Analysis 2018 List Management discussion Pt 2

[Mr_Plow]

Brisbane and St. Kilda finding some form is dangerous.

Hope we re-think our PP stance.

 

[juzza316]

Brisbane and St. Kilda finding some form is dangerous.

Hope we re-think our PP stance.

Hoping we can do the same and find some form.

 

[RudyBlue]

Hoping we can do the same and find some form.

We have, sort of

 

[Mr_Plow]

We have, sort of

Just not the winning sort... yet.

Hoping we can do the same and find some form.

Be handy.

 

[rog1995]

Are you suggesting we are giving up possibly pick 1 for a midfielder without kicking skills? Cant wait for this.

No I'm saying Murphy is a better kick than Shiel in my opinion..

 

[GapInIkonPark]

I am still yet to understand why GWS do this deal. Give up one of their supposed midfield guns and a first round pick for one first round pick in return. It makes no sense why they would agree to this.

My answer in another post:

The why is simply perfect timing. GWS has both salary cap pressure with Greene reportedly taking a pay cut and a clutch of players becoming free agents starting at the end of 2019. If GWS lose 1 would-be free agent this year and another next year, it is in a better position than if it loses the 2 next year.

 

[THE_GUN]

Brisbane and St. Kilda finding some form is dangerous.

Hope we re-think our PP stance.

Carlton saying they dont want a PP is the correct thing to do and are effectively not applying because they know they will not get it.

Dont think there is any chance the AFL will give Carlton a PP when you have traded out players to get draft picks and as a result bottomed out due to cashing players in.

The afl wouldnt do it and Carlton knew this and went on record as not wanting a PP - Richmond did the same thing 6/7 years ago it gives the supporter base confidence and lifts moral.

 

[BLUEALLTHRU]

Carlton saying they dont want a PP is the correct thing to do and are effectively not applying because they know they will not get it.

Dont think there is any chance the AFL will give Carlton a PP when you have traded out players to get draft picks and as a result bottomed out due to cashing players in.

The afl wouldnt do it and Carlton knew this and went on record as not wanting a PP - Richmond did the same thing 6/7 years ago it gives the supporter base confidence and lifts moral.

Post makes to much sense, you know where the door is

 

[Mr_Plow]

Carlton saying they dont want a PP is the correct thing to do and are effectively not applying because they know they will not get it.

Dont think there is any chance the AFL will give Carlton a PP when you have traded out players to get draft picks and as a result bottomed out due to cashing players in.

The afl wouldnt do it and Carlton knew this and went on record as not wanting a PP - Richmond did the same thing 6/7 years ago it gives the supporter base confidence and lifts moral.

I need draft picks and more talent, though.

 

[Benaly28]

I could not care less who has the 'C' beside their name. Its completely unimportant.

Please explain.

 

[THE_GUN]

Post makes to much sense, you know where the door is

Im waiting for an infraction because of that post , This is the Carlton board yeah

 

[rog1995]

All of the talk of Stephenson is relatively pointless.
Looking like a top prospect, but not at all what we needed (or continue to need) going forward. In time, Charlie will play this role (3rd tall) and play it better.

Good list management is a sum of all parts.
We had already drafted and traded in medium and tall prospects and need to trust the process. Next step was (and is) midfielders. Even if Stephenson ends up having a phenomenal career, he just didn’t fit our needs.

Unfortunately, AFL is not yet in a position where you can stockpile similar types (because they are the best available) in order to develop them as a trade commodity. Some teams in the NBA are great at this - but they have so much more leniency in player movement that teams could, for example, draft a Stephenson (even if they don’t really need his type), let him show his talents for 12 months... and then move him on for increased return.
SOS sort of had this luxury at GWS but that is such a rare situation in the afl. We at Carlton don’t have this luxury. We need midfielders and we picked up a couple of good ones in Dow and O’Brien. Have faith.

That said, I do have an inkling that SOS is attempting subtle NBA-style stockpile of KPPs for future trading, but unfortunately so many of them have been off the park that we’re yet to see how much value any of them might have. And this alone highlights a valuable point: the hit vs miss factor on KPPs in the AFL is quite challenging... which leads me to believe we recruited so many of them in order to maximise our hits, and stockpiling for future trade would just be an added bonus if they all worked out.

Just imagine a world where all of Weitering, Marchbank, plowman and macreadie (KPD) and Mckay, Curnow, silvagni and TDK (KPF) are healthy and performing... we’d feel much more comfortable right now in theorising about moving on, say, macreadie for an additional first rounder.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I wouldn't swap Dow for anyone. Seriously the kid tackles like a machine, has Judd like burst speed and is tough as nails. I'm absolutely wrapt we got him.

 

[8 Lil Monkeys]

Apparently Murph signed on for 2 more years.

