List Mgmt. 2020 List Management

[briztoon]

I think given the highly speculative nature of this draft, well outside the top 6-10 players anyway, the best option is either to trade down for multiple picks, which I think a lot of clubs will be considering which will probably make it hard to do, although a pick inside the top half dozen could end up being more valuable given the lack of clarity further down the draft, or as stated earlier use our top end picks in trades to try and maximise there value while minimising the risk, getting descent value or agreeing on that value for the pick is going to be the hard part given the current draft situation.

I think if we can find an A grade mid that is interested in coming then that would certainly be the option to take.


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Just word from the draft board.

APS schools are planning on a term 3 season, and NAB League is planning on 10 round season.

 

[DangerousD]

You’re mistaken.

In what way?
A quick google search and you can find the articles from last year where his management team or the GC team were reportedly offering/asking for a long term deal at close to a Mill

 

[DangerousD]

Not to mention... "who really is on big coin"?

- Cripps in 2021 i believe will be in his final year of his contract, so lets assume he was most likely front loaded so I'll go with $700k at best.

- Charlie in 2021 is into his 3rd year of a 4 year contract which was 3.2 million over the 4 years. Again, i would believe his contract would have been heavily front loaded so maybe 600k.

Is anyone else on more than 600k other than Martin in 2021? I wouldnt think so. So in my opinion, we would have at least 1.5 or so million ready to spend up at the end of this year.

Players like Dow, SPS, Setterfield, Walsh, O'Brien, Jones, Weitering could be on big money in the next few years, but if 1 of those players is on 500k next year id be beyond surprised.

Docherty and mckay i admit, i have no idea what they would be on.

But overall, firmly believe we will have plenty of coin

im not sure I feel very good regarding our finances if Charlie is on $800,000 per year on nothing but potential.

I know it sounds good in theory to pay guys a big wage when we have the money but it’s very hard to wind things back, especially when other clubs will always be offering more

 

[BlueJet]

In what way?
A quick google search and you can find the articles from last year where his management team or the GC team were reportedly offering/asking for a long term deal at close to a Mill

His management floated it as what it would take to get him up there.
Preference has been for him to stay in Adelaide, particularly following a few of their off field departures last year but I'm pretty comfortable that if he were to head back to Victoria, it would be for less than a million per season.

 

[BlueJet]

Because we need to add more speed and quality kicks to our midfield, not inside grunt.

Someone like Zac Williams would be a much better fit for us as he brings the above.

Many would also hope Stocker and Dow will be starting 22 next season. Both will most likely play the role of inside mid, negating the need for Wines.

Honestly, we need both.
Outside of Cripps & Ed, we're short for reliable in & under types, Wines would represent a massive upgrade on the likes of Kennedy, Jack etc.
It might be hard to manage within the cap but snagging both Williams & Wines would be close to a dream off season.

 

[briztoon]

In what way?
A quick google search and you can find the articles from last year where his management team or the GC team were reportedly offering/asking for a long term deal at close to a Mill

You said GC offered. They didn’t.

Yes his management shopped him around for that price.

Gold Coast baulked at both his asking price and the cost of a trade in terms of draft picks.

Redirect Notice

www.google.com.au

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Ideally, an earlyish first rounder should do it - the problem is that Port would likely want more for their 25yo former skipper.

Of course they would want more. And so they should. On his day he is a gun. Leadership qualities and all that jazz...

They would either want a top 5 pick and a 2nd round pick or more than likely 2 picks in the range of 6-15. I for one am not keen on both scenarios for Wines.

To me, Brad Crouch as a FA along with papley for a 1st sounds right on the money. Im extremely keen on Zac Williams but we all know the AFL wont let players from there leave as easily as they once did.

Wines just doesn't compute in my mind with the position we are in towards the back end of the rebuild.

 

[BlueJet]

Of course they would want more. And so they should. On his day he is a gun. Leadership qualities and all that jazz...

