List Mgmt. 2023 List Management

[WalshistheGOAT]

Patton and Scully were 26 and 27 at the times of their trades, and the Giants were under extreme salary cap pressure. Patton only had 1 year left on his contract. Scully had 3, but was only on 500k. And both were able to renegotiate new deals.

Williams will be 29 by the next trade period, and he signed a FA contract, so the money is fixed. It's a very different scenario.

Fair points, but Williams would still be an upgrade at half a dozen clubs that have plenty of cap space to work with over the coming years. I'm tipping there'd still be suitors to get a deal done even if it meant we had to chip in a bit of his salary ourselves.

Last year we heard murmurs from the media that the club was looking at shopping him around, doubt that's entirely untrue.

He's unfortunately surplus to our list needs and his contract would allow us to bring in far better suited players that would instantly upgrade our list and have a history of being able to stay on the park.

Wouldn't think twice if he's open to a move and someone else is open to taking him.

 

[Stamos]

Fair points, but Williams would still be an upgrade at half a dozen clubs that have plenty of cap space to work with over the coming years. I'm tipping there'd still be suitors to get a deal done even if it meant we had to chip in a bit of his salary ourselves.

Last year we heard murmurs from the media that the club was looking at shopping him around, doubt that's entirely untrue.

He's unfortunately surplus to our list needs and his contract would allow us to bring in far better suited players that would instantly upgrade our list and have a history of being able to stay on the park.

Wouldn't think twice if he's open to a move and someone else is open to taking him.

If we were shopping him around last year (which given how impractical it was, I seriously doubt), there's a pretty big difference between a fit 28 year old and a 29 year old coming off an ACL.

The contract undoubtedly hurts, but it's just not practical to move him on. What do you think would be the best (trade & contract) a club would offer?

 

[Jatz]

3 more years

So there'll be 2 come trade period. No one will pick him up, even for peanuts.

That's been a brutal pickup really.

 

[Jatz]

Fair points, but Williams would still be an upgrade at half a dozen clubs that have plenty of cap space to work with over the coming years. I'm tipping there'd still be suitors to get a deal done even if it meant we had to chip in a bit of his salary ourselves.

Last year we heard murmurs from the media that the club was looking at shopping him around, doubt that's entirely untrue.

He's unfortunately surplus to our list needs and his contract would allow us to bring in far better suited players that would instantly upgrade our list and have a history of being able to stay on the park.

Wouldn't think twice if he's open to a move and someone else is open to taking him.

We'd have to chip in most of it. No one will be all that desperate to top up with an injury prone 29 year old on big coin.

 

[Stamos]

So there'll be 2 come trade period. No one will pick him up, even for peanuts.

That's been a brutal pickup really.

No, 3 MORE years.
We're nearly 4 months into this year (given contracts go Nov-Oct)

 

[marcmurphy3]

Patton and Scully were 26 and 27 at the times of their trades, and the Giants were under extreme salary cap pressure. Patton only had 1 year left on his contract. Scully had 3, but was only on 500k. And both were able to renegotiate new deals.

Williams will be 29 by the next trade period, and he signed a FA contract, so the money is fixed. It's a very different scenario.

We could trade him to a bottom club. 3 years left on his contract. We would have to pay some of his salary (say 300k a year). Well worth it if it help us retain a guy like TDK we want to keep. Obviously he would need to agree which would be the hurdle.

Will be a good test of how ruthless we are if it comes down to pushing Zac out the door to retain someone else.

 

[thylacine60]

What's left on the Williams contract?

Bandaids

 

[Stamos]

We could trade him to a bottom club. 3 years left on his contract. We would have to pay some of his salary (say 300k a year). Well worth it if it help us retain a guy like TDK we want to keep. Obviously he would need to agree which would be the hurdle.

Will be a good test of how ruthless we are if it comes down to pushing Zac out the door to retain someone else.

Which bottom club is going to pay 500 odd for 3 years to a 29 year old recovering from an ACL?

