List Mgmt. 2020 List Management

[Jimmyonesix]

I agree with those you mention without rose coloured glasses, though Charlie’s injury concerns are a worry.

Point being we have about maybe half of what we need, from here it’s all about getting talent through the door who can have an immediate impact and improve us NOW.

Sometimes the bit parts to premiership sides aren't the big names you expect -- I for one agree with the 12-14 players core theory .

 

[9874123]

It’s going to depend on injuries to those younger guys, who can get a good run at it and who comes on, develops and who doesn’t.

There’s no 100% right template and if we end up with more pace than inside grunt or vice versa we need to maximise what we have to greatest effect and look to get what we don’t have.

For example the side could look a lot different if Philp, Dow and lob all come on, and Setterfield and kemp don’t.

Be nice if all of them did, but odds are they won’t all be guns for various reasons.

Well ultimately, if none of the right players come on the give us a good midfield mix we will end up being a one trick pony in the middle and likely won't become an elite side that challenges for flags.

 

[Red Bull]

That moment has passed us by, I feel.
Can't see us handing over any premium value, for developing mids. It makes for an overload of young mids and we have to start getting games into the likes of Dow & Stocker, maybe a little bit of Philp this year and then Kemp the next.....and that's without even raising names Fisher, SPS, Setterfield.
We have to develop what we have first before we 'reach' for more young midfielders.

Same old; Premium 25/6 year old mid and a goal-kicker or two....and if something too good to be true pops up, be ready.
That can change by the end of the year, but alike last year - I don't think it will.

That’s about the sum of it atm.
We’ve done the groundwork, now the players have to be played.
Our recruiting should be very streamlined and selective, and, we shouldn’t be afraid to pay for what we need.
A genuine quality goal kicking small forward.
An established A grade midfielder.

 

[bradr7]

Not sure I agree on Stocker replacing Ed, as Ed's major attribute is his endurance, something that Stocker has struggled with and was his biggest issue prior to being drafted and continues to hold him back. This can also be worked on but I'm not sure he'll ever be fit enough to play a run with role, I think if Stocker will cement himself as a full-time mid, it'll be by him doing more damage to the opposition then his opponent is doing to us. I think the dedicated tagger is a position that none of our young mids are right for, but its lucky that its a role that you can find relatively easily in the latter parts of the draft, or trade in ready made.

Also don't think that Dow is a Murphy type. If it will be anyone on our list that replaces him I think Martin is the obvious choice, which is a role we saw a bit of last night and hopefully will continue to see for the rest of the season, with Fisher to rotate and give Martin time forward of the ball. I am a fan of Dow and think he can develop into a good mid, but he'll never be classy enough to play that role.

 

[alfo]

I look forward to the problem of fitting Charlie in. We do have a very good and above average marking side, and with Teague we play to those strengths.

Midfield obviously needs work, Martin must stay in there. SPS 4 years in system, has shown more than many others but does need to lift, id agree.

I still think SPS will end up at least a solid best 22 player, probably in our best 10 going forward.

Definitely a good problem to have, but we don't want it to disrupt the balance of the team and cause the forward line to breakdown.
Just don't see a Casboult - Harry - Charlie - Gov forward line going forward.

Glad you're optimistic about SPS. I just don't see it, especially the best 10. Hasn't got elite speed to break lines like Martin and Yarran had.
Foot skills are outstanding but he doesn't find the ball enough to use them.

 

[bradr7]

A lot will depend on injuries & what Russell does with fitness of the group but Silvagni was used with success last year in the midfield. E.Curnow has still got a few years left in him in a stopper role. If C.Curnow gets his body right then he would be used as a floater up forward with Silvagni replacing E.Curnow or being an extra mid rotation. Having Silvagni's height & strength will help Cripps. Need to get time in the midfield into the likes of Dow, Stocker, Philp to have back up for Murphy.. At this point of time J.Martin, Walsh & Gibbons can assist with rotations

 

[HARKER]

That’s about the sum of it atm.
We’ve done the groundwork, now the players have to be played.
Our recruiting should be very streamlined and selective, and, we shouldn’t be afraid to pay for what we need.
A genuine quality goal kicking small forward.
An established A grade midfielder.

I feel we may have put this forward....once, twice, three.....100 times.
Doesn't mean that's the way it will play out, but it sems right for now

The other area we must look at is a reliable tall back. If Jones or Weitering go down, what have we got?
Goddard isn't the answer. Macreadie just can't get going. BSilvagni? Can't see it. Casboult? At 31 next year, he's not the answer.
Then there's Marchbank who isn't really a genuine CHB and even if so.....injury.....injury...injury.

We have to consolidate this squad and not squander the young mids because we can't fit them all in....and that's without even raising the possibility of having to thin the squad to ~35. No more young 'unproven' mids.

 

[DangerousD]

Definitely a good problem to have, but we don't want it to disrupt the balance of the team and cause the forward line to breakdown.
Just don't see a Casboult - Harry - Charlie - Gov forward line going forward.