They would either want a top 5 pick and a 2nd round pick or more than likely 2 picks in the range of 6-15. I for one am not keen on both scenarios for Wines.

To me, Brad Crouch as a FA along with papley for a 1st sounds right on the money. Im extremely keen on Zac Williams but we all know the AFL wont let players from there leave as easily as they once did.

Wines just doesn't compute in my mind with the position we are in towards the back end of the rebuild.

There's a reasonable chance our first pick would be in the top 5, that realistically should be sufficient to get Wines across should we determine that he's a missing piece of our side.
Wines makes sense, the question is whether the outlay in picks & cash is too steep.

Obviously it goes without saying that free agents are preferable to trading in players, as it allows the club to maximise it's draft assets so we can address multiple areas of need.
A major flaw of our rebuild to date has been our inability to secure immediate contributors to our midfield mix, hopefully the club is able to address this in the next trade/free agency period - any of those you've noted would represent significant upgrades to our existing list. *crosses fingers*

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

Of course they would want more. And so they should. On his day he is a gun. Leadership qualities and all that jazz...

They would either want a top 5 pick and a 2nd round pick or more than likely 2 picks in the range of 6-15. I for one am not keen on both scenarios for Wines.

To me, Brad Crouch as a FA along with papley for a 1st sounds right on the money. Im extremely keen on Zac Williams but we all know the AFL wont let players from there leave as easily as they once did.

Wines just doesn't compute in my mind with the position we are in towards the back end of the rebuild.

That all sounds great if it did happen, but not sure if we're in a position to cherry pick with the assumption that they would all want to come to Carlton.

If any of those players nominated us as their club of choice, then we should find a way to make it happen, including Wines. If that includes a 1st round pick, and some shuffling of other picks, then so be it.

Last year, we clearly stated that we were looking to trade rather than draft, but ended up with bugger all in the way of trades after the Papley and Martin trades fell through, and somehow Butler and Cameron made their way to other clubs after being linked to us....so subsequently had to go back to the draft. Of course we ended up getting Martin anyway, but the trade period ended up a disaster after the Coniglio situation fell over thanks to Gil.

Cats ended up receiving two first round picks and a second for Tim Kelly, so a first round pick for Wines doesn't seem out of the question imo...particularly in a year where the national draft is massively compromised. Two first round picks is over the top though....not sure if any club would agree to that.

 

[BlueTang]

That all sounds great if it did happen, but not sure if we're in a position to cherry pick with the assumption that they would all want to come to Carlton.

If any of those players nominated us as their club of choice, then we should find a way to make it happen, including Wines. If that includes a 1st round pick, and some shuffling of other picks, then so be it.

Last year, we clearly stated that we were looking to trade rather than draft, but ended up with bugger all in the way of trades after the Papley and Martin trades fell through, and somehow Butler and Cameron made their way to other clubs after being linked to us....so subsequently had to go back to the draft. Of course we ended up getting Martin anyway, but the trade period ended up a disaster after the Coniglio situation fell over thanks to Gil.

Cats ended up receiving two first round picks and a second for Tim Kelly, so a first round pick for Wines doesn't seem out of the question imo...particularly in a year where the national draft is massively compromised. Two first round picks is over the top though....not sure if any club would agree to that.

I have a feeling Port wouldn't fight too hard to keep him, since his manager was actively approaching other clubs last trade period (apparently). No doubt taking the captaincy away also makes it a little awkward for him there.

 

[Accidental genius]

i don’t feel comfortable paying big time for a player that is (1) on the slow slide (even if he is an in and under player) and (2) does not play at a high standard consistently. Also, losing your captaincy in your prime footy age raises questions marks. Is it clear why he lost captaincy?

 

[HereComesJuddy]

That all sounds great if it did happen, but not sure if we're in a position to cherry pick with the assumption that they would all want to come to Carlton.

If any of those players nominated us as their club of choice, then we should find a way to make it happen, including Wines. If that includes a 1st round pick, and some shuffling of other picks, then so be it.

