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List Mgmt. 2021 List Management
- Thread starter The Old Dark Navy's
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- Dec 22, 2006
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Did a quick analysis on what i think players are being paid this year, total ended up at 13.15 mil slightly under the cap..
Saad - $700
Kemp - $150
Marchbank - $400
Charlie Curnow - $650
Durdin - $100
Cunningham - $200
Betts - $300
Ed Curnow - $300
Harry McKay - $300
Carrol - $100
Martin - $700
Newnes - $300
JSOS - $250
Weiters - $600
Honey - $100
Fogarty - $200
Plowman - $300
Levi - $250
Jones - $300
Stocker - $150
LOB - $200
Parks - $100
Murph - $500
Pitto - $200
Cottrell $150
Owies - $100
Kennedy - $200
Gibbons - $200
McGovern - $600
Newman - $300
OMc - $100
Dow - $200
Cripps - $800
Doch - $550
SPS - $300
Philp - $100
Ramsey - $100
Walsh - $400
TDK - $250
Williamson - $150
Setterfield - $300
Fisher - $300
Williams - $750
Those highlighted are out of contract, of these players the only one's that i think will demand an increase would be Harry, JSOS & Parks and perhaps Cripps but it wont by much.. On the contrary we will likely Retire Murphy & Betts ($800k) and delist Kennedy & Newman ($500k) giving us a $1.3mil buffer to re-sign Cripps, Walsh & McKay.. and then we may look to trade players like SPS or Setterfield if they dont find themselves back in the best 22 ASAP. which would give us room to target new players.
Saad - $700
Kemp - $150
Marchbank - $400
Charlie Curnow - $650
Durdin - $100
Cunningham - $200
Betts - $300
Ed Curnow - $300
Harry McKay - $300
Carrol - $100
Martin - $700
Newnes - $300
JSOS - $250
Weiters - $600
Honey - $100
Fogarty - $200
Plowman - $300
Levi - $250
Jones - $300
Stocker - $150
LOB - $200
Parks - $100
Murph - $500
Pitto - $200
Cottrell $150
Owies - $100
Kennedy - $200
Gibbons - $200
McGovern - $600
Newman - $300
OMc - $100
Dow - $200
Cripps - $800
Doch - $550
SPS - $300
Philp - $100
Ramsey - $100
Walsh - $400
TDK - $250
Williamson - $150
Setterfield - $300
Fisher - $300
Williams - $750
Those highlighted are out of contract, of these players the only one's that i think will demand an increase would be Harry, JSOS & Parks and perhaps Cripps but it wont by much.. On the contrary we will likely Retire Murphy & Betts ($800k) and delist Kennedy & Newman ($500k) giving us a $1.3mil buffer to re-sign Cripps, Walsh & McKay.. and then we may look to trade players like SPS or Setterfield if they dont find themselves back in the best 22 ASAP. which would give us room to target new players.
- Apr 20, 2006
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It’s not hard to look two years ahead and see how many players are coming ooc and we will save money on. Curnow, C Curnow, Cas, Murphy, Newnes, Betts, McGovern either delisted or pay decreases. That’s probably close to $1.5-2mil in potential savings in two years time losing very little from the side. SPS isn’t getting a pay rise, Setterfield looks like he will get his dropped massively, Marchbank another who should get close to base wage. We probably won’t need any extra money for Dow and LOB which is probably unexpected. Kemp and Philp will need a minimum rise.
Having Really only McKay and Walsh to pay extra to is a drop in the ocean.
Having Really only McKay and Walsh to pay extra to is a drop in the ocean.
Original Moody Blue
Cancelled
- Nov 14, 2020
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Betts and Kennedy are on rookie contracts, so their base is much lower, or am I wrong?
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- Dec 22, 2006
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A rookie can be paid higher than the base and the base is higher the longer they have been in the system.
- Oct 4, 2015
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I agree with most, but I can dead set guarantee you we are not going to be getting rid of Saad and/or Williams. After 8 games, that's crazy talk, sure things aren't rosy with them at the moment but at their core, they are both very good footballers. Williams is being played in the wrong pos, it was an experiment and it's clear it isn't going to work until he at the very least builds the tank. Until he does, he needs to be at half back.
As for getting an elite KPF that can ruck as well as 2 elite mids and KPDs.... we would be lucky to bring one of those in. This is why I've been stating that we might need to look at a mini reset this year and gather an additional top 10 pick so we can draft the best talls.
Picked last in every team for every sport no doubt.
- May 2, 2015
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I reckon Cunners is on closer to 400k. We signed him for 4 years.
You are right. They were only short term selections
SOS actually had a few of those.
- Aug 22, 2014
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Ten = short for Tenacious...not ten ways, just saying you're basing your criticism on media-reported figures but then in your next point writing off the major media figures as people who have no idea what they're talking about. That seems a bit at odds.
