get rid of me that easily! The same goes with all the staff at the Club. To the medical personnel, trainers, fitness staff and weights coaches, thank you for keeping me going for all these years! I have also forged some fantastic relationships with the Club’s administration staff during my time and I’ve been involved with projects that I couldn’t have dreamed of before I started playing AFL.

To the Carlton Cheer Squad… What can I say? Thank you for always being there for me. I have loved getting to know you all over the years. I’d like to make a special mention to Caity Gough for all her support.

I’d also like to acknowledge Paul Ryan, who has been my player sponsor for my whole career. I’m sure there were better options, Paul, but I truly appreciate your loyalty! Thanks also to my manager Colin Young for all that you have done for me.

My family means the world to me, and I wouldn’t have had such a long and enjoyable career had it not been for the support of some key individuals. To my dad, thank you for always being there for me and for driving me to live my dream to play AFL. To my beautiful wife Abby, thank you for being my rock. I can’t wait to see what the next chapter of our life together brings.

Finally, to everyone who cheered me on throughout the years, thank you. You’ll never know how your support and energy drove me and motivated me.

I have loved every minute of my time at the Carlton Football Club. Never once did I take for granted the privilege of donning the Navy Blue and running out in front of our incredible members and supporters. I’m not afraid to say that there have been a few tears shed over the last week or so thinking about how much I’m going to miss the roar of the Blues faithful after a big moment, but, having played for 10 seasons, I certainly have enough memories to last me a lifetime.

It feels a bit surreal that it’s my turn to hang up the boots, but the time is right. I am certain that the Club is in the best position it’s been during my time here, and I can’t wait to see all of our youngsters blossom into the stars I know they’ll be. I promise that I’ll give my all in the coming weeks, whether at AFL or VFL level, and hopefully we can pinch a couple more wins.

I will remain a devoted Bluebagger, so you can expect this washed-up old footballer to tap you on the shoulder at some stage and ask to join you for a beer at a game! I’m happy to get the first shout!

Thank you again for all of your incredible support throughout the years. I’ll never forget it.

Dennis"

 

[Aphrodite]

From another forum. Retirement of Denis Armfield. Lods knows him.

"Dear Lods,

It is with a heavy heart that I write to you to declare that I will retire at season’s end.

After consulting with a number of my loved ones and close friends, I have decided that it’s time to start the next chapter of my life and bid farewell to my AFL career.

What a ride it’s been! Coming over from Perth to one of the biggest footy clubs in the country at the end of 2007, I could never have imagined that I’d still be here 10 years later. I was just aiming to play one game, so to have played 143 so far and receive Life Membership is something I’m certainly very proud of.

There are so many people to thank.

I want to thank everyone who has been at the Carlton Football Club over my ten-year career. You’ve taught me so much, and I truly consider you all my family.

To the men who have served as senior coach throughout my career, Brett Ratten, Mick Malthouse, John Barker and Brendon Bolton, thank you for having faith in me and for all of your guidance. Thanks also to Shane Rogers, who was the man responsible for getting me to the Blues via the 2007 National Draft, and to all of the assistant coaches/development coaches that I have worked with throughout the years. Your patience and support won’t soon be forgotten.

To my teammates and everyone I’ve played with over the years, thank you for the memories. I’ll miss being in at the Club every day, and I’ll certainly miss all the laughs, but I’m determined to stay in touch. You won’t get rid of me that easily! The same goes with all the staff at the Club. To the medical personnel, trainers, fitness staff and weights coaches, thank you for keeping me going for all these years! I have also forged some fantastic relationships with the Club’s administration staff during my time and I’ve been involved with projects that I couldn’t have dreamed of before I started playing AFL.

To the Carlton Cheer Squad… What can I say? Thank you for always being there for me. I have loved getting to know you all over the years. I’d like to make a special mention to Caity Gough for all her support.

I’d also like to acknowledge Paul Ryan, who has been my player sponsor for my whole career. I’m sure there were better options, Paul, but I truly appreciate your loyalty! Thanks also to my manager Colin Young for all that you have done for me.

My family means the world to me, and I wouldn’t have had such a long and enjoyable career had it not been for the support of some key individuals. To my dad, thank you for always being there for me and for driving me to live my dream to play AFL. To my beautiful wife Abby, thank you for being my rock. I can’t wait to see what the next chapter of our life together brings.

Finally, to everyone who cheered me on throughout the years, thank you. You’ll never know how your support and energy drove me and motivated me.

I have loved every minute of my time at the Carlton Football Club. Never once did I take for granted the privilege of donning the Navy Blue and running out in front of our incredible members and supporters. I’m not afraid to say that there have been a few tears shed over the last week or so thinking about how much I’m going to miss the roar of the Blues faithful after a big moment, but, having played for 10 seasons, I certainly have enough memories to last me a lifetime.

It feels a bit surreal that it’s my turn to hang up the boots, but the time is right. I am certain that the Club is in the best position it’s been during my time here, and I can’t wait to see all of our youngsters blossom into the stars I know they’ll be. I promise that I’ll give my all in the coming weeks, whether at AFL or VFL level, and hopefully we can pinch a couple more wins.

