Analysis 2021 trade thread

[mattsmob]

What about Ely Smith for Jarrod Cameron

39

Jarrod Cameron

Age

26

Ht

182cm

Wt

70kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.0

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

2.3

2star

M

1.7

2star

T

3.6

5star

G

1.3

5star

D

5.0

1star

K

3.5

1star

HB

1.5

1star

M

0.5

1star

T

2.5

3star

G

0.5

4star

D

8.0

2star

K

5.6

3star

HB

2.4

3star

M

2.0

3star

T

4.2

5star

G

2.0

5star

? West Coast can take a chance on someone with one year left and a bit of injury history.

 

[captainrich]

From memory Jarrod Cameron

39

Jarrod Cameron

Age

26

Ht

182cm

Wt

70kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.0

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

2.3

2star

M

1.7

2star

T

3.6

5star

G

1.3

5star

D

5.0

1star

K

3.5

1star

HB

1.5

1star

M

0.5

1star

T

2.5

3star

G

0.5

4star

D

8.0

2star

K

5.6

3star

HB

2.4

3star

M

2.0

3star

T

4.2

5star

G

2.0

5star

was in our plans on draft night but the Eagles reached for him and screwed our plans.

We actually bid on him and West Coast matched, nothing about them reaching they had first rights to him.

 

[cotter101]

Not entirely sure we need him and list spots are tight.

 

[Nuggo]

Kiddy and Cameron coming off the half back line? We are not noted for our leg speed so any speed is welcome in my eyes however list spots are an issue. Will be interesting as always to see where this ends up.

 

[Clarkythelion]

Can someone post a state of play as it is now please? Can we have a re-set now the Neale thing has gone to bed.

We have 2 list spaces (I think)
4 on the rookie list
we have to take 3 in the draft
we only have 2 uncontracted players Joyce and ?
1 can go off the main list to the rooky list which could creat a 3 spot.
How many can be on the rookie list/
Who is on there now.

Sorry just too tired from painting the house to do some google work.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Tom14]

Kiddy and Cameron coming off the half back line? We are not noted for our leg speed so any speed is welcome in my eyes however list spots are an issue. Will be interesting as always to see where this ends up.

Was having a listen to the West Australian's footy podcast this afternoon and their info was that Cameron was likely to take a year off as footy wasn't a priority at the moment, and West Coast and him would come to a settlement. Maybe we'd get him in as a mature age player for the VFL side if he moves over here but can't see him at the club next year without that.

 

[blueiris]

Can someone post a state of play as it is now please? Can we have a re-set now the Neale thing has gone to bed.

We have 2 list spaces (I think)
4 on the rookie list
we have to take 3 in the draft
we only have 2 uncontracted players Joyce and ?
1 can go off the main list to the rooky list which could creat a 3 spot.
How many can be on the rookie list/
Who is on there now.

Sorry just too tired from painting the house to do some google work.

Thanks in advance.

We only need to have two picks I hear

 

[JasRulz63]

Can someone post a state of play as it is now please? Can we have a re-set now the Neale thing has gone to bed.

We have 2 list spaces (I think)
4 on the rookie list
we have to take 3 in the draft
we only have 2 uncontracted players Joyce and ?
1 can go off the main list to the rooky list which could creat a 3 spot.
How many can be on the rookie list/
Who is on there now.

Sorry just too tired from painting the house to do some google work.

Thanks in advance.

List Mgmt. - List changes, contract status and key dates - 2021

Previous editions: 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 2020 Departures Senior List (3 out) Tom Joyce (delisted) Brock Smith (delisted) Cameron Ellis-Yomen (delisted; to be rookied) Rookie List (3 out) Grant Birchall (retired) Archie Smith (retired) Connor Ballenden (delisted) Draft Picks Pick...

www.bigfooty.com

Out of contract players
Grant Birchall (R)
Tom Fullarton
Archie Smith (R)
Connor Ballenden (R)
Thomas Joyce
James Madden (R)
Brock Smith
Keidean Coleman
Kalin Lane (R)

Current list numbers
Primary list (36-38) - 37
Rookie list - category A (4-6) - 6
Rookie list - category B (0-2) - 2
Total (44) - 45 (+1)

Essentially right now, we have -1 list spot because we took Lane in the mid-season draft after creating a spot by putting Rayner on the LTI. So we our overall off-season needs to be one more player going out than coming in.

By delisting/retiring Birchall, A Smith, Ballenden, B Smith and Joyce, that opens up five spots, one of which will be taken by Lane if we keep him on.