Again - if you take the top 20% of players out of the equation, I think you'll find that the average salary of our bottom 30 is pretty close to the bottom 30 of most other clubs. If anything, we're able to overpay some blokes to join because we've invested so heavily in the draft that our salary range would be skewed on the lower side.
We don't need to be splashing major cash to fill the gaps in our list. We need the Alex Keaths and Jordan Rougheads of the comp for down back, we need a young ruckman to develop because TDK will take the mantle by next year and Pittonet will continue on as depth, we need a Josh Bruce up forward, could look at a Hugh Greenwood type for the midfield. These guys don't cost the world, in money or picks.
Once we climb the mountain, we'll have more chance of resigning blokes for unders, but it's a hard sell to do it now. Though I'd love us to try.
Why would we delist Newman?
we are frontloaded
Why believe all the reports on our contracts and then cite the above?
Tom Lynch reportedly has a heavily back ended seven year deal rising to 1.5m/year in the final years.
Jeremy Cameron is reportedly on $950k/year
Hawks aren't worth discussing at present.
McGovern is reportedly on 1.1m/year, Gaff $900k+
- Dec 22, 2006
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Might not delist, but would have come accross on good $ and cant get on the park so would move him onto a heavily incentivised contract.
- Dec 22, 2006
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Yes, like your post
But there are things you haven't taken into consideration..
Glad I'm not a list manager
- At this stage we are a bottom 8 team/list looking to offload players to afford other players
- We would have to replace best 22 - Newman, Murphy & Betts, with what $$? Just made our depth weaker
- We desperately need a KPF/Ruck, KPDers & more midfield talent
- What happens if any or multiple of our players (Cuningham, Kemp, Dow, Stocker, Kemp) came on in a big way how do we pay them?
Could be wrong..
But from memory think it was.. Rookie wages $50,000 is not included in the cap
Betts & Murphy are not best 22 players, Betts last 2 weeks have been good however his previous 15 were very poor and if Martin or Fisher were fit I am certain he would have been dropped. Murphy has already been replaced in the best 22. Newman hasn't played for 2 years. We can expect natural growth from our existing best 22 and those on the fringe like Cunningham, Durdin, Honey, LOB, Stocker, Cottrel, Owies, Dow, Kemp.
We have seen from the past few weeks, that our issues are not personal.. We have a very good list that will get better without adding anything new. Our improvement will come from better coaching, more experience from our young players and a bit of luck with injuries.
Once TDK takes the #1 ruck role, having Pitto as depth is more than adequate and we can draft another.. However the 1 weakness in our list is a long term replacement for Levi as that 3rd fwd/ruck swingman... I would hope our list management is already talking with Esava Ratogoleas management, he is the perfect fit for this role and wont cost the world.
- Apr 20, 2006
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McGovern and Williams are the only two that look bad atm. Saad getting tagged shows he is worth it. Nearly every half back who gets attention get taken out of the game.
If our midfield weren’t getting so easily beaten then teams couldn’t afford to put time into impact players like that. Look at players like Short and Houli who run around by themselves getting easy kicks all day. HB rely on the sides style and support to impact games. Short has never had 10 contested touches in a game, Houli has had over 10, three times in the last 5 years. As soon as we get a system where we can actually use Saad more he will flourish. He is playing a receiving role yet we aren’t getting it to him.
Eagles also pay their stars top dollar. See McGov, Nic Nat, Gaff. They just don’t need to recruit as often because they draft well and when they do they only have to bid against one other side in WA.
Hawks didn’t over pay because they were contenders for about 8 years and come good with the list they drafted. We haven’t drafted well enough to do that.
Look at Richmond’s list and tell me who you would chase on big money? I bet the ones you would are already on big dollars. Same as Geelong.
GWS were stuffed because every Tom, Dick and Harry offered huge dollars for any good to average player they had. Offers that were made to J Kelly, Shiel, Coniglio for the ability of player they are has never really happened to a side before. Ablett and Franklin got those type of offers and they left these “great” clubs. Ellis got a big offer and he left Richmond. Harry could love Carlton more then anyone on the list and we could have $5mil in cap space but if someone like North offer him $13mil over 10 years then we are stuffed.
Ricky Mott
Team Captain
- Jul 26, 2015
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Maybe there was method in him doing so. To keep going to the draft and freeing up money. To give Austin and Lloyd the chance to blow 2 million in one off season of trading. Makes sense.You are right. They were only short term selections
SOS actually had a few of those.
Why do we keep referencing Betts' 2020 season as if relevant?
And his 15 previous games weren't very poor at all...it's a nonsense generalisation. He was somewhere between average and good against Freo, Gold Coast and PA just off the top of my head.
Do very much agree on the TDK call. Pitto is a trier, but the hit out and tap to advantage numbers he supposedly generates are nowhere near the eye test, and I'd argue have some sort of bearing on Cripps drop in clearance numbers.
You should really let us know your thoughts on the Board's decisions sometime.