Last year, we clearly stated that we were looking to trade rather than draft, but ended up with bugger all in the way of trades after the Papley and Martin trades fell through, and somehow Butler and Cameron made their way to other clubs after being linked to us....so subsequently had to go back to the draft. Of course we ended up getting Martin anyway, but the trade period ended up a disaster after the Coniglio situation fell over thanks to Gil.

Cats ended up receiving two first round picks and a second for Tim Kelly, so a first round pick for Wines doesn't seem out of the question imo...particularly in a year where the national draft is massively compromised. Two first round picks is over the top though....not sure if any club would agree to that.

West coast gave the Cats 14, 24 and 37 in last years draft and a 1st in this years. Lets face it, the pick will be 15 plus. Id give that up for a top 10 mid in the comp. But Wines isnt that.

What Port would request would be more than we would like to offer.

 

[Team DJ]

2x retired - Betts and Simpson
1x Traded - Kreuzer
7x Delisted - Goddard Moore Cotteral ODwyer McCreadie Lang Polson
2x Train Ons- Phillips BSilvagni

Brings our list down to 34.
Dependent on if lists are 35 or 36 allows 1 spot for a draft pick and possibly 1 for a free agent.

I would suggest teams would also have 3 - 4 train on players who are contracted part time but ineligible to play unless there is a LTI player. This is what I have demoted Fraser Phillips and Ben Silvagni too.

Ok good luck naming the 12 from our list

 

[reubsblues]

2x retired - Betts and Simpson
1x Traded - Kreuzer
7x Delisted - Goddard Moore Cotteral ODwyer McCreadie Lang Polson
2x Train Ons- Phillips BSilvagni

Brings our list down to 34.
Dependent on if lists are 35 or 36 allows 1 spot for a draft pick and possibly 1 for a free agent.

I would suggest teams would also have 3 - 4 train on players who are contracted part time but ineligible to play unless there is a LTI player. This is what I have demoted Fraser Phillips and Ben Silvagni too.

Betts and Simpson have already said they wanna play on

 

[Accidental genius]

Given his foot injuries im not sure Kruezer would bother going to another team or whether other teams would show too much interest. If we decided to pull the pin on him I reckon he would retire.

 

[Coona Blues]

2x retired - Betts and Simpson
1x Traded - Kreuzer
7x Delisted - Goddard Moore Cotteral ODwyer McCreadie Lang Polson
2x Train Ons- Phillips BSilvagni

Brings our list down to 34.
Dependent on if lists are 35 or 36 allows 1 spot for a draft pick and possibly 1 for a free agent.

I would suggest teams would also have 3 - 4 train on players who are contracted part time but ineligible to play unless there is a LTI player. This is what I have demoted Fraser Phillips and Ben Silvagni too.

Delisting or demotion of all of our developing key defenders just cannot happen. This would leave Weitering and the perhaps undersized, and injury plagued Marchbank as our only key defensive players beside the aging Jones and Casboult. Not going to happen. Also I cannot see the AFL inflicting that much pain across the league. List reductions are likely, but they cannot reduce to 35ish overnight. Varying list structures and player welfare issues will bring about a compromise re list size and salary cap.

Consider the basically AFL funded GC Suns, they currently have 51 players on their list due to concessions from the league. How do they rationalise that?

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

My understanding from what I’ve been told, one possible scenario is there could be a supplementary list made up of the last 6/8 players on the list.
Wages will be stripped back for the final 6/8 but are available anytime for a promotion due to injury or suspension, clubs could not run a successful reserves team with only 35, there is also a worry about effect on the young players longer term development for clubs...

Same mail as Charlie will miss the rest of the year...

 

[Jeremias]

My understanding from what I’ve been told, one possible scenario is there could be a supplementary list made up of the last 6/8 players on the list.
Wages will be stripped back for the final 6/8 but are available anytime for a promotion due to injury or suspension, clubs could not run a successful reserves team with only 35, there is also a worry about effect on the young players longer term development for clubs...