I will remain a devoted Bluebagger, so you can expect this washed-up old footballer to tap you on the shoulder at some stage and ask to join you for a beer at a game! I’m happy to get the first shout!

Thank you again for all of your incredible support throughout the years. I’ll never forget it.

Dennis"

Nothing to do with 'Lods knows him' and it's not a personalised email to Lods (whoever he is).

That is the exact email I received verbatim.

Army announced his retirement to Members via email.

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...tirement-thanks-dennis.1173611/#post-51762138

 

[MightyMighties]

Nothing to do with 'Lods knows him' and it's not a personalised email to Lods (whoever he is).

That is the exact email I received verbatim.

Army announced his retirement to Members via email.

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...tirement-thanks-dennis.1173611/#post-51762138

Same.

All the best to him. He brought us some great highs with his running goals and celebrations!

 

[HBF]

Excellent question!!!!

Thanks Funk.

 

[Robertio]

I would still have concerns with the bottom clubs manipulating their position on the ladder. Example: A side that sits 14th/15th with 6 rounders to go, with knowledge they will not make the finals, could manipulate team selections to assist them in finishing bottom 3

Maybe we could look at from a different angle.

If a team finishes in the top 8 or top 4, perhaps restrict that team from signing a FA for that year? Players can still move to other clubs, without the top teams becoming stronger and in turn, if they still change clubs, it would be to clubs that still sit outside the top 8.

This must happen.

 

[Moody Blue]

There was some talk over the summer we may not see him very much at all this year at any level of footy.
Whilst he still has a long way to go, we've seen a glimpse of what he can do.

We saw glimpses of Jaksch. He was going to be our key defender for a decade. He will be playing at the AMMO's next season. Saw glimpses of Sumner and Whiley and Phillips. Jaksch cost us pick 7 from memory. Interesting that Jack Lever got picked up at pick 14 in that draft.

 

[Jimmae]

Not a follower of the NFL so i can't comment but in terms of stopping FA's from going to certain teams is a restraint of trade and wouldn't pass in this climate.

It would certainly need vigorous debate, but it shouldn't be discarded. I agree that it would be unlikely though

I take it you're talking about franchise and tranistion tags?

Transition tags are pretty much being able to invoke restricted free agency on an unrestricted free agent (i.e. the ability to match an offer), as well as giving them a one-year contract that puts their pay in the top bracket at their position (average of the top 10 in the league, or a 12% bump, whichever is higher). It's not used often because players will strike if they really want to leave, and also when a new contract is signed, the transition tag can't be used again until their contract expires.

Franchise tags take two forms: exclusive and non-exclusive. Again, the player is bumped up to the average of the top 5 at his position (or a 20% increase, whichever is higher), but an exclusive tag means interested teams have to deal with the club to facilitate a trade, while non-exclusive is like an RFA, but the compensation is automatically two first round picks.

It's definitely a worthwhile tool to have, but the AFL will need to significantly decrease free agency compensation to make it work.

 

[Old navy]

Sam Reid has just resigned with Sydney on a 4 year deal, this will make Levi one of the only mature key forwards available through FA this year, should get us a reasonable pick, hopefully band 2 compo

 

[Jimmae]

Sam Reid has just resigned with Sydney on a 4 year deal, this will make Levi one of the only mature key forwards available through FA this year, should get us a reasonable pick, hopefully band 2 compo

Band 2 will be barely any different from band 3 as things stand. If the rumours are to be believed, band 3 is the best we can hope for.

 

[HARKER]

We saw glimpses of Jaksch. He was going to be our key defender for a decade. He will be playing at the AMMO's next season. Saw glimpses of Sumner and Whiley and Phillips. Jaksch cost us pick 7 from memory. Interesting that Jack Lever got picked up at pick 14 in that draft.

It's not that interesting, because that isn't a fact.

 

[Azul]

We saw glimpses of Jaksch. He was going to be our key defender for a decade. He will be playing at the AMMO's next season. Saw glimpses of Sumner and Whiley and Phillips. Jaksch cost us pick 7 from memory. Interesting that Jack Lever got picked up at pick 14 in that draft.

We got 19 back. And we traded our second rounder this year, pick 19, for Marchbank. Mathematically:

if Marchbank = Jaksch then
Pickett + Whiley + Boekhorst + Smedts = Tuohy

Better hope like hell Jarrod Pickett becomes a 200 gamer!

 

[Jimthegreat]

Nothing to do with 'Lods knows him' and it's not a personalised email to Lods (whoever he is).

That is the exact email I received verbatim.

Army announced his retirement to Members via email.

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...tirement-thanks-dennis.1173611/#post-51762138

I'll take that back then...lol

I fixed that part up.

 

[Aphrodite]

I'll take that back then...lol

I fixed that part up.

 

[I AM CARLTON]

My predictions for who might be delisted at seasons end (Not including Rookie List)

Buckley
Boekhorst
Jaksch
Sumner
Palmer
White

 

[Rarely Rong]

D. Armfield all the very best. Champion bloke!

The list management has officially begun!

 

[Doro]

How could asking for a PP possibly destroy our culture?

I'm not sure anyone has been that dramatic. Mixed messaging that's all. I hope the club don't bother applying and spend time lobbying for other things. Not everyone shares this opinion though, that's what this place is for.