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List Mgmt. 2020 List Management II

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Plow is close to the best lockdown defender of smalls in the AFL

He is a ****ing amazing defender. But with our tall defender depth stocks copping a pounding this coming off-season, we may need him to play 3rd tall, particularly if Marchbank continues to be absent.

May have to retain Levi and Macreadie as break glass defensive emergencies, if the latter can build something resembling an AFL physique.
 
Would Geelong look to upgrade their picks? Not a bad deal for us, enables the acquisition of Saad and somebody else with speed and footskills on our radar.
I think Plowman would welcome Saad with open arms, won't have to play on the slippery guys anymore.

I had hopes for Polson but he has likely played his last game for the club on the back of that. Love the endeavour but hasnt the class for AFL.

Geelong may and if not Geelong, then Brisbane with #18 & #19 odd, may.
If Williams arrives....and Papley is out of the equation, it may be a ploy we look at for the likes of Saad and *****

If Williamson does take on a wing role.....and he should....and SPS plays upfield.....and he should....maybe two quality back-men shouldn't be out of the equation for us.
 
Dow and 7 for 11, 15 and 16 I'd do, but they wouldn't. Would give us a good trade hand though.

I don't see the point in trading Dow now. His trade worth is minimal right now, and if he completely busts in due time (which is looking increasingly likely), we just have to wear it.
 

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I don't see the point in trading Dow now. His trade worth is minimal right now, and if he completely busts in due time (which is looking increasingly likely), we just have to wear it.
Holding a handful of first round picks might see a Merrett fall out of the tree, or raise Sydney's interest and suddenly Papley may become available. I agree it's not wise to trade him but if the bigger picture means you get someone of high calibre you'd have to entertain the idea.
 
Cripps becomes better when the opposition divert their attention to Walsh and Kelly/Williams.. instead of knowing that if they shutdown our #9 we are basically cooked.
This.
It's exactly why we need a player in the midfield on the ball who plays with uncompromising determination.
Our current gameplan requires someone to go in and get it, then run like hell to provide an option or lock the ball in.
I say it's Wines, some say Viney, happy to try a Graham or Brodey. Either way it's not Setters, Ed, or Murphy and we don't want to murder Walshy (he's not the answer either).
So we have to take a punt on someone else and also try to develop Stocker and Kemp and see where they fit.
Btw it's not Williams, or Papley, or Kelly. Kennedy not even in the discussion.
Does anyone have another suggestion for whom to bring in?
I would also be talking to Angus Brayshaw's management, is there anyone else?
I would suggest this is the next main post to fill.
Small forward and defender after this.
 
I still think that with Kreuzer and Simmo gone we will still have to "move on" maybe 10 more players.

That gets us to 34. 3 compulsory picks in the draft gets us to 37 then bring in 1 - 3 players depending on list size of 38 or 40.

Honestly don't see the point of rookie listed players for the next few seasons at least.
 
We've been saying it for.....a long time.
We want a Isaac Smith type.....here you go.
Yep. Willo's attacking instincts seem to get inhibited a bit having to always think about locking down on an opponent, and we end up blunting his attacking weapons.

Sound familiar? Though to be fair SPS has been much improved of late.
 
Holding a handful of first round picks might see a Merrett fall out of the tree, or raise Sydney's interest and suddenly Papley may become available. I agree it's not wise to trade him but if the bigger picture means you get someone of high calibre you'd have to entertain the idea.

Sure, but I don’t think adding Dow to any trade swings the needle far enough to make it worth our while.
 
Oh my..so the stats sheet is wrong? Everyone else is wrong but you? Can you confirm you are saying he didn't get 11 contested possessions? Second highest for the team?
You're not regurgitating the stats wrong, you appear to not be understanding what they mean, and how they can confuse you into thinking that a player is executing certain skills well.

For contested possessions, the official definition is a possession gained in a contest, but more precisely:

A possession which has been won when the ball is in dispute. Includes looseball-gets, hardball-gets, contested marks, gathers from a hit-out and frees for (i.e. frees won while contesting for possession).

