Analysis 2021 trade thread

[blueiris]

Would you feel better if we picked up a 28 year old ruck in the draft?

I would have preferred we didn’t sign everyone and had money for a Max Lynch

 

[JasRulz63]

I would have preferred we didn’t sign everyone and had money for a Max Lynch

That implies Max Lynch would be happy to come to Brisbane and fill a back-up role (at least initially) i.e. the situation he's in at Collingwood at the moment.

 

[jackess]

I would have preferred we didn’t sign everyone and had money for a Max Lynch

Why stop there? Why not Max Gawn

 

[BangyBangy]

That implies Max Lynch would be happy to come to Brisbane and fill a back-up role (at least initially) i.e. the situation he's in at Collingwood at the moment.

Yep. Consent. It's an important often overlooked part of getting trades done

Speaking on SEN Afternoons, Lions footy boss Danny Daly said Fort’s acquisition was getting closer.

“We‘ve been in good discussions with the Cats about Darcy,” he said.

“Hopefully the dominos can fall our way and I think Darcy is pretty keen to get to Brisbane so if we can get that deal done that would be great.”

 

[Harris Specter]

North & Richmond trade complete. Tarrant has moved to Richmond now. Looks like Dimma wants to have one last shot at a flag before the eventual rebuild. Interesting bit here.

The move included Tarrant because otherwise if he had moved as part of a free agency deal it would have diluted the Tigers’ compensation pick they received for Mabior Chol who moved to Gold Coast.

 

[Lazza16]

There’s no actual highlights of Fort playing so not sure what the Lions actually see in him there hasn’t been much VFL played in the last 2 seasons seems more a backward trade like the days of Trent West

They may remember him playing against us 2 0r 3 yrs ago ....was quite impressive. Will help if u can find that replay...perhaps it was SCG 2020.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I agree, he will essentially replace Fullerton in last year's finals team. That is still adding ruck depth.

Then when Hippy returns, we would either run the tallest set up in the comp, with an already slow midfield, or we would have to not play one of Joe, Hipwood, McStay, Oscar or Fort.

Well that's easy, Fort goes to the VFL once Hippy is back, unless he does a Tom Hickey. Fort has shown the least so far at AFL level from that list.

 

[scoman]

If we do get Fort I wouldn't rule out his chances of taking the number one ruck spot. OMac continues to improve, but is probably in the bottom half of starting rucks in the comp. So it's not like the ruck spot is locked by any means.

Now, like some on here I do remember watching him give our rucks a bit of a bath when we played the Cats a couple of years ago and according to Cats fans he has been pretty good in the VFL. I'm also holding on to my belief that Scott just doesn't rate ruckman and continues to select his rucks based on what else they can bring to the table apart from hitouts.

 

[mebevan]

Surprised Dwayne didn't mention McCluggage's goal kicking...

 

[PattyKwasagun]

There’s no actual highlights of Fort playing so not sure what the Lions actually see in him there hasn’t been much VFL played in the last 2 seasons seems more a backward trade like the days of Trent West

Here you go

 

[scoman]

Flicking through Kayo now.

Brisbane v Geelong Round 6 2020 Fort starts in the ruck.

 

[jonnobackpocket]

Really? Nic Nat nearly won the game off his own boot when we played them at the end of the home & away season. Gawn is unstoppable when in form like the whole of season 2021 and Grundy (in my opinion had a poor year this season) was held by Fullerton & Big O.I love the Big O but even he cant hold his own against Nic Nat, Gawn & Co. Anyone who thinks he can is kidding themselves. (disrespectful comment said in jest)

So our best ruckman cant do it but you would be happy to roll Kalin Lane out there for the year. I assume you disagree with me but you made some very good points for my argument.

 

[Tom14]

If we do get Fort I wouldn't rule out his chances of taking the number one ruck spot. OMac continues to improve, but is probably in the bottom half of starting rucks in the comp. So it's not like the ruck spot is locked by any means.

Now, like some on here I do remember watching him give our rucks a bit of a bath when we played the Cats a couple of years ago and according to Cats fans he has been pretty good in the VFL. I'm also holding on to my belief that Scott just doesn't rate ruckman and continues to select his rucks based on what else they can bring to the table apart from hitouts.

I think you overrate most of the starting rucks in the comp. There is a clear top tier (Nic Nat, Gawn, allegedly grundy) then some others who are pretty good and can make a difference on their day (Ryder/Marshall, Goldstein, Nank, Darcy, McEvoy), but on his day Oscar can compete with the second group. At the end of the day, even if he loses to that group it doesn't really impact the game that much. He certainly had the better of Darcy in both games v Freo, for example.

Aside from Gawn/Nic Nat I'm not sure I believe there is much of a ranking of rucks - its all a morass as the rest aren't real difference makers.

I don't expect Fort, who can't beat out Stanley and Esava, to come in and be picked ahead of Oscar - but he's useful depth to have.

