List Mgmt. 2020 List Management II

[Opine]

Really? I think it's critical, as player-managers will be somewhat more cautious going back to that well.

It's a big decision for a player to leave their club, as things stand in the AFL right now and you want to know you have the resources to attain the player you've been schmoozing over the course of the year.
This would obviously have been discussed between player-manager and club and only once a player knows they'll end up at the club, should the signal of the move come out.

Anyway, we know the EFC would not be easy to deal with....and the player-manager will know this....and the player will know this.
It all has to be factored in, as the player does not want to be left hanging.

lets wait and see how they go about it. ATM I've not heard anything; mainly because I don't listen to, or read, anything put out by our CEO. I want to hear what our formal LM thinks about recruiting and LM; from the LM himself.

 

[Macca43]

I’m struggling to understand giving up Shane McAdam for peanuts

a 25 year old who wanted to stay in Adelaide who in 2 years has played 13 games averaging less than 10 touches, less than 3 tackles and less than a goal a game?

Statistically almost identical in 2020 to Betts who everyone believes was ordinary this year.

 

[Jimmyonesix]

Dealing with essendon on Saad will be tiresome and on the verge of ridiculous -- I hope he signs with essendon soon so we don't have to go through the crap and ruin another trade period ..

 

[Juddernaut08]

a 25 year old who wanted to stay in Adelaide who in 2 years has played 13 games averaging less than 10 touches, less than 3 tackles and less than a goal a game?

Statistically almost identical in 2020 to Betts who everyone believes was ordinary this year.

half his age

 

[true blue19]

On Footy Classified Lloyd said St Kilda are into Taranto. IMO would be a perfect fit for us but will cost 2 first rounders

 

[Just Kreuzing]

On Footy Classified Lloyd said St Kilda are into Taranto. IMO would be a perfect fit for us but will cost 2 first rounders

So we split 7 with Geelong for 15 & 16.

15+ future first for Taranto
16 to * for Saad

 

[TENACIOUS]

On Footy Classified Lloyd said St Kilda are into Taranto. IMO would be a perfect fit for us but will cost 2 first rounders

Would rather Merrett or Kelly. (Both much better by foot)

But 2 first round picks for Taranto and $800,000 a year as Lloyd suggested would be a great get.
Sounded like St Kilda are a fair way down the track with it, if true maybe we were caught napping or he doesn't want to come here

 

[Gethelred]

They are two seperate issues but once you have a players' commitment, you have to reciprocate that commitment.
I feel that last year hurt us a bit here, even though what we did was the right thing to do. Martin could not have liked being in limbo and we can't afford to have another player in such a situation. It's just not good business.

Dodoro and the EFC won't be easy to deal with either and it's actually their prerogative to demonstrate what a player means to them.
I don't even have to think about it as I know Dodoro would put his hand out for the pick #7. Good luck getting that Essendon.....and the fun begins.

If the price of Saad is pick 7, I do not want Saad. I do not see how the price for Saad can be pick 7, given he is out of contract and we'd sooner see him walk to another club taking him before us in the PSD than we would part with pick 7 for him.

The negotiation side of this is pretty straightforward: if he wants to leave, then they cannot afford what it'd take to retain him, and their bargaining position's dead in the water. If he doesn't want to leave, our job is to make our offer more attractive than Essendons to force scenario one, either by pricing them out or by being more likely to find success in the short, medium and long term.

I really do not care about Dodoro, I think it's a fan thing as much as it's a reality of trading with Essendon. He's a prick to deal with, but in essence we're not trading with him this period. We're trading with Saad, trading ourselves, and asking Essendon whether we get him for nothing or if they want to take what's on offer.

 

[THE_GUN]

Just a side question with Saad & Carlton

How does the Carlton supporters here feel about what his value in a trade is and how confident are you in the new list manager compared to SOS
personally i think his value would fall between #12-#16 range in this years draft

 

[carlton_99]

Just a side question with Saad & Carlton

How does the Carlton supporters here feel about what his value in a trade is and how confident are you in the new list manager compared to SOS
personally i think his value would fall between #12-#16 range in this years draft

I still think he will stay at * (just an opinion) but if he were to leave I think end of first is spot on ... but Dodo will be asking for 7 + Cripps' first born. Don't know much about Austin but I was always a big fan of SOS so has some big shoes to fill.

 

[BlueTongue]

Really? I think it's critical, as player-managers will be somewhat more cautious going back to that well.

It's a big decision for a player to leave their club, as things stand in the AFL right now and you want to know you have the resources to attain the player you've been schmoozing over the course of the year.
This would obviously have been discussed between player-manager and club and only once a player knows they'll end up at the club, should the signal of the move come out.

Anyway, we know the EFC would not be easy to deal with....and the player-manager will know this....and the player will know this.
It all has to be factored in, as the player does not want to be left hanging.

...Daniher is a good example. Tom Harley really left him to defend himself with the trade request there too. Never liked Harley and that was as spineless as it gets from mr nice guy.