Looseball gets and hitout gathers are the important ones here, but it's looseball gets that you might not be familiar with:

A disputed ball at ground level not under direct physical pressure that results in an opportunity to record a legal disposal.

So you can be near a pack, sit out waiting for the football, and if you can get the ball out or tap it to someone, that's a contested possession despite no one touching you. It's a great stat for crumbing forwards and outside mids, but in a stoppage it's meant to reflect when a pacy player can react to the ball-in-dispute situations that can occur due to a lack of clean possession.

This is where I'd be interested to see the count on Kennedy. I'd also like to see his pressure act stats outside the stoppage area, and the ratio of pressure acts to tackle attempts within the stoppage.

I think you'll find that he's miles behind our other contested options at the coal face, and I'd even include Murphy in that, though Murphy gets worn down physically inside the stoppage very quickly these days.

I'm tired of being told I'm trying to tear another human being down, I'm trying to highlight something that I believe is an overwhelmingly obvious tactical weakness that directly undermines our ability to be a competitive football side, and something that needs to be corrected for in other players, who must be replaced if they cannot meet the standard.

This is about our football department and our match committee, not the man himself.

Gone:

Kreuzer
Simpson
Goddard
Lang
O'Dwyer
B Silvagni
Macreadie
Moore
Polson

50/50:

Kennedy

Apparently being offered deals but surely we might reconsider:

Casboult
Murphy
Betts

Anyone see it differently to that?
I'd retain Macreadie, invite Moore to train, and re-sign Murphy. I would be happy to re-sign Levi if he can't find a better offer.

I'd be doing everything I could to convince Eddie to come back as a coach. His fitness levels are still exceptional, but his repeat efforts are a touch off. Needs a lot more speed around him to go another season, but I don't see where that's coming from.
 
Yep. Willo's attacking instincts seem to get inhibited a bit having to always think about locking down on an opponent, and we end up blunting his attacking weapons.

Sound familiar? Though to be fair SPS has been much improved of late.

That wasn't a slight on SPS.
I'm always for playing players where they serve the whole best and the backline isn't SPS's forte.
The reaction for attaining two running and attacking backmen, would be to allow Williamson and SPS up the ground.

I'd love to see Williamson take away a wing spot from Newnes and for SPS to play forward of centre instead of Gibbons, with midfield involvement.
I think it would make for a win on all fronts. i.e The net gain is greater than for just attaining two players.
 

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That wasn't a slight on SPS.
I'm always for playing players where they serve the whole best and the backline isn't SPS's forte.
The reaction for attaining two running and attacking backmen, would be to allow Williamson and SPS up the ground.

I'd love to see Williamson take away a wing spot from Newnes and for SPS to play forward of centre, with midfield involvement.
I think it would make for a win on all fronts. i.e The net gain is greater than for just attaining two players.
Strongly agree with getting Willo and SPS up the ground. That then pushes Newnes as a permanent defensive forward (who still has the ability to hurt the opposition as he's good around goal).
 
Gone:

Kreuzer
Simpson
Goddard
Lang
O'Dwyer
B Silvagni
Macreadie
Moore
Polson

50/50:

Kennedy

Apparently being offered deals but surely we might reconsider:

Casboult
Murphy
Betts

Anyone see it differently to that?

Would hang on to Macreadie

If we find a replacement for Levi, move him on

Murphy must be told he isn't considered automatic best 22

Betts to be moved on

Find a trade for McGovern
 
Are the AFL reducing the minimum numbers you have to take in the draft? Or do you still have to take a minimum of three draftees?

Nobody knows.
But if the lists are to be cut significantly as has been suggested, and given this draft is so compromised due to no U18s, I'd hazard a guess that the minimum will be scrapped, or at least reduced.
 