 

[TeeJay Blue]

I don't think we should be in any position to question the services of certain players such as Nic Newman

24

Nic Newman

Age

32

Ht

186cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.7

5star

K

13.7

5star

HB

5.9

4star

M

5.5

5star

T

3.3

5star

MG

400.8

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

6.5

3star

HB

1.0

1star

M

2.0

2star

T

1.0

2star

MG

157.0

3star

D

22.4

5star

K

12.8

5star

HB

9.6

5star

M

5.4

5star

T

3.6

5star

MG

387.8

5star

, Lachie Plowman and Ed Curnow, when we have about a dozen other players who almost simply never provide any because they are constantly sitting on the sidelines.

It may sound harsh, but if we want to look at the true liabilities on out list, we should be looking towards the likes of Marchbank, Cuningham, Philp, Williams, Martin and McGovern.

Simply having "TALENT" means nothing if you are never using it because your body can no longer handle the rigours of footy. And before we say that injuries are normal (which nobody is denying by the way), why on Earth is it the same players dropping all the time? And it isn't exactly high intensity training; or match simulation. It's simple jogging, drills and fooling around with mates.

Freak injuries can occur once or twice now and then but if they are happening too often and affecting the same folk, then there is a problem surrounding this that needs addressing at the club.

This constant regurgitated nonsense being "If Ed or Plow play, we aren't getting anywhere" is just that. And I rather trust the coaches and staff here than some random everyday spectator to know who fits in the plans. If either aren't in the plans, then so be it. I ain't gonna be pushing for it and cheering it on like nearly everybody else here.

But at least Lachie Plowman and Ed Curnow (before 2022) can get on the park and do their job. And I would rather see them than mope about and hoping someone like Marchank or Cuningham get on the park after their 6th or 7th consecutive injury.

And for the record, NO! I am not cheering for any of the injury prone group to be delisted. I've been patiently waiting for all of them to get a string of games together. I've been patiently waiting for them to shine on the big stage. I've been patiently waiting for them to become the difference between our failures and successes. I've hoped for it all to happen.

But I have waited long enough, and I am pretty sure everybody else including the medical staff have too. This team is at a point where it needs to be contending now and so big calls have to be made whether we like these calls or not.

Williams aside due to the contract. But all of Marchbank, Cuningham, McGovern and Martin should be informed they are on their last chance. If their bodies continue to let them down, then sadly it is farewell to them.
No more of this continuous faith in the same broken bunch.

Want to take the next step in contending? Stop looking towards those who are fit and doing their job and look toward those who clearly aren't.

 

[Jatz]

No, 3 MORE years.
We're nearly 4 months into this year (given contracts go Nov-Oct)

3 more years after Nov?

Ffs. That's one hell of a contract.

 

[marcmurphy3]

Which bottom club is going to pay 500 odd for 3 years to a 29 year old recovering from an ACL?

If he is fully recovered and ready to go for next season (pending a medical) I have no doubt a club would bite. Would just be a matter of how much we have to chip in and how bad we want to get him off the books.

We would have to chip in alot so not saying doing so would be particularly favourable to us just that it isn't impossible.

 

[Stamos]

If he is fully recovered and ready to go for next season (pending a medical) I have no doubt a club would bite. Would just be a matter of how much we have to chip in and how bad we want to get him off the books.

We would have to chip in alot so not saying doing so would be particularly favourable to us just that it isn't impossible.

I don't think it's impossible, just impractical.

 

[Bletch]

Which bottom club is going to pay 500 odd for 3 years to a 29 year old recovering from an ACL?

Would have to be something like Williams + 1st rd (Car) + $$/year for maybe a 3rd round pick.

 

[Red Bull]

We’re stuck with Williams and his contract … full stop !!
Wasn’t it the word that, Cain Liddle was VERY keen for Austin to bring Williams on board no matter what ?
I believe Martin might be contracted for 2024 as well so like it or not, these 2 will likely be around.
That leaves the injury prone Marchbank Cuningham McGovern Philp and Honey absolutely in the crosshairs.
The club can’t wait any longer for these guys, it’s gotta be this year or goodbye …

 

[branedotorg]

What's Newman done to deserve being under the pump to retain his spot for next season? Has given us very good service since coming over from the Swans, sometimes he makes the odd clanger or two on field, but provides a lot of needed leadership out there ...

nothing other than being out of contract and 31 in the 2024 season. I like him a lot but at his age and contract status he'd be in the due diligence list. FWIW if he stays fit you know what you get with him, i'd be renewing for for 2024

 

[Kruezing]

Would have to be something like Williams + 1st rd (Car) + $$/year for maybe a 3rd round pick.