 

[BlueTongue]

On Footy Classified Lloyd said St Kilda are into Taranto. IMO would be a perfect fit for us but will cost 2 first rounders

Have read all of the Taranto talk over the last week or so but missed the catalyst for it.
Is he out of contract or does he want out?

 

[COBALT BLUE]

I don't think McGovern deserves the whack he has copped in this thread. This year has not been suited to talls across the whole league given majority of the games have been in the dew at night or in the wet (especially for Blues games). The shorter game time has clogged the game up, low scoring averages, not exactly a great recipe for a 3rd tall/high half forward who thrives in space.

Next year he will be much better if he can get through the pre-season without injury and the game goes back to some normality. His strengths are a great asset and at least he gives some passion on the field, which is what we lack otherwise. Just wait for a Saturday afternoon in the dry next year.. he will be leaping at everything on the half forward and creating a contest/F50 pressure.

Gov might only be a good forward or possibly now a defender ..back up depth
Has he ever been properly fit in Afl condition with run of games uninjured?
It has also been noted on here his Crows success came when they were playing well and he was left unattended as a forward
If he does get there I think it will be a long road ....

 

[Milshouse]

Mcgovin for saad would be nice, not too concerned on saad, but williams seems destined for the midfield, we have hbf in the wings, but not in the saad fold

 

[juzza316]

I don't think McGovern deserves the whack he has copped in this thread. This year has not been suited to talls across the whole league given majority of the games have been in the dew at night or in the wet (especially for Blues games). The shorter game time has clogged the game up, low scoring averages, not exactly a great recipe for a 3rd tall/high half forward who thrives in space.

Next year he will be much better if he can get through the pre-season without injury and the game goes back to some normality. His strengths are a great asset and at least he gives some passion on the field, which is what we lack otherwise. Just wait for a Saturday afternoon in the dry next year.. he will be leaping at everything on the half forward and creating a contest/F50 pressure.

What will we do with him if we aren't playing on a Saturday afternoon and/or its wet?

 

[Juddernaut08]

So we split 7 with Geelong for 15 & 16.

15+ future first for Taranto
16 to * for Saad

Would love Taranto

That 2016 trio: Taranto SPS Setterfield and the best of all... Fish!

 

[Juddernaut08]

I don't think McGovern deserves the whack he has copped in this thread. This year has not been suited to talls across the whole league given majority of the games have been in the dew at night or in the wet (especially for Blues games). The shorter game time has clogged the game up, low scoring averages, not exactly a great recipe for a 3rd tall/high half forward who thrives in space.

Next year he will be much better if he can get through the pre-season without injury and the game goes back to some normality. His strengths are a great asset and at least he gives some passion on the field, which is what we lack otherwise. Just wait for a Saturday afternoon in the dry next year.. he will be leaping at everything on the half forward and creating a contest/F50 pressure.

As a player in his prime years, he should have had more discipline and impact over the 2 years hes been here.

Lack of impact, fitness ... he has gotten his big payday ... cost us a lot ... and seemed to cbf doing anything to justify his spot.

We all hope he turns it around and he does bob up for the brilliant pass and mark. But theyre too far and few between, and he is still inconsistent with disposal and decision making.

As a 3rd tall they need to make the most of their opportunities like Gunston.

 

[chunkylover53]

Mcgovin for saad would be nice, not too concerned on saad, but williams seems destined for the midfield, we have hbf in the wings, but not in the saad fold

didn't even think of this.

McGovern + a 2nd for Saad? Essendon are desperate for forwards and we have too many. He'd be handy as a 1st or 2nd target for them.

 

[HARKER]

I really do not care about Dodoro, I think it's a fan thing as much as it's a reality of trading with Essendon. He's a prick to deal with, but in essence we're not trading with him this period. We're trading with Saad, trading ourselves, and asking Essendon whether we get him for nothing or if they want to take what's on offer.

Saad isn't worth the pick #7.
That's not to say he wouldn't be of better value than for what we may get in the draft, but the value alone is far too large. We all know that.

We also know that we won't get Saad for a second rounder. We can say we will, but we just won't, so Essendon would know we're somewhere in the middle.
The fact is that we don't have anything in the middle right now and the exchange of #7 for two later first rounders all sounds good, but maybe Geelong & Brisbane don't want to head down that path. What then?

I guess Essendon would offer Saad and their second for our #7, but I just don't think we'd want to do that this year and hen just how we can manufacture some clever manoeuvring via the draft.
Maybe there will be another team that would offer a first and a future first for our #7. Geelong? Richmond?

Getting back to the dealing -
If I was Saad and knew that Essendon were going to play hard ball that may not afford me my preferred outcome, I may just stay put and not want to go through the hassle. Only an absolute guarantee from Carlton that the deal will be done through the trade period, would have me nominate another club.