Would hang on to Macreadie

If we find a replacement for Levi, move him on

Murphy must be told he isn't considered automatic best 22

Betts to be moved on

Find a trade for McGovern
Yeah all that makes sense. Would love to punt McGovern if we could find a buyer, he's become too much of a distraction.

Really hope we reconsider our stance on Murphy, I don't want him going around again next year. Just too weak a link in a team sport.
 
The players on our list that will form the foundation for the next 4 years are:
Cripps
Doc
Weitering
SPS
Williamson
Plowman
Walsh
Setterfield
Martin
Mckay
C.Curnow

Need something to click: McGovern, Cunningham, Fisher, SOS, TDK

Unknown: Kemp, Philip, Honey

Its obvious where the gaps are. Small forwards and midfield bull.
 

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You're not regurgitating the stats wrong, you appear to not be understanding what they mean, and how they can confuse you into thinking that a player is executing certain skills well.

For contested possessions, the official definition is a possession gained in a contest, but more precisely:



Looseball gets and hitout gathers are the important ones here, but it's looseball gets that you might not be familiar with:



So you can be near a pack, sit out waiting for the football, and if you can get the ball out or tap it to someone, that's a contested possession despite no one touching you. It's a great stat for crumbing forwards and outside mids, but in a stoppage it's meant to reflect when a pacy player can react to the ball-in-dispute situations that can occur due to a lack of clean possession.

This is where I'd be interested to see the count on Kennedy. I'd also like to see his pressure act stats outside the stoppage area, and the ratio of pressure acts to tackle attempts within the stoppage.

I think you'll find that he's miles behind our other contested options at the coal face, and I'd even include Murphy in that, though Murphy gets worn down physically inside the stoppage very quickly these days.

I'm tired of being told I'm trying to tear another human being down, I'm trying to highlight something that I believe is an overwhelmingly obvious tactical weakness that directly undermines our ability to be a competitive football side, and something that needs to be corrected for in other players, who must be replaced if they cannot meet the standard.

This is about our football department and our match committee, not the man himself.


I'd retain Macreadie, invite Moore to train, and re-sign Murphy. I would be happy to re-sign Levi if he can't find a better offer.

I'd be doing everything I could to convince Eddie to come back as a coach. His fitness levels are still exceptional, but his repeat efforts are a touch off. Needs a lot more speed around him to go another season, but I don't see where that's coming from.
So essentially you're grasping at straws? You're disputing the type of contested possessions he gets but don't have any evidence to prove his possessions weren't earned.

I'm not saying you can't be critical of areas of his game (shit I do it all the time on this board about various players), but to say he isn't at least an above average inside midfielder is blatantly wrong. He most definitely has below average outside midfield traits such as spreading from the contest and his ability to chase and defend. But to say he played a bad game is objectively wrong.
 
I don't know how the club can offer Betts another year. He has been lucky to be in the team a lot of weeks.

If he does get another year it is the type of decision that can create a wedge in the club. Particularly amongst players. I can think of examples at my own amateur level where players start to question and talk behind peoples backs, it's not good for culture (I am aware local and AFL are worlds apart 😂).

It is sad seeing a champion like Betts come to the end but the easy thing to do is to let him play on.

It is such as important off season.
 
Gone:

Kreuzer
Simpson
Goddard
Lang
O'Dwyer
B Silvagni
Macreadie
Moore
Polson

50/50:

Kennedy

Apparently being offered deals but surely we might reconsider:

Casboult
Murphy
Betts

Anyone see it differently to that?

I think we might keep Macreadie. He's talented, and we'll be very thin on tall defenders once we cut Ben and Goddard.

Murphy should retire, as should Eddie (but this sounds unlikely).

Keep Levi for depth, I think he's been playing injured.
 
Merrett would actually be a perfect midfield pick up if we got him. Inside Outside mid with clean disposal and provides defensive effort. Playing alongside a big body in Cripps will get the best out of him.

I can’t see Dodoro doing it tho while he has 1 year left of his contract

I see Merrett as the perfect replacement for Murphy


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