This leaves four list spots with the composition of those spots flexible in terms of whether they are on the senior or rookie list (currently 2 senior list, 2 rookie). We can free up more senior list spots by moving senior listed players onto the rookie list (players like E Smith and CEY are prime candidates.

 

[blueiris]

List Mgmt. - List changes, contract status and key dates - 2021

Previous editions: 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019 2020 Departures Senior List (3 out) Tom Joyce (delisted) Brock Smith (delisted) Cameron Ellis-Yomen (delisted; to be rookied) Rookie List (3 out) Grant Birchall (retired) Archie Smith (retired) Connor Ballenden (delisted) Draft Picks Pick...

www.bigfooty.com

Essentially right now, we have -1 list spot because we took Lane in the mid-season draft after creating a spot by putting Rayner on the LTI. So we our overall off-season needs to be one more player going out than coming in.

By delisting/retiring Birchall, A Smith, Ballenden, B Smith and Joyce, that opens up five spots, one of which will be taken by Lane if we keep him on.

This leaves four list spots with the composition of those spots flexible in terms of whether they are on the senior or rookie list (currently 2 senior list, 2 rookie). We can free up more senior list spots by moving senior listed players onto the rookie list (players like E Smith and CEY are prime candidates.

You would think A.Smith Ballenden and Birchall move off the rookie list Fullarton moves on
Brock Smith and Tom Joyce delisted

 

[BangyBangy]

Please excuse this if it is a silly question, I just don't know how all this works. But can any of our list just get moved to our VFL team? We're allowed top up players right? Can a couple of our players like B.Smith & Joyce move off the seniors list & onto the VFL list?

 

[Tom14]

Please excuse this if it is a silly question, I just don't know how all this works. But can any of our list just get moved to our VFL team? We're allowed top up players right? Can a couple of our players like B.Smith & Joyce move off the seniors list & onto the VFL list?

We can't just move them there - we'd have to delist, and then say we'd be keen to ahve them as a top up on the VFL list. But they'd probably have some better offers elsewhere as I can't imagine we would pay our VFL top ups much. I actually don't know what the rules are for AFL clubs re non-listed VFL players, I'm sure there are some limtiations on that end too.

 

[Gadzorks]

I've been thinking about our genius trading record. We had an incredible few years but the last 2 we haven't done that well, i would contend.

PRE 2020 season:

Neale - paid a bit but absolute star.
Cameron - paid a bit but gun
McCarthy - paid very little, great player
Adams - interesting one, paid a little bit, missed a whole season, but when he was on the park this year he was exceptional, so still a clear win for me
Hodge - great acquisition did exactly what he was meant to, played better than we had hoped
Lyons - one of the great bargains in the club's history.

2020 AND BEYOND

Ah Chee - been decent. Still think a good trade but probably hasn't come on like we hoped. Still a pass.
Daniher - a tricky one. No picks given, but plenty of cash. Played every game, kicked goals. Wasn't jumping well by the end of the season and was struggling to kick 50m. Maybe getting tired. Judge after another season
Cockatoo - Need another season to judge. Needs to get his speed back or be willing to go faster. Hope he can be a gun still but not proven yet - couldn't pick him on his current output so jury's out
Birchall - played nearly every game. Clearly not fit and a long way from the Birchall at Hawthorn. Hasn't made us a better team or defence. I am very keen to see the back of him but didn't pay anything so can't call a failure.
CEY - looks an awful choice right now. We needed a big bodied mid but not a slow one. And inexplicably for a player who had played 39 games in 8 years he got a four year contract. Strangest acquisition we have made in this era. Has remained injury prone.

The other aspect is the players we have let go in the past couple of years.

KEAYS - would clearly be in our squad now. Tricky one as needed midfield time we couldn't give. Would be much better cover than Matho.
CUTLER - haven't watched him really closely but getting a game at Essendon and seems to be doing okay. Such a nice long kick and good pace.
WITHERDEN - thought he really regressed and understood trading him out. But playing Birchall (no upside) over Witherden seemed odd.
TAYLOR - always liked Lewy but not doing much at Sydney
WALKER - would have been a very handy inclusion this year I reckon, forward giving a contest and part time ruck. But no world beater.

You can't get every decision right. But we've had a few misses the past couple of years and I hope we have learnt something from it.

No more players in unless they are best 22 locks.

And I think we probably have enough players in the squad now with extended injury histories.

Keays and witherden are both to ambitious to be our depth. Need to have the opportunity provided by the trades.

Depth players are loyalists like Lester and matho. Never top ten, but learn their role and play it well. Note their role isn't superstar, so critizing them of lack of superstar traits is wasted words.