 

[Gethelred]

Saad isn't worth the pick #7.
That's not to say he wouldn't be of better value than for what we may get in the draft, but the value alone is far too large. We all know that.

We also know that we won't get Saad for a second rounder. We can say we will, but we just won't, so Essendon would know we're somewhere in the middle.
The fact is that we don't have anything in the middle right now and the exchange of #7 for two later first rounders all sounds good, but maybe Geelong & Brisbane don't want to head down that path. What then?

I guess Essendon would offer Saad and their second for our #7, but I just don't think we'd want to do that this year and hen just how we can manufacture some clever manoeuvring via the draft.
Maybe there will be another team that would offer a first and a future first for our #7. Geelong? Richmond?

Getting back to the dealing -
If I was Saad and knew that Essendon were going to play hard ball that may not afford me my preferred outcome, I may just stay put and not want to go through the hassle. Only an absolute guarantee from Carlton that the deal will be done through the trade period, would have me nominate another club.

Exactly. My point of view is, if Saad wants to come here we can work with him to get him over. It is then beholden on Essendon to make the most of a s**t hand, and not to pander to their desire to look like winning a trade.

I'm not giving them a pick higher than 20 for him. He's a good player, but he's out of contract. There is only one reason to pay more, and that is if Saad is insistent Essendon get properly recompensed for his loss, and if that's the case I'm not interested in paying through the nose for a player who will not be the difference for us.

I also don't like the idea of trading down, either. Pick 7 is valuable in its own right, and I wouldn't be against looking exclusively at the FA - Crouch, Viney, Williams - and taking it to the draft. I maintain we need to continue to pick up highly rated talent, but we need to be more position and role focused than we have been.

 

[HARKER]

I also don't like the idea of trading down, either. Pick 7 is valuable in its own right, and I wouldn't be against looking exclusively at the FA - Crouch, Viney, Williams - and taking it to the draft. I maintain we need to continue to pick up highly rated talent, but we need to be more position and role focused than we have been.

We know that the CFC have been portraying a situation where experience and needs are more important than more 18 year olds, but now that we know what we have and know what we may get.......things can change.

There are many ways to go about matters but if we didn't trade this years first, I just don't think next years would be on offer either.
That would then require us to trade. I know some are saying that no one will go, but it's way too early to be so sure of that, just yet.

 

[Gethelred]

We know that the CFC have been portraying a situation where experience and needs are more important than more 18 year olds, but now that we know what we have and know what we may get.......things can change.

There are many ways to go about matters but if we didn't trade this years first, I just don't think next years would be on offer either.
That would then require us to trade. I know some are saying that no one will go, but it's way too early to be so sure of that, just yet.

As far as I'm concerned, there are only really Cripps, Weitering, Walsh, Harry who are untradeable on our list. There are others - Martin, Doc, Charlie - who would make for difficult trades, but I'd still do them for the right price. Everything else is tradeable, provided all things can be accounted for.

If we need to give up Jack and Cuningham plus next year's second for Merrett, I'm all for it. If we have to give up Charlie and next year's first for Bontempelli, I'm for it. We need to look at improving our side, and sometimes that means rocking the boat a bit.

 

[Eiffel 65]

Just a side question with Saad & Carlton

How does the Carlton supporters here feel about what his value in a trade is and how confident are you in the new list manager compared to SOS
personally i think his value would fall between #12-#16 range in this years draft

If he was a contract player, you could argue a pick higher than that range would be required. Potentially even pick 7.

As an uncontracted player, I would have thought somewhere between the 18-25 mark is an appropriate trade value. Maybe 12-16 in this years draft given the number of academy players.

The thing with Saad is that he's 27 next season. The reality is he's probably got 3-4 seasons performing at his current level before his form drops off. It would make sense for Richmond to give up a pick as high as 12 for Saad because you're competing now. The reality for us is we may still be another 3-4 years away from being a genuine contender as a top 4 side. Come this point, we'll then be looking for Saad's replacement.

It's now being rumoured that pick 7 will be required to get Saad over the line. Personally, for our current position, I'd hit the draft again and top up the list with some DFA's or value trades. There's going to be some interesting names pop up this trade period with list sizes being reduced. Saad is definitely worthwhile at a reasonable price, but I certainly wouldn't be selling the farm for him.

Saad's a cream on the cake player. Our cake still needs a little bit more baking. You only have to look at our midfield to know that we're not quite ready to contend with the best.

 

[Eiffel 65]

So we split 7 with Geelong for 15 & 16.

15+ future first for Taranto
16 to * for Saad

Fair chance Geelong's selections will be higher than that come the end of the finals series.

 

[bmaurizio]

On Footy Classified Lloyd said St Kilda are into Taranto. IMO would be a perfect fit for us but will cost 2 first rounders

I got no issue with the market value Taranto is the correct age bracket, excellent rising talent and a strategic piece we need to strengthen our team for rapid success. I’d offer a Taranto a very enticing salary too.
Get him in door fast