Glad you're optimistic about SPS. I just don't see it, especially the best 10. Hasn't got elite speed to break lines like Martin and Yarran had.
Foot skills are outstanding but he doesn't find the ball enough to use them.

id say that Charlie either replaces SOS or one of Gov/Levi, depending on form. I’m also interested in who makes way when both Charlie and Marchbank are available?

Cas provides decent ruck cover, but if he’s out Harry has to step up.

mom a fan of SPS but don’t think he can play in defence, has good skills, vision and smarts, but currently lacks determination and physicality, something I hope he can improve.

 

[DangerousD]

Did our 2nds have a game?

 

[Red Bull]

I feel we may have put this forward....once, twice, three.....100 times.
Doesn't mean that's the way it will play out, but it sems right for now

The other area we must look at is a reliable tall back. If Jones or Weitering go down, what have we got?
Goddard isn't the answer. Macreadie just can't get going. BSilvagni? Can't see it. Casboult? At 31 next year, he's not the answer.
Then there's Marchbank who isn't really a genuine CHB and even if so.....injury.....injury...injury.

We have to consolidate this squad and not squander the young mids because we can't fit them all in....and that's without even raising the possibility of having to thin the squad to ~35. No more young 'unproven' mids.

Jones will be around for a few seasons yet.
This should allow enough time for B.Silvagni or Macreadie to stake their claim as the next in line.
I’ll readily admit to having seen next to nothing of Silvagni at this stage, but the Silvagni’s appear to be a breed that take time to fully develop.
He has the dimensions of a KPP and you would hope he has inherited that unquantifiable something special of note in the family.
Marchbank could be considered slightly undersize for a KPD but has ability and could do the job as part of a team defence if required.
Obviously, his durability is a major concern.

 

[Arr0w]

Think we are sorted for KPP,s, just continue to top up on best available to replace retiring players

Still don't see small forwards as the number one priority, but you don't say no to a player at the right price

Number one target should be midfielders with toe, grunt and above average disposal, but need to be dangerous while resting forward, rather than on the pine

 

[Arr0w]

Toe - Dow & Philp & Fisher
Grunt - Cripps & Stocker & Kemp (all being right) ...... you mean the combination, like D. Martin?

Yes. Dangerous when forward. Like DeGoey?

Martin that played predominantly through the middle? Yeah that type of mid

Murhpy, Ed, Betts don't have long left, mids that can rest forward are gold

So the likes of Fisher, Dow, Philp, Stocker, Kemp will replace those 3, then you always have injuries

Midfield is still the number one priority, IMHO.

After that, continue to take best available in the draft

 

[alfo]

id say that Charlie either replaces SOS or one of Gov/Levi, depending on form. I’m also interested in who makes way when both Charlie and Marchbank are available?

Cas provides decent ruck cover, but if he’s out Harry has to step up.

mom a fan of SPS but don’t think he can play in defence, has good skills, vision and smarts, but currently lacks determination and physicality, something I hope he can improve.

Yeah replacement for SOS seems about right, they're both 190+cm. Just feel we're a little tall up there.
Charlie could definitely be that high HF and be the hit up player along the wing.

On SPS, I don't think he can play midfield either. I was at the game last year vs North Melbourne and he was absolutely smashed through there.
Coming up against guys like Ziebell and Cunnington, he was out bodied the whole time.
So where does he fit?
Wing maybe and throw Walsh in the middle more?

 

[Crippa#9]

That moment has passed us by, I feel.
Can't see us handing over any premium value, for developing mids. It makes for an overload of young mids and we have to start getting games into the likes of Dow & Stocker, maybe a little bit of Philp this year and then Kemp the next.....and that's without even raising names Fisher, SPS, Setterfield.
We have to develop what we have first before we 'reach' for more young midfielders.

Same old; Premium 25/6 year old mid and a goal-kicker or two....and if something too good to be true pops up, be ready.
That can change by the end of the year, but alike last year - I don't think it will.

Spot on

 

[HARKER]

Martin that played predominantly through the middle? Yeah that type of mid
Murhpy, Ed, Betts don't have long left, mids that can rest forward are gold
So the likes of Fisher, Dow, Philp, Stocker, Kemp will replace those 3, then you always have injuries
Midfield is still the number one priority, IMHO.
After that, continue to take best available in the draft

Not an easy type to find.
Neither Wines nor BCrouch strike me as being that type. They're just not creative enough.
I understand people wanting us to take on one of those 'big-bodied' mids, but I still feel that will change by years end. Wishful thinking maybe.

Again - We've invested a lot of key picks on mids and we just have to make good from what we have. Provide opportunity and with a little more maturity, it just has to bear fruit, or there will be an element of failure involved.

How do all these high-selection 'young' mids coexist; Cripps, Walsh, Setterfield, Fisher, Dow, Stocker, SPS, Kemp, Philp and then adding more to this group?
Not saying they can't as I do see some of these players capable of playing dual positions and some....not so much but too much of the same thing isn't the smartest of moves.