 

[BangyBangy]

We can't just move them there - we'd have to delist, and then say we'd be keen to ahve them as a top up on the VFL list. But they'd probably have some better offers elsewhere as I can't imagine we would pay our VFL top ups much. I actually don't know what the rules are for AFL clubs re non-listed VFL players, I'm sure there are some limtiations on that end too.

Yep fair enough. Just thinking that with the interrupted Neafl & VFL seasons in the last two years, that our developing players development (hmmm, no other way to say that really) may have been stymied somewhat. Do Brock Smith, Tom Joyce, & Connor Ballenden have any chance of making it? If our club thinks no then fair enough, but if there's a glimmer of hope, then maybe it's last chance saloon on the VFL list.

 

[briztoon]

Please excuse this if it is a silly question, I just don't know how all this works. But can any of our list just get moved to our VFL team? We're allowed top up players right? Can a couple of our players like B.Smith & Joyce move off the seniors list & onto the VFL list?

VFL top up players can NOT be upgraded to play at AFL level.

Also there is a $100k salary cap for the VFL team.

 

[mattsmob]

Yep fair enough. Just thinking that with the interrupted Neafl & VFL seasons in the last two years, that our developing players development (hmmm, no other way to say that really) may have been stymied somewhat. Do Brock Smith, Tom Joyce, & Connor Ballenden have any chance of making it? If our club thinks no then fair enough, but if there's a glimmer of hope, then maybe it's last chance saloon on the VFL list.

Personally I think Joyce probably has a chance and can see why others think Ballenden might make it but at the end of the day if we end up with 3 first round picks I don't really think any of them are certainties and would much rather the new draftees.
Overall what I'd do is retire Birchall, delist A.Smith, B.Smith and Ballenden then bring in 3 first round picks. If a Jarrod Cameron or another player like Briggs wants to come to the club then I would also delist Joyce.

 

[RoyBoy17]

Anyone think we offer Ely up for trade for a late future pick or future pick upgrade next year to help with points and free up a list spot. I can’t see him getting a game next year and not a fan of him on the wing.

 

[Bucking Beads]

We won’t have any key forward stocks in the wings if we let Ballenden go. Not sure he’s going to make it but I’d be hoping for another talk to come in.

 

[scoman]

VFL top up players can NOT be upgraded to play at AFL level.

Also there is a $100k salary cap for the VFL team.

Did we pay this money to our u19 boys like Reville and Triffett?

 

[Sproj]

Most KPPs take quite a few years to mature, could this just be Ballenden's problem as well?

 

[briztoon]

We won’t have any key forward stocks in the wings if we let Ballenden go. Not sure he’s going to make it but I’d be hoping for another talk to come in.

Ballenden has mostly played in defence the past two years. I

 

[briztoon]

Did we pay this money to our u19 boys like Reville and Triffett?

No idea.

Hope the kids got match payments at least.

 

[Hollow Knight]

Sorry if it has already been discussed but what are we theorising we will be doing with next year’s first?

Obviously we need to move it out, but how do we maximise it’s value?

 

[BangyBangy]

VFL top up players can NOT be upgraded to play at AFL level.

Also there is a $100k salary cap for the VFL team.

I'm not talking about through the season.

So Joyce can't be a VFL player next year, and then get re-drafted at years end if he has a Ben Keays type talent growth spurt?

I understand there's bugger all money in the cap for the VFL team, but hell, when I was 20 I was working at Franklins Big Fresh part time while studying at uni anyway.

Not saying it's likely, just asking if it's allowable.

 

[BigCat2]

Sorry if it has already been discussed but what are we theorising we will be doing with next year’s first?

Obviously we need to move it out, but how do we maximise it’s value?

Without looking at other scenarios, us swapping our future first (likely 12-18) with Bulldogs' first this year (currently 15) would make good sense. They have a top 3 F/S this year, while we have a top 3-5 F/S next year, would help both clubs maximise use out of first round pick, rather than letting it be eaten up by an early bid. This is definitely win/win.

They can of course split their pick 15 into some lower picks with another club of course.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Without looking at other scenarios, us swapping our future first (likely 12-18) with Bulldogs' first this year (currently 15) would make good sense. They have a top 3 F/S this year, while we have a top 3-5 F/S next year, would help both clubs maximise use out of first round pick, rather than letting it be eaten up by an early bid. This is definitely win/win.

They can of course split their pick 15 into some lower picks with another club of course.

The more challenging issue may be what we do with their pick if we get it. Do we take three first round picks to the draft or try to bundle-up two of them for a higher pick. Not sure who would be willing to do that though.