What sort of car we talking about? …

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

If we were shopping him around last year (which given how impractical it was, I seriously doubt), there's a pretty big difference between a fit 28 year old and a 29 year old coming off an ACL.

The contract undoubtedly hurts, but it's just not practical to move him on. What do you think would be the best (trade & contract) a club would offer?

I think North would take him given they have one of the worst half back lines ever assembled and Hall is set to turn 33 this year, Ziebull 32. I'd think if we offered to pay 200-250k of his contract or give them a late 2nd rounder in return for a token pick it would get done. He'd be an instant upgrade on their list and they wouldn't be replacing him any time soon given they have no quality young HBF's on their list atm outside of Goater.

They get a quality player in a position of need for almost no trade cost and only have to pay 500-600k of his contract for the next 3 years in a period where they'll genuinely struggle to reach the 95% threshold.


Everyone mentioning having to give up a first rounder to offload him just baffles me. Gold Coast did it this year because they are the worst ran club in the competition. Rightly so, the entire football public and media were collectively astonished that any club could be that incompetent.

Tom Mitchell is a much closer comparison with the Hawks reported to be paying 250k this year. He was traded for pick 41 and 50

 

[Red Bull]

Would you have taken Hannebery off St.Kilda’s hands ?
Gun player when he’s on the field … but …

 

[Stamos]

Tom Mitchell is a much closer comparison with the Hawks reported to be paying 250k this year. He was traded for pick 41 and 50

Mitchell only missed 1 game last year (compared to Williams ACL), and only had 1 year left on his contract.
It's not really a close comparison.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

The clean out it should really have at least started at the end of last season but the club deferred the hard decisions and now it looks like we are going to pay the price for it in 2023.

Whilst none of these guys are singularly critical to the teams success its almost impossible to have success when 15-20% of the list are routinely unavailable for at least half the season.



In the last 3 seasons Pitto has played 33 out of 61 possible games.

When you say clean out in 2022, which names are you referring to? Marchbank we signed for next to nothing and the upside might be far greater.

Other than he, who were we going to clear out last year?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Mitchell only missed 1 game last year (compared to Williams ACL), and only had 1 year left on his contract.
It's not really a close comparison.

While true, North is also in a much worse position talent wise to the Pies.

Anyway...We disagree regarding Williams. No biggie, best to just leave it here and save ourselves the back and forth.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Would you have taken Hannebery off St.Kilda’s hands ?
Gun player when he’s on the field … but …

Absolutely not. Was a disastrous recruit for The Saints

 

[Red Bull]

Absolutely not. Was a disastrous recruit for The Saints

Exactly.
Approaching 30yo
On BIG money multi year contract
Always unavailable
Nobody’s taking Williams off our hands …

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Exactly.
Approaching 30yo
On BIG money multi year contract
Always unavailable
Nobody’s taking Williams off our hands …

I would to think Willo still has a couple of good years of footy left in him though.

Most people thought Hannebery was cooked when the Saints acquired him from The Swans.

 

[Beyond Blue]

When you say clean out in 2022, which names are you referring to? Marchbank we signed for next to nothing and the upside might be far greater.

Other than he, who were we going to clear out last year?

When I heard Voss talking about hard decisions I thought it would mean Marchbank and Cunners were done. These guys have played 41 games and 52 games in 7 and 8 years respectively - their bodies just cannot hold up - so these aren’t cases like Doc and Charlie where they’d shown they could play full seasons and just had bad luck with serious injuries.

It means we are 2 down before the season starts, 4 if you consider Akeui and a Mirkov are nowhere near Afl ready. Even 10% of your list unable to play puts a lot of pressure on the list to cover injuries and the coaches plans, the flow on effect is guys like Kemp training all pre season as a forward then being pulled down into defence in the season to cover injuries.

A line in the sand has to drawn somewhere otherwise we will never be successful.