 

[The Grover]

Toe - Dow & Philp & Fisher
Grunt - Cripps & Stocker & Kemp (all being right) ...... you mean the combination, like D. Martin?

Yes. Dangerous when forward. Like DeGoey?

Add Josh Honey to the Toe group

 

[Arr0w]

Not an easy type to find.
Neither Wines nor BCrouch strike me as being that type. They're just not creative enough.
I understand people wanting us to take on one of those 'big-bodied' mids, but I still feel that will change by years end. Wishful thinking maybe.

Again - We've invested a lot of key picks on mids and we just have to make good from what we have. Provide opportunity and with a little more maturity, it just has to bear fruit, or there will be an element of failure involved.

How do all these high-selection 'young' mids coexist; Cripps, Walsh, Setterfield, Fisher, Dow, Stocker, SPS, Kemp, Philp and then adding more to this group?
Not saying they can't as I do see some of these players capable of playing dual positions and some....not so much but too much of the same thing isn't the smartest of moves.

Not having this conversation again Harks, they aren't born, branded "midfielder only"

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Yep, with what Charlie has shown in his very short time in the game he is probably the most exciting young forward in the game and would be a major target for other clubs so I have no problem with paying him on his potential which is sky high, forwards with his tank, agility, marking power and overall game smarts are very hard to find, his 7 goals against the Dogs last year was just a taste of what he can deliver to this footy club.

Bit unfair in hindsight for people to say atm his been overpaid after the injury i recon...
Just shocking luck, would be absolutely worth every cent...
He’s contract would have been front loaded through SOS’s list management anyway...

 

[HARKER]

Add Josh Honey to the Toe group

He's got grunt also and power through the hips.
I'm sure we'll see flaws in his game when we're allowed to attend what are now practice matches, but he sure has something going for him.

 

[Arr0w]

Seems you didn't finish reading my post then

Also if you let go of a premium pick for what eventuates into a HBF'er that's only there because he just didn't fit develop into the midfielder you envisaged, then maybe you didn't do it right.

I read all of it Harks, every single word

Perhaps chew on this for a while

Prediction - Your 2020 Best 22 (Post Trade Period)

With all of the uncertainty and discussion around what will be our Best 22 come Round 1, perhaps we need to rethink and re-frame the discussion. Rather than a Consensus 22... perhaps we need to separate our list into 3 groups. 1. Consensus Best 18 players - based on CJMB and his outstanding...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Arr0w]

Mate, you know what? I don't care how we get there as long as we get there.

If you are though going to be wanting new players to come into our best team, some have to come out. Can't have it both ways.

Look, there's a lot to play out and names Macreadie, BSilvagni, Philp etc may be easy to drop into ones young team, but some proof will need to be seen....and as yet....not there.

so much can change and pretty quickly and a lot will change if list sizes get reduced.

I am sure I mentioned that didn't I? " we will need to target a KPD if the likes of BSOS or Macreadie don't come on"?

Each year we have to replace at least 3 players, like every side, if they reduce list sizes, it's the same for all sides?

 

[HARKER]

I am sure I mentioned that didn't I? " we will need to target a KPD if the likes of BSOS or Macreadie don't come on"?

Each year we have to replace at least 3 players, like every side, if they reduce list sizes, it's the same for all sides?

We have a good platform there Arrow. That's not in dispute.

Just have to keep the club genuinely buoyed and every person behind another. It means a lot and we'll see just how united we really are.

Look at Adelaide today. The left hand has no idea what the right hand is doing. Completely disjointed.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Seriously think we should go after Laird big time, Adelaide is an absolute shambles right now and he would be the perfect pairing with Doch, he's down on form but who wouldnt be at that joint and I'm tipping a few more crows are set to join the exodus this year.

Simmo can't have too many years left and he plays as a bit of a supporting role to Doch at the moment letting Doch push to more aggressive spots on the field knowing Simmo will be able to get the ball to him. Would also mean SPS could shift up forward to deliver with Martin which I still believe is his best suited area, just needs more forward craft to add goalkicking to his game but his delivery to forwards via foot has always been beautiful

Obviously Papley would be a priority but if you got the two of them and one of our mids steps up we'd be looking good on every line

 

[Arr0w]

We have a good platform there Arrow. That's not in dispute.

Just have to keep the club genuinely buoyed and every person behind another. It means a lot and we'll see just how united we really are.

Look at Adelaide today. The left hand has no idea what the right hand is doing. Completely disjointed.

No organization has full unity, especially if expectations outweigh reality

Will say again, we have been where Adelaide are, currently that is a past era

 

[chunkylover53]

Funny you should mention Adelaide players, as I was going to suggest the same.

Maybe we can make more of Fogarty than he's showing at Adelaide. These guys aren't playing for the club.

Teague would be tight with some of the players still maybe?

Crouch is an FA? Laird? What would we need to give up for Fogarty?