Same mail as Charlie will miss the rest of the year...

I have seen this floated and it makes sense, though it is a tough one for the demoted players to swallow.

Also raises the question of whether there will be age restrictions on the supplementary list - I wonder if this might be the precursor to the return of the reserves competition.

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

I have seen this floated and it makes sense, though it is a tough one for the demoted players to swallow.

Also raises the question of whether there will be age restrictions on the supplementary list - I wonder if this might be the precursor to the return of the reserves competition.

The reserves for me could only work as an eastern states competition at best, if from some reports about WA or SA cant break away from their own states due too a few reasons then we will be made up of 14 remaining teams...
That’s 7 matches a week with each team playing one anthor 3 times throughout the season in a 21 round competition, if the afl keep the current 23rd format it’s about the right amount Reserves games...
Of course the cost of it all and particularly traveling might be a problem initially to get it all up and running...

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

I have seen this floated and it makes sense, though it is a tough one for the demoted players to swallow.

Also raises the question of whether there will be age restrictions on the supplementary list - I wonder if this might be the precursor to the return of the reserves competition.

The age restriction angle would be a very interesting one, depending on what age you cap that off it’s more than likely going to impact on the cross coders and more mature guys that are coming from further back..
If say there was a cap, let’s say under 23 would probably be an age that gives clubs a little too work within...

 

[SurreyBlue]

I think we have enough coin for at least 2 players of that calibre

Simmo's last year, Murph, Ed, Levi and Krooz come off their last contracts

Plenty of OOC

We should certainly have more than GWS!!!

 

[Schoonerman]

My understanding from what I’ve been told, one possible scenario is there could be a supplementary list made up of the last 6/8 players on the list.
Wages will be stripped back for the final 6/8 but are available anytime for a promotion due to injury or suspension, clubs could not run a successful reserves team with only 35, there is also a worry about effect on the young players longer term development for clubs...

Same mail as Charlie will miss the rest of the year...

If you were ever going to miss a year than 2020 is it

 

[DangerousD]

To me, Brad Crouch as a FA along with papley for a 1st sounds right on the money. Im extremely keen on Zac Williams but we all know the AFL wont let players from there leave as easily as they once did.

I really don't know, how the AFL can justify to the other 17 clubs, how a team seems to have 5-6 players on a Mill or more. The AFL would know that they at leat have to appear to be doing the right thing, if Cameron stays, on the back of Whitfield and Cogs signing big deals, Williams might be the sacrificial lamb.
If not, they will have to offload young talent to make whatever pretend cap they are operating under. Maybe they cut Cal Ward, something has to give.

Cameron
Kelly
Whitfield
Cognilio
Greene

Williams

 

[DangerousD]

2x retired - Betts and Simpson
1x Traded - Kreuzer
7x Delisted - Goddard Moore Cotteral ODwyer McCreadie Lang Polson
2x Train Ons- Phillips BSilvagni

Brings our list down to 34.
Dependent on if lists are 35 or 36 allows 1 spot for a draft pick and possibly 1 for a free agent.

I would suggest teams would also have 3 - 4 train on players who are contracted part time but ineligible to play unless there is a LTI player. This is what I have demoted Fraser Phillips and Ben Silvagni too.

I would think the train ons that you suggest would be quite higher, or there would be a mechanism to add more. We still have to field a reserves side after all.
Im not sure i see Kruz going on to be honest, especially not at another club, if anything, maybe a year as a back up ruck.

 

[La Dispute]

I think we've got to temper expectations we will get out of the bottom few tbh. I'm predicting the shorter season will have a much bigger impact on less experienced sides, who haven't got the same level of cohesion to just ride out the break and readjust on the fly.

A top 5 pick is huge overs for Wines, especially considering a better option is available for free in Crouch. Pending another lowly finish, we'd be happy to reload with picks, add Crouch, and see what we can manoeuvre to get Papley which if he's still keen to join may mean downgrading our first pick.