 

[dlanod]

I think you overrate most of the starting rucks in the comp. There is a clear top tier (Nic Nat, Gawn, allegedly grundy) then some others who are pretty good and can make a difference on their day (Ryder/Marshall, Goldstein, Nank, Darcy, McEvoy), but on his day Oscar can compete with the second group. At the end of the day, even if he loses to that group it doesn't really impact the game that much. He certainly had the better of Darcy in both games v Freo, for example.

Honestly, Oscar's numbers and his record against those guys clearly put him into the second group (though I'd bump Darcy up to the top group) and potentially getting towards the top. I was surprised when I dug up the numbers after he was being maligned earlier in the year (before his form surge) but his raw HO numbers, HTA numbers and rate, and overall effectiveness is above guys like McEvoy, Nankervis, Lycett, Hickey, etc.

 

[blueiris]

What kind of player is Shiels and why does he suit Us?

 

[scoman]

I think you overrate most of the starting rucks in the comp. There is a clear top tier (Nic Nat, Gawn, allegedly grundy) then some others who are pretty good and can make a difference on their day (Ryder/Marshall, Goldstein, Nank, Darcy, McEvoy), but on his day Oscar can compete with the second group. At the end of the day, even if he loses to that group it doesn't really impact the game that much. He certainly had the better of Darcy in both games v Freo, for example.

Aside from Gawn/Nic Nat I'm not sure I believe there is much of a ranking of rucks - its all a morass as the rest aren't real difference makers.

I don't expect Fort, who can't beat out Stanley and Esava, to come in and be picked ahead of Oscar - but he's useful depth to have.

Honestly, Oscar's numbers and his record against those guys clearly put him into the second group (though I'd bump Darcy up to the top group) and potentially getting towards the top. I was surprised when I dug up the numbers after he was being maligned earlier in the year (before his form surge) but his raw HO numbers, HTA numbers and rate, and overall effectiveness is above guys like McEvoy, Nankervis, Lycett, Hickey, etc.

Obviously I'm speculating, but I'm sure the club expects him to have a red hot crack at taking Oscars spot. I know if I'm Darcy Fort I'd be pretty happy coming to Brisbane, I'd see the first ruck spot as attainable.

Admittedly I'm sure he thought the same at Geelong. I asked a few questions on the Geelong board last week and a few responded that they couldn't out why Fort never got more of a crack at Geelong.

 

[mattsmob]

View attachment 1256104What kind of player is Shiels and why does he suit Us?

He doesn't imo, he's a mid with average skills and athleticism. He's good defensively,works hard and seems to be a good professional but other than that he doesn't provide much of a difference to what we already have. Also he can't really play anywhere other than midfield and I'd rather that mid-time to go to other guys we have.

 

[Tom14]

Honestly, Oscar's numbers and his record against those guys clearly put him into the second group (though I'd bump Darcy up to the top group) and potentially getting towards the top. I was surprised when I dug up the numbers after he was being maligned earlier in the year (before his form surge) but his raw HO numbers, HTA numbers and rate, and overall effectiveness is above guys like McEvoy, Nankervis, Lycett, Hickey, etc.

I think this is probably fair, but a couple of games where Nank, Ryder and Hickey have given Oscar some trouble stick in the mind. But I’d have him in easily the second tier of rucks.

 

[martinson]

Obviously I'm speculating, but I'm sure the club expects him to have a red hot crack at taking Oscars spot. I know if I'm Darcy Fort I'd be pretty happy coming to Brisbane, I'd see the first ruck spot as attainable.

Admittedly I'm sure he thought the same at Geelong. I asked a few questions on the Geelong board last week and a few responded that they couldn't out why Fort never got more of a crack at Geelong.

Why not have both ?

The 2 ruck system has always been a winner for us over many years.

 

[Mighty Lions]

So our best ruckman cant do it but you would be happy to roll Kalin Lane out there for the year. I assume you disagree with me but you made some very good points for my argument.

I just didn't really appreciate your last comment regarding the "kidding yourself" remark. Everyone has an opinion and may be different to yours as in this case.

 

[jonnobackpocket]

I just didn't really appreciate your last comment regarding the "kidding yourself" remark. Everyone has an opinion and may be different to yours as in this case.

So you don’t agree with the opinion we need to get someone, besides Lane, in case Oscar goes down? To honestly believe we can beat the best sides with Lane as first ruck I think you would have to be kidding, that’s my opinion.

 

[a mayes ing]

Why not have both ?

The 2 ruck system has always been a winner for us over many years.

Because it would leave us seriously top heavy when Hippy comes back: McStay, Danniher, Hippy, OMac, Fort. Would leave too many KPFs in the forward half at one time

 

[BuntonRules]

Because it would leave us seriously top heavy when Hippy comes back: McStay, Danniher, Hippy, OMac, Fort. Would leave too many KPFs in the forward half at one time

Fagan is going to play them all in the same game? pfffffttt........

 

[a mayes ing]

Fagan is going to play them all in the same game? pfffffttt........

perhaps look at what l was quoting...

 

[BuntonRules]

perhaps look at what l was quoting...

? What has that to do with it? We would not play them all at the same time.

You don't think having a ready to go big man - in reserve- on our list is worthwile?