BTW what did you think of SOS opening the bank vault for MCGovern?
Could he be a replacement for Jones at center half back?
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- Sep 28, 2016
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Could we trial the gov there in the back half 9f the season?
Pies going hard.
- Apr 20, 2006
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3. Yes that’s what the most successful teams have been doing, Richmond also. Pay big dollars to the core and small amounts to role players.(Putting points into point form easier to reply to)
- Umm what? Seem to recall seeing Betts and Murphy playing every game when fit...
Teague has stated this many times, he will continue to play them. Makes them best 22 for mine- Don't hold you breath waiting, our list hasn't achieved anything and is on track for another mediocre year.. Bottom 8 list, until proven otherwise
- Yes agree to an extent with our rucks. We desperately need KPF/Ruck (to replace Levi)
Ratogolea a good choice.. Why would he leave premiership contender Geelong to come to Carlton? Money? Where is this money to come from after we re-sign Cripps, Walsh & McKay..- Maybe you want to rethink KPDers we have a 31 Year Old Jones and zero depth..
Anyways, this has been going around in circles all day, been fun, now know how arrow feels
- Yes and they are taking up an estimated 11.4% of our cap.. Also Curnow and Martin who are always injured are reportedly taking up 9.75% of our cap
- Agree, but a different discussion
- Not sure but they have a fair few of them (NicNat, McGovern, Gaff, Shue, Yeo, Allen, Sheed, Ryan, Kelly, Darling, Barrass, Kennedy & Hurn)
If what you say is true, rest of the list must be on $500 a week- Correct, how do we contend when we over pay now?
- None would come here and they all take unders to win flags
- Yep, now we are following in their footsteps
- Yeah and how did they work out for them and how did the team they left go? Both teams won flags
- Possibly could and you couldn't begrudge him for it, as long as he insists on a fair trade (Judd style) and not going to PSD
No one has changed my opinion, but happy to just move on
7. That’s not the point. The point is most players take less then what they could get on an open market. Successful sides more so but once the gap is large enough no team can keep all their players. We aren’t going to lose anyone unless teams come with stupid offers for them and in that case salary cap room isn’t the issue.
People were saying Port overpaid for players like Dixon, Rockliff, Lycett and Motlop. Overpaying $100k on those type of players (Saad, Williams etc) isn’t that big of a problem. ATM we are probably paying Setterfield close to $400k considering what we done to get him. His spot would currently be filled with someone on $100k. Maybe making smarter choices on that end will be more effective.
- Oct 23, 2020
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can someone please tell me how McGovern is on big money? It was my belief that he was contracted for 2 more years on big money when he came to us so he would’ve been ooc at the end of last year... either we signed him quietly or extended but which year did we do that ? And what form at our club would warrant the same sort of coin?
You’re just making up you’re own numbers you don’t know who has been front loaded or by how much 11%of this 9% of that is made up.(Putting points into point form easier to reply to)
- Umm what? Seem to recall seeing Betts and Murphy playing every game when fit...
Teague has stated this many times, he will continue to play them. Makes them best 22 for mine- Don't hold you breath waiting, our list hasn't achieved anything and is on track for another mediocre year.. Bottom 8 list, until proven otherwise
- Yes agree to an extent with our rucks. We desperately need KPF/Ruck (to replace Levi)
Ratogolea a good choice.. Why would he leave premiership contender Geelong to come to Carlton? Money? Where is this money to come from after we re-sign Cripps, Walsh & McKay..- Maybe you want to rethink KPDers we have a 31 Year Old Jones and zero depth..
Anyways, this has been going around in circles all day, been fun, now know how arrow feels
- Yes and they are taking up an estimated 11.4% of our cap.. Also Curnow and Martin who are always injured are reportedly taking up 9.75% of our cap
- Agree, but a different discussion
- Not sure but they have a fair few of them (NicNat, McGovern, Gaff, Shue, Yeo, Allen, Sheed, Ryan, Kelly, Darling, Barrass, Kennedy & Hurn)
If what you say is true, rest of the list must be on $500 a week- Correct, how do we contend when we over pay now?
- None would come here and they all take unders to win flags
- Yep, now we are following in their footsteps
- Yeah and how did they work out for them and how did the team they left go? Both teams won flags
- Possibly could and you couldn't begrudge him for it, as long as he insists on a fair trade (Judd style) and not going to PSD
No one has changed my opinion, but happy to just move on
Will also say, this off season will be the make or break of our rebuild
Contracts let’s say Curnow would have incentives match payments wouldn’t be on anything like you’re make uppity limits neither would McGovern
I could make up numbers and say Williams is completely front loaded and where paying 100 a year Martin also and where only paying 200 what’s difference between you’re numbers and mine not a lot there both wrong
- Dec 22, 2006
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The pie in the sky numbers that the media spit out are usually always over inflated to include best case scenario if player hitting all of their KPIs.