Great news Murph is staying and hopefully all the rhetoric about compensation/trade can stop.

 

[Metalcrusher]

Im waiting for an infraction because of that post , This is the Carlton board yeah

Why? Were you disrespectful? You were spot on mate

 

[Funk]

Sam McClure‏Verified account @sam_mcclure 29m29 minutes ago
Some terrific news for Carlton in what has been a tough year. Captain Marc Murphy has signed a two year contract extension, keeping him at the club until 2020.

Good - now we can chase FA's without any negative consequences re compensation.

 

[Funk]

Carlton saying they dont want a PP is the correct thing to do and are effectively not applying because they know they will not get it.

Dont think there is any chance the AFL will give Carlton a PP when you have traded out players to get draft picks and as a result bottomed out due to cashing players in.

The afl wouldnt do it and Carlton knew this and went on record as not wanting a PP - Richmond did the same thing 6/7 years ago it gives the supporter base confidence and lifts moral.

Unlike some others I think this post is mostly garbage.

Carlton did not "trade out players to get draft picks and as a result bottomed out"

That is absolute crap.

Carlton bottomed out because they ****** up about 8 consecutive drafts.

Of all the players who left only about 7 are still playing AFL.

Some left to join winning teams (Henderson, Gibbs)

Dylan Buckley- delisted played 1 game at GWS

Robinson and Garlett were shown the door for being pissed and involved in a fist fight at 5am on a Sunday morning in King St during the season and (Robinson) while injured - great for senior players to be setting the culture of the club while we're drafting all these young guys.

Tuohy, Betts and Waite wanted more $ than we were prepared to pay so left for the money - and no compensation was received for the last 2.

So tell me again - which players were traded out to get draft picks and deliberately bottom out????????

Feel free to come here and post - but stick to the facts and don't talk crap.

PS - and I really don't give a shit what Richmond did - its irrelevant to our situation.

 

[Stamos]

Unlike some others I think this post is mostly garbage.

Carlton did not "trade out players to get draft picks and as a result bottomed out"

Sure we did.
Henderson (and Yarran and Menzel, both 1st round draft picks who were best 22 in 2015) Bell, Tuohy and Gibbs.

Sure Bell left for family reasons, but I don't think we were too upset as it helped us get Charlie. Gibbs is the only one who wasn't planned for, but we did trade him, and going off last year, it has cost us several wins.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

My answer in another post:

Salary cap pressure or not, there is zero reason or incentive for GWS to do what people are suggesting should be the deal. None. It makes zero sense from a GWS perspective.

 

[Benaly28]

Quite conceivably at the start of next year we could have 4 all Australians in our side.
Doc,Cripps,Simpson,Charlie AND a Brownlow medallist not bad for a team that will finish bottom.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Please explain.

I thought it was self explanatory. I couldn't care less who the captain is. Its unimportant as far as the team goes. The leaders in the team will lead, regardless of who has the 'c' beside their name on the team sheet.

 

[Iamcarlton]

Salary cap pressure or not, there is zero reason or incentive for GWS to do what people are suggesting should be the deal. None. It makes zero sense from a GWS perspective.

Maybe not but except if Shiel goes to them and states he wants out even under contract .
Would they try and get a better deal for him in contract now or wait till FA compensation 1 year later which we know is not great for the team losing the player ?

 

[HarryFlashman]

Salary cap pressure or not, there is zero reason or incentive for GWS to do what people are suggesting should be the deal. None. It makes zero sense from a GWS perspective.

It’s been explained about 5 different ways in a number of posts, if u don’t get it, then just get over it.
U don’t have to agree with it, but if u can’t even see the other option you obviously don’t understand how trading/fa works, reading up on it else where might help

 

[DangerousD]

Dow is quick powerful strongcore just needs to tidy up his disposals. In the dangerfield mould still taking dow over anyone else in the draft. Posters need to not get carried away with stephenson 1st year not a good indicator

Yet i bet if the roles were reversed you would be saying the same thing about Stephenson. How is the first year not a good indicator? The kid was a few draft watchers number 1 player for a lot of the season and if it wasn't for his heart issue then possibly would have gone higher.


Give the kid some credit.

 

[bigdog43]

All this talk about trading and what draft pick we'll have but the most important thing for this club is to land a free agent of some worth.

 

[blue healer]

Carlton saying they dont want a PP is the correct thing to do and are effectively not applying because they know they will not get it.

Dont think there is any chance the AFL will give Carlton a PP when you have traded out players to get draft picks and as a result bottomed out due to cashing players in.

The afl wouldnt do it and Carlton knew this and went on record as not wanting a PP - Richmond did the same thing 6/7 years ago it gives the supporter base confidence and lifts moral.

Not sure there was a lot of confidence and moral around your club at the start of last season.